You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby SolidSnake on Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:23 pm

Pitts wrote:Image Image


They'll accept the blame before the golden child ever would
Image
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby pcm on Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:38 pm

MRandall25 wrote:How did that work out for them this year?


Considering they were meant to be bottom-dwellers, I'd say it worked out pretty darn well. They were a surprise contender, despite their top guns having a significant down year. Perry and Ryan were invisible against Detroit, and they still went 7 games.

Sid and Malkin were invisible against BOS, and the team got swept. If you're response is going to be "yeah but the Pens made the conf finals and the Ducks lost in the first round, so therefor the Pens are better," then I don't know what to tell you. The Pens had by far the easiest road to the conf finals. The Ducks would have walked all over NYI and OTT.

Because of their youth movement, they were able to trade Ryan and recoup significant assets. Palemieri and Etem will fill in nicely. The Pens would be SOL if they traded Neal right now.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Steve Dave on Sat Aug 03, 2013 8:13 am

Kunitz Crosby Dupuis
Jokinen Malkin Neal
Bennett Sutter D'Agostini
Glass Vitale Blysma
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby pcm on Sat Aug 03, 2013 11:45 am

Steve Dave wrote:Kunitz Crosby Dupuis
Jokinen Malkin Neal
Bennett Sutter D'Agostini
Glass Vitale Blysma


Who's the F1 forward on the 2nd and 3rd lines? This team has some question marks going into 2014. Beginning of course with salary cap compliance.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Steve Dave on Sat Aug 03, 2013 12:09 pm

pcm wrote:
Steve Dave wrote:Kunitz Crosby Dupuis
Jokinen Malkin Neal
Bennett Sutter D'Agostini
Glass Vitale Blysma


Who's the F1 forward on the 2nd and 3rd lines? This team has some question marks going into 2014. Beginning of course with salary cap compliance.


Blysma
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby meow on Sat Aug 03, 2013 1:17 pm

pcm wrote:
Steve Dave wrote:Kunitz Crosby Dupuis
Jokinen Malkin Neal
Bennett Sutter D'Agostini
Glass Vitale Blysma


Who's the F1 forward on the 2nd and 3rd lines? This team has some question marks going into 2014. Beginning of course with salary cap compliance.

I'm not sure you understand how a forecheck works if you are worried about who F1 is going to be
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby pcm on Sat Aug 03, 2013 3:16 pm

meow wrote:
pcm wrote:
Steve Dave wrote:Kunitz Crosby Dupuis
Jokinen Malkin Neal
Bennett Sutter D'Agostini
Glass Vitale Blysma


Who's the F1 forward on the 2nd and 3rd lines? This team has some question marks going into 2014. Beginning of course with salary cap compliance.

I'm not sure you understand how a forecheck works if you are worried about who F1 is going to be


In Blysma hockey, the F1 is a specific role, assigned to a specific player on each line. Obviously, in the flow of a game, another player on the line might be the first guy in, and so therefore take on the F1 assignment. But that doesn't mean its just "meh, whoever gets there first..."

Here's Blysma on the F1:

"He adds a disruption factor and a speed factor to a line that other guys on our team don't match," coach Dan Bylsma. "He has speed on the forecheck, chasing pucks down, tenacity-wise pursuing the puck. He's the F1, and he has pursuit. His tenacity on pucks and going to the net would be big factor on that line."

The lack of "tenacious, forechecking" forwards on this team is a concern.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby mikey287 on Sat Aug 03, 2013 6:35 pm

He's really just describing what an F1 would do in most types of aggressive forechecking setups. We've scaled back our forechecking pressure - well, at least we did last year. Interesting to see if the board jumps on this "lack of tenacious, forechecking forwards" bit considering one of the better ones we had was chased out of town about a month ago. I mean, I find it unlikely that they will, but it's interesting if nothing else...I would certainly enjoy it.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby pcm on Sat Aug 03, 2013 7:04 pm

I'm more interested to see what the organization's "philosophy" is for our forwards. I'd like to think the aggressive forchecking was scaled back because the team realized they needed to play a little more conservatively, and not just that they didn't have the personnel for it.

Still there was an emphasis placed on finishing checks and playing strong against the boards (the only thing we 'accomplished' against the Bruins.) The team though has drifted a fair distance from the days of its offensive cycle. Now, it seems Shero is placing an emphasis on speed and skill with the players he's bringing in. Does this mean the team is changing its philosophy? I'm curious to see how it all shakes out.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Sun Aug 04, 2013 9:54 am

mikey287 wrote:He's really just describing what an F1 would do in most types of aggressive forechecking setups. We've scaled back our forechecking pressure - well, at least we did last year. Interesting to see if the board jumps on this "lack of tenacious, forechecking forwards" bit considering one of the better ones we had was chased out of town about a month ago. I mean, I find it unlikely that they will, but it's interesting if nothing else...I would certainly enjoy it.


This is really my biggest issue with the Pens the past few years and next year. While I admit I dont have a ton of x's and o's knowledge watching the Pens passive and perimeter play (and getting more and more passive) has been troublesome for me. I trust your opinion that a lot of it has to do with coaching/style. But I also think we are missing the pieces on ALL lines to effectively play far more aggressive. Kunitz if he regains his youthful legs but Neal, Bennett, Dupuis, Jokinen, even Sutter are not really known for that. It is more coaching but personnel isnt helping.

The playoffs (rounds 1 and 3) were difficult for me to watch and understand as a Pens fan. (I am NOT saying this is correct at all but.....),,,,when I watched some Western Conference playoffs games to the naked eye it seemed most of those teams would destroy us (again not saying its true but just watching generally was different). Like the Isles did to us a lot of the time using speed and tenacity to control play and come in waves. Even teams like the Kings, Sharks, Wings just kept pressure and chances constantly. I was on the edge of my seat every minute of every game, going to the net and if not dumping it and go get it.

We dont seem to do that at all on any lines. I would be on the edge of my seat if we got an odd man break, but other than that coming down 3 on 3 was ho hum, pull up, cut across the middle, drop pass or shot. Go the other way. Of course we had chances in the Bruins series but it was nothing like other games I watched.

If you want to see the differences I suggest going to youtube and searching for some of our 07-08 and 08-09 cup run game highlights. So many dirty goals from traffic or forecheck turnovers. Just a concern for me that we wont "really" contend until that aspect of our game is fixed.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby pcm on Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:35 am

Yup, the Hawks scored against the Bruins by going to the net. The Pens didn't. Their personnel seems to be drifting farther from that "play in the dirty areas" philosophy. But ultimately it's a mentality. And you're right on sayng the Pens won't contend until they fix that.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby mikey287 on Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:23 am

BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:This is really my biggest issue with the Pens the past few years and next year. While I admit I dont have a ton of x's and o's knowledge watching the Pens passive and perimeter play (and getting more and more passive) has been troublesome for me. I trust your opinion that a lot of it has to do with coaching/style. But I also think we are missing the pieces on ALL lines to effectively play far more aggressive. Kunitz if he regains his youthful legs but Neal, Bennett, Dupuis, Jokinen, even Sutter are not really known for that. It is more coaching but personnel isnt helping.


Correct. We're much more based on skill, creation on the rush, what I like to call "organic" offense creation. My guess is that he saw the success of the Kunitz-Malkin-Neal line - who played a different style than the rest of the team by and large and has decided that is the way to do it. It's a fancy-free style that really has one option to carry the puck and one option to retrieve and then will largely play a 1-2-2 forecheck when puck possession has a less than 50% of being regained. The F1's aggression is the "read" on whether it is passive or aggressive. That seems to be the direction we're going now. I think we're more or less done being a really aggressive forecheck team...as Kunitz and Dupuis age, they'll be less effective, Kennedy was replaced with the much less belligerent Matt D'Agostini, our fourth line has slower players like Glass and Adams, Jussi Jokinen is a below average skater too. Many of these players are more calculated in their approach than anything else, which fits a more passive style of forechecking.

BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:The playoffs (rounds 1 and 3) were difficult for me to watch and understand as a Pens fan. (I am NOT saying this is correct at all but.....),,,,when I watched some Western Conference playoffs games to the naked eye it seemed most of those teams would destroy us (again not saying its true but just watching generally was different). Like the Isles did to us a lot of the time using speed and tenacity to control play and come in waves. Even teams like the Kings, Sharks, Wings just kept pressure and chances constantly. I was on the edge of my seat every minute of every game, going to the net and if not dumping it and go get it.


Yeah, I tried to make the point in NPR several times that the Western Conference is a little bit different of an animal and, by and large, better than the East. More structure. But it seemed to fall on deaf ears to some...it's not at all a surprise that a cognizant hockey fan would find the West playoffs of higher quality than the East...that's how it was in the regular season too...we can compete with anyone, but our coaching staff would have needed to make a little more in the way of adjustments, which has shown it is capable of doing (believe it or not), but sometimes just gets a little too stubborn. You're not always playing "your" game, sometimes you have to play their game to bring it back to "your" game, if that makes any sense...

BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:We dont seem to do that at all on any lines. I would be on the edge of my seat if we got an odd man break, but other than that coming down 3 on 3 was ho hum, pull up, cut across the middle, drop pass or shot. Go the other way. Of course we had chances in the Bruins series but it was nothing like other games I watched.


We're turning into the Washington Capitals, as I've said, with fists clenched...we've become or are becoming this hot dog team that's going to try to get by on skill alone. Pivonka to Bondra, Malkin to Neal, results will be similar even though we have the skill level advantage...

BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:If you want to see the differences I suggest going to youtube and searching for some of our 07-08 and 08-09 cup run game highlights. So many dirty goals from traffic or forecheck turnovers. Just a concern for me that we wont "really" contend until that aspect of our game is fixed.


Ding, ding, ding. People wonder how you beat a layered defense like Boston has, I'll tell you this, my roommate knows now because I said after every period of the series how to beat this team (or at least give them a fighting chance). That's one of the adjustments that never came. Stretch passing into a layered defense for 240 minutes is just abject silliness. They saw it, they had to of, because if I saw it from the first 15 minutes of the series, they had to have seen it because they're smarter than I am...I had an immediate reaction on how to fix it, they had to have had the same reaction...I'm just dumbfounded as to why they didn't implement it...as Doc Emrick would sarcastically say in games of great meaning that he's actively drumming up, "nothing much at stake...I guess..."

That style of play was being killed previously, it's now - as far as I can tell with these personnel moves - officially a play style of the past. If we had a more competent fourth line center on defense, I'd suggest we might be prepared to role with three offensive lines. Organic offensive lines too, globetrotters-style. But I think the momentum of my post has gotten the better of me...I'm curious to see what comes from this though...because the cycling game that I love is gone...
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby IntangibleBeer on Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:25 pm

mikey287 wrote:He's really just describing what an F1 would do in most types of aggressive forechecking setups. We've scaled back our forechecking pressure - well, at least we did last year. Interesting to see if the board jumps on this "lack of tenacious, forechecking forwards" bit considering one of the better ones we had was chased out of town about a month ago. I mean, I find it unlikely that they will, but it's interesting if nothing else...I would certainly enjoy it.


You're speaking of Tyler Kennedy, but we also lost our best forechecker in Cooke. You're right. This is a gaping hole.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby columbia on Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:34 pm

I would guess that over 90% of the posters here will miss Cooke....and they should.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby meow on Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:46 pm

columbia wrote:I would guess that over 90% of the posters here will miss Cooke....and they should.

That's a big hole that doesn't look like its going to be filled. At the same time, that's a difficult hole to fill that few other players can.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby GSdrums87 on Mon Aug 05, 2013 1:50 pm

meow wrote:That's a big hole that doesn't look like its going to be filled.

Hehe
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby KG on Mon Aug 05, 2013 5:06 pm

This is going to be a long, boring August...This off season in general feels a lot longer then typical off seasons...
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:14 pm

We're turning into the Washington Capitals, as I've said, with fists clenched...we've become or are becoming this hot dog team that's going to try to get by on skill alone. Pivonka to Bondra, Malkin to Neal, results will be similar even though we have the skill level advantage...

BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:
If you want to see the differences I suggest going to youtube and searching for some of our 07-08 and 08-09 cup run game highlights. So many dirty goals from traffic or forecheck turnovers. Just a concern for me that we wont "really" contend until that aspect of our game is fixed.


Ding, ding, ding. People wonder how you beat a layered defense like Boston has, I'll tell you this, my roommate knows now because I said after every period of the series how to beat this team (or at least give them a fighting chance). That's one of the adjustments that never came. Stretch passing into a layered defense for 240 minutes is just abject silliness. They saw it, they had to of, because if I saw it from the first 15 minutes of the series, they had to have seen it because they're smarter than I am...I had an immediate reaction on how to fix it, they had to have had the same reaction...I'm just dumbfounded as to why they didn't implement it...as Doc Emrick would sarcastically say in games of great meaning that he's actively drumming up, "nothing much at stake...I guess..."

That style of play was being killed previously, it's now - as far as I can tell with these personnel moves - officially a play style of the past. If we had a more competent fourth line center on defense, I'd suggest we might be prepared to role with three offensive lines. Organic offensive lines too, globetrotters-style. But I think the momentum of my post has gotten the better of me...I'm curious to see what comes from this though...because the cycling game that I love is gone...


Tanks for the replies Mikey. I fancy myself having enough knowledge of hockey but not necessarily a real strong x's and o's guy so its interesting to hear that side of the coin. I remember you stating that about the Western Conference and also about Sutter's role when he was being questioned here.

The one thing I also noticed in the Bruins series though was the very easy "2nd Tier Adjustments" that they made. Was it me or was their goalie playing a bit further out of the net? This completely cut off those high middle of the ice shots Malkin and Crosby like and made Neal's RW slapper useless turning him into a glass painter? I noticed it while thinking of all the easy goals against the Flyers in the 2012 playoffs. Bruins seemed to have very easy angles against us, Bryz was always deeper, Rask made it look easy.

Anyways go back to our 08-09 run. Our last 6 goals - 5 by depth players, all 6 off of turnovers. See the Hawks cup clinching goal. Shot deflected higher out, freezes goalie, hits post - alas a guy is there to knock it in. Its why I cant take it seriously that we had any bad luck from the Bruins series or are real contenders next season.

It just seems obvious and makes me fairly nervous going into next season. (not saying we should) but wouldnt be surprised to a higher priced player/top prospect dumped in a shake up to get some fresh legs throughout the lineup by November/December. Especially with the lack of pretty much everything on the bottom lines).
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby Idoit40fans on Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:43 pm

KG wrote:This is going to be a long, boring August...This off season in general feels a lot longer then typical off seasons...


Longer than last offseason? Pop
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby mikey287 on Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:53 pm

BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:
We're turning into the Washington Capitals, as I've said, with fists clenched...we've become or are becoming this hot dog team that's going to try to get by on skill alone. Pivonka to Bondra, Malkin to Neal, results will be similar even though we have the skill level advantage...

BurghersAndDogsSports wrote:
If you want to see the differences I suggest going to youtube and searching for some of our 07-08 and 08-09 cup run game highlights. So many dirty goals from traffic or forecheck turnovers. Just a concern for me that we wont "really" contend until that aspect of our game is fixed.


Ding, ding, ding. People wonder how you beat a layered defense like Boston has, I'll tell you this, my roommate knows now because I said after every period of the series how to beat this team (or at least give them a fighting chance). That's one of the adjustments that never came. Stretch passing into a layered defense for 240 minutes is just abject silliness. They saw it, they had to of, because if I saw it from the first 15 minutes of the series, they had to have seen it because they're smarter than I am...I had an immediate reaction on how to fix it, they had to have had the same reaction...I'm just dumbfounded as to why they didn't implement it...as Doc Emrick would sarcastically say in games of great meaning that he's actively drumming up, "nothing much at stake...I guess..."

That style of play was being killed previously, it's now - as far as I can tell with these personnel moves - officially a play style of the past. If we had a more competent fourth line center on defense, I'd suggest we might be prepared to role with three offensive lines. Organic offensive lines too, globetrotters-style. But I think the momentum of my post has gotten the better of me...I'm curious to see what comes from this though...because the cycling game that I love is gone...


Tanks for the replies Mikey. I fancy myself having enough knowledge of hockey but not necessarily a real strong x's and o's guy so its interesting to hear that side of the coin. I remember you stating that about the Western Conference and also about Sutter's role when he was being questioned here.

The one thing I also noticed in the Bruins series though was the very easy "2nd Tier Adjustments" that they made. Was it me or was their goalie playing a bit further out of the net? This completely cut off those high middle of the ice shots Malkin and Crosby like and made Neal's RW slapper useless turning him into a glass painter? I noticed it while thinking of all the easy goals against the Flyers in the 2012 playoffs. Bruins seemed to have very easy angles against us, Bryz was always deeper, Rask made it look easy.

Anyways go back to our 08-09 run. Our last 6 goals - 5 by depth players, all 6 off of turnovers. See the Hawks cup clinching goal. Shot deflected higher out, freezes goalie, hits post - alas a guy is there to knock it in. Its why I cant take it seriously that we had any bad luck from the Bruins series or are real contenders next season.

It just seems obvious and makes me fairly nervous going into next season. (not saying we should) but wouldnt be surprised to a higher priced player/top prospect dumped in a shake up to get some fresh legs throughout the lineup by November/December. Especially with the lack of pretty much everything on the bottom lines).


@bolded: Surely, and why wouldn't he be encouraged to do so? Rask being good laterally and good with the shuffle (despite being a poor skater when upright) helps to know that he can recover. But that notwithstanding, look at what we're doing vs. what we're going against. There isn't anyone with an ounce of hockey sense in TD Garden that thinks we're getting a second chance opportunity. It's just not going to happen. So, take the first shot away because that will be the only shot. We have good shooters, we have skill, but the 35 foot wrist shot is going to be stopped by a goalie of Rask's caliber 100 times out of 100. And considering we didn't score in the series, what I said lacks my somewhat prevalent hyperbole.

Here's the thing, and I said this a lot during and after the series, defense will win an even-numbered situation most of the time. 5 on 5 play in ordinary course, defense almost always wins. Attack on the rush 3 on 3, defense almost always wins. That's just the nature of the game, defense will win when executed properly. The odds are already stacked against you. We decided to take it a step further and attacked 1 on 3 and 2 on 4 for four consecutive games assuring us no possibility of victory.

The lower the numbers are when even, the better chance offense has. 4 on 4 will probably yield more goals per 60 minutes than 5 on 5. 3 on 3 will yield more than that. So, when you use a tactic like a stretch pass, part of your transition package, you're trying to get into a situation where you create - ideally - an odd-man rush (3 on 2, 2 on 1, etc.) or at least something where your skill will beat their rather sluggish defense (2 on 2 is a reasonable expectation for success in our case, because we do have good players). Unfortunately for us, the Bruins don't get caught in those situations...they generally have four guys back by the time we retrieve the puck. So, if you're stretch passing it, all you're doing is putting the puck ahead of all your own guys but virtually none of the enemy...it's more clever by half. Right? All of our guys are working to get the puck back, Letang gets it and finds a streaking James Neal...ok great, you've zipped a pass right through [generic LWer] and Malkin to Neal who is crossing center while Niskanen limps off for a change. You've zipped the pass right through F1 Brad Marchand --- good. Now Neal just has to beat Ference/Boychuk/Bergeron/whoever AND snipe Rask with Malkin coming late.

If you had to guess...how many goals do you think that will generate in a 7-game series?

Spoiler:
Trick question...it will be a four game series.


In short, we needed to out-number them at the point of attack. If they're gonna defend with four or five, we need to attack with four or five just to give ourselves a chance. The Blackhawks knew this and executed it. Put it in areas that they don't want to defend and set up camp...attack time will eventually lead to chances and chances will become goals. We failed. Not as a team, but as individuals playing for a team. The team was never given a fighting chance.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby pcm on Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:13 pm

We're turning into the Washington Capitals, as I've said, with fists clenched...we've become or are becoming this hot dog team that's going to try to get by on skill alone. Pivonka to Bondra, Malkin to Neal, results will be similar even though we have the skill level advantage...

It just seems obvious and makes me fairly nervous going into next season. (not saying we should) but wouldnt be surprised to a higher priced player/top prospect dumped in a shake up to get some fresh legs throughout the lineup by November/December. Especially with the lack of pretty much everything on the bottom lines).


I really think Martin is a top candidate for this. The defense is stacked as is. Despres is ready to take top 4 minutes. Orpik too is a possibility, but I think his longevity with the team means he'll play out his career here. I suppose Despres could be traded, but that seems backwards, given the salary cap issues that this team will face next season. I just don't see how we can afford Martin and Letang once 58's new contract kicks in.

Anaheim has a weak top 4. If they wanted to upgrade, Martin for Palmieri or Silfverberg would be a great place to start.
The Avs have the worst D in the league. Steve Downie would be an upgrade on Cooke, and could slide into the LW slot with Malkin and Neal. Get a high pick or one of the Avs prospects thrown in.

There are definitely options out there, as Martin could be a #1 for a slew of teams. But as far as the context of the discussion, if we hold on to him, I'd like to see the Pens adopt a more conservative, patient offensive game, with their current personnel. Instead of attacking up ice aggressively, whether on the forecheck or the stretch pass, rely on the defense to stymy the flow of the opposition and then just counter punch relying on our top end talent. This team doesn't have the personnel up front anymore to force the offensive game against a good team.

So either revamp the personnel or the game-plan.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby pcm on Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:13 pm

We're turning into the Washington Capitals, as I've said, with fists clenched...we've become or are becoming this hot dog team that's going to try to get by on skill alone. Pivonka to Bondra, Malkin to Neal, results will be similar even though we have the skill level advantage...

It just seems obvious and makes me fairly nervous going into next season. (not saying we should) but wouldnt be surprised to a higher priced player/top prospect dumped in a shake up to get some fresh legs throughout the lineup by November/December. Especially with the lack of pretty much everything on the bottom lines).


I really think Martin is a top candidate for this. The defense is stacked as is. Despres is ready to take top 4 minutes. Orpik too is a possibility, but I think his longevity with the team means he'll play out his career here. I suppose Despres could be traded, but that seems backwards, given the salary cap issues that this team will face next season. I just don't see how we can afford Martin and Letang once 58's new contract kicks in.

Anaheim has a weak top 4. If they wanted to upgrade, Martin for Palmieri or Silfverberg would be a great place to start.
The Avs have the worst D in the league. Steve Downie would be an upgrade on Cooke, and could slide into the LW slot with Malkin and Neal. Get a high pick or one of the Avs prospects thrown in.

There are definitely options out there, as Martin could be a #1 for a slew of teams. But as far as the context of the discussion, if we hold on to him, I'd like to see the Pens adopt a more conservative, patient offensive game, with their current personnel. Instead of attacking up ice aggressively, whether on the forecheck or the stretch pass, rely on the defense to stymy the flow of the opposition and then just counter punch relying on our top end talent. This team doesn't have the personnel up front anymore to force the offensive game against a good team.

So either revamp the personnel or the game-plan.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby murphydump55 on Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:31 pm

If you had to guess...how many goals do you think that will generate in a 7-game series?

Spoiler:
Trick question...it will be a four game series.


Awesome! I laughed.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby PAPLine on Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:33 pm

I thnk it has been noted here before, but I think the truth is that the Pens are built as a regular season team. They have enough talent to win the majority of their games just by showing up and playing the less structured game that we have seen since Mario. This is because no one has the luxury of setting up different defenses for each oppoonent during the season. In the playoffs, it is another story. You are going to face a team for 4 to 7 consecutive games, and the better coaches and more complete teams will be able to set-up and maintain a style of play to offset their opponent. Boston was able to do that against the Pens: keep them to the outside, clog up the middle, disrupt their shots, allow only perimeter passes and generally frustrate their "high flying" offense. Chicago was and is a more structured team than the Pens, and I think watched enough of the Pens/B's to set up an offensive plan to counter the B's defense.
As I think back with the clarity of time, I'm really not sure if it was coaching completely, or if the players were also at fault of being to stubborn and not adapting to their opponents. It's kind of like the early '90's when Mario and company played their style of hockey no matter who they faced, and just tried to outscore everyone.
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Re: You're the GM 2013-14, 2014-15

Postby columbia on Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:35 pm

mikey287 wrote:
The lower the numbers are when even, the better chance offense has. 4 on 4 will probably yield more goals per 60 minutes than 5 on 5. 3 on 3 will yield more than that. So, when you use a tactic like a stretch pass, part of your transition package, you're trying to get into a situation where you create - ideally - an odd-man rush (3 on 2, 2 on 1, etc.) or at least something where your skill will beat their rather sluggish defense (2 on 2 is a reasonable expectation for success in our case, because we do have good players). Unfortunately for us, the Bruins don't get caught in those situations...they generally have four guys back by the time we retrieve the puck. So, if you're stretch passing it, all you're doing is putting the puck ahead of all your own guys but virtually none of the enemy...it's more clever by half. Right? All of our guys are working to get the puck back, Letang gets it and finds a streaking James Neal...ok great, you've zipped a pass right through [generic LWer] and Malkin to Neal who is crossing center while Niskanen limps off for a change. You've zipped the pass right through F1 Brad Marchand --- good. Now Neal just has to beat Ference/Boychuk/Bergeron/whoever AND snipe Rask with Malkin coming late.

In short, we needed to out-number them at the point of attack. If they're gonna defend with four or five, we need to attack with four or five just to give ourselves a chance. The Blackhawks knew this and executed it. Put it in areas that they don't want to defend and set up camp...attack time will eventually lead to chances and chances will become goals. We failed. Not as a team, but as individuals playing for a team. The team was never given a fighting chance.


All of this makes sense, but it doesn't make sense to pay Letang $7.25M, with no alteration in their approach.
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