You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby shmenguin on Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:15 pm

meow wrote:
Nizzy wrote:-Mike Rupp isn't a scorer, but he came in here and put in 6-7 goals one season. You need SOME production from the 4th line guys.
-This is why I was against the Adams signing because now you have 2 guys on the 4th line that just don't score, ever.

I don't understand this. The Pens led the league in goals for during the regular season. Why exactly do we need more goals?


the way we exited the playoffs was a pretty good example of why scoring depth is important. but the 3rd line is a better example of failure than the 4th in that regard.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby lemieuxReturns on Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:23 pm

meow wrote:
Nizzy wrote:-Mike Rupp isn't a scorer, but he came in here and put in 6-7 goals one season. You need SOME production from the 4th line guys.
-This is why I was against the Adams signing because now you have 2 guys on the 4th line that just don't score, ever.

I don't understand this. The Pens led the league in goals for during the regular season. Why exactly do we need more goals?


When your top two lines get shut down as they did against boston, it is nice to have two other capable lines that can pot an occasional goal. With the scoring in that series being so low, one goal from the 4th line could have changed the series. Looking at Chicago for example, you have guys like Shaw and Krueger and even Saad when he was not playing on the top two lines all who have the ability to score a goal. Our third/fourth liner with that ability was dealt to san jose this summer. Guys like glass who have a one-dimensional role do not last long. TK hit everything just as glass does... but he also had the ability to score a goal. Guys like Adams and glass should be replaced with younger WBS guys who have the ability to score some goals too.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Gaucho on Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:24 pm

But we were supposed to have more scoring depth than any team should ever need.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby meow on Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:27 pm

shmenguin wrote:
meow wrote:
Nizzy wrote:-Mike Rupp isn't a scorer, but he came in here and put in 6-7 goals one season. You need SOME production from the 4th line guys.
-This is why I was against the Adams signing because now you have 2 guys on the 4th line that just don't score, ever.

I don't understand this. The Pens led the league in goals for during the regular season. Why exactly do we need more goals?


the way we exited the playoffs was a pretty good example of why scoring depth is important. but the 3rd line is a better example of failure than the 4th in that regard.

Exactly. No successful team counts on goal production from their fourth line. It's nice to cash in one or two every now and then, but to expect it is bad mojo.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby meow on Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:30 pm

lemieuxReturns wrote:
meow wrote:
Nizzy wrote:-Mike Rupp isn't a scorer, but he came in here and put in 6-7 goals one season. You need SOME production from the 4th line guys.
-This is why I was against the Adams signing because now you have 2 guys on the 4th line that just don't score, ever.

I don't understand this. The Pens led the league in goals for during the regular season. Why exactly do we need more goals?


When your top two lines get shut down as they did against boston, it is nice to have two other capable lines that can pot an occasional goal. With the scoring in that series being so low, one goal from the 4th line could have changed the series. Looking at Chicago for example, you have guys like Shaw and Krueger and even Saad when he was not playing on the top two lines all who have the ability to score a goal. Our third/fourth liner with that ability was dealt to san jose this summer. Guys like glass who have a one-dimensional role do not last long. TK hit everything just as glass does... but he also had the ability to score a goal. Guys like Adams and glass should be replaced with younger WBS guys who have the ability to score some goals too.

Welcome to the salary cap era. Guys like Saad and Shaw were critical to the Hawks success because they are cheap. They were cheap enough to not handcuff their roster because of cap restraints. But, if you are looking at Chicago's success, don't forget to the look at both sides of the ice. While they were second in goals for, they were first in goals against.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby bse on Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:55 pm

Kunitz - Crosby - Dupuis
Jokinen* - Malkin - Neal
Bennett - Sutter - D'Agostini**
Glass*** - Vitale - Adams
Sill****

* = Bylsma has said that he sees Bennett on the third line. In a long run it might be beneficial for cap reasons, as that likely limits Bennett's personal statistics. However, he might get very sound defensively playing on the third line. Jokinen is ok on a second line in my opinion. Just three years ago he had 30 goals in Carolina. He needs an opportunity.
** = D'Agostini has once scored over 20 goals. Bennett adds some grit to the line. I like the third regardless. It's not as bad as people think.
*** = Glass had a subpar season. I think he will rebound and be a Rupp style of player. remember he had 5+11 in Winnipeg before coming to Pens.
**** = Jeffrey just doesn't fit. He isn't good enough for top-6, and lacks pretty much everything to play in the bottom six. Zach Sill is made for a fourth line role. Jeffrey should be traded for future considerations or a 7th pick.

Scuderi* - Letang
Martin** - Orpik
Despres*** - Bortuzzo
Engelland

* = After the trade, I think it was Shero, who said Scuderi would play with Letang. It's also the best place for him, as we know Letang is terrible defensively. Now he can be himself, because there's the piece covering his mental lapses.
** = Our best pairing last season. Keep it.
*** = With Bortuzzo or Engelland playing it simple, Despres can be the one making stretch passes as per Dan's system. It also casts him in kind of a leading role, as those other two can not do anything too difficult. Niskanen should be traded for a fourth rounder.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby sil on Wed Jul 17, 2013 2:10 pm

bse wrote:Kunitz - Crosby - Dupuis
Jokinen* - Malkin - Neal
Bennett - Sutter - D'Agostini**
Glass*** - Vitale - Adams
Sill****

* = Bylsma has said that he sees Bennett on the third line. In a long run it might be beneficial for cap reasons, as that likely limits Bennett's personal statistics. However, he might get very sound defensively playing on the third line. Jokinen is ok on a second line in my opinion. Just three years ago he had 30 goals in Carolina. He needs an opportunity.
** = D'Agostini has once scored over 20 goals. Bennett adds some grit to the line. I like the third regardless. It's not as bad as people think.
*** = Glass had a subpar season. I think he will rebound and be a Rupp style of player. remember he had 5+11 in Winnipeg before coming to Pens.
**** = Jeffrey just doesn't fit. He isn't good enough for top-6, and lacks pretty much everything to play in the bottom six. Zach Sill is made for a fourth line role. Jeffrey should be traded for future considerations or a 7th pick.

Scuderi* - Letang
Martin** - Orpik
Despres*** - Bortuzzo
Engelland

* = After the trade, I think it was Shero, who said Scuderi would play with Letang. It's also the best place for him, as we know Letang is terrible defensively. Now he can be himself, because there's the piece covering his mental lapses.
** = Our best pairing last season. Keep it.
*** = With Bortuzzo or Engelland playing it simple, Despres can be the one making stretch passes as per Dan's system. It also casts him in kind of a leading role, as those other two can not do anything too difficult. Niskanen should be traded for a fourth rounder.


I think that bottom-6 (including that thrid line) is pretty crummy overall. Bennett adds about as much "grit" to the third line as Sutter does. D'Agostini could prove to be a steal...but he could also prove to be an AHL caliber player forced into 3rd line NHL duty all year...which would be uber-crummy.

I also think Bortuzzo and Engellend getting regular minutes is pretty crummy too...and doesn't really do a whole lot to help Despres grow. Sadly, unless Dumoulin/Harrington/Maatta prove they're ready, this is probably pretty close to what we'll see on defense.

They'll get more than a 4th rounder for Niskanen.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Nizzy on Thu Jul 18, 2013 9:35 am

The more and more I think about it...the more and more I hate the bottom 6.

Everyone is right.

Glass and Adams don't bring enough to the table. While Adams, isn't a guy to hurt your team, he isn't a guy (at his age now) to really improve it. I would have dumped Glass after the season, but he's a Bylsma grinder so no way it will happen. This team needs Morrow on that 3rd line putting in 15 goals next season. I think it would be a good fit for him.

Trade Niskanen already, geez, just dump him, 6th rounder, I don't even care.

DESPRES
BORTUZZO
DUMOULIN

So many guys you can plug in next year for the 5th spot. At 1.5M-1.7M cheaper.. Come on... What is going on here.

So now we lost 2 former first round picks on Iglina and Morrow and neither are back? How is that not a black mark on Shero's record? AT least re-up Morrow for 1 more year, cheap. We need grit. He wasn't amazing, but he wasn't horrid either.

He's just not fast enough I guess for Bylsma's 1 and done system. What else is knew? Bylsma should have been canned, Shero failed this off season, just like he failed letting Scuderi, a top pairing defensive defenseman go for 3.4M.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Crankshaft on Thu Jul 18, 2013 9:52 am

Can we get passed July before we start saying this off-season was a failure.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby mikey287 on Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:00 am

I don't agree with most of that...(not crankshaft's)
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Beveridge on Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:04 am

mikey287 wrote:I don't agree with most of that...(not crankshaft's)


I read it, couldn't decide what the most insane part of it was, and just left it alone.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby DontToewsMeBro on Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:11 am

Probably the part where he said letting Scuderi go was a failure but signing him this year was a failure too.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Idoit40fans on Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:15 am

I can't believe there aren't more discussions about whether or not that is just an account being run as entertainment.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Beveridge on Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:21 am

Idoit40fans wrote:I can't believe there aren't more discussions about whether or not that is just an account being run as entertainment.


It entertains me so I'm all for it.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby pens2005 on Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:42 am

Idoit40fans wrote:Why do people want Glass out of the lineup so badly? He's not bad and he's a 4th liner.


Let me guess this straight...Adams at 600k is a terrible deal because he never scores, yet Glass is a bargain at 1.1 because he....??????

Not calling you out idoit40fans, but there are a lot of posters on here who bash the Adams re-signing yet want to see glass in the lineup.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby murphydump55 on Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:42 am

bse wrote:Kunitz - Crosby - Dupuis
Jokinen* - Malkin - Neal
Bennett - Sutter - D'Agostini**
Glass*** - Vitale - Adams
Sill****

* = Bylsma has said that he sees Bennett on the third line. In a long run it might be beneficial for cap reasons, as that likely limits Bennett's personal statistics. However, he might get very sound defensively playing on the third line. Jokinen is ok on a second line in my opinion. Just three years ago he had 30 goals in Carolina. He needs an opportunity.
** = D'Agostini has once scored over 20 goals. Bennett adds some grit to the line. I like the third regardless. It's not as bad as people think.
*** = Glass had a subpar season. I think he will rebound and be a Rupp style of player. remember he had 5+11 in Winnipeg before coming to Pens.
**** = Jeffrey just doesn't fit. He isn't good enough for top-6, and lacks pretty much everything to play in the bottom six. Zach Sill is made for a fourth line role. Jeffrey should be traded for future considerations or a 7th pick.

Scuderi* - Letang
Martin** - Orpik
Despres*** - Bortuzzo
Engelland

* = After the trade, I think it was Shero, who said Scuderi would play with Letang. It's also the best place for him, as we know Letang is terrible defensively. Now he can be himself, because there's the piece covering his mental lapses.
** = Our best pairing last season. Keep it.
*** = With Bortuzzo or Engelland playing it simple, Despres can be the one making stretch passes as per Dan's system. It also casts him in kind of a leading role, as those other two can not do anything too difficult. Niskanen should be traded for a fourth rounder.


According to advanced stats, Despres and Bortuzzo/Engelland was our worst D pairing last year, while Despres Letang was our best.

I'm not sure I like Despres Bortuzzo as our 3rd pairing but I'm not sure we have much choice.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Nizzy on Thu Jul 18, 2013 12:40 pm

pens2005 wrote:
Idoit40fans wrote:Why do people want Glass out of the lineup so badly? He's not bad and he's a 4th liner.


Let me guess this straight...Adams at 600k is a terrible deal because he never scores, yet Glass is a bargain at 1.1 because he....??????

Not calling you out idoit40fans, but there are a lot of posters on here who bash the Adams re-signing yet want to see glass in the lineup.



Call him out. I've seen him contradict himself in his stances so many times. Best part is...he never posts his line-ups and just rips everyone a part.

Yes, Shero said it was a mistake for him to let Scuderi go in 2009. It was. Defense was a joke the year after with the Goligoski replacement.
The "COMBINATION" of Glass and Adams together is bad. I would rather have Adams over Glass. So you basically have a 4th line with the objective to not let in a goal...Wheres our next Max Talbot? Wheres our new young 4th line grinders working up through the system?

We could probably have the 4th line of Morrow-Vitale-Sill next year for the same price of Glass-Vitale-Adams.

FAIL.

go tweet something mikey
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby offsides on Fri Jul 19, 2013 12:37 am

I will be the first to admit that I know absolutely nothing about being a GM. So now that Dustin is signed and we are over the cap, what happens now? At least, what do you GMs think happens now?
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Gaucho on Fri Jul 19, 2013 7:40 am

How can you expect to be taken seriously when you never post your lineups?
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby JoseCuervo on Fri Jul 19, 2013 9:40 am

Nizzy and idiot are a perfect pair
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby ILikeTurtles on Fri Jul 19, 2013 10:12 am

Here is why I don't like Tanner Glass, his face off stats are garbage.
http://stats.tabita.org/faceoffs/player/tanner_glass
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby shmenguin on Fri Jul 19, 2013 11:22 am

ILikeTurtles wrote:Here is why I don't like Tanner Glass, his face off stats are garbage.
http://stats.tabita.org/faceoffs/player/tanner_glass


notsureifserious.jpg

he's not a center?
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby meow on Fri Jul 19, 2013 11:40 am

ILikeTurtles wrote:Here is why I don't like Tanner Glass, his face off stats are garbage.
http://stats.tabita.org/faceoffs/player/tanner_glass

Those are actually pretty impressive numbers. Ya know, considering he is a winger and all.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Pens4Life on Fri Jul 19, 2013 2:38 pm

I rather see 4th line of
Megna - Vitale - Sill
than Glass - Vitale - Adams :)
Bennett on 3rd line is fine, Jokinen on 2nd is just fine for me as well..
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby pcm on Fri Jul 19, 2013 2:51 pm

Dupuis-Crosby-Bennett
Kunitz-Malkin-Neal
Jeffrey-Sutter-Payerl
Glass-Vitale-D'Agostino/Adams

Trade Jokinen for cap space.
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