Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already are

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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby shmenguin on Wed May 09, 2012 12:30 pm

Froggy wrote:With the parity in the league, at least with playoff teams, every series, Hell... Every GAME, is pretty much a coin flip. We could potentially see a low seeded team knock off the 1&2 in both conferences this year. That's nuts. that kind of takes some of the sting out of a 4 losing to a 5. That series is supposed to be able to go either way.

Look at the caps. They could win two in a row and win the series, but they also could have been swept by Boston.

The pens had a chance to win every game except for maybe game 6 against Philly, and that coupled with the fact that it was Philly leads to a ton of warranted frustration.

HOWEVER...

What the flyers did or didn't do against NJ doesn't say a thing about us.


you can't just will your team to victory, that's for sure. great players and great teams can be neutralized no matter how much they want it. i knew that much after crosby's performance in the 2009 finals.

with that said, i still stand by what i posted about our composure problems.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby llipgh2 on Wed May 09, 2012 12:45 pm

shmenguin wrote:with that said, i still stand by what i posted about our composure problems.


From the Emptynetters blog this am.

-"I think what was tough on them was us not retaliating to any of the stuff they were doing and all the stuff they were saying every single game. Guys just turned away and didn’t respond to anybody. They were able to get Pittsburgh all wrapped up in that stuff. It must’ve gotten tough on them a little bit to just talk to themselves all day long.” - Brodeur on his team's discipline.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby columbia on Wed May 09, 2012 12:48 pm

He's not the first player to comment like that and it unfortunately reflects on the leadership of the Penguins.
You can decide for yourself, whether that points more to the coaching staff or those with the fancy letters on their chest.
(I'd say a bit of both.)
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby no name on Wed May 09, 2012 1:11 pm

The Pens started so much stuff with philly and didn't fall into the trap of "match up physically" Pens looked like babies out there, Malkin most of all. Letang Asham Neal all fell into it.

Game 1 everyone, up 3-1 ended loisng 4-3. We played great that game, after that we lost it. I still balme the ref on that one, we win that series is totally different.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby orpchar on Wed May 09, 2012 1:22 pm

I'm happy the Flyers lost, and not just for the obvious reasons. Had they rolled everyone and won the cup, it would've been easy for Shero/Bylsma to think 'we got a tough draw against a hot team, we just need to execute better next year, etc.'

After seeing an inferior team dominate the same Flyers team that dominated the Penguins, hopefully they take note of how big a difference it makes when you play defense first and actually do something differently when you're getting demolished on the PK.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby shafnutz05 on Wed May 09, 2012 1:29 pm

orpchar wrote:I'm happy the Flyers lost, and not just for the obvious reasons. Had they rolled everyone and won the cup, it would've been easy for Shero/Bylsma to think 'we got a tough draw against a hot team, we just need to execute better next year, etc.'

After seeing an inferior team dominate the same Flyers team that dominated the Penguins, hopefully they take note of how big a difference it makes when you play defense first and actually do something differently when you're getting demolished on the PK.


Good point.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby shmenguin on Wed May 09, 2012 1:33 pm

no name wrote:The Pens started so much stuff with philly and didn't fall into the trap of "match up physically" Pens looked like babies out there, Malkin most of all. Letang Asham Neal all fell into it.

Game 1 everyone, up 3-1 ended loisng 4-3. We played great that game, after that we lost it. I still balme the ref on that one, we win that series is totally different.


it's a little nit picky i know, but one of the most frustrating moments of the series was at that "Game 1, up 3-1" moment. we all knew that there was an issue with scrumming it up with the flyers. we saw it 2 weeks earlier - they bait us into theatrics and we fall apart. it was a fact. shortly after neal gets cheap shotted by rinaldo and simply skates away like he should, craig stinkin' adams starts roughing up schenn for no discernible reason at the end of the 2nd period. i knew at that point that we were in trouble. that moment is just infuriating in retrospect. it shows how clueless these guys were. this wasn't even a "heat of the moment" thing. it was just total chest puffing garbage.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby MRandall25 on Wed May 09, 2012 1:55 pm

orpchar wrote:I'm happy the Flyers lost, and not just for the obvious reasons. Had they rolled everyone and won the cup, it would've been easy for Shero/Bylsma to think 'we got a tough draw against a hot team, we just need to execute better next year, etc.'

After seeing an inferior team dominate the same Flyers team that dominated the Penguins, hopefully they take note of how big a difference it makes when you play defense first and actually do something differently when you're getting demolished on the PK.


I don't think you're giving New Jersey enough credit...
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby Pitts on Wed May 09, 2012 2:07 pm

MRandall25 wrote:
orpchar wrote:I'm happy the Flyers lost, and not just for the obvious reasons. Had they rolled everyone and won the cup, it would've been easy for Shero/Bylsma to think 'we got a tough draw against a hot team, we just need to execute better next year, etc.'

After seeing an inferior team dominate the same Flyers team that dominated the Penguins, hopefully they take note of how big a difference it makes when you play defense first and actually do something differently when you're getting demolished on the PK.


I don't think you're giving New Jersey enough credit...

New Jersey definitely deserves credit, but they were not that good of a team during the regular season. Like the Pens, they got healthy at season's end, but unlike the Pens, they went into "play-off hockey" when they needed to.

The Pens, though, MUST learn how to play Philly without reacting like kids in a school yard. Apparently, the entire NHL knows that all you have to do is rough up the Pens and then let them lose the game on their own.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby shafnutz05 on Wed May 09, 2012 2:07 pm

There is absolutely no question that this Flyers team had a lot more talent on paper than the New Jersey Devils. The big difference was that New Jersey played harder, won battles, hustled their asses off, and played a system that was perfectly suited to beat the Flyers. Not to mention actually having emotional composure.

You can give NJ credit, as they most certainly deserve, but the fact remains: the Flyers were embarrassed by a team that had less talent than they did, and had no business beating them in a 7 game series.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby shmenguin on Wed May 09, 2012 2:25 pm

i don't think the flyers are as good on paper as people are making them out to be, especially in relation to the devils.

the flyers defense isn't good - on paper or on the ice. the goaltenders - same. as for the forwards, they aren't nearly as deep there as the pens made them look. guys like voracek and coutourier aren't real goal scorers. same with talbot. jagr is old as dirt. hartnell's abilities didn't match his stats this year. what exactly does schenn do well aside from acting "like a broad"?

they're a good team, but they finished 1 point ahead of new jersey in the regular season - right where they belonged.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby sil on Wed May 09, 2012 2:31 pm

Pitts wrote:Apparently, the entire NHL knows that all you have to do is rough up the Pens and then let them lose the game on their own.


That secret was unleashed in game 5 of the 2009 Cup finals.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby AlexPKeaton on Wed May 09, 2012 2:38 pm

The big difference is that Brodeur with 1 leg with arthritis, DIABETUS, and an eye patch, is 10,000x better than Fleury will ever be.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby sil on Wed May 09, 2012 2:42 pm

AlexPKeaton wrote:The big difference is that Brodeur with 1 leg with arthritis, DIABETUS, and an eye patch, is 10,000x better than Fleury will ever be.


Yep, and Kovy's better than Malkin based on the fact that Illya showed up when it mattered, and Evgeni didn't.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby jeffshly on Wed May 09, 2012 3:46 pm

A bit of perspective, folks...

- The Flyers built their team to exploit Pittsburgh's weaknesses. Philly dominated Pittsburgh this year, but didn't do so well versus the rest of the division.
- One thing that was proven in the PHI-NJ series is the fact that PHI was very overrated after the first round. There's nothing that can't be fixed within this team that can't address the weaknesses that PHI exploited.
- Let's not forget that the NJ coaching staff had an entire series worth of tape to look at and analyze. They also had time to prepare a game plan in advance of the series to counter it.

The Pens played poorly in the PHI series. The fact that NJ handled PHI so easily lends credence to what I've thought all along - that the Penguins lost that series as opposed to Philadelphia actually winning it. I am confident that everything can and will be addressed by the Pens coaching staff and front office.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby Staggy on Wed May 09, 2012 4:02 pm

sil wrote:
AlexPKeaton wrote:The big difference is that Brodeur with 1 leg with arthritis, DIABETUS, and an eye patch, is 10,000x better than Fleury will ever be.


Yep, and Kovy's better than Malkin based on the fact that Illya showed up when it mattered, and Evgeni didn't.


You don't honestly believe that, do you?
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby sil on Wed May 09, 2012 4:27 pm

Staggy wrote:
sil wrote:
AlexPKeaton wrote:The big difference is that Brodeur with 1 leg with arthritis, DIABETUS, and an eye patch, is 10,000x better than Fleury will ever be.


Yep, and Kovy's better than Malkin based on the fact that Illya showed up when it mattered, and Evgeni didn't.


You don't honestly believe that, do you?


Of course I don't.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby Fire0nice228 on Wed May 09, 2012 4:29 pm

jeffshly wrote:A bit of perspective, folks...

- The Flyers built their team to exploit Pittsburgh's weaknesses. Philly dominated Pittsburgh this year, but didn't do so well versus the rest of the division.
- One thing that was proven in the PHI-NJ series is the fact that PHI was very overrated after the first round. There's nothing that can't be fixed within this team that can't address the weaknesses that PHI exploited.
- Let's not forget that the NJ coaching staff had an entire series worth of tape to look at and analyze. They also had time to prepare a game plan in advance of the series to counter it.

The Pens played poorly in the PHI series. The fact that NJ handled PHI so easily lends credence to what I've thought all along - that the Penguins lost that series as opposed to Philadelphia actually winning it. I am confident that everything can and will be addressed by the Pens coaching staff and front office.


1) Agree on them being built to compete against Pens, they said as much when they signed Pronger. Problem, he didn't even play.
2) Agree, things can be fixed. Unfortunately, a major piece probably needs moved in order to do so properly.
3) NJ/FLA went to 7 games and I assume the coaching staff of NJ was focused on the task at hand with the Panthers versus what they could potentially matchup with in round 2. I don't think they had that much time to make a gameplan in advance of the series. Game 1 was real close, and then they made adjustments during the series. The Pens didn't.

The Pens played like crap against Philly throughout the lineup. But they didn't make any adjustments on the PK, breakout, extra curricular garbage, etc. Thats the disappointing part.

Also agree with whomever else was talkin about the 40 SOG strategy. Who gives a crap if we put up twice as many shots as the NYI but still lose 5-2. Pens actual legit scoring chances are probably right on par with the rest of the league, however, the Pens give up too much on the other end in their quest to put pressure and zone time to get those 40 shots.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby Pens15 on Wed May 09, 2012 4:35 pm

You win some and you lose some, but the shocking lack of discipline and composure reflects really, really badly on both the coaching staff and leadership on the team.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby It'sagreatdayforhockey! on Wed May 09, 2012 4:42 pm

Malkamaniac wrote:
shmenguin wrote:
Malkamaniac wrote:Shmenguin has to have me on the foe list.


no way. your insanity comes with self awareness. that's a-ok.


Crap I don't want to be self aware. I want to be an agent of chaos.



What was that Skynet?



Oh and.... I hate the Flyers. So I loved watching the Flyers lose.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby penny lane on Wed May 09, 2012 5:29 pm

Pens had access to a whole lot of tape of how not to play the flyers from the season. Then went out and played the very same way in the play-offs. confounding and perplexing.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby offsides on Wed May 09, 2012 5:38 pm

penny lane wrote:Pens had access to a whole lot of tape of how not to play the flyers from the season. Then went out and played the very same way in the play-offs. confounding and perplexing.


Great point. To me this points directly at coaching. Zero adjustments were made for the playoffs.
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby Rocco on Wed May 09, 2012 7:27 pm

penny lane wrote:Pens had access to a whole lot of tape of how not to play the flyers from the season. Then went out and played the very same way in the play-offs. confounding and perplexing.


Are you suggesting Benevolent Dictator for Life Bylsma did a poor job of preparing the lads?

/faints
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby shafnutz05 on Wed May 09, 2012 7:28 pm

Rocco wrote:
penny lane wrote:Pens had access to a whole lot of tape of how not to play the flyers from the season. Then went out and played the very same way in the play-offs. confounding and perplexing.


Are you suggesting Benevolent Dictator for Life Bylsma did a poor job of preparing the lads?

/faints


Grind those ******** down
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Re: Never thought the Pens could look worse than the already

Postby Staggy on Wed May 09, 2012 7:35 pm

sil wrote:
Staggy wrote:
sil wrote:
AlexPKeaton wrote:The big difference is that Brodeur with 1 leg with arthritis, DIABETUS, and an eye patch, is 10,000x better than Fleury will ever be.


Yep, and Kovy's better than Malkin based on the fact that Illya showed up when it mattered, and Evgeni didn't.


You don't honestly believe that, do you?


Of course I don't.


Ok, just making sure haha
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