Cap projected at $70.3 million

[Bioshock]

Then there's seriously no reason to trade Jordan Staal.

Seriously the kid is what 24 years old? Prorated season of almost 40 goals? Lead the team in goals in the playoffs this year. Came up huge in the Cup year SH goal game 4 to help win the cup. Was amazing in games 6 and 7 to win the cup.

Give this kid a 6 year deal at least and at least 6 Million and call it a day.

You don't trade 24 year old studs, you can trade him when he's 30.

I really can't believe all the people that wanted to trade Staal, you can't replace players like that.

Nizzy, it's all well and good that we have the money to sign him. That isn't the issue at hand. The issue is will he want to play behind Crosby and Malkin? If it was just about money then there wouldn't be a million topics about this.

And it's not like we wanna trade him just... because. If he refuses to sign, then you trade him to get value in return and not letting him go for nothing.

[Nizzy]

Then there's seriously no reason to trade Jordan Staal.

Seriously the kid is what 24 years old? Prorated season of almost 40 goals? Lead the team in goals in the playoffs this year. Came up huge in the Cup year SH goal game 4 to help win the cup. Was amazing in games 6 and 7 to win the cup.

Give this kid a 6 year deal at least and at least 6 Million and call it a day.

You don't trade 24 year old studs, you can trade him when he's 30.

I really can't believe all the people that wanted to trade Staal, you can't replace players like that.

Nizzy, it's all well and good that we have the money to sign him. That isn't the issue at hand. The issue is will he want to play behind Crosby and Malkin? If it was just about money then there wouldn't be a million topics about this.

And it's not like we wanna trade him just... because. If he refuses to sign, then you trade him to get value in return and not letting him go for nothing.

Its all "Rossi-junk" bro. Rossi looked Jordan in the face with his dumb little questions of stuff like that. He's still under contract for 15 months and Rossi already asking about if Jordan will stay... then tweeting about were the Atlanta Braves. Garbage media. Don't believe it until he comes out himself and says so.

Facts - Shero has came out and said Jordan did no such thing to indiciate there's any problems and that he doesn't want to be here.

Facts - Jordan still had his highest goal totals playing on Malkin's wing. No reason he can't do it again if we have to move him to wing.

I think Shero is too smart to let a 24 year old, 6'4" two way center get moved. Honestly the only player right now i'd be completely thrilled about is Weber. Because its a huge overpayment. That's what it will take to get Staal.

[BurghersAndDogsSports]

Then there's seriously no reason to trade Jordan Staal.

Seriously the kid is what 24 years old? Prorated season of almost 40 goals? Lead the team in goals in the playoffs this year. Came up huge in the Cup year SH goal game 4 to help win the cup. Was amazing in games 6 and 7 to win the cup.

Give this kid a 6 year deal at least and at least 6 Million and call it a day.

You don't trade 24 year old studs, you can trade him when he's 30.

I really can't believe all the people that wanted to trade Staal, you can't replace players like that.

Nizzy, it's all well and good that we have the money to sign him. That isn't the issue at hand. The issue is will he want to play behind Crosby and Malkin? If it was just about money then there wouldn't be a million topics about this.

And it's not like we wanna trade him just... because. If he refuses to sign, then you trade him to get value in return and not letting him go for nothing.

Its all "Rossi-junk" bro. Rossi looked Jordan in the face with his dumb little questions of stuff like that. He's still under contract for 15 months and Rossi already asking about if Jordan will stay... then tweeting about were the Atlanta Braves. Garbage media. Don't believe it until he comes out himself and says so.

Facts - Shero has came out and said Jordan did no such thing to indiciate there's any problems and that he doesn't want to be here.

Facts - Jordan still had his highest goal totals playing on Malkin's wing. No reason he can't do it again if we have to move him to wing.

I think Shero is too smart to let a 24 year old, 6'4" two way center get moved. Honestly the only player right now i'd be completely thrilled about is Weber. Because its a huge overpayment. That's what it will take to get Staal.

Not to state the obvious but GM's (especially Ray Shero) dont come out and state the truth in the media all the time. Just because he said Jordan gave no such indication does not mean much. Why play your hand to other teams openly if he did. It drives down his trade value. Personally I dont think anyone here really "wants" to trade Staal. The discussion has been the rumors he wants an extended role and also with a new CBA there is potential for less cap money - so the discussion goes to if we cant sign them all who gets traded.

That is much different than I want to trade Staal.

You have to factor in that this thread is basing cap numbers on the current system, which is fine of course, but is one which gives 7% more to players than the average of the other leagues, even the NFL. There is no way I believe there will not be some sort of adjustment to that coming out of the labor talks/new CBA this summer.

[Troy Loney]

Is it a slam dunk that the penguins can spend up to that ceiling?

[pens_CT]

Is it a slam dunk that the penguins can spend up to that ceiling?

No need to worry about that because once the new CBA is signed, the players percentage of the revenue will go down, and the cap will be less than 70.3 mil. Expect a nominal increase over this year's cap.

[BurghersAndDogsSports]

Is it a slam dunk that the penguins can spend up to that ceiling?

I think that is going to be part of the CBA issues. If the cap and floor are so far apart and the players are getting that big of a cut you are going to start running into similar issues as before. It's not quite at the level yet but could be.

Not to mention from what we have seen, with a cap, floor and rev sharing there are still quite a few teams struggling. These are going to be strong points for the league to bring up against the Nhlpa.

I also think there is something a bit off in a cap league if a team like the pens, while selling out with new arena revenue and a cap are not exactly swimming in money.

That 7% NHL players get compared to other leagues can go a long way.

[Bioshock]

Is it a slam dunk that the penguins can spend up to that ceiling?

No need to worry about that because once the new CBA is signed, the players percentage of the revenue will go down, and the cap will be less than 70.3 mil. Expect a nominal increase over this year's cap.

Yes, the Pens can spend to whatever cap is given because the cap is determined by how much revenue the teams are making and it's all relative. 57% is still 57% regardless of how high the number is and the calculations this year come out to 70.3 or 73.8, depending on who you listen to. The new TV deal, coupled with the new arena and add in a 10% ticket increase along with killer ratings will make it business as usual for the Pens as long as there is a salary cap.

As for the cap itself, i really don't see it being less than what is specified in this topic. My reasons are:

1. There was a lockout recently and neither side is going to want a work stoppage of any sort so if anything, the new CBA will be very close if not the same as the old CBA
2. Donald Fehr will never let the players give anything back. The players might stand-pat but they certainly won't give back any of the 57%.

If anything, i expect with the current climate of the game for the cap to either got to the predictions in this topic or go even higher. If there hadn't been a work stoppage 7 years ago, then i could see it going down but then again, there wouldn't be a cap in the first place. Lol.

[Streaks House]

Is it a slam dunk that the penguins can spend up to that ceiling?

I think that is going to be part of the CBA issues. If the cap and floor are so far apart and the players are getting that big of a cut you are going to start running into similar issues as before. It's not quite at the level yet but could be.

Not to mention from what we have seen, with a cap, floor and rev sharing there are still quite a few teams struggling. These are going to be strong points for the league to bring up against the Nhlpa.

I also think there is something a bit off in a cap league if a team like the pens, while selling out with new arena revenue and a cap are not exactly swimming in money.

That 7% NHL players get compared to other leagues can go a long way.

What does the organization value? Are they willing to operate with minimal profit (or in the red) to put the best product they can on the ice? Or are they more interested in maximizing profits? Not all ownership/management groups operate with the same goals...

[BurghersAndDogsSports]

Is it a slam dunk that the penguins can spend up to that ceiling?

No need to worry about that because once the new CBA is signed, the players percentage of the revenue will go down, and the cap will be less than 70.3 mil. Expect a nominal increase over this year's cap.

Yes, the Pens can spend to whatever cap is given because the cap is determined by how much revenue the teams are making and it's all relative. 57% is still 57% regardless of how high the number is and the calculations this year come out to 70.3 or 73.8, depending on who you listen to. The new TV deal, coupled with the new arena and add in a 10% ticket increase along with killer ratings will make it business as usual for the Pens as long as there is a salary cap.

As for the cap itself, i really don't see it being less than what is specified in this topic. My reasons are:

1. There was a lockout recently and neither side is going to want a work stoppage of any sort so if anything, the new CBA will be very close if not the same as the old CBA
2. Donald Fehr will never let the players give anything back. The players might stand-pat but they certainly won't give back any of the 57%.

If anything, i expect with the current climate of the game for the cap to either got to the predictions in this topic or go even higher. If there hadn't been a work stoppage 7 years ago, then i could see it going down but then again, there wouldn't be a cap in the first place. Lol.

But remember the 57% is of combined league wide revenue not individual team related revenue. That is the issue at hand, why there is too much of a variance is floor vs. ceiling really and why 57% might be a bit high for more teams than it is not. We need to think outside of Pittsburgh to teams in decent markets and situations that are still struggling. The Pens are by all accounts in the major market salary range now (sold out, spending to the cap, new arena cash) but not all teams can say that and its not the Pens are making the profits they should in this situation. Its a small number of teams that should be forking over the $65 million per season and now $70 - $73 or whatever the rumors are.

The irony is the NFL and NBA could probably be at 57% and most teams still making money. The NHL should be the one at 50% by far and they are not (especially with their high % of cap variance floor to ceiling variance).

I agree that nobody on either side wants another work stoppage, but I dont think the NHL is in as solid of a position in regards to this as we would like to think.

[BurghersAndDogsSports]

Is it a slam dunk that the penguins can spend up to that ceiling?

I think that is going to be part of the CBA issues. If the cap and floor are so far apart and the players are getting that big of a cut you are going to start running into similar issues as before. It's not quite at the level yet but could be.

Not to mention from what we have seen, with a cap, floor and rev sharing there are still quite a few teams struggling. These are going to be strong points for the league to bring up against the Nhlpa.

I also think there is something a bit off in a cap league if a team like the pens, while selling out with new arena revenue and a cap are not exactly swimming in money.

That 7% NHL players get compared to other leagues can go a long way.

What does the organization value? Are they willing to operate with minimal profit (or in the red) to put the best product they can on the ice? Or are they more interested in maximizing profits? Not all ownership/management groups operate with the same goals...

I see what you are saying but that is not my point. The Pens may be perfectly happy in this situation breaking even every year and then selling the team in 10 years. I dont know.
But my point is in regards to the cap/cba situation.

The Pens by all accounts are in a good situation at worst, yet they are not making a killer profit every year. That is a problem for the league if you think outside of Pittsburgh. They have a cap, rev sharing and are a growing business yet there are too many teams with issues.

All that I am saying is I dont think the negotiations will be as simple as people think. The players or league each giving up a few things. 57% is high especially for hockey and I think its going to be tough to get this done.

[Pitt87]

Then there's seriously no reason to trade Jordan Staal.

Seriously the kid is what 24 years old? Prorated season of almost 40 goals? Lead the team in goals in the playoffs this year. Came up huge in the Cup year SH goal game 4 to help win the cup. Was amazing in games 6 and 7 to win the cup.

Give this kid a 6 year deal at least and at least 6 Million and call it a day.

You don't trade 24 year old studs, you can trade him when he's 30.

I really can't believe all the people that wanted to trade Staal, you can't replace players like that.

Nizzy, it's all well and good that we have the money to sign him. That isn't the issue at hand. The issue is will he want to play behind Crosby and Malkin? If it was just about money then there wouldn't be a million topics about this.

And it's not like we wanna trade him just... because. If he refuses to sign, then you trade him to get value in return and not letting him go for nothing.

Bio, he said seriously. That means he's serious.

I completely agree; its not the cap situation that keeps him here, its the personnel situation that keeps him here. We don't NEED to make an adjustment to the offense. We absolutely have to re-evaluate our top 4 defenders, which may necessitate a change to the offense. A higher cap makes that less likely, but, as Bio said, the cap does not dictate Jordan Staal's future with the Pens.

[pens_CT]

Is it a slam dunk that the penguins can spend up to that ceiling?

No need to worry about that because once the new CBA is signed, the players percentage of the revenue will go down, and the cap will be less than 70.3 mil. Expect a nominal increase over this year's cap.

As for the cap itself, i really don't see it being less than what is specified in this topic. My reasons are:

1. There was a lockout recently and neither side is going to want a work stoppage of any sort so if anything, the new CBA will be very close if not the same as the old CBA
2. Donald Fehr will never let the players give anything back. The players might stand-pat but they certainly won't give back any of the 57%.

If anything, i expect with the current climate of the game for the cap to either got to the predictions in this topic or go even higher. If there hadn't been a work stoppage 7 years ago, then i could see it going down but then again, there wouldn't be a cap in the first place. Lol.

The NFL players get 46 to 48 percent of the revenue. The NBA after the lockout get 49-51 percent. Not sure how Fehr is going to hold on to 57 percent. The 53 million cap floor is going to kill teams that are swimming in red ink e.g. Phoenix, Colorado, Dallas etc.

[pcm]

This also means that Crosby could get $14 million per year on his new contract.

[KG]

I think Staal is comfortable here and will try to sign a contract extension that is beneficial to both him and the franchise.

[BCG51585]

This also means that Crosby could get $14 million per year on his new contract.

Good point because that would be 20%. You know Crosby will take less to keep the core intact. And assuming Malkin follows suit and is given the same contract, how much do you guys think they will get? Maybe $11.5 million per? So that's...

Crosby 11.5
Malkin 11.5
Staal 7?
Letang 7?
Neal 5
Fleury 8?

$50 million on 6 players. That still makes things interesting.

[BurghersAndDogsSports]

This also means that Crosby could get $14 million per year on his new contract.

True and that is a problem with a fairly high % that goes to the players combined with an even split of TV revenue not being large enough to at least attempt to balance things out. And the 57% being combined league revenue doesnt help a team that isnt kicking as much into the pot (just do the math even with rev sharing) in compared to what they need to spend.

Right now at 57% (and even though its getting better) not a ton of equal TV revenue compared to teams budgets, the cap at this level is helping teams like the NYR's just make a lot of profit with a ceiling and only small rev sharing, and forcing teams in smaller markets to hit payrolls they are having a hard time making.

Now yes obviously there is still more parity than before and that is a good thing. But cutting that 7% and lowering the cap floor and ceiling will go a long way in the league for probably 10 - 12 teams. And thats why I think there will be tough negotiations.

[Noise]

This also means that Crosby could get $14 million per year on his new contract.

Good point because that would be 20%. You know Crosby will take less to keep the core intact. And assuming Malkin follows suit and is given the same contract, how much do you guys think they will get? Maybe $11.5 million per? So that's...

Crosby 11.5
Malkin 11.5
Staal 7?
Letang 7?
Neal 5
Fleury 8?

$50 million on 6 players. That still makes things interesting.

I'm not giving Staal or Letang 7. 5.5 max for each of them.

[psuhockey9]

This also means that Crosby could get $14 million per year on his new contract.

Good point because that would be 20%. You know Crosby will take less to keep the core intact. And assuming Malkin follows suit and is given the same contract, how much do you guys think they will get? Maybe $11.5 million per? So that's...

Crosby 11.5
Malkin 11.5
Staal 7?
Letang 7?
Neal 5
Fleury 8?

$50 million on 6 players. That still makes things interesting.

I'm not giving Staal or Letang 7. 5.5 max for each of them.

And Fleury at 8 is an absolute joke!

[darkstar57]

This also means that Crosby could get $14 million per year on his new contract.

True and that is a problem with a fairly high % that goes to the players combined with an even split of TV revenue not being large enough to at least attempt to balance things out. And the 57% being combined league revenue doesnt help a team that isnt kicking as much into the pot (just do the math even with rev sharing) in compared to what they need to spend.

Right now at 57% (and even though its getting better) not a ton of equal TV revenue compared to teams budgets, the cap at this level is helping teams like the NYR's just make a lot of profit with a ceiling and only small rev sharing, and forcing teams in smaller markets to hit payrolls they are having a hard time making.

Now yes obviously there is still more parity than before and that is a good thing. But cutting that 7% and lowering the cap floor and ceiling will go a long way in the league for probably 10 - 12 teams. And thats why I think there will be tough negotiations.

sorry but the 57% is a negotiated number and means hundred of millions of dollars to be paid to the players, if the owners proposed a 50-50 split, the players would balk and we'd easily have another lockout, getting the number to 56% or 55.5% is more doable. Thats more then a touch negotiations, that a stalemate and another lockout. Also, you don't address that there is an escrow account that part of the players salary is paid into (17%) i believe, if the league hits it target number, the players get there money back, if not it goes to the owners. There has been a lot of talk of just removing that (since players get there money upfront) and moving the percentage down to 56%.

Also, its not like the small market teams don't have that money, if the cap goes up, the revenue comes from somewhere, mostly the tv contract, so they are getting that money to spend, so the divide is not as great as people think.

Now that the coyotes are sold, will help the league out since they longer have to keep that franchise afloat.

[BurghersAndDogsSports]

This also means that Crosby could get $14 million per year on his new contract.

True and that is a problem with a fairly high % that goes to the players combined with an even split of TV revenue not being large enough to at least attempt to balance things out. And the 57% being combined league revenue doesnt help a team that isnt kicking as much into the pot (just do the math even with rev sharing) in compared to what they need to spend.

Right now at 57% (and even though its getting better) not a ton of equal TV revenue compared to teams budgets, the cap at this level is helping teams like the NYR's just make a lot of profit with a ceiling and only small rev sharing, and forcing teams in smaller markets to hit payrolls they are having a hard time making.

Now yes obviously there is still more parity than before and that is a good thing. But cutting that 7% and lowering the cap floor and ceiling will go a long way in the league for probably 10 - 12 teams. And thats why I think there will be tough negotiations.

sorry but the 57% is a negotiated number and means hundred of millions of dollars to be paid to the players, if the owners proposed a 50-50 split, the players would balk and we'd easily have another lockout, getting the number to 56% or 55.5% is more doable. Thats more then a touch negotiations, that a stalemate and another lockout. Also, you don't address that there is an escrow account that part of the players salary is paid into (17%) i believe, if the league hits it target number, the players get there money back, if not it goes to the owners. There has been a lot of talk of just removing that (since players get there money upfront) and moving the percentage down to 56%.

Also, its not like the small market teams don't have that money, if the cap goes up, the revenue comes from somewhere, mostly the tv contract, so they are getting that money to spend, so the divide is not as great as people think.

Now that the coyotes are sold, will help the league out since they longer have to keep that franchise afloat.

I agree with most of what you said, I was only pointing out what the problems are. So you dont see a problem and the league and NHLPA fighting over a %? In the end you may be right but the league is not going to go away quietly.

But I disagree about the fact that just because the 57% is a negotiated number it wont mean problems. In the NFL - the TV money is huge and spread out equally. In the NHL the tv, now that it is better, is still just a nice supplement. It doesnt equal out the way the system is set up. Teams is bigger markets still kill other teams with ticket sales/cash nd there is no balance. I mean some teams are 1/2 the price of others. The 57% and cap has done a nice job of limiting the top salary teams player dollars basically allowing them more profit. Small market teams, a lot of them are still having a hard time reaching the floor, that has been said and published a lot so I am not sure what you are getting at there? While the system is better than a few years ago it still has pretty big issues.

The escrow? I dont think the owners would go for that for a 1% kickback. If the revenues go way down they are screwed and out piles of money for the right to guarantee 1% savings?

[columbia]

The new NBC contract didn't figure into this year's cap, I presume. I can the percentage for the players going down, without ripping apart the cap levels.

Not having the relative numbers, it's hard to know...

[BurghersAndDogsSports]

The new NBC contract didn't figure into this year's cap, I presume. I can the percentage for the players going down, without ripping apart the cap levels.

Not having the relative numbers, it's hard to know...

Very good point but are the players still willing to lose percentage points on the total revenue? Regardless of the situation?

[columbia]

The new NBC contract didn't figure into this year's cap, I presume. I can the percentage for the players going down, without ripping apart the cap levels.

Not having the relative numbers, it's hard to know...

Very good point but are the players still willing to lose percentage points on the total revenue? Regardless of the situation?

Not sure that it matters; just the total dollar amount.
Keepin mind that I'm just speculating on a possible outcome.