Pierre saying Malkin to Kings for Kopitar, Dustin Brown

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Postby doublem on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:30 pm

PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.



You're missing the point. If you trade him now or next year his value will likely be equal or close. There will be 10 teams willing to pay the max for him this year OR next. Why trade him now when you can have him for a year at a 4mill cap hit.

Shero would just have to make up his mind now that's whats going to happen, but if he decided to trade him now i guess his decision would already be made up; so thats not a problem.


I get what you are saying and I agree that holding onto him as long as possible is smart. But the problem I see--and maybe I'm assuming way too much here--is that Malkin would HAVE to be dealt because every GM in the league is going to see that the Penguins can't afford to have 3 players taking up half of the payroll. So whereas right this second it would be a "luxury" to deal Malkin but at the end of next season it would be a "necessity". So in theory GM's would know that they could give up less in return.


Why would it be necessity? If they dont resign hossa they will have plenty of room. Crosby, 8.7, lets even say malkin 11 thats 20. Than whit, gonch, fleury, malone thats another 20 maybe, add staal thats maybe around 43 million that leaves around 15 million and thats a rough esimate.
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Postby Bob McKenzie on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:31 pm

PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.


If it comes down to Malkin and Hossa, I let Hossa walk. It is easier to find a winger that can score some goals than it is to find a game-breaking player such as Ovechkin, Crosby, or Malkin.


I agree 110%. But on the other hand that's exactly why you can get a Lindrosian return for one player such as that. It's interesting to think about the possibilities but you simply can't fail if you keep Malkin over Hossa.


If Peter Forsberg never panned out, that trade wouldn't have looked so good. Mike Ricci was a good player, but he wasn't a game breaker like Lindros before Scott Stevens killed him.
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Postby doublem on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:33 pm

Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.


If it comes down to Malkin and Hossa, I let Hossa walk. It is easier to find a winger that can score some goals than it is to find a game-breaking player such as Ovechkin, Crosby, or Malkin.


I agree 110%. But on the other hand that's exactly why you can get a Lindrosian return for one player such as that. It's interesting to think about the possibilities but you simply can't fail if you keep Malkin over Hossa.


If Peter Forsberg never panned out, that trade wouldn't have looked so good. Mike Ricci was a good player, but he wasn't a game breaker like Lindros before Scott Stevens killed him.


And trades like that never happen, Lindros is about the only example of it and when it does happen the best player, which is malkin usually wins for the team.
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Postby PenguinHockeyFanatic on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:34 pm

doublem wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.



You're missing the point. If you trade him now or next year his value will likely be equal or close. There will be 10 teams willing to pay the max for him this year OR next. Why trade him now when you can have him for a year at a 4mill cap hit.

Shero would just have to make up his mind now that's whats going to happen, but if he decided to trade him now i guess his decision would already be made up; so thats not a problem.


I get what you are saying and I agree that holding onto him as long as possible is smart. But the problem I see--and maybe I'm assuming way too much here--is that Malkin would HAVE to be dealt because every GM in the league is going to see that the Penguins can't afford to have 3 players taking up half of the payroll. So whereas right this second it would be a "luxury" to deal Malkin but at the end of next season it would be a "necessity". So in theory GM's would know that they could give up less in return.


Why would it be necessity? If they dont resign hossa they will have plenty of room. Crosby, 8.7, lets even say malkin 11 thats 20. Than whit, gonch, fleury, malone thats another 20 maybe, add staal thats maybe around 43 million that leaves around 15 million and thats a rough esimate.


Oh ok, you're suggesting that they don't sign Hossa and then trade Malkin?

I understand what you're saying now, but the only way I would consider trading Malkin is if I knew I could give Hossa that money. If Kopitar doesn't work out you can trade him down the line for another good player or two.
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Postby PenguinHockeyFanatic on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:35 pm

Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.


If it comes down to Malkin and Hossa, I let Hossa walk. It is easier to find a winger that can score some goals than it is to find a game-breaking player such as Ovechkin, Crosby, or Malkin.


I agree 110%. But on the other hand that's exactly why you can get a Lindrosian return for one player such as that. It's interesting to think about the possibilities but you simply can't fail if you keep Malkin over Hossa.


If Peter Forsberg never panned out, that trade wouldn't have looked so good. Mike Ricci was a good player, but he wasn't a game breaker like Lindros before Scott Stevens killed him.


Yeah but didn't they get like 5 first rounders and a #1 goalie as well (Hextall)?
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Postby doublem on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:36 pm

PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
doublem wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.



You're missing the point. If you trade him now or next year his value will likely be equal or close. There will be 10 teams willing to pay the max for him this year OR next. Why trade him now when you can have him for a year at a 4mill cap hit.

Shero would just have to make up his mind now that's whats going to happen, but if he decided to trade him now i guess his decision would already be made up; so thats not a problem.


I get what you are saying and I agree that holding onto him as long as possible is smart. But the problem I see--and maybe I'm assuming way too much here--is that Malkin would HAVE to be dealt because every GM in the league is going to see that the Penguins can't afford to have 3 players taking up half of the payroll. So whereas right this second it would be a "luxury" to deal Malkin but at the end of next season it would be a "necessity". So in theory GM's would know that they could give up less in return.


Why would it be necessity? If they dont resign hossa they will have plenty of room. Crosby, 8.7, lets even say malkin 11 thats 20. Than whit, gonch, fleury, malone thats another 20 maybe, add staal thats maybe around 43 million that leaves around 15 million and thats a rough esimate.


Oh ok, you're suggesting that they don't sign Hossa and then trade Malkin?

I understand what you're saying now, but the only way I would consider trading Malkin is if I knew I could give Hossa that money. If Kopitar doesn't work out you can trade him down the line for another good player or two.


No, im saying they would have plenty of cap space for malkin without hossa and no you never trade malkin.
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Postby doublem on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:38 pm

PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.


If it comes down to Malkin and Hossa, I let Hossa walk. It is easier to find a winger that can score some goals than it is to find a game-breaking player such as Ovechkin, Crosby, or Malkin.


I agree 110%. But on the other hand that's exactly why you can get a Lindrosian return for one player such as that. It's interesting to think about the possibilities but you simply can't fail if you keep Malkin over Hossa.


If Peter Forsberg never panned out, that trade wouldn't have looked so good. Mike Ricci was a good player, but he wasn't a game breaker like Lindros before Scott Stevens killed him.


Yeah but didn't they get like 5 first rounders and a #1 goalie as well (Hextall)?


They got tons of money and a bunch of good players but not great the trade was Peter Forsberg, as well as Ron Hextall, Chris Simon, Mike Ricci, Kerry Huffman, Steve Duchesne, a 1st round selection (Jocelyn Thibault) in 1993, a 1st round selection (later traded to the Toronto Maple Leafs, later traded to the Washington Capitals - Nolan Baumgartner) in 1994, and $15,000,000 cash.
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Postby pcsteel203 on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:39 pm

You get max value for Malkin right now...one year from now...GM's will back off...knowing the Pens cant afford him...and they can scoop him up RFA for just the picks

It actually makes sense...but only if they sign Hossa
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Postby purelebo84 on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:41 pm

Don't believe it for even a second.
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Postby joker10277 on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:42 pm

They better not trade Malkin, :shock: I bought his home and winter classic jersey.... :D
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Postby PenguinHockeyFanatic on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:42 pm

doublem wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
doublem wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.



You're missing the point. If you trade him now or next year his value will likely be equal or close. There will be 10 teams willing to pay the max for him this year OR next. Why trade him now when you can have him for a year at a 4mill cap hit.

Shero would just have to make up his mind now that's whats going to happen, but if he decided to trade him now i guess his decision would already be made up; so thats not a problem.


I get what you are saying and I agree that holding onto him as long as possible is smart. But the problem I see--and maybe I'm assuming way too much here--is that Malkin would HAVE to be dealt because every GM in the league is going to see that the Penguins can't afford to have 3 players taking up half of the payroll. So whereas right this second it would be a "luxury" to deal Malkin but at the end of next season it would be a "necessity". So in theory GM's would know that they could give up less in return.


Why would it be necessity? If they dont resign hossa they will have plenty of room. Crosby, 8.7, lets even say malkin 11 thats 20. Than whit, gonch, fleury, malone thats another 20 maybe, add staal thats maybe around 43 million that leaves around 15 million and thats a rough esimate.


Oh ok, you're suggesting that they don't sign Hossa and then trade Malkin?

I understand what you're saying now, but the only way I would consider trading Malkin is if I knew I could give Hossa that money. If Kopitar doesn't work out you can trade him down the line for another good player or two.


No, im saying they would have plenty of cap space for malkin without hossa and no you never trade malkin.


Okay. Yeah I mean that's what I would do too. Let Hossa go allow yourself the cap space to comfortably pay Geno and bring in some new wingers who will hopefully work out.

I thought you were speculating about when you would trade Geno, not if. If that's the case, you could wait will whenever to deal Geno if you don't sign Hossa. But if they do sign Hossa they would have to trade Geno soon. Because once his contract kicks in it's Tampa Bay all over again.

Once Hossa signs elsewhere all of these Geno rumors will go away too. They wont ever trade him without a Hossa type in his place.
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Postby czwalga on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:42 pm

PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.



You're missing the point. If you trade him now or next year his value will likely be equal or close. There will be 10 teams willing to pay the max for him this year OR next. Why trade him now when you can have him for a year at a 4mill cap hit.

Shero would just have to make up his mind now that's whats going to happen, but if he decided to trade him now i guess his decision would already be made up; so thats not a problem.


I get what you are saying and I agree that holding onto him as long as possible is smart. But the problem I see--and maybe I'm assuming way too much here--is that Malkin would HAVE to be dealt because every GM in the league is going to see that the Penguins can't afford to have 3 players taking up half of the payroll. So whereas right this second it would be a "luxury" to deal Malkin but at the end of next season it would be a "necessity". So in theory GM's would know that they could give up less in return.




See what you're thinking is correct for 98% of the players in the league. The GM's would be battling against other GM's to obtain his rights not against the penguins situation. There's going to be so many offers because of who he is. If he was just an above average player what you're thinking may come into play.
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Postby HomerPenguin on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:43 pm

If I'm Shero, I say "Hmm, well, throw in Jack Johnson and, maybe, I won't soil myself while laughing in your face. But my answer will still be 'No.'"
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Postby meecrofilm on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:46 pm

HomerPenguin wrote:If I'm Shero, I say "Hmm, well, throw in Jack Johnson and, maybe, I won't soil myself while laughing in your face. But my answer will still be 'No.'"


Hah, pretty much.

All these Malkin trade speculation threads are making my head hurt.

He's not going anywhere.
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Postby Maagwa on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:46 pm

pcsteel203 wrote:You get max value for Malkin right now...one year from now...GM's will back off...knowing the Pens cant afford him...and they can scoop him up RFA for just the picks

It actually makes sense...but only if they sign Hossa

NO

I said it before and I'll say it again... I'd rather have Malkin than Crosby, AO, Etc .... there is just something about him... I don't think as much of hisl potential is show compared to AO and Sid
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Postby PenguinHockeyFanatic on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:46 pm

doublem wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.


If it comes down to Malkin and Hossa, I let Hossa walk. It is easier to find a winger that can score some goals than it is to find a game-breaking player such as Ovechkin, Crosby, or Malkin.


I agree 110%. But on the other hand that's exactly why you can get a Lindrosian return for one player such as that. It's interesting to think about the possibilities but you simply can't fail if you keep Malkin over Hossa.


If Peter Forsberg never panned out, that trade wouldn't have looked so good. Mike Ricci was a good player, but he wasn't a game breaker like Lindros before Scott Stevens killed him.


Yeah but didn't they get like 5 first rounders and a #1 goalie as well (Hextall)?


They got tons of money and a bunch of good players but not great the trade was Peter Forsberg, as well as Ron Hextall, Chris Simon, Mike Ricci, Kerry Huffman, Steve Duchesne, a 1st round selection (Jocelyn Thibault) in 1993, a 1st round selection (later traded to the Toronto Maple Leafs, later traded to the Washington Capitals - Nolan Baumgartner) in 1994, and $15,000,000 cash.


The Nordiques won the Cups, the Flyers didn't. If the Pens could land 2 awesome players and maybe even some good draft picks for a super-star starved franchise like LA I think the Pens should listen. Especially when you have a #2 overall pick that is in the NHL and playing center, and the financial freedom to land a player who is almost as good as Geno.

It makes a lot of sense actually. But I still wouldn't trade Geno! :D
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Postby Bob McKenzie on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:47 pm

PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.


If it comes down to Malkin and Hossa, I let Hossa walk. It is easier to find a winger that can score some goals than it is to find a game-breaking player such as Ovechkin, Crosby, or Malkin.


I agree 110%. But on the other hand that's exactly why you can get a Lindrosian return for one player such as that. It's interesting to think about the possibilities but you simply can't fail if you keep Malkin over Hossa.


If Peter Forsberg never panned out, that trade wouldn't have looked so good. Mike Ricci was a good player, but he wasn't a game breaker like Lindros before Scott Stevens killed him.


Yeah but didn't they get like 5 first rounders and a #1 goalie as well (Hextall)?


Hextall wasn't all that.

Lindros was traded for:
Peter Forsberg (unknown talent at the time - I remember watching the draft and the announcers didn't even know who he was and was surprised he was chosen so high)
Ron Hextall - G (nothing special)
Mike Ricci - C (Good player)
Chris Simon - LW (Ok/prospect)
Kerry Huffman - D (Average D like Darryl Sydor)
Steve Duchesne - D (Offensive Defenseman - Decent)
1st round pick (turned out to be Jocelyn Thibault)
1st round pick (traded to the Maple Leafs)
$15 million dollars

Today, I'm not even sure you could do this trade with the CBA. Forsberg, Simon and Ricci were the only players out of the deal that lasted when the Nordiques/Avs started winning.

Aside from the money, if Forsberg didn't pan out and became the next Robert Dome or Craig Hillier, the trade wouldn't have worked out so well.
Last edited by Bob McKenzie on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Kovy27 on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:47 pm

If this was the "deal" their 1st round pick better be involved.
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Postby Durbano on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:49 pm

Has Malkin ever said (even if it was in translation) that he wants the max? Or has his agent ever indicated same?
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Postby Kovy27 on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:50 pm

Anyone who says they would keep Malkin over Crosby needs to watch more hockey to see that Crosby is leagues ahead of AO and Malkin.

This rumor is very real....The salary cap is the reason why this would happen.
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Postby pens#1 on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:52 pm

Durbano wrote:Has Malkin ever said (even if it was in translation) that he wants the max? Or has his agent ever indicated same?


NO HE HASN'T!!!!!
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Postby Maagwa on Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:57 pm

Kovy27 wrote:Anyone who says they would keep Malkin over Crosby needs to watch more hockey to see that Crosby is leagues ahead of AO and Malkin.

This rumor is very real....The salary cap is the reason why this would happen.

I've pretty much looked at every stat I could find about Malkin (his russian league stuff).... every Video Clip on youtube, Vimeo, Etc I've been looking at this forever... mark my words... that kid is going to be a legend if it just gets his work ethic/motivation... I think Crosby does anything it takes... but Malkin has more ability than anyone I've seen snice I was watching hockey.... anyway

Kovy I am getting the impression you think we should keep Hossa over Malkin.... in that case I kinda lost value in your posts no offence.... Malkin fits this team with his age.. and will grow at the same rate.. and I having trouble expressing my thoughts atm but I am willing to have a discussion
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Postby Bob McKenzie on Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:00 pm

PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
doublem wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
PenguinHockeyFanatic wrote:
czwalga wrote:You dont trade malkin till next year IF you ever do it. You're trading him away when basically you can get the same type of deals next year.

If he gets traded he's going to ask for the max, this year or next; whoever trades for him will know this and expect it. So if we sign him to the max next year then trade him... we at least have him next year.


I would agree except for one thing. What if they want to sign Hossa? If they sign him and really go for another strong Cup caliber team this season then they will be left with little room to negotiate for Malkin. Especially because Gonchar will still be on the books for that season and Fleury and Staal will bump up the cap a lot too.

So even thgouh his value would be just as good if not better if they waited, the economic feasibility of retaining him could put the Pens in a desperate situation to almost "dump" a contract, and I don't ever want to see that word used again.


If it comes down to Malkin and Hossa, I let Hossa walk. It is easier to find a winger that can score some goals than it is to find a game-breaking player such as Ovechkin, Crosby, or Malkin.


I agree 110%. But on the other hand that's exactly why you can get a Lindrosian return for one player such as that. It's interesting to think about the possibilities but you simply can't fail if you keep Malkin over Hossa.


If Peter Forsberg never panned out, that trade wouldn't have looked so good. Mike Ricci was a good player, but he wasn't a game breaker like Lindros before Scott Stevens killed him.


Yeah but didn't they get like 5 first rounders and a #1 goalie as well (Hextall)?


They got tons of money and a bunch of good players but not great the trade was Peter Forsberg, as well as Ron Hextall, Chris Simon, Mike Ricci, Kerry Huffman, Steve Duchesne, a 1st round selection (Jocelyn Thibault) in 1993, a 1st round selection (later traded to the Toronto Maple Leafs, later traded to the Washington Capitals - Nolan Baumgartner) in 1994, and $15,000,000 cash.


The Nordiques won the Cups, the Flyers didn't. If the Pens could land 2 awesome players and maybe even some good draft picks for a super-star starved franchise like LA I think the Pens should listen. Especially when you have a #2 overall pick that is in the NHL and playing center, and the financial freedom to land a player who is almost as good as Geno.

It makes a lot of sense actually. But I still wouldn't trade Geno! :D


I think Joe Sakic had something to do with it.

Like I said, Forsberg was an unknown commodity at the time. If he became Alexander Daigle, it'd been a different story.

The Nordiques had a ton of young talent from their drafts and years of playing bad, just like the Pens now.
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Postby Kovy27 on Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:01 pm

Maagwa wrote:
Kovy27 wrote:Anyone who says they would keep Malkin over Crosby needs to watch more hockey to see that Crosby is leagues ahead of AO and Malkin.

This rumor is very real....The salary cap is the reason why this would happen.

I've pretty much looked at every stat I could find about Malkin (his russian league stuff).... every Video Clip on youtube, Vimeo, Etc I've been looking at this forever... mark my words... that kid is going to be a legend if it just gets his work ethic/motivation... I think Crosby does anything it takes... but Malkin has more ability than anyone I've seen snice I was watching hockey.... anyway

Kovy I am getting the impression you think we should keep Hossa over Malkin.... in that case I kinda lost value in your posts no offence.... Malkin fits this team with his age.. and will grow at the same rate.. and I having trouble expressing my thoughts atm but I am willing to have a discussion


I am more worried about the salary cap and being able to bring talent in. If Hossa comes in at 7 mill and has major mojo working with Sid...that is such a plus. Sid is by far and away the best player in this league...and he's proven it. This is Sid's team...not Malkin's, not Fleury's, not Whitney....You build around Sid and make the team competitive.

Sid has every ability to take this team to the next level. I don't get that with Malkin. When Sid was out...Malkin + Defense + Conklin got them into the playoffs. Conklin was the main reason why they got it. Hate to break it to you.
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Postby Dickie Dunn on Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:06 pm

I don't feel like finding it but I know I saw wrong information about Dustin Brown's contract somewhere in this thread. His average salary is 3.175 million through the 2014-15 season.

As far as this rumor goes, I'd love to see another player added in to the "deal" like Johnson, Cammalleri, or Frolov, but regardless of that, I've never been against dealing Malkin.
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