Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby shmenguin on Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:26 pm

tfrizz wrote:As far as PKers go, it remains relatively unchanged. Of the 12 players to record at least 0:01 SH TOI in the playoffs, 10 are returning.

Craig Adams - 3:34
Pascal Dupuis - 2:57
Matt Cooke - 2:05
Brandon Sutter - 2:00
Tanner Glass - 1:14
Jussi Jokinen - 0:50
Brenden Morrow - 0:25
Sidney Crosby - 0:14
Joe Vitale - 0:13
Chris Kunitz - 0:05
Beau Bennett - 0:04
Evgent Malkin - 0:00 (0:09 total)


one of the league's worst penalty kills will get all of its aces back...coooool
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Froggy on Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:30 pm

shmenguin wrote:
tfrizz wrote:As far as PKers go, it remains relatively unchanged. Of the 12 players to record at least 0:01 SH TOI in the playoffs, 10 are returning.

Craig Adams - 3:34
Pascal Dupuis - 2:57
Matt Cooke - 2:05
Brandon Sutter - 2:00
Tanner Glass - 1:14
Jussi Jokinen - 0:50
Brenden Morrow - 0:25
Sidney Crosby - 0:14
Joe Vitale - 0:13
Chris Kunitz - 0:05
Beau Bennett - 0:04
Evgent Malkin - 0:00 (0:09 total)


one of the league's worst penalty kills will get all of its aces back...coooool

except of course for cooke, who was arguably our best penalty killer
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby shmenguin on Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:56 pm

Froggy wrote:
shmenguin wrote:
tfrizz wrote:As far as PKers go, it remains relatively unchanged. Of the 12 players to record at least 0:01 SH TOI in the playoffs, 10 are returning.

Craig Adams - 3:34
Pascal Dupuis - 2:57
Matt Cooke - 2:05
Brandon Sutter - 2:00
Tanner Glass - 1:14
Jussi Jokinen - 0:50
Brenden Morrow - 0:25
Sidney Crosby - 0:14
Joe Vitale - 0:13
Chris Kunitz - 0:05
Beau Bennett - 0:04
Evgent Malkin - 0:00 (0:09 total)


one of the league's worst penalty kills will get all of its aces back...coooool

except of course for cooke, who was arguably our best penalty killer


yippee whipee

though bringing in scuderi is a big deal for the PK. we saw what losing michalek did to us this year. say what you will about his overall game, but he was an elite penalty killing defenseman when he was here. and a guy like that can make a difference. though when you have a bunch of forwards who can't skate worth a lick slowly gliding around their own zone, there's gonna be a pretty low ceiling no matter what.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Mon Aug 26, 2013 11:14 pm

KG wrote:
pcm wrote:Morrow was one of the Pen's best forwards from deadline to defeat vs. Bruins. He filled his role to a T, whether contributing on an offensive line (w/ Jokinen-Bennett) in a purely checking role (w/ Sutter-Cooke) or making a difference from the 4th line. That he never got a chance to be a net presence with Malkin is a testament to Blysma's failings this past playoffs.

But whatever. Those saying he "sucked" or contributed little because he slowed the team down, I think are just making stabs in the dark. With reasoning like "The Isles exposed this team with speed. Therefore, the Pens are too slow... Morrow is slow, therefore he sucks."

Morrow was exactly what this team was missing the year before against the Flyers, and the year before that against the Lightning (with Cooke out). And it looks like they're going to be missing it in a big way again this year, unless some changes to the roster happen.


Good post. I agree. The lack of speed Morrow brings is not the problem. The team can't all be speed demons. Every player serves a role and purpose. You need grit to win in the playoffs. That said, you cant have your grinders out there in bad matchups, which is where coaching comes in to play. Last years playoff loss was more on Byslma then the composition of the roster...IMO


I don't know. I'm no HCDB fan but the roster had plenty of holes masked during other rounds for various reasons. Morrow just wasn't simply that good.

Sure he did some ok things especially when trapping basically all the time but he was clearly over matched in a lot of aspects. I don't think it's generalizing to say he was slow and swatting because that is what he is.

I get that our bottom 6 was basically out there to clog the neutral zone and wasn't capable of much else (contrary to popular belief some trapping teams have sick transition games), but heck I could put a line of 3 WBS players on entry level contracts to just go out and do what are third and fourth lines did.

It wasn't all HCDB, our 3rd and 4th lines were pretty bad beyond trapping and Morrow was a part of that and from what I read was bad all year.

Good riddance, I think he is the exact reason the pens got a guy like Dags. At least have one skill set that is useful beyond allure.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Factorial on Tue Aug 27, 2013 12:07 pm

Did the Pens ever confirm this broken kneecap? Or just Morrow's agent?
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Jesse on Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:53 pm

Morrow was brought to Pittsburgh to be a presence in the room. He didn't do that. His value is low beyond that, which is why he's currently without contract.

Thanks, but no thanks. Matt D'Agostini is enough of an enigma, both of those guys would be a nightmare here.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby pcm on Wed Aug 28, 2013 11:15 am

Morrow an enigma? Probably the first time he's ever been called that. The guy is meat and potatoes, a warrior who puts it all out there for you every night. So strange.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby NeddieVedder on Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:07 pm

read title as Morozov
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Brugrabud on Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:21 pm

He seemed to take a step back I agree on the leadership role.. you can tell he came here and didn't want to step on any toes.. same thing with Iggy... yet that is precisely what they were acquired for. I wonder if this is something where Shero/Bylsma could have pulled both aside and told them they were brought here for that reason and not to just be fly's on the wall repeating whatever the mantra of the room was that night (I am thinking of the scene in Slap Shot where the Hanson brothers yell and repeat everything Reg Dunlop preached in the locker room).
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Stick_licker on Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:23 pm

pcm wrote:Morrow an enigma? Probably the first time he's ever been called that. The guy is meat and potatoes, a warrior who puts it all out there for you every night. So strange.


Agreed 100%. Having Morrow around is great for leadership and team character. I'd also be ok with a young unproven guy with some potential taking his spot. What I'm not really okay with is the philosophy of filling those spots with known low-potential players like Glass and to a lesser extent Adams.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby shmenguin on Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:42 pm

this team definitely needs more leadership, but morrow failed wildly at that role in his time here.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby FallenHero96 on Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:00 pm

Maybe Morrow and Iginla were never the leaders that they were hyped up to be.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby KG on Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:03 pm

shmenguin wrote:this team definitely needs more leadership, but morrow failed wildly at that role in his time here.


Not making excuses for anyone. But it is probably hard to come into a winning situation and become a leader. He probably wanted to just "fit in"?
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby columbia on Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:04 pm

shmenguin wrote:this team definitely needs more leadership, but morrow failed wildly at that role in his time here.


What is the evidence for this statement?
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Brugrabud on Wed Aug 28, 2013 4:09 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uK55gMbnXHc

Answers a lot of the questions we're asking here...

I still would want him back, especially because he hopefully would feel more comfortable especially after a full season around these guys.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby pcm on Wed Aug 28, 2013 4:27 pm

Morrow and Iginla were both long-standing captains for their teams, each respectively the face of their franchise. They joined their first "new" team of their careers with 15 games to go in the regular season... joining a well-established group of players that have won a cup together already. Have you ever seen anyone start a new job and "take leadership of the company" right away? How about 2 guys trying to do this at once? If Shero brought them in to be leaders in the room, then their "failing" in that regard is his fault.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby MRandall25 on Wed Aug 28, 2013 4:34 pm

pcm wrote: Have you ever seen anyone start a new job and "take leadership of the company" right away?


Billy Guerin.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Crankshaft on Wed Aug 28, 2013 4:40 pm

MRandall25 wrote:
pcm wrote: Have you ever seen anyone start a new job and "take leadership of the company" right away?


Billy Guerin.


Perfect example. For a guy who has only played 95 games plus playoffs with the organization, it feels like he's been around forever.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Idoit40fans on Wed Aug 28, 2013 5:20 pm

FallenHero96 wrote:Maybe Morrow and Iginla were never the leaders that they were hyped up to be.


They were up there and age and produced numbers throughout their careers, of course they were great leaders.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Jesse on Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:57 pm

columbia wrote:
shmenguin wrote:this team definitely needs more leadership, but morrow failed wildly at that role in his time here.


What is the evidence for this statement?


Reports from the room are evidence for this statement. I participated in a roundtable with several writers for Pittsburgh magazine about the Boston series and the state of the team. Rob Rossi was very candid in his assessment, from within the room, of the fact that Morrow/Iginla were simply along for the ride and did not invest themselves in what was happening with this team.

That is the antithesis of why they were brought here in the first place. Is Morrow a meat and potatoes guy? Sure. Did he actively invest himself in the room? No. That makes him thoroughly replaceable and one of about a hundred third line types of his ilk. Many of whom are much younger, as well.

Here is Rob's exact quote on the matter:

Looking back, Shero was banking on Iginla and Morrow commanding a presence in the room. They resisted. They were playing for contracts, not the Cup. It was his great miscalculation, but who could see that coming? I suspect Shero knew those guys had little left in the tank. He wanted them to take over the room, and allow Crosby and Malkin to just play. That never happened. Iginla shrunk from that role; Morrow never found a groove.


Link: http://www.pittsburghmagazine.com/Best- ... oundtable/
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Jesse on Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:59 pm

MRandall25 wrote:
pcm wrote: Have you ever seen anyone start a new job and "take leadership of the company" right away?


Billy Guerin.


Ron Francis.

Gary Roberts.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby columbia on Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:08 pm

Take over the room?
If that - Shero's intention - is accurate, then it's a pretty discouraging assessment of the team leadership....and I'm not talking about Morrow and Iginla.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Luckybreak on Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:53 pm

columbia wrote:Take over the room?
If that - Shero's intention - is accurate, then it's a pretty discouraging assessment of the team leadership....and I'm not talking about Morrow and Iginla.


Sid leads on the ice (unless a defensively sound team implements a system that our coach is slow to accept might require corresponding changes) and seems to be programmed to be too nice to really take charge in a fiery motivational way.
Geno has a vastly improved grasp of English but I doubt he can articulate well enough, coupled with an endearing shyness that suggests he saves his leadership for random outbursts at his linemates (wish they could mike him up for a game...)
Letang is a sullen hot head with amazing hair and a personality that lags behind his on ice flare.
Orpik has a stare that can burn through steel, but his 'leadership' seems uniformaly critical and probably gets phased out after hearing for a few seasons.
Flower - well, would you be motivated by a guy nicknamed Flower?!

That's a big chunk of money tied into some of the best players in the league, but I don't see a great 'leadership' ROI. I think role players in the ilk of Talbot/Cooke/Rupp/Billy G have been replaced by Glass and AHL fringers who lack the aforementioned player's spark. Essentially I think you need several different types of leadership in a team that can step up at the right time and the current team might lack the ability to respond to every situation.

I also don't blame Morrow and Iggy for wanting to 'fit in' but they both failed to grasp the role that Guerin filled so admirably for his short time here.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Jesse on Thu Aug 29, 2013 2:37 pm

columbia wrote:Take over the room?
If that - Shero's intention - is accurate, then it's a pretty discouraging assessment of the team leadership....and I'm not talking about Morrow and Iginla.


Brendan Morrow's decline in Dallas is well documented as far as his play is concerned. He was a shell of his former self, albeit still effective in a third line role.

To understand Shero's perspective on this, I take a step back to the prior years collapse at the hands of the Flyers. The Penguins are, relatively, still a young group of players with a ton of offensive flair. They mentally broke down against the Flyers and it showed in nearly every facet of their game.

The purpose of bringing Brendan Morrow here was more about his attitude in the room than it was his ability on the ice. They were brought in to be hardened veterans that could speak to what was needed nightly in order to be successful.

Whether or not that was needed is debatable. Regardless, they didn't do it. And if we're talking about filling a hole left by Brendan Morrow, I would rather see the Penguins sign someone half his age that's a lot more capable in the capacity he fills. Again, he wasn't completely awful, or even awful at all, but it's not the direction I'd head going into an 82 game season with a guy fresh off of a split kneecap nearing 40 years old.
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Re: Not Re-signing Morrow a HUGE mistake

Postby Pitts on Thu Aug 29, 2013 2:59 pm

MRandall25 wrote:
pcm wrote: Have you ever seen anyone start a new job and "take leadership of the company" right away?


Billy Guerin.

Gary Roberts
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