Kessel all the way....

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Postby Reilly on Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:46 pm

FallenHero96 wrote:Am I looking too far into things, or does it seem like Greg Malone seemed highest on Staal?


Hopefully Greg Malone is fired when the new GM comes him. In fact his whole staff has to go. I mean seriously, does anyone think Kevin Stevens makes for a good scout?
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Postby kovyman1127 on Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:54 pm

Hopefully Greg Malone is fired when the new GM comes him. In fact his whole staff has to go. I mean seriously, does anyone think Kevin Stevens makes for a good scout?


I think this is the most simple, but brilliant thing I've ever read on LGP.com.

Nepotism giving Kevin Stevens, Joe Mullen, Randy Hillier, Ed O, Glen Patrick, Rick Kehoe, ect jobs.
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Postby relantel on Thu Apr 20, 2006 10:01 pm

kovyman1127 wrote:
Hopefully Greg Malone is fired when the new GM comes him. In fact his whole staff has to go. I mean seriously, does anyone think Kevin Stevens makes for a good scout?


I think this is the most simple, but brilliant thing I've ever read on LGP.com.

Nepotism giving Kevin Stevens, Joe Mullen, Randy Hillier, Ed O, Glen Patrick, Rick Kehoe, ect jobs.


Kehoe's and Malone's ties to the team in a post-player role predate CP...
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Postby ville5 on Thu Apr 20, 2006 10:22 pm

Ron` wrote:That was a ridiculous thing for anyone to say, let alone start their argument for picking Kessel by attributing to some GMs etc. Mark my words this draft is not strong at the top and Kessel is no sure thing.

Well, not so ridiculous. About 10 GMs said they would've taken Kessel OVER Crosby. It's mentioned here:
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/hockey/j ... ocus_x.htm
You can find it alittle before the red box on the left starts. The box with the snipets of the other prospects. (Johnson, Mitera, etc.)
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Postby netwolf on Thu Apr 20, 2006 10:26 pm

Not to bag on Kessel, but I wonder if those GMs have changed their tune?
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Postby Fast B on Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:13 am

ville5 wrote:Well, not so ridiculous. About 10 GMs said they would've taken Kessel OVER Crosby.


Not to put too fine a point on it, but those GMs must have been smoking something. Granted, those statements came long before Crosby was even close to 100 NHL points, but it's still ridiculous on the face of it. Ovechkin may be the only player about whom you could have legitimately made this statement.
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Postby MrKnowNothing on Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:38 am

I think St. Louis might surprise some people and take Kessel first. Just a thought, nothing behind it.

I'm comfortable with Kessel being picked by the Pens now, but I am starting to think that they should see what St Louis wants to swap places.
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Postby Paulie_Walnutz on Fri Apr 21, 2006 1:18 am

Reilly wrote:
FallenHero96 wrote:Am I looking too far into things, or does it seem like Greg Malone seemed highest on Staal?


Hopefully Greg Malone is fired when the new GM comes him. In fact his whole staff has to go. I mean seriously, does anyone think Kevin Stevens makes for a good scout?


I think that should be priority number 2 for the new GM. First priority is getting Malkin over here. The second should be a major overhaul of the scouting staff. The bright future of the Pens is bright as a result of picking so low in the draft. But it's taken 4 seasons to get to this point. I'm glad we have Crosby, Fleury and Malkin in the future, but had the Pens drafted anything other than good AHL players prior to the age of futility, we wouldn't be talking about how great the future will be. I think, it's the moves that Patrick didn't make, just as much as the moves he did make, that cost him his job.
The first mistake was keeping his brother on as the coach of the Baby Pens. Players weren't being developed properly and we are suffering for it now. 2nd mistake, keeping the same scouts after years of drafting 1st round busts. Robert Dome, Craig Hillier, Morozov, now Kraft. Some people may say, "well look at the picks they've gotten in the last 4 years." Those were no-brainer picks. The most work CP did on draft day was trading to get Fleury. And even that didn't take much work as FLA already had their franchise goalie. The 3rd mistake was hiring Edzo, with no coaching experience, and without interviewing any other candidates. I think Edzo will turn out to be a good coach someday, but you don't hire someone with no coaching experience to coach an NHL team.

I forgot to mention another mistake. Keeping Kehoe around as the coach for almost two full seasons, when it was painfully obvious that he had no interest in coaching after his first 20 games.
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Postby DelPen on Fri Apr 21, 2006 7:24 am

ziggystardust wrote:I really want the pens to take Johnson. He can do that move only Chara and Pronger do in the league today - cut off the angle, shut down a passing lane with his stick, shut down a shooting lane with body and throw the puck carrier down with one arm. Now THAT is how you play defense lol


So does everyone else but he'll be going #1 overall. Unless we trade up we aren't getting him.
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Postby LexPenguin on Fri Apr 21, 2006 9:55 am

Long time lurker, first time poster with a couple of thoughts.

Everyone has been giving their own opinion on who St Louis takes and then who people hope STL takes so the Pens can get XXX.

My qualifying pick for St. Louis after looking at that roster and who is in their minors is they NEED to take Kessell, or as DelPen puts it, trades down for Jordan Stahl. I say they take Kessell. Why you ask? Among their top 10 scorers this year - Scott Young (38); Peter Cajanek (30); Dean McAmmond (32); Keith Tkachuk (34); Lee Stempniak (23); Jay McClement (23); Jamal Mayers (31); Dallas Drake (37); Christian Backman (26) - ages of players right now in ( ). That is an OLD collection of players. The Blues have NOTHING in the lines of a big time scorer in the minors, or even one being close to making an impact within two years. Their leading goal scorer was 38-year old Scott Young with 18.

If you combine the Pens and Blues, the goal scorers are ranked as follows: 1. Crosby (Pitt) 39; 2. LeClair and Malone (Pitt) 22; 4. Young (STL) 18; 5. Armstrong and Ouellet (Pitt) 16.

Heck, Gonchar and Leclair would have led them in point totals and everyone thought they sucked on this board.

Bottom line, STL needs scorers.

That brings me to Pittsburgh. The play IMO is hope Johnson falls to them with the number two pick. One of Pittsburgh's flaws is defense. Again, I have read that Whitney sucks, Orpick sucks, Gonchar sucks; Melichar sucks on this board ... Again, can't see the games since I live in Kentucky. Only watch the games when they play at Columbus. Since everyone thinks all of those guys suck defensively, wouldn't it be prudent to draft a DEFENSEMAN? Erik Johnson is a kid who could do the same think a Dion Phaneuf did in Calgary. Pittsburgh DOESN'T have a guy like him on the blueline within the organization. Whitney is a different d-man than him; so is Orpik; so is Welch; so is Gonchar. Combo - offense and defense- Johnson would be the best. His addition would give the Pens a nice and YOUNG blueline collection to build on. Bottom line, Fleury/Caron faced way too many shots this year. Asking them to make high 30s or low 40 saves per game is a bit much. Maybe its the system and the coaching. To me, its defense. There are some gifted scorers that have been found in the later rounds. The list is very long of guys who havee been drafted in the 4-7 rounds, if not later that have put up huge goal totals. You CAN'T find a d-man like Johnson later.

Jonathan Toews is a good one. Saw him play earlier against my alma mater, the University of Denver. Really like his game and someone is going to be getting a very good player. Stahl looks intriguing.

People bring up that its imperative that this pick be ready to play for the Pens in 2006-07? Why so? With Malkin coming over (hopefully) as well as a few cosmetic changes, the offese will be in much better shape. Defensively, I'd imagine a change will be forthcoming as to at least one pretty significant improvement (Free agent) - significant meaning good veteran, but probably not a STUD. Noah Welch should be up and that helps as well. Having this pick ready to play in 2006-07 isn't that necessary.

Just some thoughts.
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Postby Admin on Fri Apr 21, 2006 9:57 am

LexPenguin wrote:Long time lurker, first time poster with a couple of thoughts.

Welcome to the board!
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Postby Reilly on Fri Apr 21, 2006 10:43 am

LexPenguin wrote:Long time lurker, first time poster with a couple of thoughts.

Everyone has been giving their own opinion on who St Louis takes and then who people hope STL takes so the Pens can get XXX.

My qualifying pick for St. Louis after looking at that roster and who is in their minors is they NEED to take Kessell, or as DelPen puts it, trades down for Jordan Stahl. I say they take Kessell. Why you ask? Among their top 10 scorers this year - Scott Young (38); Peter Cajanek (30); Dean McAmmond (32); Keith Tkachuk (34); Lee Stempniak (23); Jay McClement (23); Jamal Mayers (31); Dallas Drake (37); Christian Backman (26) - ages of players right now in ( ). That is an OLD collection of players. The Blues have NOTHING in the lines of a big time scorer in the minors, or even one being close to making an impact within two years. Their leading goal scorer was 38-year old Scott Young with 18.

If you combine the Pens and Blues, the goal scorers are ranked as follows: 1. Crosby (Pitt) 39; 2. LeClair and Malone (Pitt) 22; 4. Young (STL) 18; 5. Armstrong and Ouellet (Pitt) 16.

Heck, Gonchar and Leclair would have led them in point totals and everyone thought they sucked on this board.

Bottom line, STL needs scorers.

That brings me to Pittsburgh. The play IMO is hope Johnson falls to them with the number two pick. One of Pittsburgh's flaws is defense. Again, I have read that Whitney sucks, Orpick sucks, Gonchar sucks; Melichar sucks on this board ... Again, can't see the games since I live in Kentucky. Only watch the games when they play at Columbus. Since everyone thinks all of those guys suck defensively, wouldn't it be prudent to draft a DEFENSEMAN? Erik Johnson is a kid who could do the same think a Dion Phaneuf did in Calgary. Pittsburgh DOESN'T have a guy like him on the blueline within the organization. Whitney is a different d-man than him; so is Orpik; so is Welch; so is Gonchar. Combo - offense and defense- Johnson would be the best. His addition would give the Pens a nice and YOUNG blueline collection to build on. Bottom line, Fleury/Caron faced way too many shots this year. Asking them to make high 30s or low 40 saves per game is a bit much. Maybe its the system and the coaching. To me, its defense. There are some gifted scorers that have been found in the later rounds. The list is very long of guys who havee been drafted in the 4-7 rounds, if not later that have put up huge goal totals. You CAN'T find a d-man like Johnson later.

Jonathan Toews is a good one. Saw him play earlier against my alma mater, the University of Denver. Really like his game and someone is going to be getting a very good player. Stahl looks intriguing.

People bring up that its imperative that this pick be ready to play for the Pens in 2006-07? Why so? With Malkin coming over (hopefully) as well as a few cosmetic changes, the offese will be in much better shape. Defensively, I'd imagine a change will be forthcoming as to at least one pretty significant improvement (Free agent) - significant meaning good veteran, but probably not a STUD. Noah Welch should be up and that helps as well. Having this pick ready to play in 2006-07 isn't that necessary.

Just some thoughts.




thats nice, but St. Louis is taking Johnson. They're not looking to get back to the playoffs next season, they're rebuilding. Their defense has just as many questionmarks as their offense/goaltending.
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Postby FallenHero96 on Fri Apr 21, 2006 10:57 am

People have said that Whitney, Orpik, Gonchar ect all suck but it depends on whos saying it. Let's just say some people here make a lot more sense than some other people here. But this core of defenseman will develop and get better. Especially Whitney. Gonchar is Gonchar, he is high risk/high reward. Thats the price of doing business with him.

Also I think one of the biggest reasons we had the record we had this year is because we had some very poor goaltending most of the year. But in my opinion, and probably many others, we currently have the best crop of defensemen this penguins team has seen in 10 years, even if we dont get Johnson.
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Postby Cire7 on Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:34 pm

Here is an article from a ST. Louis paper on what they think the Blues might do in the draft.

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/sports ... enDocument
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Postby Mad City Mike on Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:48 pm

netwolf wrote:Lange and Errey are on SportsBeat now. Errey thinks St. Louis will take Johnson and the Pens will take Staal. Lange didn't mention anyone by name but thinks the biggest need is a goal scoring power forward.


Errey only thinks they should take Staal because he is from Peterborough.
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Postby Jim on Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:49 pm

Mad City Mike wrote:
netwolf wrote:Lange and Errey are on SportsBeat now. Errey thinks St. Louis will take Johnson and the Pens will take Staal. Lange didn't mention anyone by name but thinks the biggest need is a goal scoring power forward.


Errey only thinks they should take Staal because he is from Peterborough.


I haven't seen any of these guys play... but Staal gets bonus points in my book because he is huge... and should only get bigger. I wouldn't mind a hulking forward with skill...
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Postby netwolf on Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:55 pm

Jim wrote:
Mad City Mike wrote:
netwolf wrote:Lange and Errey are on SportsBeat now. Errey thinks St. Louis will take Johnson and the Pens will take Staal. Lange didn't mention anyone by name but thinks the biggest need is a goal scoring power forward.


Errey only thinks they should take Staal because he is from Peterborough.


I haven't seen any of these guys play... but Staal gets bonus points in my book because he is huge... and should only get bigger. I wouldn't mind a hulking forward with skill...


I don't know, the more I look at Staal and his numbers (he was a point per game guy injuniors this past season), I'm starting to think his rise up the ranking had more to do with his brother's breakout year in Carolina than anything he did. That's not to say he can't or won't be a great player, just makes you wonder...
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Postby Reilly on Fri Apr 21, 2006 1:05 pm

Jim wrote:
Mad City Mike wrote:
netwolf wrote:Lange and Errey are on SportsBeat now. Errey thinks St. Louis will take Johnson and the Pens will take Staal. Lange didn't mention anyone by name but thinks the biggest need is a goal scoring power forward.


Errey only thinks they should take Staal because he is from Peterborough.


I haven't seen any of these guys play... but Staal gets bonus points in my book because he is huge... and should only get bigger. I wouldn't mind a hulking forward with skill...


I'll take Kessels breakaway speed and puck handling over Staal's size. Does Staal even use his size? Kessel will draw so many penalties in the NHL from players having to hook him all the time. Lets not even mention Kessel shoots right. He'll put in so many rebounds cause he goes to the net every single time.
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Postby Ron` on Fri Apr 21, 2006 5:56 pm

Reilly wrote:
LexPenguin wrote:Long time lurker, first time poster with a couple of thoughts.

Everyone has been giving their own opinion on who St Louis takes and then who people hope STL takes so the Pens can get XXX.

My qualifying pick for St. Louis after looking at that roster and who is in their minors is they NEED to take Kessell, or as DelPen puts it, trades down for Jordan Stahl. I say they take Kessell. Why you ask? Among their top 10 scorers this year - Scott Young (38); Peter Cajanek (30); Dean McAmmond (32); Keith Tkachuk (34); Lee Stempniak (23); Jay McClement (23); Jamal Mayers (31); Dallas Drake (37); Christian Backman (26) - ages of players right now in ( ). That is an OLD collection of players. The Blues have NOTHING in the lines of a big time scorer in the minors, or even one being close to making an impact within two years. Their leading goal scorer was 38-year old Scott Young with 18.

If you combine the Pens and Blues, the goal scorers are ranked as follows: 1. Crosby (Pitt) 39; 2. LeClair and Malone (Pitt) 22; 4. Young (STL) 18; 5. Armstrong and Ouellet (Pitt) 16.

Heck, Gonchar and Leclair would have led them in point totals and everyone thought they sucked on this board.

Bottom line, STL needs scorers.

That brings me to Pittsburgh. The play IMO is hope Johnson falls to them with the number two pick. One of Pittsburgh's flaws is defense. Again, I have read that Whitney sucks, Orpick sucks, Gonchar sucks; Melichar sucks on this board ... Again, can't see the games since I live in Kentucky. Only watch the games when they play at Columbus. Since everyone thinks all of those guys suck defensively, wouldn't it be prudent to draft a DEFENSEMAN? Erik Johnson is a kid who could do the same think a Dion Phaneuf did in Calgary. Pittsburgh DOESN'T have a guy like him on the blueline within the organization. Whitney is a different d-man than him; so is Orpik; so is Welch; so is Gonchar. Combo - offense and defense- Johnson would be the best. His addition would give the Pens a nice and YOUNG blueline collection to build on. Bottom line, Fleury/Caron faced way too many shots this year. Asking them to make high 30s or low 40 saves per game is a bit much. Maybe its the system and the coaching. To me, its defense. There are some gifted scorers that have been found in the later rounds. The list is very long of guys who havee been drafted in the 4-7 rounds, if not later that have put up huge goal totals. You CAN'T find a d-man like Johnson later.

Jonathan Toews is a good one. Saw him play earlier against my alma mater, the University of Denver. Really like his game and someone is going to be getting a very good player. Stahl looks intriguing.

People bring up that its imperative that this pick be ready to play for the Pens in 2006-07? Why so? With Malkin coming over (hopefully) as well as a few cosmetic changes, the offese will be in much better shape. Defensively, I'd imagine a change will be forthcoming as to at least one pretty significant improvement (Free agent) - significant meaning good veteran, but probably not a STUD. Noah Welch should be up and that helps as well. Having this pick ready to play in 2006-07 isn't that necessary.

Just some thoughts.




thats nice, but St. Louis is taking Johnson. They're not looking to get back to the playoffs next season, they're rebuilding. Their defense has just as many questionmarks as their offense/goaltending.


Are you always this rude? He makes a valid point and you respond by saying "thats nice, but ST Louis is taking Johnson, summarily dismissing him like an incredulous window licker. It must be great to be Reilly, how does it really feel?
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Postby Reilly on Fri Apr 21, 2006 7:00 pm

Ron` wrote:
Reilly wrote:
LexPenguin wrote:Long time lurker, first time poster with a couple of thoughts.

Everyone has been giving their own opinion on who St Louis takes and then who people hope STL takes so the Pens can get XXX.

My qualifying pick for St. Louis after looking at that roster and who is in their minors is they NEED to take Kessell, or as DelPen puts it, trades down for Jordan Stahl. I say they take Kessell. Why you ask? Among their top 10 scorers this year - Scott Young (38); Peter Cajanek (30); Dean McAmmond (32); Keith Tkachuk (34); Lee Stempniak (23); Jay McClement (23); Jamal Mayers (31); Dallas Drake (37); Christian Backman (26) - ages of players right now in ( ). That is an OLD collection of players. The Blues have NOTHING in the lines of a big time scorer in the minors, or even one being close to making an impact within two years. Their leading goal scorer was 38-year old Scott Young with 18.

If you combine the Pens and Blues, the goal scorers are ranked as follows: 1. Crosby (Pitt) 39; 2. LeClair and Malone (Pitt) 22; 4. Young (STL) 18; 5. Armstrong and Ouellet (Pitt) 16.

Heck, Gonchar and Leclair would have led them in point totals and everyone thought they sucked on this board.

Bottom line, STL needs scorers.

That brings me to Pittsburgh. The play IMO is hope Johnson falls to them with the number two pick. One of Pittsburgh's flaws is defense. Again, I have read that Whitney sucks, Orpick sucks, Gonchar sucks; Melichar sucks on this board ... Again, can't see the games since I live in Kentucky. Only watch the games when they play at Columbus. Since everyone thinks all of those guys suck defensively, wouldn't it be prudent to draft a DEFENSEMAN? Erik Johnson is a kid who could do the same think a Dion Phaneuf did in Calgary. Pittsburgh DOESN'T have a guy like him on the blueline within the organization. Whitney is a different d-man than him; so is Orpik; so is Welch; so is Gonchar. Combo - offense and defense- Johnson would be the best. His addition would give the Pens a nice and YOUNG blueline collection to build on. Bottom line, Fleury/Caron faced way too many shots this year. Asking them to make high 30s or low 40 saves per game is a bit much. Maybe its the system and the coaching. To me, its defense. There are some gifted scorers that have been found in the later rounds. The list is very long of guys who havee been drafted in the 4-7 rounds, if not later that have put up huge goal totals. You CAN'T find a d-man like Johnson later.

Jonathan Toews is a good one. Saw him play earlier against my alma mater, the University of Denver. Really like his game and someone is going to be getting a very good player. Stahl looks intriguing.

People bring up that its imperative that this pick be ready to play for the Pens in 2006-07? Why so? With Malkin coming over (hopefully) as well as a few cosmetic changes, the offese will be in much better shape. Defensively, I'd imagine a change will be forthcoming as to at least one pretty significant improvement (Free agent) - significant meaning good veteran, but probably not a STUD. Noah Welch should be up and that helps as well. Having this pick ready to play in 2006-07 isn't that necessary.

Just some thoughts.




thats nice, but St. Louis is taking Johnson. They're not looking to get back to the playoffs next season, they're rebuilding. Their defense has just as many questionmarks as their offense/goaltending.


It must be great to be Reilly, how does it really feel?



it feels awesome.
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Postby DelPen on Fri Apr 21, 2006 7:12 pm

Cire7 wrote:Here is an article from a ST. Louis paper on what they think the Blues might do in the draft.

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/sports ... enDocument


Is this guys a regular Blues beat writer because he doesn't know much about the NHL and how the draft works. The Pens didn't lose 2nd overall, they simply didn't change position. And the NHL draft does not work like the NFL draft where teams covet 4th rounders. Anything beyond the top 5 is a crap shoot and most of the time it's the top 3. You don't trade down for more picks, you trade down for immediate help like the Lightning did when they traded the #4 (Pitkanen) away for Fedotenko. They didn't trade it for a later 1st, a 4th and a 6th like an NFL team would have done.
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Postby Ron` on Fri Apr 21, 2006 8:19 pm

It must be great to be Reilly, how does it really feel?[/quote]


it feels awesome.[/quote]

The life of Reilly
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