2018 Summer Game Plan

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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby murphydump55 on Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:46 am

FLPensFan wrote:
murphydump55 wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:Would anyone do a Brassard plus (pick/prospect) for Max Pacioretty deal? I wondered about this one before, as Montreal is said to want a center for Max. I think overall, Pacioretty has more value than Brassard, and that would require the Penguins kicking in a bit more. If the Penguins did Brassard, Simon, and a late pick for Pacioretty with 33% retained, would you take that deal? Both guys are within a year apart age wise, and both are UFAs next year.

That would leave Sheahan as the 3C, and Penguins would need to acquire a 4C or let guys like Blueger, Bellerive, and Dea battle out for the 4C position.

It sounds a bit enticing, but I would still be leary of the center depth behind Sheahan.


There’s possibilities out there in UFA land for 4c:

Derek Ryan
Fillpulla
Beagle
Plekanec
Letestu

Granted not the sexiest names but could be had for a decent price.

Riley Nash would be another one, although he will likely be overpaid based on the season he had.


That’s why I excluded him
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:52 am

murphydump55 wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:
murphydump55 wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:Would anyone do a Brassard plus (pick/prospect) for Max Pacioretty deal? I wondered about this one before, as Montreal is said to want a center for Max. I think overall, Pacioretty has more value than Brassard, and that would require the Penguins kicking in a bit more. If the Penguins did Brassard, Simon, and a late pick for Pacioretty with 33% retained, would you take that deal? Both guys are within a year apart age wise, and both are UFAs next year.

That would leave Sheahan as the 3C, and Penguins would need to acquire a 4C or let guys like Blueger, Bellerive, and Dea battle out for the 4C position.

It sounds a bit enticing, but I would still be leary of the center depth behind Sheahan.


There’s possibilities out there in UFA land for 4c:

Derek Ryan
Fillpulla
Beagle
Plekanec
Letestu

Granted not the sexiest names but could be had for a decent price.

Riley Nash would be another one, although he will likely be overpaid based on the season he had.


That’s why I excluded him

:thumb:
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby jreed on Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:58 am

Ive always liked Jay Beagle...he'd be an ideal 4C. He'll probably get a slight pay bump and be up around the $2M mark.

Filppula is an interesting thought. He's great on faceoffs and a solid PK'er. Could also be used on the wing when needed.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Jim on Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:00 pm

FLPensFan wrote:Would anyone do a Brassard plus (pick/prospect) for Max Pacioretty deal? I wondered about this one before, as Montreal is said to want a center for Max. I think overall, Pacioretty has more value than Brassard, and that would require the Penguins kicking in a bit more. If the Penguins did Brassard, Simon, and a late pick for Pacioretty with 33% retained, would you take that deal? Both guys are within a year apart age wise, and both are UFAs next year.

That would leave Sheahan as the 3C, and Penguins would need to acquire a 4C or let guys like Blueger, Bellerive, and Dea battle out for the 4C position.

It sounds a bit enticing, but I would still be leary of the center depth behind Sheahan.


I would like to see Pacioretty on this team, but... Sheahan needs to be signed yet, plus I think that last year showed that Sheahan is not good enough to be a full time 3C for the Penguins game. That would mean that the Pens would still need a 3C, not a 4C.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby thehockeyguru on Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:31 pm

Jim wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:Would anyone do a Brassard plus (pick/prospect) for Max Pacioretty deal? I wondered about this one before, as Montreal is said to want a center for Max. I think overall, Pacioretty has more value than Brassard, and that would require the Penguins kicking in a bit more. If the Penguins did Brassard, Simon, and a late pick for Pacioretty with 33% retained, would you take that deal? Both guys are within a year apart age wise, and both are UFAs next year.

That would leave Sheahan as the 3C, and Penguins would need to acquire a 4C or let guys like Blueger, Bellerive, and Dea battle out for the 4C position.

It sounds a bit enticing, but I would still be leary of the center depth behind Sheahan.


I would like to see Pacioretty on this team, but... Sheahan needs to be signed yet, plus I think that last year showed that Sheahan is not good enough to be a full time 3C for the Penguins game. That would mean that the Pens would still need a 3C, not a 4C.


I don't really want to move Brassard, not without a legit 3c replacement.

The only way this team can make a drastic improvement is by moving Letang.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Jim on Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:34 pm

Image

Crosby says, "I will retire unless you get Lucic or Bobby Ryan... with 50% retained"

Lucic for 5x$3M ($13M total actual salary over 5)
- or -
Ryan for 4x$3.625M ($15M total actual salary over 4)
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby thehockeyguru on Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:42 pm

Jim wrote:Image

Crosby says, "I will retire unless you get Lucic or Bobby Ryan... with 50% retained"

Lucic for 5x$3M ($13M total actual salary over 5)
- or -
Ryan for 4x$3.625M ($15M total actual salary over 4)


Bobby Ryan
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Dr Rosenrosen on Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:53 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:
Jim wrote:Image

Crosby says, "I will retire unless you get Lucic or Bobby Ryan... with 50% retained"

Lucic for 5x$3M ($13M total actual salary over 5)
- or -
Ryan for 4x$3.625M ($15M total actual salary over 4)


Bobby Ryan

You gotta let Sid retire if he makes a dumb demand like that. I'm concerned for his brain.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:58 pm

Jim wrote:Image

Crosby says, "I will retire unless you get Lucic or Bobby Ryan... with 50% retained"

Lucic for 5x$3M ($13M total actual salary over 5)
- or -
Ryan for 4x$3.625M ($15M total actual salary over 4)

That's a very tough question. Bobby Ryan has better production over the course of his career, but, his numbers have tailed off the past several years.....really ever since he left Anaheim. I'd like to say it's the Guy Boucher effect, but Ryan's struggles started before Boucher was the coach.

I would probably take Lucic because of his size, and the fact that he has only had 1 down year. I have more faith that Lucic can return to being a 20 goal scorer than I do in thinking Ryan can get back to 30 goals. Plus, Lucic fills that power forward type role. He wouldn't be a deterent, but I do see Lucic playing the type of game that if Tom Wilson is out there running around, he's either going to quickly confront Wilson, or he's going to start targeting the other teams stars.....as long as Sullivan allows him.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Steve on Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:59 pm

Jim wrote:Image

Crosby says, "I will retire unless you get Lucic or Bobby Ryan... with 50% retained"

Lucic for 5x$3M ($13M total actual salary over 5)
- or -
Ryan for 4x$3.625M ($15M total actual salary over 4)


Image
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Jim on Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:07 pm

Steve wrote:Image


Both of them? No...
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby no name on Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:22 pm

never mind
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Hatrick on Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:38 pm

IntangibleBeer wrote:
Hatrick wrote:
KG wrote:Was just spitballing...I know Lucic contract is an albatross. But I think if we were to get him it would add a bit of physical swagger to this team (like Reaves was supposed to do, I know).

Have to wonder if coming back to the east will reinvigorate him and playing on a cup contender etc. that said what if we were able to get rid of our 2 worst contracts...

To Pitt: Lucic plus $2 mill retained making his cap hit $4mill

To Edmonton: Sheary and Hunwick. $5.25mill in cap hit for both however they only have 2 years left.

Edmonton gets out of the bad contract by taking on 2 shorter term contracts but that is offset by them retaining.

Thoughts?

as I said a few times, any trade with lucic involved has to be 50% retained or no deal. The contract is bad enough now let alone in 5 years.

lucic @ 50% is 3mil
plus a decent draft pick or two

for sheary and hunwick


Even with those terms, I'm inclined to say pass. Given his lack of speed and skating, Lucic couldn't keep up on this team. $3Mil is a lot to pay someone to eat nachos.

well they are paying hunwick 2m to eat nachos right now, the limited roles he could actually fulfill is worth the last million
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Hatrick on Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:44 pm

steelershark wrote:
Hatrick wrote:
steelershark wrote:
Hatrick wrote:
steelershark wrote:Does anyone know how Adam Johnson played in WBS? he was considered a good prospect coming out of college. Can he play a 4th line center in the NHL? Move Brassard to LW2, Sheehan to 3C and Johnson to 4C. LInes could be: Guetz- Sid- Horny
Brassard-Geno- Sprong
Rust-Sheehan-Phil
ZAR-Johnson-?

guessing in that lineup you are already dealing away hagelin and sheary? and already flipped rust from rw to lw


Yes Hagelin and Rust are similar players, but Rust would be less expensive, with the ability to play both sides. To me, its either Sheary or Guetz, and I would go with Guetz.

to me sheary vs guentzel is not a debate at all, guentzel is the lw next to sid starting the season unquestionably. sheary if he isn't traded I would put on 3rd line. Hagelin I could see as anywhere from 2nd to 4th line LW if he is still here, in my opinion ideally we could keep him but last year of contract and high cap hit means he could be a trade chip as well. However even if you trade those two I am leaving rust on RW unless something else changes since I feel he is more effective on that side even though he could play LW as well. So I would switch the question marks with rust if sheary and hagelin are both traded without knowing the return.

With Rust on the 4th line it is an awfully expensive 4th, if Sheehan is your center. Rust gives you options that Hagelin does not, so Rust is my choice.

I could care less about the money on each line, its the aggregate that matters not the distribution so that's a non factor. The rust doing stuff hagelin doesn't is a more valid reason but again its that vs which side he is better on and I go with that being a bigger factor than rust vs hagelin.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:21 pm

Barry Trotz not returning to coach the Capitals. From what I am hearing, he was on the hot seat, lowballed, hardballed, whiffleballed, etc, and was not happy with the way he was treated by management and/or their lack of faith in him.

https://www.nhl.com/capitals/news/statement-from-the-washington-capitals-on-barry-trotz/c-299100932

More info from Pierre LeBrun: Trotz had a clause in his contract that he would automatically be given a 2 year contract extension if he won the Stanley Cup, however, this extension only came with a 300K bump in pay. Trotz was making 1.5M, which is rather low for a coach of his caliber, so a bump to 1.8M wasn't really much of an improvement.

Sounds like Caps wouldn't go higher, and Trotz knew he could make more on the open market.
Last edited by FLPensFan on Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby lemieuxReturns on Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:28 pm

FLPensFan wrote:Barry Trotz not returning to coach the Capitals. From what I am hearing, he was on the hot seat, lowballed, hardballed, whiffleballed, etc, and was not happy with the way he was treated by management and/or their lack of faith in him.

https://www.nhl.com/capitals/news/statement-from-the-washington-capitals-on-barry-trotz/c-299100932


I think the Caps were in a weird place after winning.... their GM wanted a new guy and anything other than the cup was the excuse they were going to use to not re-sign him. After he wins it, the only way now was to make him want to leave. Trotz actually helped the GM here. Now the GM is not the bad guy and the fans do not revolt.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby LimerickPensFan on Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:55 pm

lemieuxReturns wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:Barry Trotz not returning to coach the Capitals. From what I am hearing, he was on the hot seat, lowballed, hardballed, whiffleballed, etc, and was not happy with the way he was treated by management and/or their lack of faith in him.

https://www.nhl.com/capitals/news/statement-from-the-washington-capitals-on-barry-trotz/c-299100932


I think the Caps were in a weird place after winning.... their GM wanted a new guy and anything other than the cup was the excuse they were going to use to not re-sign him. After he wins it, the only way now was to make him want to leave. Trotz actually helped the GM here. Now the GM is not the bad guy and the fans do not revolt.

If the Pens lost Sullivan over money within weeks after winning the cup, I think I'd be all over the GM.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby penny lane on Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:59 pm

Barry knew it took a lunar eclipse for the caps to win in PGH.
I imagine a current GM could be waiting for this announcement to go ahead and fire his coach to
hire a SC coach.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:16 pm

LimerickPensFan wrote:
lemieuxReturns wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:Barry Trotz not returning to coach the Capitals. From what I am hearing, he was on the hot seat, lowballed, hardballed, whiffleballed, etc, and was not happy with the way he was treated by management and/or their lack of faith in him.

https://www.nhl.com/capitals/news/statement-from-the-washington-capitals-on-barry-trotz/c-299100932


I think the Caps were in a weird place after winning.... their GM wanted a new guy and anything other than the cup was the excuse they were going to use to not re-sign him. After he wins it, the only way now was to make him want to leave. Trotz actually helped the GM here. Now the GM is not the bad guy and the fans do not revolt.

If the Pens lost Sullivan over money within weeks after winning the cup, I think I'd be all over the GM.

According to Isabelle Khurshudyan, who covers the Caps, the Caps aren't very happy about it. From what they are saying, Trotz negotiated that Stanley Cup clause, including the amount of the raise. So they felt a bit hurt that he was leaving when terms he negotiated and agreed to kicked in. This was from a bit earlier in the day.

MacLellan had a press conference a little bit ago. Said Trotz's representation wanted a 5 year deal....his extension was only for 2 years. Trotz representation also wanted him to be paid in line with the top 5 coaches in the league. McLellan apparently got emotional, saying Trotz probably does deserve to be paid in that range, but not every team is willing to pay that much.

Khurshudyan had made reference earlier in the day of how the Capitals traditionally have not put a large emphasis on coaching salary. They have a history of going with cheaper options.

I haven't heard anything official, but it sure sounds like Todd Reirden will be the new coach there.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby LimerickPensFan on Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:13 pm

FLPensFan wrote:
LimerickPensFan wrote:
lemieuxReturns wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:Barry Trotz not returning to coach the Capitals. From what I am hearing, he was on the hot seat, lowballed, hardballed, whiffleballed, etc, and was not happy with the way he was treated by management and/or their lack of faith in him.

https://www.nhl.com/capitals/news/statement-from-the-washington-capitals-on-barry-trotz/c-299100932


I think the Caps were in a weird place after winning.... their GM wanted a new guy and anything other than the cup was the excuse they were going to use to not re-sign him. After he wins it, the only way now was to make him want to leave. Trotz actually helped the GM here. Now the GM is not the bad guy and the fans do not revolt.

If the Pens lost Sullivan over money within weeks after winning the cup, I think I'd be all over the GM.

According to Isabelle Khurshudyan, who covers the Caps, the Caps aren't very happy about it. From what they are saying, Trotz negotiated that Stanley Cup clause, including the amount of the raise. So they felt a bit hurt that he was leaving when terms he negotiated and agreed to kicked in. This was from a bit earlier in the day.

MacLellan had a press conference a little bit ago. Said Trotz's representation wanted a 5 year deal....his extension was only for 2 years. Trotz representation also wanted him to be paid in line with the top 5 coaches in the league. McLellan apparently got emotional, saying Trotz probably does deserve to be paid in that range, but not every team is willing to pay that much.

Khurshudyan had made reference earlier in the day of how the Capitals traditionally have not put a large emphasis on coaching salary. They have a history of going with cheaper options.

I haven't heard anything official, but it sure sounds like Todd Reirden will be the new coach there.

I heard the press conference. Basically, he said "he wanted to be paid like one of the top coaches in the league". Shocking. Isn't a coach that has won two president's trophies and a stanley cup in the last three years one of the top coaches in the league? MacLellan sounded like he felt Trotz was breaking a contract, which is potentially true depending on the wording of the extension clause.

I've heard the same rumors about Rierden.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby KG on Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:18 pm

So im betting there will only be tinkering to the lineup. Kessel and Letang will most likely stay on for another run.

If JR wants to add forward depth the usual suspects will be the trade bait. It wouldn’t shock me if Brassard was moved in a larger deal. He only has 1 more year on his deal and his salary demands will probably be more then we want to spend for a 3C.

I would look to lock up Sheahan on a 3 year deal for a good cap hit in case he becomes the 3C eventually and then sign a Beagle type.

Brassard, Sheary, Rust, Hunwick are the most likely targets.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby thehockeyguru on Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:20 pm

KG wrote:So im betting there will only be tinkering to the lineup. Kessel and Letang will most likely stay on for another run.

If JR wants to add forward depth the usual suspects will be the trade bait. It wouldn’t shock me if Brassard was moved in a larger deal. He only has 1 more year on his deal and his salary demands will probably be more then we want to spend for a 3C.

I would look to lock up Sheahan on a 3 year deal for a good cap hit in case he becomes the 3C eventually and then sign a Beagle type.

Brassard, Sheary, Rust, Hunwick are the most likely targets.


If Letang continues to get 24 or 25 minutes a game it'll be another short run.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:23 pm

KG wrote:So im betting there will only be tinkering to the lineup. Kessel and Letang will most likely stay on for another run.

If JR wants to add forward depth the usual suspects will be the trade bait. It wouldn’t shock me if Brassard was moved in a larger deal. He only has 1 more year on his deal and his salary demands will probably be more then we want to spend for a 3C.

I would look to lock up Sheahan on a 3 year deal for a good cap hit in case he becomes the 3C eventually and then sign a Beagle type.

Brassard, Sheary, Rust, Hunwick are the most likely targets.

Well, Yohe talked to Rutherford this morning. Here are the highlights:

--Penguins could sign a free agent or two, but it isn't likely to be on July 1st or in the early stage of free agency. I would suspect anyone here is going to be depth, ie, doesn't sound like Rutherford is going to overpay or chase a guy like JVR or Kovalchuk

--Rutherford's direct quote was "I'm not even thinking about free agency right now." Says with the players they need to resign, that will likely take them up to the cap, so they won't have room to add via free agency. One key statement he said..."We are going to re-sign some of our restricted free agents." Some....a stark change of tune to what he said a few weeks ago, which was all. Of course, he very well could have meant he was going to tender all of them to be able to retain their rights, and not really meant resign.

--Rutherford said a lot of teams are going to be close to the cap like them, said he expects a lot of trades at the draft, and said certainly possible he will be involved, when asked by Yohe.

--“Here’s the thing,” Rutherford said. “I don’t have to do anything. If I don’t do anything this summer, we’re still a contending team. We absolutely needed to get a full summer off. We didn’t want it, but our guys needed it. There’s no question in my mind about that. So, we’ll be in good shape even if we don’t bring anyone in.”

--Yohe said Rutherford was more reluctant to make some moves last year out of loyalty, wanting to bring back the Cup champion players. This year.....“Yeah, it possibly is easier to move some guys now,” Rutherford said. “Those memories and those accomplishments never go away. But we can’t live on those either. We want to win again. So, there’s a real chance we’ll make a couple of changes here in a little bit.”

--Yohe hinted that he would like to make the team younger, but that said, Rutherford won't hesitate to add a 30 plus year old player via trade if he thinks it will help the team now. Rutherford said they are in a year by year mode. They are not at a point to think about transitioning to the future. They are about winning right now.

--Rutherford does not expect to have any contract talks with Guentzel this summer. Said he has other guys to worry about this summer.

--That said, Rutherford again said they may not be able to resign all their guys. Says they have to make sure they aren't locking guys up on term/$$ that would prevent them from locking up a player they want to keep in the future (thinking Guentzel and Sprong here). Sheahan and Oleksiak sounded like the priority to resign. Rust's name never was mentioned in the conversation.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby KG on Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:28 pm

From those quotes above about signing our own RFA's...sounds like JR doesn't want to make the Sheary mistake again...

And I'm fine with waiting out UFA day. Wait it out and get some bargains. At least we don't have to worry about Cullen ruining our plans this offseason! :)
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:40 pm

I kind of think that Rutherford is looking to move Rust, Sheary, Simon, and maybe Hunwick. I'm basing part of this off the rumored Domi pieces offered. I would hate to see Rust go, as I like that he can play both wings, even if he produces better on the RW. But, the Penguins can likely find a quality player for the 4th line at half that cost.

Simon is a dime a dozen to me. He shows flashes, but isn't consistent enough in any one area to have a lot of value.

It will be interesting the rest of this week as things heat up. Excited to see how this team starts shaping up at the draft.
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