You are the GM

[DesertPenguin]

I would hate to lose a dman for nothing on waivers. Even if Lovejoy, Strait, etc are not making our lineup they have to be top 7 for somebody out there. Late round pick in return is better than giving them away for free.

Lots of pressure on Shero this year. 9 million in cap space (more than any of the other contenders in the East) and a surplus of prospects to trade away. He needs to hit a home run or two between now and April's deadline.

I think we can all rest assured that the team on the ice next weekend will look different come playoff time but since our season ended vs Philly we have done nothing to improve the team via trade, draft, UFA signing, etc.

I sincerely doubt Shero spends to the cap this year, unless it is for a rental that we plan to let walk at the end of the season. Remember, the cap drops from 70m to 64.3m next year, and that number is partially inflated per the CBA agreement, so the year following it could fall even more. During that span, we need to sign Malkin and Letang, and now that the long term contract loopholes have been closed, those will not be easy signings. Malkin's cap hit will be higher than Sid's, even if his salary is the same, and Letang will get a significant raise.

If anything, the time for Shero to make moves is in this coming off season, to pick up mid level players that other teams need to deal away to cut their cap number.

[no name]

If you can trade 2 guys for one better quality stay at home guy i think you would have to do it. Also we have enough depth on D that clearing some room might give some guys in WB more playing time.

Engelland you got to keep, he is our only enforcer on the team. But getting rid of Lovejoy Burtozzo, Sneep, Strait any of these 2 might fetch you one NHL guy.

Granted you might not get much but its better than losing guys on waivers.

[penny lane]

Maybe pens can steal shea weber away; preds PO'd at him. pens need a stand up and brush them aside defensemen. Sacrifice offense for a steady defense...oh my. Defense and neutral trap key in 94 lockout season.
We've seen since 09, that offense alone won't get this team playing again in june.

[pugilist13]

I have over 9 million in cap space. The time is now to deal one of the D prospects and a pick to upgrade the blueline. I'm not talking about a top pair guy. A second pair guy who can give me some solid minutes in our zone. Possibly look at a winger for this season. Utilize buyouts if necessary over the summer. Vegas may have the Pens as the favorite, but i sure as hell dont. I dont even have them at the top in the east at this point. Cryers and Rags are both deeper than the Pens. I hate both of those clubs, but it is what it is.

When i said D prospects, i dont mean the Bortuzzo's or Strait's of the world. Those guys are a dime a dozen. At this point i look to move a Harrington, Pouliot, Maatta, Despres.

[MRandall25]

Will people wait to see how the team plays before jumping to insane conclusions?

[DelPen]

Pens are more than good enough to make the playoffs as the 5th see finishing 3rd in the division if it comes to that. With that much cap space wait until the deadline and get some rentals who can still be bought out if needed for next season since there are two amnesty buyouts Shero can use.

If Despres plays well enough to make the team then Lovejoy has the least upside and value so you try to move him or carry 9 defensemen and 12 forwards and maybe dress 7 D some nights until a trade can be worked out. That leaves Tangradi down in WBS or Jeffrey waived, rather keep Jeffrey around too, might be able to move him too for a team sucking out of the gate looking for a change, same with Lovejoy.

But I don't see anyone outside the organization coming in until April unless there's a trade too good to pass for Shero.

[DesertPenguin]

Pens are more than good enough to make the playoffs as the 5th see finishing 3rd in the division if it comes to that. With that much cap space wait until the deadline and get some rentals who can still be bought out if needed for next season since there are two amnesty buyouts Shero can use.

If Despres plays well enough to make the team then Lovejoy has the least upside and value so you try to move him or carry 9 defensemen and 12 forwards and maybe dress 7 D some nights until a trade can be worked out. That leaves Tangradi down in WBS or Jeffrey waived, rather keep Jeffrey around too, might be able to move him too for a team sucking out of the gate looking for a change, same with Lovejoy.

But I don't see anyone outside the organization coming in until April unless there's a trade too good to pass for Shero.

I don't think it will be a blockbuster, but there will likely be a trade during camp to lower our number of non waiver eligible D from 8 to 7. One or both of Lovejoy and Strait will be moved, likely for picks, unless they get wrapped up as chips in a bigger deal.

[Sams_Dog]

I have over 9 million in cap space. The time is now to deal one of the D prospects and a pick to upgrade the blueline. I'm not talking about a top pair guy. A second pair guy who can give me some solid minutes in our zone. Possibly look at a winger for this season. Utilize buyouts if necessary over the summer. Vegas may have the Pens as the favorite, but i sure as hell dont. I dont even have them at the top in the east at this point. Cryers and Rags are both deeper than the Pens. I hate both of those clubs, but it is what it is.

When i said D prospects, i dont mean the Bortuzzo's or Strait's of the world. Those guys are a dime a dozen. At this point i look to move a Harrington, Pouliot, Maatta, Despres.

I agree. To get the stay-at-home Dman the Pens need they are going to have to part with one of those really good, young blue chip guys. But they have so many that I'm not really worried about it. We can afford to part with some of them. I see the Pens trading one NHL regular winger, one 3-5 Dman and one top prospect for a nice #2 or #3 Dman and a forward prospect.

[Defence21]

I hope this doesnt turn into a thread like the Rick Nash (or any trade) thread where people think Despres, a pick and Kennedy would bring anything to us.

If Goligoski brought us James Neal, why can't Despres bring us around the same return?

We don't need another superstar on this team.

Because Goligoski (and Whitney because that example will be brought up soon enough) were in their 3rd and 5th years (or 5th and 7th overall) in the NHL and were established and everyone in the league knew exactly what they would bring to their teams. Average wingers are a dime a dozen (sorry Kennedy and Dupuis).

Edit above: of course they would bring us something, but not as much as people around here think. Way overvalued at this point.

So, Despres is in what year 3 of his pro career? D men take a few years to develop. I think he would bring something, but you are right, it won't be Bobby Ryan.

I am in no way saying he cant bring anything of value, most likely at the deadline for an impending UFA or someone not quite working out on a non playoff team.

But the reality is, we have a surplus of d prospects. If we are lucky half will work out like they should. Those half will be serious trade bait (in the theory of why we went drafting this way) in their 2nd or 3rd year in the NHL. Not before, before that they are simply prospects for deadline deadline deals or add ins to get a real deal done.

I just dont think we have many "tradable assets" at the pro level right now with the thinking we are not trading Malkin, Neal, Letang etc.

I find it funny how people use Goligoski's and Whitney's NHL experience as reasoning for the return that came to Pittsburgh, and yet many of the same people (not necessarily you) were the ones ripping Whitney and Goligoski for being "garbage" and incapable of playing prominent roles in the NHL. Additionally, before either was traded, these are the people who were saying, "there's no way Shero gets anything of value for Britney or Golisukski."

If a team perceives Despres to be a good fit for its system and near NHL ready and has a surplus at a position, it could -- or would -- be willing to deal for Despres and give up quality to get him. And, by quality, we're not talking about a rental or an overaged veteran.

Am I saying such a trade is out there? No. I'm simply saying that a highly-touted prospect from a team known for its depth of defensive prospects very easily could yield a quality long-term top-six forward return. I'm thinking of a late-20s, 50-60 point winger. Some examples: Pacorietty, Wheeler, Burrows, Gagner, Versteeg, Weiss, etc. None are to-flight wingers, but all are quality and capable of helping this team.

[The U]

Will people wait to see how the team plays before jumping to insane conclusions?

I don't think anybody is "down" on the team. We had a surplus and prospects and cap space last year as well. We tried to make moves at the deadline and failed. We tried to sign top tier UFAs this offseason and failed. We've lost in the first rd of the playoffs two hrs in a row. Since Philly rolled us the team has actually gotten worse on paper.

At some point the cap space and prospects have to be used to upgrade the team. Our last meaningful/deep playoff run was 4-5 years ago? That's a long time considering the guys we have on this team.

We all know this team is good and they're going to make the playoffs but given the current situation it's only understandable that most are eagerly awaiting Shero's next move.

It take two to tango of course. Shero can't make a trade unless he finds a partner.

[Fire0nice228]

I said before and I say again, why does everyone think the Pens are in a position to 'trade for and then buy out so and so next season"..? The team has stated they need to make it to atleast the 2nd round to turn a meaningful profit. The Penguins are not one of the teams that can afford to throw money around willy nilly

[MRandall25]

We didn't try to make moves at the deadline because there were no moves to make. You don't make moves and waste cap space just for the sake of making moves and using cap space.

Will you at least wait until the season starts before trying to trade everyone away?

[SolidSnake]

What's wrong with discussing moves? that's what this is, a discussion board? I never seen someone get so riled up about everything

[MRandall25]

What's the point of discussing moves in the first place if we have 0 idea how this team is playing?

I'm not riled up, just wondering why we're basing our opinions of this year's team (which hasn't even played a game) to last year? Let the guys play FFS.

[SolidSnake]

What's the difference discussing moves now or during the summer? the team doesn't play during the summer. What else is there to discuss since the season hasn't started yet?

[MRandall25]

I guess the first place to start is "No one was discussing trading everyone of our D corps during the summer"

[SolidSnake]

Well, there was a chance there was going to be no season, now there is. Funny how it works out.

[MRandall25]

I dunno. I just think it's stupid to even be discussing trading people until the season starts. That belief holds true during the summer as well. Until the team plays a few games, everyone is on the same level playing-wise. It's easier to make/form opinions on players after watching them play a few games in the new season than it is to say "Hurr durr Player X sucked last year so we should trade him and Player Y who also sucked for Team Z's best player".

[BurghersAndDogsSports]

I find it funny how people use Goligoski's and Whitney's NHL experience as reasoning for the return that came to Pittsburgh, and yet many of the same people (not necessarily you) were the ones ripping Whitney and Goligoski for being "garbage" and incapable of playing prominent roles in the NHL. Additionally, before either was traded, these are the people who were saying, "there's no way Shero gets anything of value for Britney or Golisukski."

If a team perceives Despres to be a good fit for its system and near NHL ready and has a surplus at a position, it could -- or would -- be willing to deal for Despres and give up quality to get him. And, by quality, we're not talking about a rental or an overaged veteran.

Am I saying such a trade is out there? No. I'm simply saying that a highly-touted prospect from a team known for its depth of defensive prospects very easily could yield a quality long-term top-six forward return. I'm thinking of a late-20s, 50-60 point winger. Some examples: Pacorietty, Wheeler, Burrows, Gagner, Versteeg, Weiss, etc. None are to-flight wingers, but all are quality and capable of helping this team.

Missed the point. the pont is you can't get what we got for those two if we traded while they were in the minors, not even close. And there are very few teams that would give up a 50-60 point winger for Despres or any of our dmen unless its the deadline and the situation is perfect. Everyone is tied for first place right now, and other than one to two teams making a round or two of the playoffs would go a long way financially.

Anyways what is the point of drafting tons of purely puck moving dmen if we are going to dump them off for dime a dozen forwards?

[ulf]

would you guys quit telling me I'm the GM

[Kovy27]

I find it funny how people use Goligoski's and Whitney's NHL experience as reasoning for the return that came to Pittsburgh, and yet many of the same people (not necessarily you) were the ones ripping Whitney and Goligoski for being "garbage" and incapable of playing prominent roles in the NHL. Additionally, before either was traded, these are the people who were saying, "there's no way Shero gets anything of value for Britney or Golisukski."

If a team perceives Despres to be a good fit for its system and near NHL ready and has a surplus at a position, it could -- or would -- be willing to deal for Despres and give up quality to get him. And, by quality, we're not talking about a rental or an overaged veteran.

Am I saying such a trade is out there? No. I'm simply saying that a highly-touted prospect from a team known for its depth of defensive prospects very easily could yield a quality long-term top-six forward return. I'm thinking of a late-20s, 50-60 point winger. Some examples: Pacorietty, Wheeler, Burrows, Gagner, Versteeg, Weiss, etc. None are to-flight wingers, but all are quality and capable of helping this team.

Yep, you and I think alike. Lets be honest, if Columbus felt that Despres could be a future player for them and gave us something FOR NOW in return...everyone would be jumping up and down. We got our winger for Sid or Malkin! YAY! Unicorns and Rainbows!!!!!!!

There are some teams that need defensive help and might feel giving a better player for a young puck moving d would be beneficial to our team.

Also, on the other point...it is a surplus of prospect Ds. We are so deep with prospects that we can use them as assets. If someone said here's a 50 dollar bond that you can cash out in 25 years and that person wants 20 bucks because they need the cash now. You know who makes out on that deal in the long run? The bond.

[Kovy27]

I find it funny how people use Goligoski's and Whitney's NHL experience as reasoning for the return that came to Pittsburgh, and yet many of the same people (not necessarily you) were the ones ripping Whitney and Goligoski for being "garbage" and incapable of playing prominent roles in the NHL. Additionally, before either was traded, these are the people who were saying, "there's no way Shero gets anything of value for Britney or Golisukski."

If a team perceives Despres to be a good fit for its system and near NHL ready and has a surplus at a position, it could -- or would -- be willing to deal for Despres and give up quality to get him. And, by quality, we're not talking about a rental or an overaged veteran.

Am I saying such a trade is out there? No. I'm simply saying that a highly-touted prospect from a team known for its depth of defensive prospects very easily could yield a quality long-term top-six forward return. I'm thinking of a late-20s, 50-60 point winger. Some examples: Pacorietty, Wheeler, Burrows, Gagner, Versteeg, Weiss, etc. None are to-flight wingers, but all are quality and capable of helping this team.

Also, I think Weiss will be part of the Luongo trade to Fla at some point this year. If Fla starts off bad, I wouldn't be surprised. He's a UFA at season's end and for some reason, I don't think Fla will sign him.

[Defence21]

I find it funny how people use Goligoski's and Whitney's NHL experience as reasoning for the return that came to Pittsburgh, and yet many of the same people (not necessarily you) were the ones ripping Whitney and Goligoski for being "garbage" and incapable of playing prominent roles in the NHL. Additionally, before either was traded, these are the people who were saying, "there's no way Shero gets anything of value for Britney or Golisukski."

If a team perceives Despres to be a good fit for its system and near NHL ready and has a surplus at a position, it could -- or would -- be willing to deal for Despres and give up quality to get him. And, by quality, we're not talking about a rental or an overaged veteran.

Am I saying such a trade is out there? No. I'm simply saying that a highly-touted prospect from a team known for its depth of defensive prospects very easily could yield a quality long-term top-six forward return. I'm thinking of a late-20s, 50-60 point winger. Some examples: Pacorietty, Wheeler, Burrows, Gagner, Versteeg, Weiss, etc. None are to-flight wingers, but all are quality and capable of helping this team.

Also, I think Weiss will be part of the Luongo trade to Fla at some point this year. If Fla starts off bad, I wouldn't be surprised. He's a UFA at season's end and for some reason, I don't think Fla will sign him.

I don't see Florida being dumb enough to make a Luongo trade. Maybe I'm wrong, but they have a legit future stud that is probably one year away from being their franchise goalie. Adding Luongo to the mix would make no sense. I've seen enough progress from this team's management to think they'd be willing to sacrifice the future for the now.

[columbia]

That's why TOR is the perfect destination for him.

[Defence21]

I find it funny how people use Goligoski's and Whitney's NHL experience as reasoning for the return that came to Pittsburgh, and yet many of the same people (not necessarily you) were the ones ripping Whitney and Goligoski for being "garbage" and incapable of playing prominent roles in the NHL. Additionally, before either was traded, these are the people who were saying, "there's no way Shero gets anything of value for Britney or Golisukski."

If a team perceives Despres to be a good fit for its system and near NHL ready and has a surplus at a position, it could -- or would -- be willing to deal for Despres and give up quality to get him. And, by quality, we're not talking about a rental or an overaged veteran.

Am I saying such a trade is out there? No. I'm simply saying that a highly-touted prospect from a team known for its depth of defensive prospects very easily could yield a quality long-term top-six forward return. I'm thinking of a late-20s, 50-60 point winger. Some examples: Pacorietty, Wheeler, Burrows, Gagner, Versteeg, Weiss, etc. None are to-flight wingers, but all are quality and capable of helping this team.

Missed the point. the pont is you can't get what we got for those two if we traded while they were in the minors, not even close. And there are very few teams that would give up a 50-60 point winger for Despres or any of our dmen unless its the deadline and the situation is perfect. Everyone is tied for first place right now, and other than one to two teams making a round or two of the playoffs would go a long way financially.

Anyways what is the point of drafting tons of purely puck moving dmen if we are going to dump them off for dime a dozen forwards?

No, no. I got your point loud and clear. And I disagree with it. I'm not saying it will happen -- or even that Shero and the Penguins want it to happen. But I am saying it could happen and that it's far from illogical, as you and others suggest.

There are many teams out there right now that have no chance of competing in the short term, yet have a bright future. Of these teams, there may be one or two that have an abundance of wingers, quite possibly wingers that they realize won't be with them when they achieve success in a few years. They may see an opportunity to acquire a future top-pairing defenseman who may be a year away from the NHL (or more appropriately, from NHL success) by trading away a player they know will be gone in a year or two anyway.

Now, you mention that it is pointless to trading a puck moving defenseman for a dime a dozen forward. That's fair. But is a 50-60 point winger a dime a dozen player? Is Kunitz really that ordinary? He pots 50-60 points, hits, forechecks, plays quality defense, and compliments the league's best center -- while also showing an ability to play well with any linemates his partnered with. Just because a player "only" scores 50-60 points doesn't make him a dime a dozen player.

Obviously you disagree with my opinion -- and that's fair. We're here to discuss and disagree. But what I don't understand is why people who have seen Shero acquire some legitimate players for pieces that were perceived as complete garbage would rule out the possibility of Shero turning Despres (a highly touted prospect who is very near NHL ready) for a long-term, albeit not superstar caliber, scoring line winger.

Goligoski (third pairing, struggling, disliked in Pittsburgh) for Neal AND Niskanen
Whitney (hated by fans, diminishing skills, injury history at a young age in Pittsburgh) for Kunitz AND Tangradi
Armstrong (valuable third liner), Christensen (shootout specialist), Esposito (plumetting stock for two years) and a 1st rounder (very late) for Hossa AND Dupuis -- I will mention the caveat that both Hossa and Dupuis were rentals, and Hossa walked, while Dupuis re-signed

I would say 1/5 Pens fans would have expected any of these trades was possible. In fact, my guess is most likely would have laughed if any of these trades was suggested ahead of time on a message board like LGP -- yet Shero pulled them off by means of legitimate negotiation skills and because professional GMs and scouts for professional teams know much, much more about players and prospects than most fans could even dream of knowing.