Fleury is done

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Re: Fleury is done

Postby Big Easy Pens Fan on Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:33 pm

DelPen wrote:He needs to stop giving up a goal on the first shot he sees which seems like almost every game. It doesn't matter what situation it is in, practice, scrimmage, preseason, regular season or playoffs. All show evidence his head is not in the game he is playing.


This.

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Re: Fleury is done

Postby shafnutz05 on Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:33 pm

bhaw wrote:
shafnutz05 wrote:OP: hyperbole

Reality: I have little to no confidence in Fleury, especially when it counts.

I admittedly haven't watched any Pens preseason action, but I'm not surprised that he still looks sloppy.


Don't let the hyperbole get in the way. The first goal wasn't on him. Poor coverage and Brooks Orpik did a great job blocking MAF's entire view but not blocking the puck.

The D looks just as sloppy as the playoffs. MAF doesn't look worse (or better) than he did before. But the attention he is getting is overlooking the fact that even with Scuderi, our D looks like a steaming pile. We could have a Vezina candidate in goal.


Thanks, that's a lot of info I didn't have. Looks like the same old same old :(
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby MRandall25 on Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:36 pm

Big Easy Pens Fan wrote:
"A work in progress"? At this time in Fleury's career these 4 words do not compute.

BEPF


Considering he was never taught proper positioning in juniors or as a young pro, he is most definitely a W.I.P. at this point. Pretty much is re-learning the position.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby Big Easy Pens Fan on Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:45 pm

MRandall25 wrote:
Big Easy Pens Fan wrote:
"A work in progress"? At this time in Fleury's career these 4 words do not compute.

BEPF


Considering he was never taught proper positioning in juniors or as a young pro, he is most definitely a W.I.P. at this point. Pretty much is re-learning the position.


Okay, I understand that, but for a team that aspires to win a Stanley Cup (soon), he needs to be, at 28/29, a WIP somewhere else.

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Re: Fleury is done

Postby skullman80 on Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:45 pm

MRandall25 wrote:
Big Easy Pens Fan wrote:
"A work in progress"? At this time in Fleury's career these 4 words do not compute.

BEPF


Considering he was never taught proper positioning in juniors or as a young pro, he is most definitely a W.I.P. at this point. Pretty much is re-learning the position.


That's not good enough at this point to be honest. It just isn't.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby meow on Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:55 pm

People are very quick to throw Fleury under the bus, yet no one seems to have a solution. Trade him? For who? Let the new goalie coach actually do his job for longer than 3 pre-season games?
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby Gaucho on Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:58 pm

Re-learning his position is neither necessary nor possible, imho. He knows how to play goal when he puts his mind to it
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby meow on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:01 pm

Gaucho wrote:Re-learning his position is neither necessary nor possible, imho. He knows how to play goal when he puts his mind to it

So he's a slacker that doesn't care anymore?
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby Gaucho on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:06 pm

meow wrote:
Gaucho wrote:Re-learning his position is neither necessary nor possible, imho. He knows how to play goal when he puts his mind to it

So he's a slacker that doesn't care anymore?


No, but he seems to suffer from vertigo or whatever at the worst possible moments.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby skullman80 on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:07 pm

Fleury at the age or 27 or 28 shouldn't need a new friggin goalie coach to teach him the game, or a sports psychiatrist or any of that crap. He's not some 18 year old rookie at this point. He should be mentally able to handle the workload and do his job.

He frustrates me because he has all the talent in the world, but these last few years in the playoffs have just been awful. It can't continue.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby FreeCandy44 on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:08 pm

I guess I should sell the tickets to the 2 games I purchased this year. You know since "the fans" have already declared it over and done.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby skullman80 on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:09 pm

FreeCandy44 wrote:I guess I should sell the tickets to the 2 games I purchased this year. You know since "the fans" have already declared it over and done.


The OP was a bit over the top.

That being said the criticism that Floury gets now is absolutely warranted and valid.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby Gaucho on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:10 pm

He wouldn't be the first very talented goalie whose wheels fall off completely in what should be his prime. Let's hope it doesn't happen.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby sil on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:11 pm

Finally a thread dedicated only to discussing Fleury's woes!
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby JoseCuervo on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:24 pm

Whether you like him or not, Fleury is going to be the starter this year. He certainly has warranted his criticism, but at this time, the team just does not have a viable replacement.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby Pavel Bure on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:27 pm

I'm baffled by the another chance crowd. The guy is done. He's got now years of proven meltdown failure. The sample size is big enough to say he stinks when it counts the most.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby Jim on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:37 pm

I finally don't have to speak the truth about Fleury (some call it bashing). It is nice that other people are finally cutting through the bull.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby offsides on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:38 pm

sil wrote:Finally a thread dedicated only to discussing Fleury's woes!


Wonder how many pages this one will go. Most Fleury threads easily reach double digits.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby murphydump55 on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:41 pm

Pavel Bure wrote:I'm baffled by the another chance crowd. The guy is done. He's got now years of proven meltdown failure. The sample size is big enough to say he stinks when it counts the most.


Shhhh, not on here!

The guy has twice this preseason, given up a goal on the first shot he faced, and he's notorious for that.

Also in the team scrimmage he let in 3 goal on the first 3 shots. (two of the goal scorers were Adams and Glass)

It's hard to believe he's turned the corner, figured it out, whatever you want to call it. He no longer gets the benefit of the doubt, he has to start showing up in whatever situation he's in. Practice, scrimmage, pre season, regular season, etc.

I'm willing to see what he'll do this season before I write him off completely, but I'm hardly optimistic with the start he's had. However, it could mean absolutely nothing and he could come out with our regular D in front of him and be a completely competent goaltender. Judging by Shero's comments, I could see him putting him on a short leash and finding some kind of fix if he fails again.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby bhaw on Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:45 pm

Gaucho wrote:Re-learning his position is neither necessary nor possible, imho. He knows how to play goal when he puts his mind to it


Agreed. There is no "re-learning" going on. It's not like a team you tear apart and rebuild. They are just tweaking what he already does.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby tfrizz on Sun Sep 22, 2013 8:08 pm

JoseCuervo wrote:Whether you like him or not, Fleury is going to be the starter this year. He certainly has warranted his criticism, but at this time, the team just does not have a viable replacement.


And, as is always the case, the options available on the market are few and almost always overpriced.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby tfrizz on Sun Sep 22, 2013 8:10 pm

murphydump55 wrote:
Pavel Bure wrote:I'm baffled by the another chance crowd. The guy is done. He's got now years of proven meltdown failure. The sample size is big enough to say he stinks when it counts the most.


Shhhh, not on here!

The guy has twice this preseason, given up a goal on the first shot he faced, and he's notorious for that.

Also in the team scrimmage he let in 3 goal on the first 3 shots. (two of the goal scorers were Adams and Glass)

It's hard to believe he's turned the corner, figured it out, whatever you want to call it. He no longer gets the benefit of the doubt, he has to start showing up in whatever situation he's in. Practice, scrimmage, pre season, regular season, etc.

I'm willing to see what he'll do this season before I write him off completely, but I'm hardly optimistic with the start he's had. However, it could mean absolutely nothing and he could come out with our regular D in front of him and be a completely competent goaltender. Judging by Shero's comments, I could see him putting him on a short leash and finding some kind of fix if he fails again.


As I posted earlier in the thread, Fleury has been bad in the preseason almost his entire career. He's also been a notoriously slow starter in the majority of his NHL seasons. In fact, the only time I can actually recall him being "ready to go" in camp and to start the season was in 2009 when he was at the Canadian Olympic camp over the summer.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby BurghersAndDogsSports on Sun Sep 22, 2013 8:51 pm

tfrizz wrote:
JoseCuervo wrote:Whether you like him or not, Fleury is going to be the starter this year. He certainly has warranted his criticism, but at this time, the team just does not have a viable replacement.


And, as is always the case, the options available on the market are few and almost always overpriced.


That could be the case with any position though. Doesn't change the fact he has earned this on his own.

While I agree the OP and some thoughts may be over the top. A 7 year starter at goalie with a championship shouldn't be giving fans any reason (let alone this many) to doubt him. Not too mention this isn't a typical fan overreaction like when a QB has one bad series. There is quite a large sample size and some of it is very overwhelming evidence.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby Pavel Bure on Sun Sep 22, 2013 9:01 pm

tfrizz wrote:
murphydump55 wrote:
Pavel Bure wrote:I'm baffled by the another chance crowd. The guy is done. He's got now years of proven meltdown failure. The sample size is big enough to say he stinks when it counts the most.


Shhhh, not on here!

The guy has twice this preseason, given up a goal on the first shot he faced, and he's notorious for that.

Also in the team scrimmage he let in 3 goal on the first 3 shots. (two of the goal scorers were Adams and Glass)

It's hard to believe he's turned the corner, figured it out, whatever you want to call it. He no longer gets the benefit of the doubt, he has to start showing up in whatever situation he's in. Practice, scrimmage, pre season, regular season, etc.

I'm willing to see what he'll do this season before I write him off completely, but I'm hardly optimistic with the start he's had. However, it could mean absolutely nothing and he could come out with our regular D in front of him and be a completely competent goaltender. Judging by Shero's comments, I could see him putting him on a short leash and finding some kind of fix if he fails again.


As I posted earlier in the thread, Fleury has been bad in the preseason almost his entire career. He's also been a notoriously slow starter in the majority of his NHL seasons. In fact, the only time I can actually recall him being "ready to go" in camp and to start the season was in 2009 when he was at the Canadian Olympic camp over the summer.

Tfrizz people don't have this attitude because of his preseason.
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Re: Fleury is done

Postby pcm on Sun Sep 22, 2013 9:08 pm

tfrizz wrote:
JoseCuervo wrote:Whether you like him or not, Fleury is going to be the starter this year. He certainly has warranted his criticism, but at this time, the team just does not have a viable replacement.


And, as is always the case, the options available on the market are few and almost always overpriced.


Not this year and usually, not in the goalie position. There are lots of cheap talented guys available on the market at all positions this year because of the cap situation. And it seems there are always decent journeymen goalies available. Bryzgalov is in the same tier as Fleury and Vokoun. Despite the debacle in Philly, he was maybe their only decent player last year.

If Fleury plays like a seive through 25 games, what is Shero going to do? No doubt this is a question Ray's considering. Obviously Fleury is going to be the starter through the first quarter of the season. But as a GM, you can't look at his body of work and feel confident in your goaltending moving forward. A Plan B is certainly being looked at.
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