2013 vs 1993

Forum for Pittsburgh Penguins-related messages.

Moderators: Three Stars, dagny, pfim, netwolf

2013 vs 1993

Postby DelPen on Fri May 03, 2013 2:28 pm

Some say the 1993 team was the best Pens team ever. Looking at the playoff roster though, I think we had two of the best players to ever play for the Pens and a top 6 playing great hockey but then got shut down and there was no one else to step up.

1993:
Stevens-Lemiuex-Tocchet
McEachern-Francis-Jagr
Loney-Straka-Mullen
Daniels-Tippett-Needham

Really great top 5, pretty weak bottom 7 though. Gone from the year before was Trottier, Errey, Bourque and Hrdina up front. Big drop in veteran presence and they lost the ability for supporting scoring vs the Isles. The Errey for Ramsey trade really hurt the team. I think Errey may have got us past the Isles since Loney could have skipped down a line making the lineup better.

In 2013, you stop Sid and Malkin you still have Sutter, Morrow, Cooke, Jokinen and Bennett to deal with and I think all are better players than the bottom 6 of the 1993 player with Mullen being maybe one exception but several are still probably better now than he was in 1993. This team has a lot of potential to be one of the best ever if everything can click.
DelPen
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 33,572
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2006 9:27 am
Location: Lake Wylie, SC

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby IntangibleBeer on Fri May 03, 2013 2:51 pm

I think you're on to something. I didn't remember that Errey had been traded that soon after the Cups. What I do recall is that the 1993 team was loaded with scorers and more finesse guys and was visibly missing "grit". They expected to show up and win. Now that you remind me that Errey was gone, it makes sense.
IntangibleBeer
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 618
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 10:17 am

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby slipshod on Fri May 03, 2013 3:00 pm

Kevin Stevens getting his face broken on the ice really shook the team and they weren't the same until they were down by two. It should never have gotten to game 7 of course but that team had a habit of falling behind in a series, hitting the mystical "switch" and coming back. They just played with fire too many times. I still say they win that game if Stevens isn't nearly killed there and then who knows what would happen.

I will agree that this years team is overall a tougher team
slipshod
Junior 'A'
Junior 'A'
 
Posts: 489
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 11:17 am

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby RxBandit66 on Fri May 03, 2013 3:14 pm

The Stevens facial injury was the biggest factor in them losing. During that season, Lemieux got cancer and by that point in the season his body was tired from all the treatments. Also, Barrasso's daughter I believe had some type of illness. It was too much to overcome I think. When Barrasso made the comment that hockey was "just a job" and that there were "more important things in life than hockey" the yinzers practically ran him out of town, but he was absolutely correct in this case.

Following that season, Stevens was never the same, Tocchet hurt his back, Lemieux was hurt during most of the 1994 season, the Samuelssons got old, and the team entered a period of financial hardship. Had the stars aligned just right, who knows how many more Cups they could have won.
RxBandit66
AHL All-Star
AHL All-Star
 
Posts: 5,815
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 10:49 am
Location: Kittanning

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby mikey287 on Fri May 03, 2013 3:18 pm

That's not bad quite yet, the third line is good, in my opinion. But it is a sign of things to come and it haunts us throughout much of the rest of the 90's...

This is 1996...or something like it, right?

P.Nedved-M.Lemieux-J.Jagr
K.Miller-R.Francis-T.Sandstrom
M.Naslund*-B.Smolinski-G.Murray
J.Dziedzic-C.Wells/R.Park-D.Roche/A.Stojanov*

D.Mironov-S.Zubov
N.Maciver-C.Tamer
C.Joseph-N.Wilkinson

F.Leroux and I.Moran were swingmen or no?

* - The Naslund for Stojanov trade happens to try to add grit...and then Francis gets hurt in the 1996 playoffs...

Then what happened...something like this...?

Sandstrom-Lemieux-Jagr
Roche-Nedved-Miller
Dziedzic-Smolinski-Murray
Leroux-Lauer-Stojanov

Then it just became Jagr and friends...and then a lot of unspeakable things happened...and then Crosby came.
mikey287
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 17,342
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 6:40 pm
Location: Philadelphia, PA - @MichaelFarkasHF

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby Stick_Flex on Fri May 03, 2013 3:26 pm

I saw that 96 team in Anaheim. I sat right next to the penguins bench. Anaheim totally destroyed them. I remember Tamer was breaking sticks right next to my face and screaming the entire game. It really scared the hell out of me. As a kid I thought he might jump the glass and start killing people.
Stick_Flex
Junior 'A'
Junior 'A'
 
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:52 pm
Location: Anaheim

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby Nizzy on Fri May 03, 2013 3:35 pm

If francis doesnt get hurt in 1996, do they win the cup?

Also, besides 1993, what was the best year from 94-01 that had the most potential/you thought was a lock to win the cup?
Nizzy
AHL'er
AHL'er
 
Posts: 2,596
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2007 2:30 pm
Location: Steel City

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby joopen on Fri May 03, 2013 3:39 pm

Nizzy wrote:If francis doesnt get hurt in 1996, do they win the cup?

Also, besides 1993, what was the best year from 94-01 that had the most potential/you thought was a lock to win the cup?


They may make the Cup but still might not win. The East was bad that year.
joopen
AHL All-Star
AHL All-Star
 
Posts: 6,794
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2007 11:17 pm
Location: right behind you

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby mikey287 on Fri May 03, 2013 3:44 pm

No. They beat the Panthers probably, but there's no way they beat the Avs.

Even though they were an expansion, defensive team...look at that 1996 Panthers team...they were deeper than we were, fair or unfair? They didn't have the high end skill certainly, but beyond the top line, which team was really better?
mikey287
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 17,342
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 6:40 pm
Location: Philadelphia, PA - @MichaelFarkasHF

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby She'sTheFastest on Fri May 03, 2013 3:44 pm

RxBandit66 wrote:The Stevens facial injury was the biggest factor in them losing. During that season, Lemieux got cancer and by that point in the season his body was tired from all the treatments. Also, Barrasso's daughter I believe had some type of illness. It was too much to overcome I think. When Barrasso made the comment that hockey was "just a job" and that there were "more important things in life than hockey" the yinzers practically ran him out of town, but he was absolutely correct in this case.

Following that season, Stevens was never the same, Tocchet hurt his back, Lemieux was hurt during most of the 1994 season, the Samuelssons got old, and the team entered a period of financial hardship. Had the stars aligned just right, who knows how many more Cups they could have won.


I lik Barasso a whole lot, like some still like Jagr, but let's not rewrite history. He became downright antagonistic and that's why he was run of town. It was so bad he would be cheered when he was a healthy scratch. Yeah the guy was treated like garbage, but he heaped a lot of it on himself too.
She'sTheFastest
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 2,424
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 7:41 pm

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby shmenguin on Fri May 03, 2013 3:49 pm

mikey287 wrote:No. They beat the Panthers probably, but there's no way they beat the Avs.

Even though they were an expansion, defensive team...look at that 1996 Panthers team...they were deeper than we were, fair or unfair? They didn't have the high end skill certainly, but beyond the top line, which team was really better?


in case anyone wanted to feel really really angry on this wonderful friday afternoon...


and yes, the rats are even worse than you remember
shmenguin
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 22,542
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 11:34 pm

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby Stick_Flex on Fri May 03, 2013 3:50 pm

She'sTheFastest wrote:
RxBandit66 wrote:The Stevens facial injury was the biggest factor in them losing. During that season, Lemieux got cancer and by that point in the season his body was tired from all the treatments. Also, Barrasso's daughter I believe had some type of illness. It was too much to overcome I think. When Barrasso made the comment that hockey was "just a job" and that there were "more important things in life than hockey" the yinzers practically ran him out of town, but he was absolutely correct in this case.

Following that season, Stevens was never the same, Tocchet hurt his back, Lemieux was hurt during most of the 1994 season, the Samuelssons got old, and the team entered a period of financial hardship. Had the stars aligned just right, who knows how many more Cups they could have won.


I lik Barasso a whole lot, like some still like Jagr, but let's not rewrite history. He became downright antagonistic and that's why he was run of town. It was so bad he would be cheered when he was a healthy scratch. Yeah the guy was treated like garbage, but he heaped a lot of it on himself too.



I noticed Pitt is good at treating underachievers like crap.
Stick_Flex
Junior 'A'
Junior 'A'
 
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:52 pm
Location: Anaheim

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby NeddieVedder on Fri May 03, 2013 3:55 pm

Anytime someone says Shero just inherited Patrick's teams, they should compare the bottom 6's that Ray put together to the ones Craiggers did(n't).

Our two best teams post-93:

1996
Miller Lemieux Sandstrom
Nedved Francis Jagr
Dziedzic Smolinski Murray
Roche Lauer Stojanov

Tamer Zubov
Mironov Joseph
Daigneault Wilkinson
Leroux

2001
Lemieux Hrdina Jagr
Straka Lang Kovalev
Stevens Primeau Morozov
Corbet Kraft Beranek

Kasparaitis Moran
Boughner Laukkanen
Ference Bergevin
Jonsson

As soon as Shero took over, he immediately brought in Ruutu, Dom Moore, and Petrovicky, then Roberts and Laraque, then Cooke and Adams.
NeddieVedder
Junior 'A'
Junior 'A'
 
Posts: 416
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2006 11:35 am

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby Guinness on Fri May 03, 2013 4:12 pm

mikey287 wrote:That's not bad quite yet, the third line is good, in my opinion. But it is a sign of things to come and it haunts us throughout much of the rest of the 90's...

This is 1996...or something like it, right?

P.Nedved-M.Lemieux-J.Jagr
K.Miller-R.Francis-T.Sandstrom
M.Naslund*-B.Smolinski-G.Murray
J.Dziedzic-C.Wells/R.Park-D.Roche/A.Stojanov*

D.Mironov-S.Zubov
N.Maciver-C.Tamer
C.Joseph-N.Wilkinson


Damn... I loved that team. But I forgot how silky soft that defense was.

The '93 team was a force. That's why so many of them say it was the best team they ever played on. ANY team featuring what 6 or 7 HHOF'ers is going to be unbelievable.
Guinness
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 11,330
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2006 7:30 am
Location: At the pub

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby She'sTheFastest on Fri May 03, 2013 4:16 pm

shmenguin wrote:
mikey287 wrote:No. They beat the Panthers probably, but there's no way they beat the Avs.

Even though they were an expansion, defensive team...look at that 1996 Panthers team...they were deeper than we were, fair or unfair? They didn't have the high end skill certainly, but beyond the top line, which team was really better?


in case anyone wanted to feel really really angry on this wonderful friday afternoon...


and yes, the rats are even worse than you remember


Yeah, the nice thing about 1996 is knowing the fact that the AVS were beating either opponent that year.
She'sTheFastest
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 2,424
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 7:41 pm

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby Desiato on Fri May 03, 2013 5:13 pm

The 96 team was very good and had depth. Unfortunately, the team had very poor/nonexistent coaching that did not adjust well to the clutch and grab of the Panthers after "new NHL" type officiating during the regular season. I think the Pens vs Avs would have been an awesome series.

The 92 Playoffs Pens are the team to beat IMO. They beat the Rangers and swept the Bruins without Mario before sweeping the Blackhawks, winning 11 in a row to end the playoffs. That team had it all. No true weaknesses. On paper, the 2013 team would be more comparable if Iginla and Morrow were in their primes.
Desiato
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 1,193
Joined: Wed May 05, 2010 2:28 pm

Re: 2013 vs 1993

Postby She'sTheFastest on Fri May 03, 2013 5:19 pm

Desiato wrote:The 96 team was very good and had depth. Unfortunately, the team had very poor/nonexistent coaching that did not adjust well to the clutch and grab of the Panthers after "new NHL" type officiating during the regular season. I think the Pens vs Avs would have been an awesome series.

The 92 Playoffs Pens are the team to beat IMO. They beat the Rangers and swept the Bruins without Mario before sweeping the Blackhawks, winning 11 in a row to end the playoffs. That team had it all. No true weaknesses. On paper, the 2013 team would be more comparable if Iginla and Morrow were in their primes.


Agreed. Everyone points to the 93 team as an epic fail, but the 92 team was stacked and they did what they were supposed to. They're my favorite as well. That being said, I am willing to say this team is just as talented because there does not appear to be any weaknesses.
She'sTheFastest
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 2,424
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 7:41 pm


Return to Pittsburgh Penguins

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Hugo Stiglitz and 31 guests

e-mail