Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coach

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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby PensHckyFan79 on Fri Aug 09, 2013 3:27 pm

Bylsma spearheaded these discussions over the summer...."We looked for a number of years adding an additional coach to our staff. We weren't just looking for a coach. We were looking for a criteria of a coach and experience of a coach. That's where our conversations with Jacques began," Bylsma said. "I began speaking with Jacques numerous times in the last couple of months. The expertise of Jacques, his experience in the game at many different levels, is really what we want to add to our team."


Not sure of how a coaching staff is chosen and what not, but it sounds like DB had a good amount of input on this decision. Do Head coaches generally get to pick there assistants? I feel this is a good hire and can only help the Pens in the long run.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=679945&navid=nhl:topheads
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby Crankshaft on Fri Aug 09, 2013 3:30 pm

PensHckyFan79 wrote:
Bylsma spearheaded these discussions over the summer...."We looked for a number of years adding an additional coach to our staff. We weren't just looking for a coach. We were looking for a criteria of a coach and experience of a coach. That's where our conversations with Jacques began," Bylsma said. "I began speaking with Jacques numerous times in the last couple of months. The expertise of Jacques, his experience in the game at many different levels, is really what we want to add to our team."


Not sure of how a coaching staff is chosen and what not, but it sounds like DB had a good amount of input on this decision. Do Head coaches generally get to pick there assistants? I feel this is a good hire and can only help the Pens in the long run.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=679945&navid=nhl:topheads


I am sure head coaches get to choose their own staff, but get approval from Shero/Lemieux.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby Tico Rick on Fri Aug 09, 2013 3:30 pm

I wonder if this will make DB want to see a sports psychologist. :pop:
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Aug 09, 2013 3:31 pm

We haven't had a 3rd asst. coach since the Cup win, right?

And yes, most head coaches pick their assistants.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby PensHckyFan79 on Fri Aug 09, 2013 3:36 pm

I only brought it up because a lot of people around here were saying this was Shero's doing and praising him for "fixing" the DB situation when it seems like it is more DB noticed a deficiency in his staff and sought out a coach who would complement the current staff. Either way whoever is behind this I like it.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby guiner on Fri Aug 09, 2013 4:07 pm

I've thought about this a long time but never bothered posting it because I just never see it happening, but with this signing... maybe we could see something like it.

The successful (stanley cup) winning teams in Pens history have had the ability to play stellar defense when needed. Classic example being coming from behind against caps 3 games to 1 by going to a left wing lock. When the Pens won most recently, they were capable of getting a lead, and just closing the door on comebacks, IMO this was due to still having HCMT defensive system still available in their minds.

Unfortuanatly, HCDB seems to be (maybe he has learned) enamored with this 'our game' thing and they never seem to consider that our game could be multifaceted. In the last few years, we just can't hold leads or play defense reliably when needed.

I like how HCDB breaks the season down into 10 games segments. I'd like to see the team develop 2 primary strategies, one offensive grind dem b***** down, and one defensive (perhaps martin derived.)

Start the season 20 games all defense, get that system in place, then in each segment predetermine some portion of games like 8-2 then 6-4 etc introducing more offensive oriented games. Then maybe last 20 games or so, just have the flexibility to switch styles dependent upon the in game situation. More or less, treat the regular season as a systematic training of both styles until the team is capable of playing either way.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby pcm on Fri Aug 09, 2013 4:47 pm

In order for the Pens to follow suit of the Red Wings as they age, and remain a winning team while being one of the oldest teams, they need to play a much smarter, more aware game. Jacques Martin brings that potential to the Pens. And if indeed, Blsyma sought him out, then kudos to him for recognizing he has to adapt and get better at coaching a winning team.

If they can become a patient team that squeezes shut the opposition's momentum and pounces on their mistakes, then I can see this team winning the cup again.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby darkstar57 on Fri Aug 09, 2013 5:46 pm

I am sure people won't see it like this but....

I think Bylsma knows his weaknesses and the chance to add Martin and work with him to become a better defensive mind coach and improve his overall approach show a lot
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby Factorial on Fri Aug 09, 2013 6:25 pm

Rylan wrote:Why must everything be about "sending a message" and not just addressing a need?


Draftnik wrote:lgp groupthink
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby mikey287 on Fri Aug 09, 2013 7:19 pm

I am pleasantly, pleasantly surprised by this hire. Jacques Martin has a lot of experience in a lot of different situations. He understands organizations from the top down. He's very sharp tactically. He's done really well with shutdown pairings over the years (Phillips/Volchenkov willed shoddy goaltending to the 2007 SC Finals). EDIT: He had left Ottawa by then, but he helped develop Chara, Redden, Phillips, A-Train, etc.) Anyway...Martin was also a former goalie, so I'm sure he can bring an idea or two, even if it's just a drill or two that he remembered from SLU...speaking from experience, ya never know what will make things click for a player...

Martin has done a really good job with defensive teams. Almost to a fault, because he didn't always adapt when his team fell behind and needed a spark. He's not noted for being a players' coach, he's pretty tough, rigid, etc. Which is great for this team. I've said that the organization lacks leadership from top to bottom (the best leader we have, in my outsider opinion, is probably Shero or Lemieux, and the latter probably isn't involved in the day-to-day business). Bylsma and his current staff doesn't strike me as particularly engaging (a Jacques Martin would never allow what transpired in the 2012 ECQF vs. Philadelphia). Crosby is a lead by example guy, not a rah-rah guy, Orpik just leads by not blinking at you, I'm not aware that any other player has a strong enough voice beyond those two...(aside: one reason why I wanted Brenden Morrow back).

Anyhow, really happy with the Martin hiring. He's going to bring some new ideas, a new voice and once he gets over the "stepping on toes" early, uncomfortable games, I think he'll step up to be a real leader on the bench. When **** starts to unwind, when we get our sweater caught on a nail, he's got the scissors ready...in recent seasons, we've spun around until nude.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby PAPLine on Fri Aug 09, 2013 9:06 pm

First they send MAF to a sports psycologist then they bring in Martin, I think that someone in the organization is starting to understand that they have to put pressure on the current parts if they are going to get anywhere.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby KG on Fri Aug 09, 2013 9:21 pm

Big fan of this hire. Agreed with mikey, surprised that the Pens went this route. Martin will bring some much needed defensive discipline to this team. Rierden to the skybox?
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby Boogeyman on Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:55 pm

If I recall, our defense was perfectly capable last year, rather it was our inability to create offense against a stout defensive group that sealed our fate. I'm not sold on the impact that seems to be expected by fans with this hire. This organization has been more like a cult in the management department, it won't be long before Martin is brainwashed into the country club mentality.

The fact of the matter is unless Bylsma let's Martin implement his philosophy and change styles of play, this team will still be trapped out of a cup year in and year out. Until then, Martin can tell Orpik and Letang how to hold their sticks correctly, or something. Which is all I would imagine him to be doing. You can't play Dan Bylsma and Jaques Martin hockey at the same time. We all know that we will still be watching Dan Bylsma hockey. Martin isn't going to nearly, even remotely have the effect that is being put out there. It's not his team, not his call.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby mikey287 on Sat Aug 10, 2013 12:13 am

Fair. But the organization didn't actively bring in a name like Martin with his reputation and his known style without wanting to take some sort of influence from him. He didn't get hired to be a stickboy. Similarly, Martin didn't leave his much easier media job to sit around and put coasters under the players' glasses either...it's right to expect some degree of influence. Our game doesn't have to be one or the other. It's not like teams flip a coin in training camp and go, "heads is offensive, tails is defensive for the year..." There's a way to mix and match ideas and make a system that works.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby Willie Kool on Sat Aug 10, 2013 12:38 am

IanMoran wrote:Only negative is DB will do fine in the regular season, so we're going to waste another of Crosby / Geno's prime

1. DB's system and Fleury in the regular season.
2. JM's system and Vokoun in the playoffs.
3. Profit.

:pop:
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby Beveridge on Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:27 am

I think the hidden gem that could come from this is while the Pens are learning a Martin defensive strategy, so to speak, they might just understand how more to beat it.

We can sit here at our chairs and say, "It's so easy to see how you beat this Boston's defense, or whatever team" but having a coach with experience who runs a defense that likes to frustrate (hello Halak and 2010 playoffs) an offensive team, this hire can benefit both sides of the coin.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby ExPatriatePen on Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:49 am

Willie Kool wrote:
IanMoran wrote:Only negative is DB will do fine in the regular season, so we're going to waste another of Crosby / Geno's prime

1. DB's system and Fleury in the regular season.
2. JM's system and Vokoun in the playoffs.
3. Profit.

:pop:


Don't think GMRS hasn't considered this scenario.

I'm enjoying the Genius that is GMRS. Last year it was like he anticipated MAFs meltdown and had a #1 experienced goalie waiting in the wings.
This year I think he recognizes that HCDB just doesn't have what it takes when the Playoffs roll around, so he goes out and gets himself a really good insurance policy.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby DontToewsMeBro on Sat Aug 10, 2013 9:39 am

Aside from signing Malkin this could be the best move they've made this offseason.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby KG on Sat Aug 10, 2013 10:06 am

ExPatriatePen wrote:
Willie Kool wrote:
IanMoran wrote:Only negative is DB will do fine in the regular season, so we're going to waste another of Crosby / Geno's prime

1. DB's system and Fleury in the regular season.
2. JM's system and Vokoun in the playoffs.
3. Profit.

:pop:


Don't think GMRS hasn't considered this scenario.

I'm enjoying the Genius that is GMRS. Last year it was like he anticipated MAFs meltdown and had a #1 experienced goalie waiting in the wings.
This year I think he recognizes that HCDB just doesn't have what it takes when the Playoffs roll around, so he goes out and gets himself a really good insurance policy.


Agreed. Martin addition will be huge come playoff time...
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby columbia on Sat Aug 10, 2013 10:10 am

I'm been trying to digest this news since yesterday and have to say that I'm pretty damn pleased.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby Gaucho on Sat Aug 10, 2013 12:03 pm

I like it. It gives the Penguins a good excuse to win a Cup despite DB's ineptitude.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Sat Aug 10, 2013 2:29 pm

In general I like it. Not necessarily for the trap aspect but after watching us with poor defensive coverage and giving up easy tap in goals on odd man breaks that type of coaching seems to be needed.

I'm not sold on a mix of HCDB's system and a trap though. We have drafted and signed FA's for a specific system for 5 years now. While I get examples like 1992 those teams had underrated depth/role players and defensive players, two of the better power forwards in the game and a hall of fame 2 way center on the 2nd line. I'm not saying it can't be done I just don't see how we mix stretch passing and a fast paced game into slowing it down. A lot of trapping works based on better puck control in the offensive zone forcing more difficult breakouts.

Also, every coach that comes in and implements a trap gets run out of the city in 2 years.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby PensFanInDC on Sat Aug 10, 2013 3:32 pm

Maybe it takes some pressure off of Bylsma is also coaching team USA
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby pens_CT on Sat Aug 10, 2013 3:43 pm

What's more important than who they have as the head coach, or as his assistants, is holding the players accountable for playing both ends of the ice. I haven't seen that from HCDB so far except for some rookies like Despres. I guess time will tell how much influence Martin will have on strategy.
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Re: Jacques Martin hired by the Penguins as an assistant coa

Postby mikey287 on Sat Aug 10, 2013 7:14 pm

See, people get a little too caught up in systems sometimes. Not every coach has a system. Some have a style. Some are highly adaptable. Some have just guidelines (do's and do not's) and are great communicators and motivators. Et cetera.

Last year we played more 1-2-2 (colloquially, the dreaded "T" word) than I've seen us play ever...Jacques Martin can influx a little more puck possession into our game hopefully. I said a few years ago we could become a "strong side attack" type of team, but we're too slow now I think. But we have the skill.

Either way, it doesn't have to be one thing or the other. It's just nice to have this exchange of ideas that should be coming during the season from an experienced defensive coach.
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