Lockout

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Re: Lockout

Postby pens_srq on Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:49 pm

NHLFA needs to demand some revenues. We could demand payment for every time they put our image on the jumbotron. Fans used in marketing campaigns need to demand fair pay!
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Re: Lockout

Postby pens_srq on Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:53 pm

Sam's Drunk Dog wrote:There needs to be more pressure from the fans on the players and league to get a deal done. I feel there needs to be something that acts as a catalyst to start getting everyone united to make sure the fan's voice is heard.

We could make a mockery of them.. o wait. Never mind.
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Re: Lockout

Postby Godric on Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:55 pm

Pittsburgh Penguins owner Ron Burkle's statement:

http://www.post-gazette.com/stories/...medium=twitter
Quote:
"The idea to put players and owners together in the same room was a refreshing idea. Commissioner (Gary) Bettman should be thanked for proposing it and (Donald and Steve Fehr of the NHLPA should be thanked for agreeing to it.

"The players came with a strong desire to get back to playing hockey. They were professional and did a good job of expressing their concerns and listening to ours.

"We wanted to move quickly and decisively. We have all spent too much time without any real progress at the expense of our fans, our sponsor and the communities we serve. It was time to make bold moves and get a deal. Many people think we got over our skis and they are probably right, but we wanted to do everything we could to get back to hockey now. We didn't hold back.

"We made substantial movement on our end quickly, but unfortunately that was not met with the same level of movement from the other side. The players asked us to be patient and keep working with them. It's not what they do and they wanted us to know they were committed. We understood and appreciated their situation. We came back with an aggressive commitment to pensions which we felt was well received. We needed a response on key items that were important to us, but we were optimistic that we were down to very few issues. I believe a deal was within reach.

"We were therefore surprised when the Fehrs made a unilateral and 'non-negotiable' decision -- which is their right, to end the player/owner process that has moved us farther in two days than we moved at any time in the past months.

"I want to thank the players involved for their hard work as we tried to reach a deal.

"I hope that going backwards does not prevent a deal."
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Re: Lockout

Postby knives of ice on Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:56 pm

how many times have the owners/bettman said that everything they offered this week is now off the table?

what a complete and utter joke this process is. both sides are insanely moronic.
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Re: Lockout

Postby Godric on Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:58 pm

knives of ice wrote:how many times have the owners/bettman said that everything they offered this week is now off the table?

what a complete and utter joke this process is. both sides are insanely moronic.


This is all on the players. They are letting Fehr grab his ball and go home
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Re: Lockout

Postby pens_srq on Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:58 pm

yes adding Bettman and Don Fehr back in has helped so much
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Re: Lockout

Postby Godric on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:01 am

I've never seen Gary Bettman as emotional as he was when he talked to the press today
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Re: Lockout

Postby ulf on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:04 am

If this season gets canceled, bettman has to go. I've been a supporter of his, but losing 25% of games in an 8 year span is inexplicable.
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Re: Lockout

Postby pens_srq on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:06 am

So Sid thinks NHL's take it or leave it attitude was not clear in their latest proposal. I was wondering about that as well. This seems like more of a negotiating tactic than anything else if that's the case. I hate Bettman and Fehr's negotiating tatics.

Is there something else behind this? Have the owners switched their positions? Was Bettman emotional in that press conference because of anger at the NHLPA or someone(s) else?

If I were Bettman and owners got enough votes to switch positions on me after I had given these other guys the green light to make a deal, I might be mad at the "hard-liners" who made the decision, not the NHLPA
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Re: Lockout

Postby Godric on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:10 am

ulf wrote:If this season gets canceled, bettman has to go. I've been a supporter of his, but losing 25% of games in an 8 year span is inexplicable.


Fehr is a terrorist... its really not bettman's fault this time.
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Re: Lockout

Postby Godric on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:11 am

Fehr is not looking out the interests of the majority of the nhlpa
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Re: Lockout

Postby tfrizz on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:12 am

knives of ice wrote:how many times have the owners/bettman said that everything they offered this week is now off the table?

what a complete and utter joke this process is. both sides are insanely moronic.


If the NHLPA walked in there tomorrow and said "ok, let's sign that deal" there's no way they could/would refuse it.
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Re: Lockout

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:13 am

pens_srq wrote:So Sid thinks NHL's take it or leave it attitude was not clear in their latest proposal. I was wondering about that as well. This seems like more of a negotiating tactic than anything else if that's the case. I hate Bettman and Fehr's negotiating tatics.

Is there something else behind this? Have the owners switched their positions? Was Bettman emotional in that press conference because of anger at the NHLPA or someone(s) else?

If I were Bettman and owners got enough votes to switch positions on me after I had given these other guys the green light to make a deal, I might be mad at the "hard-liners" who made the decision, not the NHLPA


Well some reports were saying the owners basically thought they had a deal. (this is me speculating not based on anything but what I have read) - if that is the case then Fehr is a majority of the problem. I understand completely the dislike for Gary but if what is being reported is true, that and he told the players to stand strong they can do better, then this lockout is starting to be put entirely on his shoulders.
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Re: Lockout

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:18 am

BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:
pens_srq wrote:So Sid thinks NHL's take it or leave it attitude was not clear in their latest proposal. I was wondering about that as well. This seems like more of a negotiating tactic than anything else if that's the case. I hate Bettman and Fehr's negotiating tatics.

Is there something else behind this? Have the owners switched their positions? Was Bettman emotional in that press conference because of anger at the NHLPA or someone(s) else?

If I were Bettman and owners got enough votes to switch positions on me after I had given these other guys the green light to make a deal, I might be mad at the "hard-liners" who made the decision, not the NHLPA


Well some reports were saying the owners basically thought they had a deal. (this is me speculating not based on anything but what I have read) - if that is the case then Fehr is a majority of the problem. I understand completely the dislike for Gary but if what is being reported is true, that and he told the players to stand strong they can do better, then this lockout is starting to be put entirely on his shoulders.


"The owners THOUGHT they had a deal"

Therein lies the problem. They thought they had a deal. They jumped the gun. They got sucked in like most of us did.

You can't assume you have a deal until it's agreed upon. That's not Fehr's fault.
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Re: Lockout

Postby Kraftster on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:18 am

It is Fehr's job to tell the NHLPA when he thinks there's more to get. It is the NHLPA's job to decide when to say "There's enough here already." Fehr. Is. Doing. His. Job.
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Re: Lockout

Postby Godric on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:21 am

Kraftster wrote:It is Fehr's job to tell the NHLPA when he thinks there's more to get. It is the NHLPA's job to decide when to say "There's enough here already." Fehr. Is. Doing. His. Job.


Its also Fehrs job to hear the majority voice from his clientele.... and he isn't.
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Re: Lockout

Postby Steve on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:22 am

Every time the NHL makes their "best offer" - Fehr gets them to make a better one. (or so it seems to me). At some point, enough will be enough - and I think from the owners side, that's where we are at now. If the "moderate" owners such as Burkle etc are livid over this - I think that could be an indicator – that the NHLPA isn’t receiving any more better deals. In fact, I think they may not get a deal as good as the most recent one.

I also think both sides, are underestimating the damage this is doing, from a fans perspective. Yes, we will come back - but maybe not as fast as they think - or as enthusiastic (including a willingness to spend $$$) as last time. To me, this league is now tainted. How long that takes to wear off, if ever, I’m not sure.
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Re: Lockout

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:22 am

Godric wrote:
Kraftster wrote:It is Fehr's job to tell the NHLPA when he thinks there's more to get. It is the NHLPA's job to decide when to say "There's enough here already." Fehr. Is. Doing. His. Job.


Its also Fehrs job to hear the majority voice from his clientele.... and he isn't.


Really? If the majority wanted a deal, they would have gotten a deal. Read the bolded and underlined.
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Re: Lockout

Postby Godric on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:24 am

MRandall25 wrote:
Godric wrote:
Kraftster wrote:It is Fehr's job to tell the NHLPA when he thinks there's more to get. It is the NHLPA's job to decide when to say "There's enough here already." Fehr. Is. Doing. His. Job.


Its also Fehrs job to hear the majority voice from his clientele.... and he isn't.


Really? If the majority wanted a deal, they would have gotten a deal. Read the bolded and underlined.


I did read that. Its clear you are not picking up what I am putting down.

There has been no player vote, because if there was the lockout would be over.
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Re: Lockout

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:26 am

Godric wrote:
MRandall25 wrote:
Godric wrote:
Kraftster wrote:It is Fehr's job to tell the NHLPA when he thinks there's more to get. It is the NHLPA's job to decide when to say "There's enough here already." Fehr. Is. Doing. His. Job.


Its also Fehrs job to hear the majority voice from his clientele.... and he isn't.


Really? If the majority wanted a deal, they would have gotten a deal. Read the bolded and underlined.


I did read that. Its clear you are not picking up what I am putting down.

There has been no player vote, because if there was the lockout would be over.


There hasn't been a player vote because they think they can get more.

How do you know "the majority of his clientele" wants a deal when it's clear the players want a little more?

If the "majority of his clientele" wanted the deal, they would've gotten it. Period.
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Re: Lockout

Postby Godric on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:31 am

MRandall25 wrote:There hasn't been a player vote because they think they can get more.



There hasn't been a player vote because Fehr knows players would break and the lockout would be over.

How do you know "the majority of his clientele" wants a deal when it's clear the players want a little more?

Its clear the superstars want a little more but the Hamrliks just don't want to lose a year of salary


If the "majority of his clientele" wanted the deal, they would've gotten it. Period.

You're wrong. Fehr holds the power to actually see what the nhlpa wants as a whole and he won't
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Re: Lockout

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:33 am

I disagree, and it's not worth it to keep going. You don't get it.
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Re: Lockout

Postby DudeMan2766 on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:34 am

@BrandonPrust8: I'm done caring.. We keep moving and giving.. This 1 way street sucks



Just mind numbingly infuriating :evil:
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Re: Lockout

Postby offsides on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:36 am

MRandall25 wrote:
Godric wrote:
MRandall25 wrote:
Godric wrote:
Kraftster wrote:It is Fehr's job to tell the NHLPA when he thinks there's more to get. It is the NHLPA's job to decide when to say "There's enough here already." Fehr. Is. Doing. His. Job.


Its also Fehrs job to hear the majority voice from his clientele.... and he isn't.


Really? If the majority wanted a deal, they would have gotten a deal. Read the bolded and underlined.


I did read that. Its clear you are not picking up what I am putting down.

There has been no player vote, because if there was the lockout would be over.


There hasn't been a player vote because they think they can get more.

How do you know "the majority of his clientele" wants a deal when it's clear the players want a little more?

If the "majority of his clientele" wanted the deal, they would've gotten it. Period.


So it will be the player's fault if the season is lost because they wanted a "little more"?
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Re: Lockout

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:36 am

MRandall25 wrote:
BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:
pens_srq wrote:So Sid thinks NHL's take it or leave it attitude was not clear in their latest proposal. I was wondering about that as well. This seems like more of a negotiating tactic than anything else if that's the case. I hate Bettman and Fehr's negotiating tatics.

Is there something else behind this? Have the owners switched their positions? Was Bettman emotional in that press conference because of anger at the NHLPA or someone(s) else?

If I were Bettman and owners got enough votes to switch positions on me after I had given these other guys the green light to make a deal, I might be mad at the "hard-liners" who made the decision, not the NHLPA


Well some reports were saying the owners basically thought they had a deal. (this is me speculating not based on anything but what I have read) - if that is the case then Fehr is a majority of the problem. I understand completely the dislike for Gary but if what is being reported is true, that and he told the players to stand strong they can do better, then this lockout is starting to be put entirely on his shoulders.


"The owners THOUGHT they had a deal"

Therein lies the problem. They thought they had a deal. They jumped the gun. They got sucked in like most of us did.

You can't assume you have a deal until it's agreed upon. That's not Fehr's fault.


No it could be. We don't know why they thought they had a deal. Maybe the players were positive, said this looks good and Fehr shot them down.

I don't think the owners are upset because they were cracking champagne, I think they were upset because it seemed the players were receptive and close to a deal until Fehr got involved.

It's different than just thinking things were cool, they had to have had a reason.
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