New Reason why CEC is not loud

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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby DropEmJayBird on Sat Jan 26, 2013 2:22 pm

mac5155 wrote:I was pretty sauced up at the home opener and tried to get chants going, but was met with blank stares and eye rolls


I saw you, but at the time I was slightly miffed that I could not find anywhere in the arena that offered even a drop of Marcassin Estate Chardonnay, my favorite wine. That's probably why I gave you a dirty look. My wife and I both decided to leave after the third TV timeout in the second, taking my potential client and his subordinate back to Cap Grill for that very reason.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby FreeCandy44 on Sat Jan 26, 2013 2:30 pm

Were spoiled....hence my post.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby largegarlic on Sat Jan 26, 2013 2:37 pm

Having been to several MLS games in recent years, I wonder if the Pens could something similar in terms of handling/encouraging fan noise. I've gone to MLS games in Philly, but I think most MLS teams do something like this. They have designated sections in the stadium for the hardcore supporters groups, who stand, chant, bang drums, etc. throughout the game. There's little "inorganic" noise pumped in through the stadium speakers--they just let the supporters groups do the work, and sometimes the larger crowd joins in on chants started by the supporters. The non-supporters sections are for the families, location droppers, quiet, but intensely focused fans (I include myself in this group), etc.

I think it's a pretty good compromise in that it doesn't chase off the location dropper, bandwagon fans and their money, but it also allows and encourages very vocal support of the home side, which often becomes infectious and spreads to the whole stadium.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby skullman80 on Sat Jan 26, 2013 2:40 pm

FreeCandy44 wrote:Did it ever occur to anybody, that everyone has become quiet because weve been spoiled by success? Like the players, the fans expect to win every game now. That happens when you have a team full of talent. We as fans have become spoiled and jaded with winning and cheering now. The people who attend games have seen us win so much that it is now expected which im sure cuts in on the old attention span/cheering. Why cheer or even pay attention when you expect to win? Winnipeg lost there team and have had little success. Like the team, the fans are hungry for winning hockey. It reflected last night based on there cheering and passion. To sum it up....winning has made us sof!


I think this has a lot to do with it. No one gets up for regular season games any more. Playoffs aren't just expected, but deep runs into the playoffs are the expectation now. Now I don't think this is the only reason, but I think it plays a big part. People are spoiled, and it's hard to get up for a regular season game on a Wednesday night, home opener or not .
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby DesertPenguin on Sat Jan 26, 2013 4:07 pm

On the flip side to all this, ive gotten Coyotes tickets on Stubhub before for 8 bucks, and the crowd was bad. Granted they were nosebleed, but a saturday night game vs The Flyers should not be cheaper than a movie. At least the CEC gets filled to capacity, unlike Jobing.com. Putting that arena in Glendale was one of the biggest bonehead moves i've ever seen.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby penmyst on Sat Jan 26, 2013 4:15 pm

So, the Pens success has attracted a different sort of ticket buyer?

Is that a bad thing? The success part I mean.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby TheHammer24 on Sat Jan 26, 2013 4:18 pm

Fire0nice228 wrote:Too many corporate types and people there to 'location drop' (Oh , we're going to the Pens game look at me!!!). For a game like the home opener all the corporate folks are going to go to that to location drop or take clients or impress whomever; not to watch the game or cheer. I don't know why I do it but if you look at comments on the Pens facebook for the result last night and see people blaming Vokoun saying he played like a rookie and stuff like that its no small wonder. They have no clue. Alot of 'fans' right now are obviously new and bandwagon and only halfhearted a hockey/Pens fan and are mostly at the rink for the cool factor. just imo.

I generally agree.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby Digitalgypsy66 on Sat Jan 26, 2013 7:31 pm

I was going to get all ranty about corporate seats, and I think that is an issue, such as the story of the Paul MacLean lookalike in Ottawa (basically, a fan that looked like Sens coach MacLean sat behind the Sens bench in his company's seats. The lookalike said he hadn't been to a game in two years because clients usually use them): http://sports.nationalpost.com/2013/01/ ... lookalike/

But then I remembered my first Penguins game was courtesy of corporate seats, way back in 1987. A vendor my dad did business with (and wanted more of his business) gave him those tickets, and a 14 year old DigitalGypsy went and subsequently fell in love with the Penguins. Still watching them 26 years later...

So there is good and bad about corporate seats...but I don't remember yelling much at that game. :lol:

Don't some arenas mic crowd noise for TV?
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby Hawkeynut on Sat Jan 26, 2013 9:26 pm

Hard to make noise when you are on LGP.com posting in "Fire DB" threads. I blame cel phones.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby pens2005 on Sun Jan 27, 2013 1:15 am

drnort wrote:
pens2005 wrote:
drnort wrote:It has nothing to do with the size or shape of the arena. That argument is ridiculous. If you are at the game, its clear that a large number of people simply have no interest in making noise. The arena acoustics arent making them sit there staring at the ceiling or uploading their view to facebook.

It has almost everything to do with the "location drop" that someone else mentioned. Going to the Pens game is cool. Being a Pens fan is cool. There are a significantly large number of people that are attending games right now that have no real interest in the game of hockey, but only have interest in being a Pens fan. I have nothing against those people. But the fact is, they arent into the games.

It also has nothing to do with ticket prices. It has a lot more to do with the fact that season ticket holders can sell their tickets for a profit. So fans that used to have a reason to attend every game and make for a better atmosphere are now finding any reason they can to sell their tickets, make money, and stay at home. The tickets are being bought by those that simply want to "check out a Pens game."

The same thing started happening at Mellon Arena the last 2 years. Gone are the days of fans attending 30-40 games a year. When the people in the seats change from game to game, the atmosphere suffers.


Again, comparing any of the arenas to winnipegs is dumb. It's widely regarded as the loudest arena in hockey.

CEC is fine. People complaining about the noise are annoying.

It's loud enough. Come playoff time it's rockin' in there.

"But it's not the loudest!" argument people sound like 6 year olds.


Where exactly did I compare CEC to Winnipeg?? I am not expecting our fans to be the loudest in hockey. This has more to do with the fans being engaged and being into the game. Cheering when we clear the zone on the PK, more than one section chanting Fleury's name, people actually joining in when someone starts a Lets Go Pens chant, fans standing and cheering when our players take the ice, etc. There are empty seats consistently during the game as people are busy getting food and merchandise during play.

Thats why I am not buying the "arena design" as any kind of an excuse. Its not about the noise level. Its about the fans, in general, being a part of the game. And at some point, Pens fans as a whole quit being as engaged as they USED to be. I dont care to compare our fans to anyone else. I dont care for our fans to be as loud as Washington, Philly, Montreal, or Winnipeg. I was simply providing reasons why our fans intensity at games has seemed to drop off.

I have left playoff games having the same feeling. "That did not feel like a playoff atmosphere". I dont know why some people get offended when this conversation comes up. No one is claiming that Pens fans are bad fans. Just discussing why those in the arena are unable to create an atmosphere like we have seen in Pittsburgh in the past.


They are plenty loud...stop whining.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Sun Jan 27, 2013 2:54 am

It's the entire event from pre to post game and everything in between. Other newer arenas just flat out have much more to offer and it's not even close. Plenty of places to be and to plan your entire evening around the game.......except Consol.

You get into it pre game, the game, the crowd, and hanging and drinking at the arena after. It's the entire feel at these places. I think everyone that posted here is correct in a way. It can get loud, but not often enough. They are one of the top priced teams in the us driving a corporate crowd, the game stuff like music and whatever is awful on a good day.

But it's the pens fault. They are $10 million up under the cap but 2nd highest priced team (corporate). They built a cheap arena, with no amenities for us regular folk. Other teams have figured out to keep the pre game and after money in the clubs hands by building bars, restaurants and destinations for all. Except Consol.

The pens said - go to another place before and after, come here for a ton of money, if you are corporate be in small terrible clubs, listen to pearl jam and different big hit videos and be happy.

I'm biased becasue I have seen other arenas and consol and the pens are lucky they have Sid or it would fall apart in a week.

The crowd is weaker, the acoustics are worse those are all true but the main issue is apparently some folks who thought building a slab of ice with seats and bricks around it would be enough, never thinking about what the fan wants, expects or needs.
Last edited by BurghersAndDogsSports on Sun Jan 27, 2013 8:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby knives of ice on Sun Jan 27, 2013 4:32 am

pens2005 wrote:
drnort wrote:It has nothing to do with the size or shape of the arena. That argument is ridiculous. If you are at the game, its clear that a large number of people simply have no interest in making noise. The arena acoustics arent making them sit there staring at the ceiling or uploading their view to facebook.

It has almost everything to do with the "location drop" that someone else mentioned. Going to the Pens game is cool. Being a Pens fan is cool. There are a significantly large number of people that are attending games right now that have no real interest in the game of hockey, but only have interest in being a Pens fan. I have nothing against those people. But the fact is, they arent into the games.

It also has nothing to do with ticket prices. It has a lot more to do with the fact that season ticket holders can sell their tickets for a profit. So fans that used to have a reason to attend every game and make for a better atmosphere are now finding any reason they can to sell their tickets, make money, and stay at home. The tickets are being bought by those that simply want to "check out a Pens game."

The same thing started happening at Mellon Arena the last 2 years. Gone are the days of fans attending 30-40 games a year. When the people in the seats change from game to game, the atmosphere suffers.


Again, comparing any of the arenas to winnipegs is dumb. It's widely regarded as the loudest arena in hockey.



CEC is fine. People complaining about the noise are annoying.

It's loud enough. Come playoff time it's rockin' in there.

"But it's not the loudest!" argument people sound like 6 year olds.



exactly right. i've gone to 99 percent of the home games in the past seven years at mellon and the cec. i've been to nearly every opposing arena on the east coast including MSG, Philly, Ottawa, Detroit for the playoffs. The idea that somehow Pittsburgh isn't as loud as these other arenas is BS plain and simple. Pittsburgh will NEVER EVER EVER be as loud as winnipeg or montreal. if fans are disappointed or stunned its just not normal behavior to be super loud and very unlikely to happen regardless of the arena - just look at winnipeg when the pens were up 2-0. there is no doubt game 4 against philly last year when staal scored the arena was super loud, that isn't going to happen every game. if the team is down, plays like crap, or blows 3-0 leads the crowd will not be loud and never will be its just human nature.

now, i'm strictly speaking of crowd noise. the problems with the new arena are a completely different topic
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby Big Easy Pens Fan on Sun Jan 27, 2013 9:20 am

Steve Dave wrote:We went to a game last year (TB) and there was a "couple" sitting next to us, and all they discussed the whole game was that they didn't think some girl should be getting married to some guy. It was kind of annoying. They didn't even pay attention to the game. I guess you have the right to do whatever if you pay for tickets.


I agree with the highlited above. However, I doubt seriously that the "couple" actually paid for the tickets they were occupying. Probably given to them by whoever wasn't able use them that night. And if the money isn't coming directly out of your pocket you are more likely to either not use them or not use them for the purpose intended. Lesson here: Do not give tickets away to persons who you are not absolutly sure will use them for the purpose intended.

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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby FreeCandy44 on Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:36 pm

I have tix to the Pens Vs Flyers game March 24. I intend on booing and screaming my heart out. If I get mocked or people roll there eyes at me? Meh so be it. I paid money for them and I intend on having some fun.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby FreeCandy44 on Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:50 pm

Ill be in 208 if anybody wants an autograph by the way.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby cheesesteakwithegg on Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:39 am

BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:It's the entire event from pre to post game and everything in between. Other newer arenas just flat out have much more to offer and it's not even close. Plenty of places to be and to plan your entire evening around the game.......except Consol.

You get into it pre game, the game, the crowd, and hanging and drinking at the arena after. It's the entire feel at these places. I think everyone that posted here is correct in a way. It can get loud, but not often enough. They are one of the top priced teams in the us driving a corporate crowd, the game stuff like music and whatever is awful on a good day.

But it's the pens fault. They are $10 million up under the cap but 2nd highest priced team (corporate). They built a cheap arena, with no amenities for us regular folk. Other teams have figured out to keep the pre game and after money in the clubs hands by building bars, restaurants and destinations for all. Except Consol.

The pens said - go to another place before and after, come here for a ton of money, if you are corporate be in small terrible clubs, listen to pearl jam and different big hit videos and be happy.

I'm biased becasue I have seen other arenas and consol and the pens are lucky they have Sid or it would fall apart in a week.

The crowd is weaker, the acoustics are worse those are all true but the main issue is apparently some folks who thought building a slab of ice with seats and bricks around it would be enough, never thinking about what the fan wants, expects or needs.


The Pens are going to be developing the old arena site, and I would venture to guess that it will have its fair share of bars and restaurants. Would be nice if they picked up the pace on it, but it will be there eventually.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby meow on Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:56 am

Spoiled sports fans are spoiled
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby topshelf66 on Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:50 am

Buccigrass was at the Blue Jackets game last nght and commented on the improved atmosphere. He stated that the over the top in-game entertainment had been turned down from his last visit. He seemed to imply that that allowed for a better fan experience / creation of atmosphere.

I attended Game 7 at Verizon Center. Thier in-game was like CEC now. I remember thinking while there that this must be what you have to do when you have an arena full of people that really don't appreciate the game.

I have been to ACC and Centre Bell since. Neither arena is loud, outside of a home goal, and there is not much in game entertainment. You can however hear people talking about the game.

The people I sit with at CEC and I usually wiat until the walk back to the car to discuss the game. You can't have a conversation during a stoppage.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby pulp22 on Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:57 am

canaan wrote:ive never been much of a rah rah type at hockey games. i rarely make noise and prefer just to watch the game. aside from the high fives and cheering during goals, im probably a part of the "evil quiet fans" that this thread is denigrating. that being said, i paid for my ticket the same as you so get bent.


Truth.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby Ossa on Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:07 pm

largegarlic wrote:Having been to several MLS games in recent years, I wonder if the Pens could something similar in terms of handling/encouraging fan noise. I've gone to MLS games in Philly, but I think most MLS teams do something like this. They have designated sections in the stadium for the hardcore supporters groups, who stand, chant, bang drums, etc. throughout the game. There's little "inorganic" noise pumped in through the stadium speakers--they just let the supporters groups do the work, and sometimes the larger crowd joins in on chants started by the supporters. The non-supporters sections are for the families, location droppers, quiet, but intensely focused fans (I include myself in this group), etc.

I think it's a pretty good compromise in that it doesn't chase off the location dropper, bandwagon fans and their money, but it also allows and encourages very vocal support of the home side, which often becomes infectious and spreads to the whole stadium.


I'd love the idea of a supporters section but I can't ever see it happening at NHL games. The closest thing I've seen of a "supporter section" at a NHL game was at the Islanders game where the last couple rows in the upper bowl stood the entire game. It was kinda cool.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:09 pm

cheesesteakwithegg wrote:
BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:It's the entire event from pre to post game and everything in between. Other newer arenas just flat out have much more to offer and it's not even close. Plenty of places to be and to plan your entire evening around the game.......except Consol.

You get into it pre game, the game, the crowd, and hanging and drinking at the arena after. It's the entire feel at these places. I think everyone that posted here is correct in a way. It can get loud, but not often enough. They are one of the top priced teams in the us driving a corporate crowd, the game stuff like music and whatever is awful on a good day.

But it's the pens fault. They are $10 million up under the cap but 2nd highest priced team (corporate). They built a cheap arena, with no amenities for us regular folk. Other teams have figured out to keep the pre game and after money in the clubs hands by building bars, restaurants and destinations for all. Except Consol.

The pens said - go to another place before and after, come here for a ton of money, if you are corporate be in small terrible clubs, listen to pearl jam and different big hit videos and be happy.

I'm biased becasue I have seen other arenas and consol and the pens are lucky they have Sid or it would fall apart in a week.

The crowd is weaker, the acoustics are worse those are all true but the main issue is apparently some folks who thought building a slab of ice with seats and bricks around it would be enough, never thinking about what the fan wants, expects or needs.


The Pens are going to be developing the old arena site, and I would venture to guess that it will have its fair share of bars and restaurants. Would be nice if they picked up the pace on it, but it will be there eventually.


I'm not 100% sold on that being a huge decelopment opportunity. I think there will be some but nearly what people expect. They haven't even sold what's outside Consol and is there anything new on 5th? Nobody will ever go there when there isn't an event, at least the north shore is a decent enough area to sustain some business, apartments and office buildings. I don't see most of that in what is a bad area on non pens nights.

Anyways, my point is that Consol specifically should have more. Every other building I have ever been to has bars and restaurants and plenty of them inside the arena. Before and after the games are a blast.

I mean development or not who on the pens decided that big bad wide open air is better than putting in places that keep the money (and grow atmosphere) instead of making the Marriott and other bars richer?
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby KennyTheKangaroo on Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:11 pm

topshelf66 wrote:I attended Game 7 at Verizon Center. Thier in-game was like CEC now. I remember thinking while there that this must be what you have to do when you have an arena full of people that really don't appreciate the game.


This reminds kenny the kangaroo of going to watch an arena football game. loud and obnoxious and catering to the lowest common denominator. its a shame that the penguins have resorted to that style.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby Kharlamov on Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:49 pm

Whoever is in charge of the sound at the CEC should talk to his counterpart at the RCA dome where the Indy Colts play. They pump in fake crowd noise.
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby raewhit on Tue Jan 29, 2013 3:19 pm

I'm not 100% sold on that being a huge development opportunity. I think there will be some but nearly what people expect. They haven't even sold what's outside Consol and is there anything new on 5th? Nobody will ever go there when there isn't an event, at least the north shore is a decent enough area to sustain some business, apartments and office buildings. I don't see most of that in what is a bad area on non pens nights.


That North Shore development is all new since PNC Park and Heinz Field opened. It took years for that to develop. I remember going to games at Heinz Field when there was nothing there.

Of course- Mellon Arena has only been gone for less than a year. Remember the Pens are required to start development a year after the arena demolition. I would assume roads and infrastructure would be the first step then commercial and retail. I had read that the prices that they are asking for the 5th avenue properties is crazy-probably why nothing has been happening there.

The Consol area is not any worse than that North Shore area. The advantage that the Consol has is that there are so many more events-concerts, ice shows etc.. It is always busy. Gotta give more than 1 year though. :D
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Re: New Reason why CEC is not loud

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:07 pm

I would think baseball and football have similar number of events, almost 100 pro and college games per year. Similar.
Anyways, dont really want to discuss that becasue its off topic, but my point is the Pens are apparently (if this is true) counting on development for too much, if that is the reason they didnt build squat other than bricks with an ice rink in the middle.

I just think that area is a lot different than the Heinz/PNC area. For some reason that north shore is near enough and easily accessible enough to draw non game day, or office lunch type crowds.

I dont picture people walking or driving up there for anything although I could be wrong.
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