NHL realignment on the table again.

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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Rocco on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:29 am

Remind me again why they can't just put Nashville in the Southeast (since, you know, they're in the southeast part of the US) and Winnipeg in the Central?
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Kovy27 on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:31 am

Rocco wrote:Remind me again why they can't just put Nashville in the Southeast (since, you know, they're in the southeast part of the US) and Winnipeg in the Central?


The Red Wings will cry like little ********.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Pens15 on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:33 am

I really hate this so much. People don't realize what an uphill battle it's going to be to make the playoffs every year out of the new Atlantic conference. Some of the wealthiest, best run, most committed franchises in the league. If we really have to do this backwards system, I'd so much rather be with the Northeast conference. Hell with rivalries, make new ones. I actually hate playing the Flyers anyway.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby slappybrown on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:41 am

Pens15 wrote:I really hate his so much. People don't realize what an uphill battle it's going to be to make the playoffs every year out of the new Atlantic conference. Some of the wealthiest, best run, most committed franchises in the league. If we really have to do this backwards system, I'd so much rather be with the Northeast conference. Hell with rivalries, make new ones. I actually hate playing the Flyers anyway.

Yes, the number of cups the NYR, NYI, and PHI have won over the past 20 years is astounding.

In a pre-cap world, the Rangers were a laughingstock, spending millions for zero outside of 94. Philly hit a couple finals, but that's it. The only org you can really call well-run from a hockey perspective on a consistent basis is NJ. NYR have gotten their act together lately. In a salary cap world, I'm not too worried about it, let alone to the point where I want to ditch the teams I love to hate.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Rocco on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:41 am

Kovy27 wrote:
Rocco wrote:Remind me again why they can't just put Nashville in the Southeast (since, you know, they're in the southeast part of the US) and Winnipeg in the Central?


The Red Wings will cry like little ********.


They'll miss Nashville that badly? I didn't realize anyone really cared that much about the Predators.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby slappybrown on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:43 am

Rocco wrote:
Kovy27 wrote:
Rocco wrote:Remind me again why they can't just put Nashville in the Southeast (since, you know, they're in the southeast part of the US) and Winnipeg in the Central?


The Red Wings will cry like little ********.


They'll miss Nashville that badly? I didn't realize anyone really cared that much about the Predators.

I think it's more the travel. They claim that in the event there is realignment, they've been promised they'd move to a divioson or conference that would put that in the Eastern time zone for most games. They hate that they are on EST and play most CST/MST/PST games.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Steve Dave on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:43 am

Rocco wrote:Remind me again why they can't just put Nashville in the Southeast (since, you know, they're in the southeast part of the US) and Winnipeg in the Central?


Makes too much sense?
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:45 am

Rocco wrote:
Kovy27 wrote:
Rocco wrote:Remind me again why they can't just put Nashville in the Southeast (since, you know, they're in the southeast part of the US) and Winnipeg in the Central?


The Red Wings will cry like little ********.


They'll miss Nashville that badly? I didn't realize anyone really cared that much about the Predators.


Nashville in the East means Detroit stays West. Detroit doesn't want to travel.

Too bad they don't realize Columbus is further East than they are.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby slappybrown on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:49 am

MRandall25 wrote:
Rocco wrote:
Kovy27 wrote:
Rocco wrote:Remind me again why they can't just put Nashville in the Southeast (since, you know, they're in the southeast part of the US) and Winnipeg in the Central?


The Red Wings will cry like little ********.


They'll miss Nashville that badly? I didn't realize anyone really cared that much about the Predators.


Nashville in the East means Detroit stays West. Detroit doesn't want to travel.

Too bad they don't realize Columbus is further East than they are.

Ill try to find the article where a Detroit writer/blogger talked about this supposed back room promise to move DET east from years ago or something
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Pens15 on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:50 am

slappybrown wrote:
Pens15 wrote:I really hate his so much. People don't realize what an uphill battle it's going to be to make the playoffs every year out of the new Atlantic conference. Some of the wealthiest, best run, most committed franchises in the league. If we really have to do this backwards system, I'd so much rather be with the Northeast conference. Hell with rivalries, make new ones. I actually hate playing the Flyers anyway.

Yes, the number of cups the NYR, NYI, and PHI have won over the past 20 years is astounding.

In a pre-cap world, the Rangers were a laughingstock, spending millions for zero outside of 94. Philly hit a couple finals, but that's it. The only org you can really call well-run from a hockey perspective on a consistent basis is NJ. NYR have gotten their act together lately. In a salary cap world, I'm not too worried about it, let alone to the point where I want to ditch the teams I love to hate.


Philly and NYR are two of the best run orgs in the league. They are committed to winning and spare no expense. Everybody wants to play there and they get just about every FA they want. NYR has been a contender year in and year out. How's that compare to Toronto? Montreal? The Atlantic will be so, so tough to come out of. Every year you will have some of the best teams in the league knocking each other off in the first round. Hate hate hate it.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby tfrizz on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:51 am

Rocco wrote:Remind me again why they can't just put Nashville in the Southeast (since, you know, they're in the southeast part of the US) and Winnipeg in the Central?


They were talking about this during 2nd intermission of the Washington @ Tampa game last night. They speculated the move would more likely be Winnipeg to the Northwest, Minnesota to the Central, and Nashville to the Southeast.

They also mentioned that it's likely to be opposed by Detroit and Columbus - two teams in the Eastern time zone who are stuck in the Western Conference. (Nashville is in the Central time zone)
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Pens15 on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:53 am

tfrizz wrote:
Rocco wrote:Remind me again why they can't just put Nashville in the Southeast (since, you know, they're in the southeast part of the US) and Winnipeg in the Central?


They were talking about this during 2nd intermission of the Washington @ Tampa game last night. They speculated the move would more likely be Winnipeg to the Northwest, Minnesota to the Central, and Nashville to the Southeast.

They also mentioned that it's likely to be opposed by Detroit and Columbus - two teams in the Eastern time zone who are stuck in the Western Conference. (Nashville is in the Central time zone)


Dear God I hope they're right, but the recent reports have said that the 4 conference idea was still on the table.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby slappybrown on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:58 am

Pens15 wrote:
slappybrown wrote:
Pens15 wrote:I really hate his so much. People don't realize what an uphill battle it's going to be to make the playoffs every year out of the new Atlantic conference. Some of the wealthiest, best run, most committed franchises in the league. If we really have to do this backwards system, I'd so much rather be with the Northeast conference. Hell with rivalries, make new ones. I actually hate playing the Flyers anyway.

Yes, the number of cups the NYR, NYI, and PHI have won over the past 20 years is astounding.

In a pre-cap world, the Rangers were a laughingstock, spending millions for zero outside of 94. Philly hit a couple finals, but that's it. The only org you can really call well-run from a hockey perspective on a consistent basis is NJ. NYR have gotten their act together lately. In a salary cap world, I'm not too worried about it, let alone to the point where I want to ditch the teams I love to hate.


Philly and NYR are two of the best run orgs in the league. They are committed to winning and spare no expense. Everybody wants to play there and they get just about every FA they want. NYR has been a contender year in and year out. How's that compare to Toronto? Montreal? The Atlantic will be so, so tough to come out of. Every year you will have some of the best teams in the league knocking each other off in the first round. Hate hate hate it.

A lot of what you are saying is just inaccurate or over a small period of time. Sather has been more down than up in his time. He'll, they missed the playoffs as close as two years ago. Clarke's Flyers well run? That's an interesting take.

And in terms of money, resources, and prestige not automatically equaling success, TML and MTL are the perfect examples. The cap world puts everyone, for the most part, on fairly equal footing.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Pens15 on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:05 pm

To me a team that's making the playoffs year in and year out, consistently in contention, is well run. It's a short list of clubs and since the lockout both NYR and Philly are on the list. Occasional down year notwithstanding. Jersey too, and despite their current morass, Washington too. Mark my words this Atlantic will be easily the toughest group to come out of every year for a long time.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby columbia on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:07 pm

As someone who receives Sports South with my cable, I can assure you that Nashville is a Southern team - they're on if the Canes don't have a game that night.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby tfrizz on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:11 pm

Pens15 wrote:
tfrizz wrote:
Rocco wrote:Remind me again why they can't just put Nashville in the Southeast (since, you know, they're in the southeast part of the US) and Winnipeg in the Central?


They were talking about this during 2nd intermission of the Washington @ Tampa game last night. They speculated the move would more likely be Winnipeg to the Northwest, Minnesota to the Central, and Nashville to the Southeast.

They also mentioned that it's likely to be opposed by Detroit and Columbus - two teams in the Eastern time zone who are stuck in the Western Conference. (Nashville is in the Central time zone)


Dear God I hope they're right, but the recent reports have said that the 4 conference idea was still on the table.


The 4 conference idea isn't terrible, aside from two things I really dislike - (1) unbalanced divisions/conferences and (2) breaking up so many rivalries.

If I were to propose a 4 conference setup, this is how I'd do it:


Eastern Conference
East Division: Carolina, Columbus, Florida, New Jersey, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Tampa Bay, Washington
Northeast Division: Boston, Buffalo, Detroit, Montreal, NY Islanders, NY Rangers, Ottawa, Toronto

Western Conference
Pacific Division: Anaheim, Calgary, Edmonton, Los Angeles, Phoenix, San Jose, Vancouver
Mid-West Division: Chicago, Colorado, Dallas, Minnesota, Nashville, St Louis, Winnipeg


All teams in the Eastern Conference are on EST; teams in the Mid-West Division are on CST except Colorado (MST); and teams in the Pacifing Division are on either MST (Calgary, Edmonton, Phoenix) or PST. This eliminates the 3 time zone difference between Columbus/Detroit and the PST teams.

Scheduling, however, would be a nightmare because of the way the NHL weights it (divisional, intra-conference, inter-conference).
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby slappybrown on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:13 pm

Pens15 wrote:To me a team that's making the playoffs year in and year out, consistently in contention, is well run. It's a short list of clubs and since the lockout both NYR and Philly are on the list. Occasional down year notwithstanding. Jersey too, and despite their current morass, Washington too. Mark my words this Atlantic will be easily the toughest group to come out of every year for a long time.


I think you're overselling those teams performance post lockout for the most part, and I think the league is more cyclical in a cap world than you do, but fair enough.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:14 pm

There's also only 7 teams in each Western division/conference. If 4 make the playoffs from each, the West teams have a better chance statistically to make the playoffs.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby tfrizz on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:19 pm

MRandall25 wrote:There's also only 7 teams in each Western division/conference. If 4 make the playoffs from each, the West teams have a better chance statistically to make the playoffs.


Correct. The problem is the concentration of teams in the northeastern part of the continent. Based on location you could really put all Eastern Conference teams except Carolina, Florida, and Tampa Bay into one division.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Steve Dave on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:28 pm

MRandall25 wrote:There's also only 7 teams in each Western division/conference. If 4 make the playoffs from each, the West teams have a better chance statistically to make the playoffs.


What if Columbus stayed in Midwest?
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:29 pm

Steve Dave wrote:
MRandall25 wrote:There's also only 7 teams in each Western division/conference. If 4 make the playoffs from each, the West teams have a better chance statistically to make the playoffs.


What if Columbus stayed in Midwest?


Then you'd be screwing over a team who is further east than Detroit, and in the Eastern Time Zone
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby shoeshine boy on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:46 pm

I'm all for Nashville moving to the SE division. it's only a 4 hour drive from me and that would get me back my 2 Penguins games a year. I was looking forward to this year's game but the lockout ruined that.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Pens15 on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:47 pm

tfrizz wrote:The 4 conference idea isn't terrible, aside from two things I really dislike - (1) unbalanced divisions/conferences and (2) breaking up so many rivalries.


So then, am I the only one who sees the huge potential for unfair playoff outcomes on pretty much a yearly basis?

Every year some conferences will be weaker than others. Every single year less deserving teams will get in over more deserving teams, and less deserving teams will progress farther than more deserving teams.

You could say it's cyclical, but even if so, that just means the injustice will be spread around in different years. Wouldn't you rather minimize the injustice that must occur at all?

This system will generate much controversey and consternation every single year. It tells me how bush league of a league the NHL really is that they're prioritizing some owners whining about travel over competitive integrity.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Idoit40fans on Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:49 pm

I hate the idea of unbalanced divisions. Unbalanced scheduling and unbalanced playoffs. Idiotic.
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Re: NHL realignment on the table again.

Postby Nizzy on Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:19 pm

-If the Phoenix Coyotes continue to lose 30 Million per year, without an owner still IIRC, I can't see this franchise staying there.
-There simply shouldn't be 2 teams in Florida. I mean really? Why? Dumb.
-Quebec needs the Nordiques back.
-Seattle/Victoria BC would be cool. Problem is, Seattle is getting the Supersonics back (sac. kings) so can they support 4 teams? Thunderbirds.
-Saskatchewon area in canada might be able to support a team if they have the arena
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