Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby Scott on Wed May 22, 2013 3:01 pm

sil wrote:
But "not cycling or pressuring" doesn't necessarily equate to "sitting back" either, no?


What would you call it then?

Here is the third line right now. No pressure, no fore check, no cycle, no puck possession time, no behind the net play, and instead of rambling on with the comments and commas...overall a total lack of play in the offensive zone.
You have one player trying to hang out in the neutral zone, another player already at the goal line smashing a player creating a turnover that never realizes because nobody is there to grab the loose puck, and another one covering a guy for a breakout and the turnover hasn't even happened yet.

Two of the three forwards have given up on the offense before it got a chance to materialize. Every single shift.
When 2 of 3 forwards are waiting to play defense, you certainly can say that line is sitting back. The Pens are not going to win the cup if the identity of the third line is to let the other team have the puck all shift and play good defense. :roll:

Here is hoping Sutter has a 2 or three points tonight. :thumb:
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby DontToewsMeBro on Wed May 22, 2013 3:06 pm

You are to Brandon Sutter what SmurfyDump55 is to Geno.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby MRandall25 on Wed May 22, 2013 3:21 pm

DontToewsMeBro wrote:You are to Brandon Sutter what SmurfyDump55 is to Geno. every player.


FTFY
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby mikey287 on Wed May 22, 2013 9:28 pm

Scott wrote:Here is the third line right now. No pressure,


F1 pressure, passive forecheck to neutralize speed in specialized situations against specific players. Not at all unique or strange to see.

Scott wrote:no fore check,


F1 is fairly aggressive in pushing the play...idea is not to let the offensive catalyst (65) get a head of steam up the middle of the ice. Direct them into the second layer (containing 16 for us), that layer (or that layer +1) forces a surrender of possession. Last layer (or last back) sets a pick and retrieve or just a straight retrieval. Once their main offensive catalysts lose the puck (65 and 19) we have much less to worry about it.

Scott wrote: no cycle, no puck possession time, no behind the net play,


Not their job. Not put in a position to do that. Note situational starts and even as far as straight line matching. Saying the same thing three times over though hardly makes for a list. Their job is to disrupt the Senators main offensive attack. Which sounds like an easy task, of course, but - of course, in reality - it is not. Sutter and Cooke and Kennedy and those guys have done a very good job on this front. Which is shown by Sutter not being out there for much in the way of goals against (one legitimately, right?), Cooke out for 1 and Kennedy out for 0 against. Cooke and Sutter especially are somehow expected to start most of their shifts hemmed into their own end against the best competition of a team in the Eastern Conference Semi-finals and hem the other team in their end the entire time as if other clubs have no good players that can also push the pace? It's as bad of an argument as it sounds...but here we are anyway...

Scott wrote: and instead of rambling on with the comments and commas...overall a total lack of play in the offensive zone.


How about facts and ellipses...?

Scott wrote:You have one player trying to hang out in the neutral zone, another player already at the goal line smashing a player creating a turnover that never realizes because nobody is there to grab the loose puck, and another one covering a guy for a breakout and the turnover hasn't even happened yet.


Good, you are watching. You just aren't seeing. Largely passive 1-2-2 forecheck. Explained above. F3 (usually Sutter, good wheels and hockey sense...best play reader should be there in this situation). Neutralize speed, keep pucks away from the middle of the rink, stifle creativity, manage gaps and spacing properly, separate player from puck...step by step and they're doing a fine job of it so far. They should be commended for keeping pucks out of the net. They leave us in a better position when they leave the ice.

Scott wrote:Two of the three forwards have given up on the offense before it got a chance to materialize. Every single shift.


By design. You want to see everyone playing shinny and going for offense and just doing whatever they feel like, I'll send you a copy of the 2012 Eastern Conference Quarterfinals. I didn't enjoy it nearly as much as most...but some people like that type of "hockey"

Scott wrote:When 2 of 3 forwards are waiting to play defense, you certainly can say that line is sitting back. The Pens are not going to win the cup if the identity of the third line is to let the other team have the puck all shift and play good defense. :roll:


Their identity is abundantly clear and the players have embraced the mission and carried it out with a high amount of success to date. Just because you don't like that identity does not make it non-existent.
Last edited by mikey287 on Wed May 22, 2013 9:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby Rylan on Wed May 22, 2013 9:29 pm

What are you trying to accomplish mikey? Do you hate yourself this much, because if you do we can get you help. Banging your head against a wall is unhealthy. If people wish to remain ignorant, let them.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby mikey287 on Wed May 22, 2013 9:31 pm

Rylan wrote:What are you trying to accomplish mikey? Do you hate yourself this much, because if you do we can get you help. Banging your head against a wall is unhealthy. If people wish to remain ignorant, let them.


I appreciate your concern. This wasn't for Scott, it's so the rest of the fan base can understand what's happening...stop the spread of misinformation...(ahem, kill time at an intermission)...etc.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby Rylan on Wed May 22, 2013 9:33 pm

Its been abundantly clear that misinformation spreads faster than good information.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby mikey287 on Wed May 22, 2013 9:45 pm

Rylan wrote:Its been abundantly clear that misinformation spreads faster than good information.


Easier to digest. Think McDonalds vs. organic food.

Also note, even down 2 the shift that contained the 6:00 mark of the 3rd period with Letang and Crosby out for us saw the Senators play a 1-2-2 low. Every team in the league has done this at some point...
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby sil on Wed May 22, 2013 9:56 pm

Scott wrote:
sil wrote:
But "not cycling or pressuring" doesn't necessarily equate to "sitting back" either, no?


What would you call it then?


Scott ignorance.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby Pitts on Wed May 22, 2013 9:57 pm

I'll just go ahead and repeat this right now so we can keep this circus wheel churning:

Here is the third line right now. No pressure, no fore check, no cycle, no puck possession time, no behind the net play.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby MRandall25 on Wed May 22, 2013 10:05 pm

Has anyone asked if Scott is watching the same games we are yet?
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby Pitts on Wed May 22, 2013 10:14 pm

I thought Brandon Sutter had a fine game tonight!
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby columbia on Wed May 22, 2013 10:15 pm

Pitts wrote:I thought Brandon Sutter had a fine game tonight!


He didn't score, so that certainly equates a failure.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby Shakes on Wed May 22, 2013 10:51 pm

Anthrax Jones ‏@AnthraxJones 10m
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"Probably. They have too much depth." -- Alfie
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby mikey287 on Wed May 22, 2013 10:53 pm

Pitts wrote:I thought Brandon Sutter had a fine game tonight!


He was very good again, yes.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby shmenguin on Wed May 22, 2013 10:54 pm

Best game he's played in a while
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby bhaw on Wed May 22, 2013 11:05 pm

MRandall25 wrote:Has anyone asked if Scott is watching the same games we are yet?


I conceded, specifically, that we aren't in the Game 3 GDT.

I'm certainly upset we didn't have secondary scoring tonight. This team is a failure.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby IMFC on Wed May 22, 2013 11:27 pm

mikey287 wrote:
Rylan wrote:What are you trying to accomplish mikey? Do you hate yourself this much, because if you do we can get you help. Banging your head against a wall is unhealthy. If people wish to remain ignorant, let them.


I appreciate your concern. This wasn't for Scott, it's so the rest of the fan base can understand what's happening...stop the spread of misinformation...(ahem, kill time at an intermission)...etc.


Success. Thanks.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby Idoit40fans on Thu May 23, 2013 7:51 am

shmenguin wrote:Best game he's played in a while


How many goals did he have?
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby dollartaco on Thu May 23, 2013 7:54 am

As long as Sutter yells OLD BOY OLD BOY OLD BOY at Kennedy all game, every game he's a net positive.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby Shakes on Thu May 23, 2013 8:20 am

dollartaco wrote:As long as Sutter yells OLD BOY OLD BOY OLD BOY at Kennedy all game, every game he's a net positive.


Co-sign.

As an aside, nice play by TK to chip it into space for Sid right before he walked Phillips.
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Re: Brandon Sutter...can we scratch?

Postby Gaucho on Thu May 23, 2013 8:45 am

Did Scott drown in his quicksand yet or will he make one last desperate attempt to, er, dig deeper?
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