Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Henry Hank on Sat Nov 29, 2008 7:55 pm

It's not possible for any player to dominate like that anymore. Players are stronger and faster in general, teams focus a lot more on D, goalie equipment is still a lot bigger.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Stan Potash on Sat Nov 29, 2008 8:01 pm

Anything is possible.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Stan Potash on Sat Nov 29, 2008 8:08 pm

Players in the 80s were stronger and faster than they were in the 50s, yet Mario and Gretzky were still able to dominate like nobody before them, eh?
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Killiecrankie on Sat Nov 29, 2008 8:10 pm

purelebo84 wrote:Sid and Geno will go down as the 2nd and 3rd best players in Pens history.

They will both go down as top 20 players in NHL history.



I understand you may be too young to remember Jagr in his prime, but at the moment, neither Sid or Geno is close to the dominance of Jaromir Jagr.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Henry Hank on Sat Nov 29, 2008 8:20 pm

The game evolved from th 50's to the 80's in ways that enhanced offense - curves on sticks, the playing style adopted from the Russians. Everything from the 80's to now has been defensive-oriented. Few teams play free wheeling hockey, goalies have a huge advantage compared to what they had. Unless the game changes in ways that promote offense, you're not going to see players dominate like that.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Guinness on Sat Nov 29, 2008 8:22 pm

Rocco wrote:
Kovy27 wrote:I thought Bob Boughner was the best Penguin in history.


That would be your boy Rico Fata.


Two words: Rick. Berry.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Stan Potash on Sat Nov 29, 2008 8:35 pm

Henry Hank wrote:The game evolved from th 50's to the 80's in ways that enhanced offense - curves on sticks, the playing style adopted from the Russians. Everything from the 80's to now has been defensive-oriented. Few teams play free wheeling hockey, goalies have a huge advantage compared to what they had. Unless the game changes in ways that promote offense, you're not going to see players dominate like that.



Which isn't to say it's not possible
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby dman66 on Sat Nov 29, 2008 9:40 pm

i think that if mario or wayne played in this generation of players, they might still be ahead of the pack. if sid, malkin, and ao played in the 80s, they would most definitely tear up the nhl at the time. with the pads being larger, and teams playing more defensively, it may be impossible to compare everyone
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Pitts on Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:13 pm

Stan Potash wrote:Which brings up an interesting question: Were Gretzky and Lemieux actually that much better than Sid, Malkin, AO, etc, or were they just that much better than their competition at the time? I think most would have to agree that the skill level of the competition wasn't as refined as it is now. But does that mean it's more or less impressive that Gretzky and Lemieux were able to excel the way they did?

Sorry, Lemieux in his day would skate circles around Crosby and Malkin. Yes, he was THAT good.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Zag35 on Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:16 pm

Well they are officailly 1 - 2 now, Malkin 39, Sid 34!!
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby littlemoonboot on Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:19 pm

Mario was just...... :shock: :shock: :shock:
MCM "Monk Moments" all over the place.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby littlemoonboot on Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:31 pm

Malkin leads the league in assists. Who are people calling Adam Oates? :twisted:
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby mjg on Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:37 pm

littlemoonboot wrote:Mario was just...... :shock: :shock: :shock:
MCM "Monk Moments" all over the place.


Remember that goal Mario scored on the faceoff? Sid and Geno can't even win faceoffs let alone score goals off faceoffs.

But seriously, Sid and Geno could compete with the best of the 80's. Players evolve from one generation to the next. They get better.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Steve on Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:41 pm

tombarrassorules wrote:bobby errey needs to sit down and think of a better nickname than "two headed monster". take a good hard look at yourself bob, and come up with something better.


Yes.

And, stop mentioning John Madden's name during the game. He's not playing!
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby toby91_ca on Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:04 am

Killiecrankie wrote:
purelebo84 wrote:Sid and Geno will go down as the 2nd and 3rd best players in Pens history.

They will both go down as top 20 players in NHL history.



I understand you may be too young to remember Jagr in his prime, but at the moment, neither Sid or Geno is close to the dominance of Jaromir Jagr.

Perhaps not yet, but when Jagr was Crosby's age, his stats were 231gp, 93g, 220pts. Crosby's currently at 236gp, 112g, 328pts.

Also, during the 2006/07, there was a points in the season where he was on pace to lead the league in scoring by 40+ pts. I think injuries drew him back to the pack (even though he didn't stop playing).
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby JoseCuervo on Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:10 am

Steve wrote:
tombarrassorules wrote:bobby errey needs to sit down and think of a better nickname than "two headed monster". take a good hard look at yourself bob, and come up with something better.


Yes.

And, stop mentioning John Madden's name during the game. He's not playing!


But if he was in the game, Crosby wouldn't have gotten close to a hat trick.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby littlemoonboot on Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:12 am

mjg wrote:
littlemoonboot wrote:Mario was just...... :shock: :shock: :shock:
MCM "Monk Moments" all over the place.


Remember that goal Mario scored on the faceoff?


Yes. :shock:
I don't like to take away from what Sid and Geno are doing, and they are still young. Who knows. But my god, Mario's talent was just unreal and there is no telling what he could have accomplished if he was always healthy.

Fighting cancer? No problem. Hey guys, just finished radiation but let's still get a game winning streak and President's trophy and I'll take that scoring title again. It's all good!

I was just thinking the other day about some crazy goal he had, it must have been playoffs 92 but it was like a curveball goal or something. He was way off at about the goal line and by the far boards...it was like some crazy golf goal or something.
Last edited by littlemoonboot on Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby meecrofilm on Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:12 am

JoseCuervo wrote:
Steve wrote:
tombarrassorules wrote:bobby errey needs to sit down and think of a better nickname than "two headed monster". take a good hard look at yourself bob, and come up with something better.


Yes.

And, stop mentioning John Madden's name during the game. He's not playing!


But if he was in the game, Crosby wouldn't have gotten close to a hat trick.


Madden may have been watching on the FSN feed if he was travelling with the team. Imagine how angry all those comments must have made him. Steigy and Errey ftw.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Stan Potash on Sun Nov 30, 2008 3:56 am

lulz
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby André on Sun Nov 30, 2008 8:53 am

Stan Potash wrote:
Which brings up an interesting question: Were Gretzky and Lemieux actually that much better than Sid, Malkin, AO, etc, or were they just that much better than their competition at the time? I think most would have to agree that the skill level of the competition wasn't as refined as it is now. But does that mean it's more or less impressive that Gretzky and Lemieux were able to excel the way they did? After all, they were using the same equipment as their competition. Stick AO on the Islanders in 1983 and see how many goals he'd score. That would be amazing to see.


It's more that they were better than the competition of their time, which is also what matters. Just like in any sport.

AO wouldn't have been the same if born in the early 60's. Genetics, new training/diet etc. Like I've said a 100 times before that reasoning doesn't makes sense, I bet there are 100 forwards today who would tear it up if they were transfered to the 80's Islanders/Oilers with a time machine. What someone did vs the competition in their own era is what matters.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby André on Sun Nov 30, 2008 9:10 am

toby91_ca wrote:
Killiecrankie wrote:
purelebo84 wrote:Sid and Geno will go down as the 2nd and 3rd best players in Pens history.

They will both go down as top 20 players in NHL history.



I understand you may be too young to remember Jagr in his prime, but at the moment, neither Sid or Geno is close to the dominance of Jaromir Jagr.

Perhaps not yet, but when Jagr was Crosby's age, his stats were 231gp, 93g, 220pts. Crosby's currently at 236gp, 112g, 328pts.

Also, during the 2006/07, there was a points in the season where he was on pace to lead the league in scoring by 40+ pts. I think injuries drew him back to the pack (even though he didn't stop playing).


Killiecrankie: If he was born in 84 I'm sure he's seen Jagr's prime. One of his prime seasons was two years ago :P Altough I'd say 95-01 was his real prime.

They way Sid and Malkin are playing now could very well be compared to Jagr's top level. Soon at least. 68 was the best player in the world for different stretches and both Sid and Geno has been that now as well (altough shorter stretches). Actually, if you compare them by age they're both better than Jagr.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby André on Sun Nov 30, 2008 9:12 am

mjg wrote:
littlemoonboot wrote:Mario was just...... :shock: :shock: :shock:
MCM "Monk Moments" all over the place.


Remember that goal Mario scored on the faceoff? Sid and Geno can't even win faceoffs let alone score goals off faceoffs.

But seriously, Sid and Geno could compete with the best of the 80's. Players evolve from one generation to the next. They get better.


They would dominate, as they're dominating now.

Barring serious injuries they could both go down as top 10 of all time. Ovechkin too. That's how special these guys are.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby czwalga on Sun Nov 30, 2008 11:17 am

Malkin and Crosby have the ability to eclipse jagr, they don't have a chance in hell to eclipse lemieux; atleast in terms of pure skill. If lemieux stayed healthy and had crosbys work ethic... well no words. :shock:
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Why So Serious? on Sun Nov 30, 2008 11:19 am

czwalga wrote:Malkin and Crosby have the ability to eclipse jagr, they don't have a chance in hell to eclipse lemieux; atleast in terms of pure skill. If lemieux stayed healthy and had crosbys work ethic... well no words. :shock:


Mario = simply the game's best. Ever.

Nobody will even get close to what he did, including 87 and 71.
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Re: Malkin and Crosby 1 & 2 in Leaders in Scoring

Postby Rocco on Sun Nov 30, 2008 11:20 am

toby91_ca wrote:
Killiecrankie wrote:
purelebo84 wrote:Sid and Geno will go down as the 2nd and 3rd best players in Pens history.

They will both go down as top 20 players in NHL history.



I understand you may be too young to remember Jagr in his prime, but at the moment, neither Sid or Geno is close to the dominance of Jaromir Jagr.

Perhaps not yet, but when Jagr was Crosby's age, his stats were 231gp, 93g, 220pts. Crosby's currently at 236gp, 112g, 328pts.

Also, during the 2006/07, there was a points in the season where he was on pace to lead the league in scoring by 40+ pts. I think injuries drew him back to the pack (even though he didn't stop playing).


That's a little misleading- Jagr was extremely raw and came to a deeper, veteran team with a coach that wouldn't play him in the 3rd period. Crosby started on a pretty lousy team and got all the 1st line ice time or PP time he could handle once Edzo was canned and Therrien took over. Crosby was also much more ready for the NHL on his arrival than Jagr- I'm not sure how much better Jagr's numbers would have been in his first season with more ice time because it was pretty clear that he wasn't ready yet. The real tragedy of Jagr's career is that he hit his prime as the NHL's period of high scoring was coming to a close and spent his years from 25-30 years old playing in the clutch-and-grab era. By the time the NHL opens things up again, he's on the downside of his career.
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