How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby DocEmrick on Fri Jan 23, 2009 3:54 pm

conforto45 wrote:
DocEmrick wrote:Trading Satan, Eaton frees up enough space for St. Louis I believe. And Tampa's dumb enough to do it. Plus they're desperate. It won't happen, but it would be cool.

Oh, and Eklund has some BS up that we're interested in Prucha. :roll: :roll: :roll:


again? werent we interested in Prucha 2 years ago? Malone for Prucha, that sounds familiar...

i wouldve rather had Malone then.. and i wish we still had Malone now


Yeah there were multiple rumors of a Malone for Prucha deal if I remember correctly. Pretty ridiculous, and it's all speculation based on a few years ago I'll bet.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby DelPen on Fri Jan 23, 2009 3:55 pm

No. That would be a horrible trade. You don't move Whitney unless you are getting a Nathan Horton or a Brian Ginota back in return.

As far as the roster when everyone is healthy:

Cooke-Crosby-Malkin
Fedotenko-Staal-Sykora
Dupuis-Talbot-Kennedy
Biznasty-Thomas-Godard

Gonchar-Orpik
Scuderi-Whitney
Letang-Gill

That should be good enough to win on a consistant basis.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby Pitts on Fri Jan 23, 2009 4:12 pm

Anyone notice where the leafs are in the standings? Leafs wingers suck. That's why the team sucks. No thanks. ;)
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby KG on Fri Jan 23, 2009 4:13 pm

DelPen wrote:No. That would be a horrible trade. You don't move Whitney unless you are getting a Nathan Horton or a Brian Ginota back in return.

As far as the roster when everyone is healthy:

Cooke-Crosby-Malkin
Fedotenko-Staal-Sykora
Dupuis-Talbot-Kennedy
Biznasty-Thomas-Godard

Gonchar-Orpik
Scuderi-Whitney
Letang-Gill

That should be good enough to win on a consistant basis.


FYI, Gionta is a UFA after this season...
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby Mongoose87 on Fri Jan 23, 2009 4:31 pm

Pitts wrote:Anyone notice where the leafs are in the standings? Leafs wingers suck. That's why the team sucks. No thanks. ;)

Their team puts a lot of shots on. I don't know how well they finish, but my roommate is a big Leafie and say goaltending is their real problem.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby Ron` on Fri Jan 23, 2009 4:35 pm

I say Whitney goes back to Bobby and calls it a career. No harm no foul.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby Kicksave on Sat Jan 24, 2009 3:04 am

DelPen wrote:No. That would be a horrible trade. You don't move Whitney unless you are getting a Nathan Horton or a Brian Ginota back in return.

As far as the roster when everyone is healthy:

Cooke-Crosby-Malkin
Fedotenko-Staal-Sykora
Dupuis-Talbot-Kennedy
Biznasty-Thomas-Godard

Gonchar-Orpik
Scuderi-Whitney
Letang-Gill

That should be good enough to win on a consistant basis.


I can agree with Horton but Gionta? C'mon DelPen, you're better than that.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby ville5 on Sat Jan 24, 2009 4:11 am

Pitts wrote:Anyone notice where the leafs are in the standings? Leafs wingers suck. That's why the team sucks. No thanks. ;)

If the Leafs wingers suck, what's that say about our wingers? We have a total of 5 players with 13 or more goals and 3 of them are Centers. So, Antro and Ponk are big improvements.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby bhaw on Sat Jan 24, 2009 11:51 am

Doesn't Toronto also have a boat load of young d-men in their system as well that are just about NHL ready? I thought they had a bunch of young guys start the season and had too many.

Also, Antropov is a UFA. Hopefully he would actually sign, otherwise we are giving up Whitney for nothing.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby HomerPenguin on Mon Jan 26, 2009 2:39 pm

FuturePens wrote:Sid and Geno could play together and Staal could become a second line center...


Because...Staal is suddenly going to grow hands and figure out how to pass the puck?
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby farnham16 on Tue Jan 27, 2009 4:38 pm

Keeping Geno and Sid together long term is just a giant mistake. For starters, Geno is much better at center than wing. You are taking away many things he can do when you put him at wing. Two, Sid and Geno are both pass first players and have shown for as long as they have played together that they will defer to one another.

And the biggest reason its a bad idea is because of Jordan Staal. At this point in his career he is not a good playmaking center. The kid can't pass, score, or create offense with any consistency. So if you keep Malkin and Crosby together for good then this team will have one line that other teams have to worry about, thus making it much easier to defend us.

If we are going to take one of our centers and put him at wing, then it should be Staal. Keeping Staal at wing makes much more sense then putting Geno there does.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby passmaster16 on Tue Jan 27, 2009 5:12 pm

farnham16 wrote:Keeping Geno and Sid together long term is just a giant mistake. For starters, Geno is much better at center than wing. You are taking away many things he can do when you put him at wing. Two, Sid and Geno are both pass first players and have shown for as long as they have played together that they will defer to one another.

And the biggest reason its a bad idea is because of Jordan Staal. At this point in his career he is not a good playmaking center. The kid can't pass, score, or create offense with any consistency. So if you keep Malkin and Crosby together for good then this team will have one line that other teams have to worry about, thus making it much easier to defend us.

If we are going to take one of our centers and put him at wing, then it should be Staal. Keeping Staal at wing makes much more sense then putting Geno there does.


I agree. Keeping them on the first line turns the Pens into a one line team. One line teams don't make it very far in the playoffs. Only problem is I'm not sure that Staal is even the answer at wing. I think they want him to be but they haven't tried it long enough to really see if he can be. If he can't score consistently with Geno or Sid, then we have a problem. A young, bonified scoring winger would be nice right now.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby It'sagreatdayforhockey! on Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:38 pm

DelPen wrote:
As far as the roster when everyone is healthy:

Cooke-Crosby-Malkin
Fedotenko-Staal-Sykora
Dupuis-Talbot-Kennedy
Biznasty-Thomas-Godard

Gonchar-Orpik
Scuderi-Whitney
Letang-Gill

That should be good enough to win on a consistant basis.


Exactly, Why does everyone think we need a trade or that every other team is willing to take our crap for players that will improve our team?

Once this lineup is intact we have one great line, one above average line, one speedy/attacking/fiesty line and one fighting/checking line. That along with a defense that just last year was considered near the top of the league and Fluery/Garon give us a solid team.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby tksmr2 on Wed Jan 28, 2009 12:32 am

I'll give Whitney some more time due to the surgery/recovery. But, he has been playing sooo bad this year. I don't know why people think he is a puck moving defenseman. Well, maybe a puck giving away, soft defenseman that makes many mental blunders. Also, a guy that needs extreme motivation to get physical.

Otherwise he is great. I hope he does revert back to the 60pt or so player he was.. with a lot more grit... but right now he's not worth much more than a bag of pucks IMO.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby canaan on Wed Jan 28, 2009 1:57 am

tksmr2 wrote:I'll give Whitney some more time due to the surgery/recovery. But, he has been playing sooo bad this year. I don't know why people think he is a puck moving defenseman. Well, maybe a puck giving away, soft defenseman that makes many mental blunders. Also, a guy that needs extreme motivation to get physical.

Otherwise he is great. I hope he does revert back to the 60pt or so player he was.. with a lot more grit... but right now he's not worth much more than a bag of pucks IMO.


lol.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby KG on Thu Jan 29, 2009 12:10 am

http://tsn.ca/nhl/standings/

Click on the Kaberle link to watch the video. First one up is Colby Armstrong back to Pittsburgh is making the rounds and Ryan Whitney's name has come up in trade talks for an elite winger....hmmmm
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby Draftnik on Thu Jan 29, 2009 12:37 am

KG wrote:http://tsn.ca/nhl/standings/

Click on the Kaberle link to watch the video. First one up is Colby Armstrong back to Pittsburgh is making the rounds and Ryan Whitney's name has come up in trade talks for an elite winger....hmmmm


Dregger has been on fire lately with his alleged inside info on PGH. First MT's firing was imminent. Then Adam Hall was going to be coming back. Now Armstrong (the source of the MT firing rumors the past 2.5 seasons IMO, probably the source of the rumor re: his return) is allegedly coming back and Whitney is allegedly on the block.

If Shero really wanted to keep Armstrong as part of the Pens core he wouldn't have traded him in the first place. He would have put together another combination to get Hossa.

Which Whitney are the Pens going to trade? The one that again led all Pens Dmen with 25 min TOI, the one that led Pens Dmen with 5 blocked shots, or the one that was tied for the lead with 3 hits tonight?

http://www.nhl.com/scores/htmlreports/20082009/ES020712.HTM

He was a bit soft on his skates again when he allowed himself to be interfered with on the NYR 1st goal, just like the CAR GWG, but he had a great all around game tonight. When he is on his game the Pens are a much better team. It doesn't make sense to move him now with the Gonch not certain to come back at a high level after his injury.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby booboo on Thu Jan 29, 2009 12:53 am

Whitney has a short window of opportunity to prove himself to be the lead pp qb
for this team until Gonch is gone. He is missing it the way he plays right now.
He is - and historically he was - a defensive liability.

The question is: can the pens live with a guy who is a big part of the other teams scoring on us
and who occasionally produces a smart lead pass and chips in on the SOG?

My gut feeling is to trade him before it is too late to get a solid return.
We have Letang, Gogo to pick up the duty. Letang is all around developed player,
Gogo should be like that not very long from now.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby Henry Hank on Thu Jan 29, 2009 1:00 am

Whitney's upside is through the roof. His vision is great. He's got the size. He's proven to be an elite producer in the past. We have to look no further than Brooks Orpik to see a defenseman that was a few years into his career before he finally put it together. Just about everyone was ready to give up on Orpik. Whitney hasn't been great since he's come back, but then again he's coming back from a major procedure that alters the very way he functions with that foot. I would expect things to get gradually better, and the time to really judge his progress will be next season.

A Whitney who is improved on D and returns to his ~60 point level is a ridiculous bargain at $4 million per compared to what some other guys are getting paid. There's too much upside there to consider moving him unless you're getting something back with a similar long-term upside.

Colby's not what this team needs. They don't need someone who doesn't give 100% effort all of the time. As a team, that's part of what has gotten them into this mess. Shero made the decision that he wasn't a key player here, I doubt he goes out of his way to bring him back.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby Mongoose87 on Thu Jan 29, 2009 3:35 am

Draftnik wrote:
KG wrote:http://tsn.ca/nhl/standings/

Click on the Kaberle link to watch the video. First one up is Colby Armstrong back to Pittsburgh is making the rounds and Ryan Whitney's name has come up in trade talks for an elite winger....hmmmm


Dregger has been on fire lately with his alleged inside info on PGH. First MT's firing was imminent. Then Adam Hall was going to be coming back. Now Armstrong (the source of the MT firing rumors the past 2.5 seasons IMO, probably the source of the rumor re: his return) is allegedly coming back and Whitney is allegedly on the block.

If Shero really wanted to keep Armstrong as part of the Pens core he wouldn't have traded him in the first place. He would have put together another combination to get Hossa.

Which Whitney are the Pens going to trade? The one that again led all Pens Dmen with 25 min TOI, the one that led Pens Dmen with 5 blocked shots, or the one that was tied for the lead with 3 hits tonight?

http://www.nhl.com/scores/htmlreports/20082009/ES020712.HTM

He was a bit soft on his skates again when he allowed himself to be interfered with on the NYR 1st goal, just like the CAR GWG, but he had a great all around game tonight. When he is on his game the Pens are a much better team. It doesn't make sense to move him now with the Gonch not certain to come back at a high level after his injury.

Led the team in hits!? The sky is falling!
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby FuturePens on Thu Jan 29, 2009 9:33 am

Whitney had a terrible first period last night and a terrible game against Carolina. The Pens run a much more successful PP statistically with Gogo and they will even more so once Gonchar returns...Whitney will be expendible...
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby burghsportsguys on Thu Jan 29, 2009 10:15 am

Henry Hank wrote:Whitney's upside is through the roof. His vision is great. He's got the size. He's proven to be an elite producer in the past. We have to look no further than Brooks Orpik to see a defenseman that was a few years into his career before he finally put it together. Just about everyone was ready to give up on Orpik. Whitney hasn't been great since he's come back, but then again he's coming back from a major procedure that alters the very way he functions with that foot. I would expect things to get gradually better, and the time to really judge his progress will be next season.

Whitney's vision is great, no argument. He makes some really good outlet passes. His size is irrelevant because he doesn't use it to his advantage. He's much bigger than Letang, but KL is much more physical. He's had one "elite" season. And in that season, he was still a defensive liability.

Whitney hasn't been great since his comeback, and he wasn't great last year.... at times, he was awful. I'm not going to make injury excuses for a guy that is playing 25 minutes a night.

Henry Hank wrote:A Whitney who is improved on D and returns to his ~60 point level is a ridiculous bargain at $4 million per compared to what some other guys are getting paid. There's too much upside there to consider moving him unless you're getting something back with a similar long-term upside.

A Whitney who never improves on defense and scores 40-50 points per year is ridiculously overpaid - we can play both ends of this. He's not going to ever turn it on with respect to physicality, that train has long left the station. Ryan Whitney is Kevin Hatcher. If you think Hatcher would be a $4MM per year guy in today's NHL, then so be it, I don't think so. The thing is, Gonchar is somewhat a defensive liability, but he's much more sound than Whitney. And he's a much better offensive d-man. And he's bordering on overpaid at 5MM per year.

You consider moving him for a few reasons... one, you have Letang and Gogo. It would be absurd to deal Gogo and keep Whitney, especially if everything is based on potential. Gogo is further along right now than Whitney was at this point of his career, IMO (but I think you'd disagree). The other major reason you think of dealing him is to get that top 6 winger. The Pens would be a better team tomorrow if, for example, they had Nathan Horton on the first line and Gogo stepping in to fill the role vacated by Whitney.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby booboo on Thu Jan 29, 2009 10:56 am

You are absolutely right burghsportsguys.

If other teams GMs think as highly about Whitney's upside as Henry Hank does,
the optimal move for Shero would be to pull the trigger right away.
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Re: How about Whitney for a couple Leafs wingers?

Postby KG on Thu Jan 29, 2009 10:58 am

Whitney is clearly the piece that makes some money that could be dealt for another player who makes some money...Position strength, to fill a position weakness without taking on more money...Hello Mr. Frolov...
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