Rate our defense??

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Rate our defense??

Postby no name on Mon Feb 03, 2014 1:32 pm

Naming the best player to the worst and give a little run down on who you want to see in the postseason.

1. Martin, experenced, smart and good decision maker. Can play power play and PK his steady presence is needed on the blueline.
2. Letang, i give him ahigh rating due to his talent level. though honestly i don't think we need him anymore. tradebait.
3. Maatta, even with his youth he displays Martin-esque poise. In a few more years he i will be our No.1 blueliner.
4. Orpik, we lack physical play and he still brings it more than other players. Always been a fan of his so might be blind to the fact he is older.
5. Scuds. see Orpik.
6. Niskanen, playing great this year but still not a top 4 guy on this team, feel worry for a team who has him playing top 4 minutes.
7. Despres, he will be part of our future just needs to polish his game for a little longer.
8. Bortuzzo, he is getting better could see him getting some playoff time vs teams we want a phycial presence.
9. Engelland, can never have to many d men. Thought like what i see of him at forward.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby meow on Mon Feb 03, 2014 1:45 pm

Best meaning what? Most talented? Best fit for the current system? Best defensively? Most valuable? Best hair?
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby murphydump55 on Mon Feb 03, 2014 1:47 pm

Martin - struggling and looks rusty as heck since returning
Letang - regressing, wouldn't be upset to see him go
Maatta - future talent, steal of a pick, steady but comes with rookie mistakes at times.
Orpik - great skater but decision making has been pretty bad as of late. Brings an element of physical play that we lack
Scuderi - anytime he wants to show up and be that steady rock on the backend would be nice. Struggling as well.
Niskanen - he's been our best dman this year, and easily our most consistent
Despres - I would like to see more of him this year. Our record with him in the lineup speaks for itself.
Bortuzzo - keep this kid in the lineup. His physical and thorn in the side type play is something that our blueline lacks.
Engelland - I like Engo at forward with the possibility of playing him on the blueline in emergency situations (not sliding him back for PK's)

These are in no specific order btw.

When you look at our D, Martin, Letang, Orpik, and Scuderi are all struggling. Yes, our top 4 veteran D are struggling.

It's sad when I felt more confident when we dressed an AHL blueline. Not good.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby Idoit40fans on Mon Feb 03, 2014 2:06 pm

Id rate it a 6/11
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby tfrizz on Mon Feb 03, 2014 2:38 pm

Idoit40fans wrote:Id rate it a 6/11


I'd honestly say it's a "middle of the pack" defense at best, but I also believe that the system is a big part of the reason for that. So much emphasis on transition and offense that it seems like defense kind of gets overlooked.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby pcm on Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:21 pm

I'd say this is the best group of defensemen this organization has ever had.

Compare:

2009
Gonchar-Orpik
Gill-Scuderi
Goligoski-Letang
Eaton-Boucher

1991
Murphy-Ulf
Coffey-Roberts
Hillier-Paek
Jennings-Taglianetti

1992
The Pens traded Coffey (contenders don't trade defensemen?), lost Hillier, added Kjell and Stanton.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby lemieuxReturns on Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:29 pm

If only based on this season so far, then I would rate them as follows:

Niski
Martin
Maata
Scuderi
Bortuzzo
Letang
Orpik
Depres
Engelland
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby Gaucho on Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:34 pm

pcm wrote:I'd say this is the best group of defensemen this organization has ever had.


I agree. It's true that the top 4 has been somewhat underachieving so far this season, but they've all been battling various injuries. Let's hope they find their groove.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby columbia on Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:36 pm

This poster had forgotten about Philippe Boucher.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby meow on Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:42 pm

Gaucho wrote:
pcm wrote:I'd say this is the best group of defensemen this organization has ever had.


I agree. It's true that the top 4 has been somewhat underachieving so far this season, but they've all been battling various injuries. Let's hope they find their groove.

Is it true that the top 4 has been underachieving this year? They are 7th in the league for 5-on-5 goals against per game. They have the number ranked 1 PK. They give up the 5th lowest shots per game. They have the highest winning percentage - by a very sizable margin - when leading after the end of the first period. Don't drink the kool aid, Gaucho.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby Gaucho on Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:48 pm

meow wrote:
Gaucho wrote:
pcm wrote:I'd say this is the best group of defensemen this organization has ever had.


I agree. It's true that the top 4 has been somewhat underachieving so far this season, but they've all been battling various injuries. Let's hope they find their groove.

Is it true that the top 4 has been underachieving this year? They are 7th in the league for 5-on-5 goals against per game. They have the number ranked 1 PK. They give up the 5th lowest shots per game. They have the highest winning percentage - by a very sizable margin - when leading after the end of the first period. Don't drink the kool aid, Gaucho.


They've been better than some people give them credit for, but I think they can still be better. I mean, Martin and Letang hardly played at all, it seems.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby pcm on Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:49 pm

^Yeah, but is that because Niskanen and Maatta have been so damn good? The Pens top 4 dmen this season, based on total ice time:

Niskanen
Orpik
Maatta
Letang

Everyone agrees Letang is underachieving. Orpik has been regular season Orpik. The credit IMO for the Pens' defensive acumen this year goes much more to Niskanen and Maatta then the top 4 highest paid dmen.

Hell, even Bortuzzo and Engelland have played more than Scuderi.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby no name on Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:10 pm

In the playoffs when the play becomes more physical and the pace slows down, the game becomes much more defesive oriented. I hope Bylsma realizes Maattas inexperience and Niskanens lack of physical play could hinder us a little. Not alot but a little. In the playoffs when you want to maintain a late lead are you going to press for offense and "keep the puck in your zone" or try to shut the other team down "Jacques Martin Style". When you put on the brakes and try to end the game with 10 minutes left the experience you get from Martin, Scuds and Orpik should be used first and foremost.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby slappybrown on Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:18 pm

pcm wrote:1992
The Pens traded Coffey (contenders don't trade defensemen?), lost Hillier, added Kjell and Stanton.


IIRC, the Penguins were out of the playoffs or close to it when they traded Coffey (and Recchi). They were defending champs, but there were serious questions about them making the playoffs, let alone being serious contenders.

That said, if you want to trade Martin and get back some combination of top 5 power forward in the NHL, second pairing defensively responsible d-man, and veteran backup goalie, I'm more willing to listen. I don't know that a Martin-based package gets you that.

The point remains that trading a top-pairing guy is extremely rare for obvious reasons.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby no name on Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:25 pm

meow wrote:Best meaning what? Most talented? Best fit for the current system? Best defensively? Most valuable? Best hair?



This was my first sentence:

Naming the best player to the worst and give a little run down on who you want to see in the postseason.

SO i guess i am looking for the players you would use the most to the least in the playoffs.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby indian on Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:40 pm

Ranked in order of this year's playoff minutes. Self explanatory.
Martin
Letang
Orpik
Scuderi
Niskanen
Maatta
Bortuzzo
Despres
Engellend
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby RisslingsMissingTeeth on Tue Feb 04, 2014 11:03 am

Considering our success in recent playoffs, here is the ice time in descending order I would like to see:
Nisky
Martin
Maatta
Scuds
Letang
Borts
Despres
(trade Orpik)
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby KG on Tue Feb 04, 2014 11:19 am

This is the deepest our D has been in years, on paper. Granted Orpik isn't what he was and Letang can't stay healthy. But bodies wise, the D is very deep and above average. IMO...
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby IntangibleBeer on Tue Feb 04, 2014 2:16 pm

slappybrown wrote:
pcm wrote:1992
The Pens traded Coffey (contenders don't trade defensemen?), lost Hillier, added Kjell and Stanton.


IIRC, the Penguins were out of the playoffs or close to it when they traded Coffey (and Recchi). They were defending champs, but there were serious questions about them making the playoffs, let alone being serious contenders.



That is correct! There was real doubt that they would make the playoffs. 1991-92 was a crazy year:
  • Badger Bob died shortly after the start of the season.
  • The team had changed owners.
  • Mario had physical problems again.

That was the year they acquired Rick Tocchet, which turned out to be a key element in the championship win. His regular season game against Chicago (with a wired-up jaw in the 3rd period) sent a message few on that team forgot.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby no name on Tue Feb 04, 2014 3:18 pm

92 was a great year.

Don't forget K Samuelsson also. The infussion of defense and toughness hepled that team alot. I would love to see Shero take a page out of Patricks book and make a bold and agressive move adding those dimensions to this team.Even on SIds wing i would like to see a player who knows how to play both ends of the ice and is tough. A very tall order in todays NHL, Milan Lucci's don't grow in trees now a days.
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Re: Rate our defense??

Postby abwvu1 on Tue Feb 04, 2014 11:11 pm

Ranking based on name recognition, talent, tenure:

1. Orpik
2. Martin
3. Letang
4. Scuderi
5. Niskanen
6. Maatta
7. Despres
8. Engelland
9. Burtuzzo

Current performance:
1. Niskanen
2. Maatta
3. Martin
4. Oprik
5. Letang
6. Scuderi
7. Despres
8. Engelland
9. Burtuzzo

The top 4 of Orpik-Martin-Scuds-Letang have been underwhelming to say the least. ECF will once again be ugly if they don't shape back up in time.
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