Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby Hawkeynut on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:32 pm

Sorry Ben, you've been Despres'ed!
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby danisu21 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:34 pm

:scared:


but not really.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby llipgh2 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:38 pm

Good luck Rev.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby mikey287 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:38 pm

columbia wrote:It should be noted that this is why Strait was waived and not Lovejoy. Only one of them would be able to bring this sort of return.
Having said that, I'm kind of surprised that it was as high as a 5th. :shrugs:


I don't think that's necessarily the right conclusion. It might not be wrong, but I wouldn't infer it. If you reversed the situations and Lovejoy was sent down early and Strait stayed with the team. We might have gotten a 5th for Strait right now and lost (or not) Lovejoy to waivers and not batted an eyelash.

Right now, the Ducks have some injuries and a couple of defensemen with serious cases of cranial flatulence...so, they have a bit of a need right now.

A trade like this isn't a target of a player in many cases. This is an organizational depth move, adds a right-handed shot, adds a cheap contract to a team on a budget with minimal assets lost.

You generally want to make a trade worth someone's while. Offering a 7th round pick or a 6th means little to a GM/scouts. If they have a player that they have deemed worthy of selection, that they feel is a must-have, they'll make it work. Picks in the 5th through 7th round are roughly of similar value. Trading back into the draft in the 7th round is not difficult if there's a player missed that the team feels they can not lure via the invite route.

Exceptions always apply, but circumstances should be noted more than absolute value.

Note that it's a 2014 pick, not 2013. Circumstances apply. Ducks lost their original 2nd, 4th and 7th already.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby guiner on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:38 pm

I think he was better than people gave him credit for. Goodluck Ben.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby columbia on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:40 pm

mikey287 wrote:
columbia wrote:It should be noted that this is why Strait was waived and not Lovejoy. Only one of them would be able to bring this sort of return.
Having said that, I'm kind of surprised that it was as high as a 5th. :shrugs:


I don't think that's necessarily the right conclusion. It might not be wrong, but I wouldn't infer it. If you reversed the situations and Lovejoy was sent down early and Strait stayed with the team. We might have gotten a 5th for Strait right now and lost (or not) Lovejoy to waivers and not batted an eyelash.

Right now, the Ducks have some injuries and a couple of defensemen with serious cases of cranial flatulence...so, they have a bit of a need right now.

A trade like this isn't a target of a player in many cases. This is an organizational depth move, adds a right-handed shot, adds a cheap contract to a team on a budget with minimal assets lost.

You generally want to make a trade worth someone's while. Offering a 7th round pick or a 6th means little to a GM/scouts. If they have a player that they have deemed worthy of selection, that they feel is a must-have, they'll make it work. Picks in the 5th through 7th round are roughly of similar value. Trading back into the draft in the 7th round is not difficult if there's a player missed that the team feels they can not lure via the invite route.

Exceptions always apply, but circumstances should be noted more than absolute value.

Note that it's a 2014 pick, not 2013. Circumstances apply. Ducks lost their original 2nd, 4th and 7th already.


They would not have gotten 5th for Strait, IMO.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby Cagsjr724 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:40 pm

Best of luck to Reverend Lovejoy! Hope he gets a chance to crack the lineup.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby Metalmike on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:45 pm

The Pens always bring up the Pittsburgh native's from Upper St. Clair. Dylan Reese to make the Ryan Malone fans somewhat happy.

Metal Mike, Canada's #1 Penguins Fan.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby meecrofilm on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:45 pm

meow wrote:Shero's hands were tied. I think Lovejoy's value was a little higher, but everyone knew Shero had to trade a D. Having 38 D on one-way deals can drive the price down for your guys.


Nah. 5th is very solid for Lovejoy.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby Froggy on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:46 pm

he was refreshing to see as a kid who legitimately seemed in awe of his good fortune every time he stepped on the ice. he always seemed excited just to be playing, and i liked seeing that. I wish i liked him as much as a player as i did from what i saw of him as a person. Best of luck, though.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby farnham16 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:47 pm

Good luck to him. Solid person. Below average hockey player.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby ILikeTurtles on Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:57 pm

The Pens got a fifth for a guy that was going to end up on waivers when Nisky came back, also he was an undrafted free agent out of college. Really this is good for the Pens and good for him to get a fresh chance in ANA.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby FreeCandy44 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:03 pm

I always liked him. Good luck in Anaheim with BBQ Bruce.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby Cagsjr724 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:04 pm

Maybe Mark Eaton gets a shot with the big club this year after this trade.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby helmespc on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:08 pm

Glad I don't have to hear how bad he is constantly on this board anymore.... time to focus all our attention on ET.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby pens_CT on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:11 pm

This gets them one more contract under the limit of 50, and gives Shero more room to add people at the deadline or sign a college free agent in the spring (Andrej Sustr for example).
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby mikey287 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:13 pm

columbia wrote:
mikey287 wrote:
columbia wrote:It should be noted that this is why Strait was waived and not Lovejoy. Only one of them would be able to bring this sort of return.
Having said that, I'm kind of surprised that it was as high as a 5th. :shrugs:


I don't think that's necessarily the right conclusion. It might not be wrong, but I wouldn't infer it. If you reversed the situations and Lovejoy was sent down early and Strait stayed with the team. We might have gotten a 5th for Strait right now and lost (or not) Lovejoy to waivers and not batted an eyelash.

Right now, the Ducks have some injuries and a couple of defensemen with serious cases of cranial flatulence...so, they have a bit of a need right now.

A trade like this isn't a target of a player in many cases. This is an organizational depth move, adds a right-handed shot, adds a cheap contract to a team on a budget with minimal assets lost.

You generally want to make a trade worth someone's while. Offering a 7th round pick or a 6th means little to a GM/scouts. If they have a player that they have deemed worthy of selection, that they feel is a must-have, they'll make it work. Picks in the 5th through 7th round are roughly of similar value. Trading back into the draft in the 7th round is not difficult if there's a player missed that the team feels they can not lure via the invite route.

Exceptions always apply, but circumstances should be noted more than absolute value.

Note that it's a 2014 pick, not 2013. Circumstances apply. Ducks lost their original 2nd, 4th and 7th already.


They would not have gotten 5th for Strait, IMO.


I don't think it would have been outlandish to ask for a non-conditional pick for Strait at this point in the season. He'd have been more valuable if he had cleared waivers for us, but I think that we could have gotten a non-conditional pick from him at this point.

It's fairly immaterial. But Strait is on a two-way deal, he just turned 25 at the start of the year, most teams should have information on him...played at a popular college, represented the United States internationally, was a top-75 draft pick. Lovejoy, is 29 in a few days, sub-100 games of NHL experience, less popular college, no int'l experience, was not on the draft radar (still in HS, then lost a year to transferring in a key developmental year), on a one-way deal.

Advantages for Lovejoy: better skater, right-handed. Not much else.

Reverse the situations, I think we can get the same for Strait now as we did Lovejoy now. I don't believe either of them had even this much value on January 19th, as acquiring either of these players meant that you (the GM) felt that either player offered an upgrade to your current core of players.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby It'sagreatdayforhockey! on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:19 pm

Rocco wrote:But how will they get Iginla if they can't dangle Lovejoy? Fire Shero.



Tangradi + Kennedy + Ana 5th; that should still get it done.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby Dickie Dunn on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:25 pm

Cagsjr724 wrote:Maybe Mark Eaton gets a shot with the big club this year after this trade.


Mark Eaton sucks. He sucked for the past two years in New York. He sucked so bad that none of the 30 teams in the NHL offered him a contract this off season. No thanks. Not now. Not ever. My hate for him grows every time his name is mentioned on this board. He's a turd. There isn't another fan base in the league that even remembers his name. He's a bottom pairing defenseman who is well past his usefulness in the NHL and his injured ass is already injured.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby Mongoose87 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:26 pm

Dickie Dunn wrote:
Cagsjr724 wrote:Maybe Mark Eaton gets a shot with the big club this year after this trade.


Mark Eaton sucks. He sucked for the past two years in New York. He sucked so bad that none of the 30 teams in the NHL offered him a contract this off season. No thanks. Not now. Not ever. My hate for him grows every time his name is mentioned on this board. He's a turd. There isn't another fan base in the league that even remembers his name. He's a bottom pairing defenseman who is well past his usefulness in the NHL and his injured ass is already injured.

I don't even understand how you could hate someone so unobtrusive.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby columbia on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:27 pm

mikey287 wrote:
columbia wrote:
mikey287 wrote:
columbia wrote:It should be noted that this is why Strait was waived and not Lovejoy. Only one of them would be able to bring this sort of return.
Having said that, I'm kind of surprised that it was as high as a 5th. :shrugs:


I don't think that's necessarily the right conclusion. It might not be wrong, but I wouldn't infer it. If you reversed the situations and Lovejoy was sent down early and Strait stayed with the team. We might have gotten a 5th for Strait right now and lost (or not) Lovejoy to waivers and not batted an eyelash.

Right now, the Ducks have some injuries and a couple of defensemen with serious cases of cranial flatulence...so, they have a bit of a need right now.

A trade like this isn't a target of a player in many cases. This is an organizational depth move, adds a right-handed shot, adds a cheap contract to a team on a budget with minimal assets lost.

You generally want to make a trade worth someone's while. Offering a 7th round pick or a 6th means little to a GM/scouts. If they have a player that they have deemed worthy of selection, that they feel is a must-have, they'll make it work. Picks in the 5th through 7th round are roughly of similar value. Trading back into the draft in the 7th round is not difficult if there's a player missed that the team feels they can not lure via the invite route.

Exceptions always apply, but circumstances should be noted more than absolute value.

Note that it's a 2014 pick, not 2013. Circumstances apply. Ducks lost their original 2nd, 4th and 7th already.


They would not have gotten 5th for Strait, IMO.


I don't think it would have been outlandish to ask for a non-conditional pick for Strait at this point in the season. He'd have been more valuable if he had cleared waivers for us, but I think that we could have gotten a non-conditional pick from him at this point.

It's fairly immaterial. But Strait is on a two-way deal, he just turned 25 at the start of the year, most teams should have information on him...played at a popular college, represented the United States internationally, was a top-75 draft pick. Lovejoy, is 29 in a few days, sub-100 games of NHL experience, less popular college, no int'l experience, was not on the draft radar (still in HS, then lost a year to transferring in a key developmental year), on a one-way deal.

Advantages for Lovejoy: better skater, right-handed. Not much else.

Reverse the situations, I think we can get the same for Strait now as we did Lovejoy now. I don't believe either of them had even this much value on January 19th, as acquiring either of these players meant that you (the GM) felt that either player offered an upgrade to your current core of players.


That's a lot of ifs, perhaps, maybes and speculation.
Only one of the two was waived and - in the end - that's what we have to go by.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby The U on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:29 pm

It's a 5th rounder in 2014...not 2013.

I think that's worth less than a 5th rounder in this upcoming draft. I don't think you can say "wow Shero got a 5th rounder for Lovejoy!"

It's probably equivalent to a 7th in this yrs draft.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby columbia on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:32 pm

Unless you're couching that in an analysis of the two draft classes, a 5th is a 5th is a 5th.
Last edited by columbia on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby booboo on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:32 pm

I wonder what value it adds to our future negotiating positions that would potentially involve our surplus defensemen if those picked from our waivers or traded for picks do well wherever they end up? If there is some consistency to positive outcomes of such moves from the point of view of the receiving teams, it should elevate our asking price in any future trades involving our surplus D, right?
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Re: Lovejoy to Anaheim for 5th round pick

Postby ILikeTurtles on Wed Feb 06, 2013 11:36 pm

Any pick after rounds 3-4 is basically a crap shoot. Shero picked up a draft pick for a guy that he signed off waivers for free. He was out of the mix in Pittsburgh, there is no way to complain about this deal.
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