You are the GM

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Re: You are the GM

Postby MRandall25 on Sun Jan 13, 2013 12:21 pm

Wouldn't they just give Malkin the same cap hit (which is what I was going for)?
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Re: You are the GM

Postby Fire0nice228 on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:00 pm

No because Crosbys cap hit is 8.7 but some of his years are paid at well over 8.7 and since they can't do the big drop off thing anymore they'll have to pay malkin more.

The first 8 years of sids new contract would have a cap hit of 10.9mil by my calculations, so since they can only give Malkin an 8 year deal now, his cap hit will be more if they pay him the same as Sid, which I assume is what Geno wants.

source (add up the first 8 years of sids contract on cap geek an divide by 8)
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Re: You are the GM

Postby ulf on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:02 pm

That makes no sense. The cap is going down.. no way Geno makes more money than Sid
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Re: You are the GM

Postby Fire0nice228 on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:04 pm

It makes perfect sense. If Geno wants to make the same in actual dollars as Sid (like he did on his last contract) his cap hit will be higher.

Considering Geno is the best player in the world right now, I'd assume he'll get paid as much as Sid.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby Gaucho on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:11 pm

He'll get the same money over a shorter period of time? How does that make perfect sense? Especially with the cap going down.

Sorry, I just don't see it.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:15 pm

Gaucho wrote:He'll get the same money over a shorter period of time? How does that make perfect sense? Especially with the cap going down.

Sorry, I just don't see it.


because Sid has his actual cash front loaded. You can't do that as much with the new cba. So will only be gettin paid like a million his last year.

Can't do that with Geno. It's how and why teams were signing those 12 year deals and why players loves them.

Parise got like a 12 million bonus on sept 14th for example. That's why it was such a sticking negotiating point.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby Fire0nice228 on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:16 pm

If you add up Sids actual money per year the first 8 years of his contract, each year is over 8.7 mil, the only reason his cap hit is 8.7 is because of the trailer years. If you pay Malkin the same in actual money per year for 8 years (instead of 12 that crosby got with the last 4 pulling his cap hit down) malkins cap hit is over 10 million.

you all think Geno will get paid less in real money than Sid just because the went down for a few seasons until it comes back up as revenues grow? If so I disagree with that notion.

So yes, I'm saying (assuming)he'll get the same money as sid did (in real life dollars which has nothing to do with cap in this instance)for the first 8 years of Sids contract, but since geno cant have the trailer years thrown on to lower his hit, his cap hit will be higher. Same as Pensct said on the last page.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby rickyaustin on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:36 pm

It's been talked about publicly, and written about numerous times — Malkin likely will carry a cap-hit higher than Crosby.

A few reasons:

Crosby is obviously taking a huge hometown discount, as per usual. Not that Malkin is above this, he's clearly been a team player as long as he's been a Penguin, but…

Crosby makes a ton of money from endorsements as well ($4M). Malkin doesn't have nearly as many ($400k). Forbes did an article on this in late 2012: http://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenha ... d-players/

So to make roughly the same amount, you'd pay Malkin more in NHL salary, as Crosby will have endorsements to pad his income. No way it's a $4M difference, but 1.5-2M more isn't out of the question IMO.

Based on production, Malkin is currently the better player. Crosby has missed a ton of time, while Malkin is just coming off a scoring title and MVP.

Remember, Malkin is already at 8.7M on the cap. A bump to say, 9.5 or 10M isn't a big bump for Shero, who is well under next year's cap. It's not like the shock of going from entry-level to top-paid player contracts there was a few years ago.

My gut is Malkin comes in at 8 years, 80M, an increase, but still a discount.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby Fire0nice228 on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:39 pm

The endorsement part of it doesnt even matter. His cap hit will be higher because it he wants the same money per year (speaking of his SPC only) as Crosby he wont have the cheater years at the end to lower the hit.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby ulf on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:51 pm

Fire0nice228 wrote:If you add up Sids actual money per year the first 8 years of his contract, each year is over 8.7 mil, the only reason his cap hit is 8.7 is because of the trailer years. If you pay Malkin the same in actual money per year for 8 years (instead of 12 that crosby got with the last 4 pulling his cap hit down) malkins cap hit is over 10 million.

you all think Geno will get paid less in real money than Sid just because the went down for a few seasons until it comes back up as revenues grow? If so I disagree with that notion.

So yes, I'm saying (assuming)he'll get the same money as sid did (in real life dollars which has nothing to do with cap in this instance)for the first 8 years of Sids contract, but since geno cant have the trailer years thrown on to lower his hit, his cap hit will be higher. Same as Pensct said on the last page.

Oh wait we're talking real life dollars?
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Re: You are the GM

Postby rickyaustin on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:52 pm

Fire0nice228 wrote:The endorsement part of it doesnt even matter. His cap hit will be higher because it he wants the same money per year (speaking of his SPC only) as Crosby he wont have the cheater years at the end to lower the hit.


I think it's a bit simplistic to think they're just gonna lop off the last 4 years of Crosby's contract and call it a day. If they want to front-load it with $12M to keep him happy initially, that's fine — something like 12,12,12,12,10,8,7,7 (8yr/$80M)— but I really think when people talk about wanting the same money, I assume we're all talking cap number.

The highest paid player in the game is Alex Ovechkin at $9.5M cap hit. Crosby/Malkin are #2 at $8.7. Do you really see Malkin up above $10M+ to $11M or $12M?? Seems excessive, especially for a team player.

Image
Last edited by rickyaustin on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby JeanPronovost on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:52 pm

Exactly. Sid's salary in 2014-15 will be $12 million. Does anyone think Geno will be satisfied with $10 million?
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Re: You are the GM

Postby ulf on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:53 pm

How about not real life dollars where 10 mil per year is a touch under 17% of our total cap room? As opposed to Sid's 8.7 being about 13%? It's silly to ignore the cap decreasing by 10%
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Re: You are the GM

Postby JeanPronovost on Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:58 pm

Well, that's the whole question. Is Geno going to be understanding about getting fewer actual dollars than Sid simply because Sid got his deal in before the new CBA? If Geno's OK with that, he'll sign. If he's not, he might look elsewhere.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby MRandall25 on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:01 pm

What makes you think Shero is going to let Geno make it to July 1st (or whatever) in 2014? They're allowed to start negotiating the extension this year. There's literally 0 chance of Malkin making it to UFA.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby ulf on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:01 pm

JeanPronovost wrote:Well, that's the whole question. Is Geno going to be understanding about getting fewer actual dollars than Sid simply because Sid got his deal in before the new CBA? If Geno's OK with that, he'll sign. If he's not, he might look elsewhere.

I am sure Geno and his agent are well aware of the new circumstances.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby pens_CT on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:04 pm

ulf wrote:
JeanPronovost wrote:Well, that's the whole question. Is Geno going to be understanding about getting fewer actual dollars than Sid simply because Sid got his deal in before the new CBA? If Geno's OK with that, he'll sign. If he's not, he might look elsewhere.

I am sure Geno and his agent are well aware of the new circumstances.

Since Geno and Sid have the same agent you would think so.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby JeanPronovost on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:08 pm

MRandall25 wrote:What makes you think Shero is going to let Geno make it to July 1st (or whatever) in 2014? They're allowed to start negotiating the extension this year. There's literally 0 chance of Malkin making it to UFA.


Just because they can negotiate is no guarantee that they'll get it done.

Any top player who makes it to UFA status does so because he and his team have failed to cut a deal in a year's time. The Devils and Zach Parise negotiated for that long.

I'm not predicting Geno will leave, I'm just saying don't assume it's a lock he stays.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby pens_CT on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:10 pm

JeanPronovost wrote:Well, that's the whole question. Is Geno going to be understanding about getting fewer actual dollars than Sid simply because Sid got his deal in before the new CBA? If Geno's OK with that, he'll sign. If he's not, he might look elsewhere.

I remember reading and/or hearing that Shero told Sid prior to the lockout that Geno would probably be making more (cap number) than him once a new CBA was signed due to contract length restrictions etc. Sid apparently doesn't have an issue with it, the only problem is getting the number and Letang's to fit under the cap without having AHL talent at the other positions.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby ville5 on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:14 pm

Personally, i'd like to see what Sutter can do in top 6. If BB isn't ready.
Then if he's successful, get a 3rd line center.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby Lesky on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:16 pm

What are you guys saying? Malkin might leave? Its a bad day for hockey suddenly :cry:
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Re: You are the GM

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:22 pm

MRandall25 wrote:What makes you think Shero is going to let Geno make it to July 1st (or whatever) in 2014? They're allowed to start negotiating the extension this year. There's literally 0 chance of Malkin making it to UFA.


Well that's not relevant to the cap hit though. Sign him a year out or one day out he may have a higher cap hit than Sid.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:24 pm

pens_CT wrote:
JeanPronovost wrote:Well, that's the whole question. Is Geno going to be understanding about getting fewer actual dollars than Sid simply because Sid got his deal in before the new CBA? If Geno's OK with that, he'll sign. If he's not, he might look elsewhere.

I remember reading and/or hearing that Shero told Sid prior to the lockout that Geno would probably be making more (cap number) than him once a new CBA was signed due to contract length restrictions etc. Sid apparently doesn't have an issue with it, the only problem is getting the number and Letang's to fit under the cap without having AHL talent at the other positions.


Sure but the issue is everyone is thinking Sid and Geno will have a cap hit of $17, when its possible to be closer to 20 or 1/3 of a potential cap or $30 million with Fleury and Neal havin 50 percent of cap in 4 guys.

That leads to discussions of what you can pay Letang or whoever etc
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Re: You are the GM

Postby rickyaustin on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:26 pm

There's zero chance we lose Geno, relax everyone. Current cap hit is $8.7M, they're not going to lose him over a small increase in salary. There's nothing to suggest otherwise.
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Re: You are the GM

Postby Idoit40fans on Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:26 pm

Its not worth speculating on what the cap will look like when you have no idea what salary demands will be
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