Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby thehockeyguru on Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:50 am

no name wrote:This series baffles me, can't understand it, Fleury was awful, PK couldn't stop them. Malkin and Sid were contained... Still can't grasp what caused this implosion.




I'd start by looking at what the plan is when you have a 2-3 goal lead. This team had several of them and consistently blew them against a good offensive Flyers team. It seemed like the Pens stop playing their game which got them the lead in the first place.

Secondly we need to move from the mindset that we can just play our system and not worry about what our opponent is doing. If a passive PK isn't working against an opponent then change it. Don't keep doing it and expect different results.

Again these are coaching problems not player problems which is why I'm confident whether you agree with it or not, there won't be 1 significant roster move.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Fast B on Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:54 am

The Snapshot wrote:
SolidSnake wrote:Like I said, to the people who think no moves should be done to the team, and if Shero does stand pat, then the pens deserve every bad thing that happens to them.


Moves are not stupidly trading away whatever core player people want to blame. I blame Fleury for the series ending as it did, and firmly believe that the Pens could have sorted themselves out over the course of a larger sample size and different opponent.


You're not wrong that Fleury was bad, but if you think that his poor play was the only reason the Pens lost the way they did then I question whether you were watching the series (and the month or so of games leading up to it).

And I said that in as few sentences as possible; hope you approve.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby pfim on Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:58 am

The series wasn't close, the Pens benefited from Bryzgalov's play almost as much as the Flyers benefited from Fleury's.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby tfrizz on Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:58 am

thehockeyguru wrote:I'd start by looking at what the plan is when you have a 2-3 goal lead. This team had several of them and consistently blew them against a good offensive Flyers team. It seemed like the Pens stop playing their game which got them the lead in the first place.


The plan was to go into a defensive shell, but that relies way too much on the ability to play defense.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby offsides on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:00 pm

pfim wrote:The series wasn't close, the Pens benefited from Bryzgalov's play almost as much as the Flyers benefited from Fleury's.


I never felt like we were in that series. But I am a glass half empty guy.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby columbia on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:01 pm

tfrizz wrote:
thehockeyguru wrote:I'd start by looking at what the plan is when you have a 2-3 goal lead. This team had several of them and consistently blew them against a good offensive Flyers team. It seemed like the Pens stop playing their game which got them the lead in the first place.


The plan was to go into a defensive shell, but that relies way too much on the ability to play defense.


Shades of the 80s, when the fans would complain about blown leads, because the team had gone into a shell defense.
(They couldn't play defense then, either. :pop: )
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby thehockeyguru on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:04 pm

tfrizz wrote:
thehockeyguru wrote:I'd start by looking at what the plan is when you have a 2-3 goal lead. This team had several of them and consistently blew them against a good offensive Flyers team. It seemed like the Pens stop playing their game which got them the lead in the first place.


The plan was to go into a defensive shell, but that relies way too much on the ability to play defense.


That's what happened in Game 5 and we only won that game because Fleury played out of his mind.

That is on the coaches and not the players. They need to continue to play aggressive and counter-attack.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Bathgate on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:07 pm

Fast B wrote:You're not wrong that Fleury was bad, but if you think that his poor play was the only reason the Pens lost the way they did then I question whether you were watching the series (and the month or so of games leading up to it).

And I said that in as few sentences as possible; hope you approve.


Everybody on this board who has participated in the never-ending discussions/arguments about the appropriateness of criticizing Fleury (and goaltenders in general) should read the following treatise:

http://pittsburgh.sbnation.com/pittsburgh-penguins/2012/4/23/2967193/marc-andre-fleury-penguins-vs-flyers-nhl-playoffs
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby pfim on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:11 pm

Bathgate wrote:
Fast B wrote:You're not wrong that Fleury was bad, but if you think that his poor play was the only reason the Pens lost the way they did then I question whether you were watching the series (and the month or so of games leading up to it).

And I said that in as few sentences as possible; hope you approve.


Everybody on this board who has participated in the never-ending discussions/arguments about the appropriateness of criticizing Fleury (and goaltenders in general) should read the following treatise:

http://pittsburgh.sbnation.com/pittsburgh-penguins/2012/4/23/2967193/marc-andre-fleury-penguins-vs-flyers-nhl-playoffs


Not sure I understand the argument. Are there people here (or anywhere) saying he played well? Of course not.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby columbia on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:15 pm

Bathgate wrote:
Fast B wrote:You're not wrong that Fleury was bad, but if you think that his poor play was the only reason the Pens lost the way they did then I question whether you were watching the series (and the month or so of games leading up to it).

And I said that in as few sentences as possible; hope you approve.


Everybody on this board who has participated in the never-ending discussions/arguments about the appropriateness of criticizing Fleury (and goaltenders in general) should read the following treatise:

http://pittsburgh.sbnation.com/pittsburgh-penguins/2012/4/23/2967193/marc-andre-fleury-penguins-vs-flyers-nhl-playoffs


:grind that axe:
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Fast B on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:15 pm

pfim wrote:
Bathgate wrote:
Fast B wrote:You're not wrong that Fleury was bad, but if you think that his poor play was the only reason the Pens lost the way they did then I question whether you were watching the series (and the month or so of games leading up to it).

And I said that in as few sentences as possible; hope you approve.


Everybody on this board who has participated in the never-ending discussions/arguments about the appropriateness of criticizing Fleury (and goaltenders in general) should read the following treatise:

http://pittsburgh.sbnation.com/pittsburgh-penguins/2012/4/23/2967193/marc-andre-fleury-penguins-vs-flyers-nhl-playoffs


Not sure I understand the argument. Are there people here (or anywhere) saying he played well? Of course not.


That entire essay appears to be rationalizing the tendency to blame the goaltender for everything that goes wrong. Yes, it's valid to say the goaltending was bad, but the defensive tone of that essay makes it sound like he's got an axe to grind. Of course, given who's posting the link to it here I find that tone highly appropriate.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby llipgh2 on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:15 pm

Everyone is to blame, from Shero on down. It was failure by the entire orga-i-zation.

To single out players, or DB or his staff imho is pointless. Everyone is accountable.

The only one who seemed to get the gravity of it all was Jordan Staal. So instead of complaining about everyone else, I'm going to commend Jordan for his guts and determination. He got it, if no one else did.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Idoit40fans on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:48 pm

When someone criticizes the play of a particular player, they aren't saying that that person is solely responsible for anything bad that happens to the team. They're saying that that person played poorly. They might even be saying that they don't feel like writing a book about everything that went wrong with the team.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Fast B on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:54 pm

Idoit40fans wrote:When someone criticizes the play of a particular player, they aren't saying that that person is solely responsible for anything bad that happens to the team. They're saying that that person played poorly. They might even be saying that they don't feel like writing a book about everything that went wrong with the team.


I agree with you, except for cases where the person says things like, "if you swapped Bad Player X with his counterpart from another team everything would have been fine", and "I blame X for losing the series". Those are pretty absolute statements.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby llipgh2 on Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:58 pm

Idoit40fans wrote:When someone criticizes the play of a particular player, they aren't saying that that person is solely responsible for anything bad that happens to the team. They're saying that that person played poorly. They might even be saying that they don't feel like writing a book about everything that went wrong with the team.


I think it's wasted effort when everyone failed.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Idoit40fans on Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:06 pm

Fast B wrote:
Idoit40fans wrote:When someone criticizes the play of a particular player, they aren't saying that that person is solely responsible for anything bad that happens to the team. They're saying that that person played poorly. They might even be saying that they don't feel like writing a book about everything that went wrong with the team.


I agree with you, except for cases where the person says things like, "if you swapped Bad Player X with his counterpart from another team everything would have been fine", and "I blame X for losing the series". Those are pretty absolute statements.


They're pretty uncommon statements.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Penspal on Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:37 pm

I did not see the presser live. I read the transcripts before I watched the accompanying vids. I have to say, the transcripts arewere terrible (they have been fixed). Originally, the Sid one read something like.... Q: You will be trying Free Agency? Sid's Anser: "Yeah, that's the route I'll take". I was like WTF. Of course that is not at all what he said, but it certainly put things right in my mind. A few other take aways...

- Staal seemed the most visually upset during the interview. I wonder if he already knows something about his future?
- Duper was a close 2nd. I respect that he didn't want to discuss his reg season success, especilaly since his playoff effort was weak (pk.. brutal)
- Everything can change, and often does when RS is involved. I really believe he'll try to trade M &/or M if he can. Too many young quality (and thereofre cheap rookies he could use)
- Fleury with the Pirates hat...... seems fitting
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Sarcastic on Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:53 pm

pfim wrote:The series wasn't close, the Pens benefited from Bryzgalov's play almost as much as the Flyers benefited from Fleury's.


We also have to keep in mind they played without their two best defensemen. The picture is probably worse than what we saw in the series. Put Pronger and Meszaros in there and games probably aren't close, score-wise. Pronger is done, but they will likely find a comparable replacement. Which is why I am not a fan of resigning Sullivan, considering how much problem we had attacking their defense. We need more size.. a power forward and a couple large checkers.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Sarcastic on Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:58 pm

Penspal wrote:I did not see the presser live.


You can see all the exit interviews on their webpage. The Getaway Day 1&2 stuff.

http://penguins.nhl.com/index.html
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Sarcastic on Wed Apr 25, 2012 3:03 pm

Fast B wrote:
Idoit40fans wrote:When someone criticizes the play of a particular player, they aren't saying that that person is solely responsible for anything bad that happens to the team. They're saying that that person played poorly. They might even be saying that they don't feel like writing a book about everything that went wrong with the team.


I agree with you, except for cases where the person says things like, "if you swapped Bad Player X with his counterpart from another team everything would have been fine", and "I blame X for losing the series". Those are pretty absolute statements.


A single player would not change the outcome of the whole series (with the exception of a dominant goalie), but there were players who underperformed or weren't good enough to begin with. Or, at least, were not right for the team or its chemistry or against this particular opponent. It is OK to criticize players individually.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Fast B on Wed Apr 25, 2012 3:32 pm

Sarcastic wrote:
Fast B wrote:
Idoit40fans wrote:When someone criticizes the play of a particular player, they aren't saying that that person is solely responsible for anything bad that happens to the team. They're saying that that person played poorly. They might even be saying that they don't feel like writing a book about everything that went wrong with the team.


I agree with you, except for cases where the person says things like, "if you swapped Bad Player X with his counterpart from another team everything would have been fine", and "I blame X for losing the series". Those are pretty absolute statements.


A single player would not change the outcome of the whole series (with the exception of a dominant goalie), but there were players who underperformed or weren't good enough to begin with. Or, at least, were not right for the team or its chemistry or against this particular opponent. It is OK to criticize players individually.


I'm not disagreeing with anything you said.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby NJ5934 on Wed Apr 25, 2012 9:00 pm

tfrizz wrote:
KG wrote:
NJ5934 wrote:I have a funny feeling Staal gets traded this summer. Not saying I support it....it just seems that the direction of the team is going to change and Staal has priced himself out of Pittsburgh.


Agreed....

Let's start seeing some trade proposals! it's the off-season now :D


Staal's not going to bring in as much as you might think. The potential of losing him to UFA after just 1 season puts a damper on his value.


I agree....but I'm not in favor of trading Staal inthe first place. As nuts as it sounds, I'd rather move Malkin. Not only are you going to get the rebuild return we would need, we would likely be cutting out the 10 million he's probably going to get in the next contract. I think what this team needs more than anything is a Weber type.....a true shutdown blueliner that get log big pp time. There are a few around the league and if I'm moving geno I'm starting with a stud blueliner, a top six guy with some size and a first rounder.

I know everyone has their own read on the Shero presser but I thought it was the first time we heard him give a realistic response to the three center issue. If you want to keep Letang, Staal, and Neal......one of the nine million dollar guys is going to have to go....it's inevitable.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby KG on Wed Apr 25, 2012 9:01 pm

I did not like the line from Shero about finding out what went wrong "the last 10 days."

As many have said, the Pens went down defensively once Sid came back.

The team got ultra soft and complacent..."we're healthy, we can outscore anyone" approach...

That doesn't work come playoff time.

I blame Bylsma for not nipping this in the bud in the regular season. The team was playing like garbage the last month of the season. Do something about it! how about you raise your voice once in a while.

You're the head coach, not their best friend!

I'm down on Dan...he's going to have to make some changes to his approach.
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby RxBandit66 on Wed Apr 25, 2012 10:50 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:
tfrizz wrote:
thehockeyguru wrote:I'd start by looking at what the plan is when you have a 2-3 goal lead. This team had several of them and consistently blew them against a good offensive Flyers team. It seemed like the Pens stop playing their game which got them the lead in the first place.


The plan was to go into a defensive shell, but that relies way too much on the ability to play defense.


That's what happened in Game 5 and we only won that game because Fleury played out of his mind.

That is on the coaches and not the players. They need to continue to play aggressive and counter-attack.


Exactly. Keep on the attack but quit the excessive pinching and pressing by the defense. I don't understand why Bylsma cannot get this through his head. I believe Bylsma understand the concept, but he cannot reign his players in, because he has no authority. Whatever the case, he just cannot make the appropriate adjustments. I just got done watching the Caps knock off the Bruins in OT to take the series. Dale Hunter can make adjustments. The Caps look like a playoff team now, and they have an unknown rookie in net. The Caps have passed the Penguins by, and so have the Flyers. They have made adjustments and have learned how to win in the postseason. The longer coach aBylsmal is kept around, the further the team is going to slide down the rabbit hole. Where is Mario in all of this? Can't he see the organization is blowing a chance at a dynasty for the second time in two generations?
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Re: Shero/Bylsma press conference thread

Postby Streaks House on Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:07 pm

Mario can't be happy.
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