Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby thedude400 on Thu May 15, 2014 1:44 pm

Like I've theorized before, it wouldn't surprise me if Bylsma tried to flip the 'switch' on his coaching style after taking criticism, maybe right before the playoffs (or possibly even last year after the ECF fail). But It's just not going to work after several years of a country club atmosphere, the players aren't going to buy into it. Don't fall for this news snippet (even if it is true) as it only confuses the real situation which is that over the years Bylsma has been too soft, laissez faire about accountability and consistent performance standards, and fearful of upsetting the Pens top stars. He may have tried to change late but it would have only been out of desperation.

And let's be honest when it comes to garnering the attention and respect of multi-millionaires, you must have considerable experience in their profession, otherwise they won't care to listen to you. A 17 point season in Anaheim doesn't go a long way in the eyes of two multi 100+ point per season all-stars.

If you want respect but don't have experience, you have to get creative and find ways to inspire and be effective. If you can't do that it's time to peel the expiration date off your back and move on to something you're a little bit better at. I wish the best of luck to Dan (he played college hockey where I graduated from) but I want to see a hoisted cup before I'm too old to care.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby DelPen on Thu May 15, 2014 1:49 pm

Hockey is still a game and there has to be some degree of enjoyment, also known as fun. If it's not fun to go out on the ice and play then something is wrong. I would almost garuntee any comments were more inline with Bylsma sucking all the fun out of the game with his tedious meetings and pointless practices that yielded ineptness on the ice when executed.

I had a theory that they were either listening to him and doing exactly what he wanted or tuned him out completely. I'm getting a sense they did what he wanted, he showed tape and then scolded them for doing something stupid when in fact it's what they practiced.

That will grate anyone.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby alancac98 on Thu May 15, 2014 1:58 pm

Okay, so I haven't read the entire thread so I apologize if this was already stated. Whether Rossi is correct or blowing smoke it doesn't matter. We can all be pretty assured that there was a problem in the locker room and between players and coach. With that said, let's move on to something a little more of a concern and the questions are: Why were the players empowered in the first place? Why do the players feel that they should be empowered? Those are the questions I would like to ask any of the players including Crosby or Malkin. They are played to pay, period. Shut the hell up and play the damn game! To any coach of a professional sports team, why are you trying to be friends? Yeah, you don't have to be a prick, but you sure as hell should demand respect and control of the team from the onset of your tenure as coach. They are not friends! And they sure as hell shouldn't need to be treated with kid gloves either!

I for one, hope they get a harnosed coach who will not take **** from any player, but will also be a great motivator of men. Treat them with respect and dignity, but constantly let them be reminded that you call ALL of the shots on this team - and the owners should back it up! If any team member feels they should have a say in how things are run, they can be shown the door, that includes Sid! Damn, sounds like a bunch of ******** spoiled girls who are now mad that they can't have their slummer party!
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby superconan on Thu May 15, 2014 2:03 pm

DelPen wrote:Hockey is still a game and there has to be some degree of enjoyment, also known as fun. If it's not fun to go out on the ice and play then something is wrong. I would almost garuntee any comments were more inline with Bylsma sucking all the fun out of the game with his tedious meetings and pointless practices that yielded ineptness on the ice when executed.

I had a theory that they were either listening to him and doing exactly what he wanted or tuned him out completely. I'm getting a sense they did what he wanted, he showed tape and then scolded them for doing something stupid when in fact it's what they practiced.

That will grate anyone.


Meetings are toxic. Less is more.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby Bioshock on Thu May 15, 2014 2:07 pm

Kraftster wrote:
cheesesteakwithegg wrote:Anyone else hear what Rossi had to say on DVE this morning?

For those that missed it, he said that he has heard that something is going on with Sid personally that affected his play this post season. He said that he didn't have enough info to put it into print yet, but yeah...

Rob Rossi, folks.


What a disgrace. Wow do I hate him.



ARGH!!! I HATE HIM LIKE SO MUCH!!!
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby superconan on Thu May 15, 2014 2:25 pm

Crosby - "Winning's fun".
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby profpolisci on Thu May 15, 2014 2:32 pm

I was listening to Stan this afternoon. The ol'29er was a guest and he debunked Rossi's article in its entirety.
I like Rob's writing but in this instance it can be interpreted and manipulated a variety of ways, thus, it serves no useful purpose. The piece cannot be characterized as news and oddly (given the climate) it doesn't even make for good gossip.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby joey leo on Thu May 15, 2014 2:46 pm

all i know is, i have my pitchfork, i have my torch, could someone please point me in the direction of the angriest mob?
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby LAChrisPaul on Thu May 15, 2014 3:51 pm

Crosby the "coach killer"? Crosby is a coach maker. Bylsma has an incredibly good regular season record, due in large part to the quality of the team he inherited, led by the league's MVP. There's no coach in their right mind that would look at the Pens organization, the top end talent, and the recent success and not want to be the guy to get them their next cup. This is crazy.

Bylsma has to go, because he can't produce a team with a playoff identity. The Pens, since Talbot fought Carcillo, have been a team that is trying to "look" tough and seem though without actually being tough. There's no one in there who'll go take one for the team, not for real. Engelland is the closest and he's not even on the ice. Crosby gets abused and then spends most of his time trying to show he's the tough one and he won't take it.

Neal was the worst player on the ice for most of the playoffs. Did nothing offensively without Geno next to him. Stupid penalties over and over. There's something wrong with the team, but it's got more to do with the mental/emotional makeup than the actual roster, and most, if not all, of that has to fall on DB.

It's hard to say that the team didn't quit on him. That's just how they looked on the ice. Flower stood on his head most of the playoffs but the only other guys who looked like they cared were Malkin, Jokinen, Gibbons, and Stempniak at times. Everyone else was either slow, tired, or disinterested. Martin and Niskanen get a pass because they were so strong in the first round. Maata had too many mental errors. Goc, Adams, Glass, etc... were non factors. Kunitz and Crosby were alright. Letang got it going and looked much better but the results just weren't there. I don't know. It's all just so frustrating.

Was never really mad at Bylsma before because the team was winning and everyone seemed cohesive. That's gone. Blow it up.




RxBandit66 wrote:
bhaw wrote:If you're soft for 5 years then suddenly start criticizing people, it comes off wrong. If any of this is true, I'm sure it very much came off as desperation to save his own job and pass blame onto the players. If you have managed people at any point, there's nothing conflicting here. It would be the same if Therrien suddenly tried to come off as understanding and reserved. Players wouldn't buy it and see it as desperation.

slappy is right though... DB's inability to construct a game plan and make proper personnel choices is enough to get rid of him.


I think it's along these lines. Bylsma probably over corrected and ended up sending mixed messages. His handling of young players (and favoring over the age of 30 AHL guys) and Shero's mangled drafts are the most damning thing. Bylsma's strategiy was a weakness but they still should have won this series. And it gives NO excuse for the 2012 Flyers debacle. Many longtime fans have the bad taste of that still in their mouths.

If these comments are true, then Crosby is a weak captain. It makes it look like he didn't try this post season, which 100% would have cost his team a trip to the conference finals, maybe beyond.

If these comments are true, Crosby will be labeled as a coach killer, and it may impact the quality of coach (and players) that will want to come here.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby bdevido on Thu May 15, 2014 4:20 pm

"if these comments are true, then crosby is a weak captain."---you can't put it any better than that.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby Fire0nice228 on Thu May 15, 2014 4:51 pm

Image

woooooooooooof.........if they think they came out as if each game was a game 7 then **** me we are screwed
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby rgj on Thu May 15, 2014 5:42 pm

I'm not real sure exactly what thread to post this, so forgive me if I post it on two or three......

IF Bylsma is fired, it will be the SECOND coach fired in the career of SuperStars Crosby, Malkin, Fluery, and Letang.

I'm beginning to wonder that the Pens' problems may not be the coach......
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby DelPen on Thu May 15, 2014 5:46 pm

rgj wrote:I'm not real sure exactly what thread to post this, so forgive me if I post it on two or three......

IF Bylsma is fired, it will be the SECOND coach fired in the career of SuperStars Crosby, Malkin, Fluery, and Letang.

I'm beginning to wonder that the Pens' problems may not be the coach......


3rd for Crosby and Fleury (kind of), don't forget Edzo.

Therrien's act gets old fast. we shall see how long he stays employed this time in Montreal. Bylsma was never the right coach for this team but the talent of the players kept him employed.

People are making too much of this.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby bhaw on Thu May 15, 2014 5:50 pm

rgj wrote:I'm not real sure exactly what thread to post this, so forgive me if I post it on two or three......

IF Bylsma is fired, it will be the SECOND coach fired in the career of SuperStars Crosby, Malkin, Fluery, and Letang.

I'm beginning to wonder that the Pens' problems may not be the coach......


Outside of a few isolated examples like Ruff with Buffalo and Babcock with Detroit, wouldn't that mean all teams are in the same boat?
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby Crankshaft on Thu May 15, 2014 6:17 pm

rgj wrote:I'm not real sure exactly what thread to post this, so forgive me if I post it on two or three......

IF Bylsma is fired, it will be the SECOND coach fired in the career of SuperStars Crosby, Malkin, Fluery, and Letang.

I'm beginning to wonder that the Pens' problems may not be the coach......


Just because you keep saying this in each Bylsma thread, that doesn't make it any less wrong.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby DelPen on Thu May 15, 2014 7:51 pm

Thinking more about criticizing Sid at meetings. Remember the game where Sid put a pass into the slot where he thought Gibbons should have been but Gibbons was on the boards where the system dictates? Dupuis would have read the play and Crosby and would have probably been there. But Gibbons adheres to the system.

So say he rips into Crosby for that in front of the team. Sid then goes on to play to the system to prove a point. His play looked ordinary because Bylsma makes everyone average either better or worse.

No creativity. No talent. Just make the play even if it's not the best one.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby AlexPKeaton on Thu May 15, 2014 8:11 pm

DelPen wrote:Thinking more about criticizing Sid at meetings. Remember the game where Sid put a pass into the slot where he thought Gibbons should have been but Gibbons was on the boards where the system dictates? Dupuis would have read the play and Crosby and would have probably been there. But Gibbons adheres to the system.

So say he rips into Crosby for that in front of the team. Sid then goes on to play to the system to prove a point. His play looked ordinary because Bylsma makes everyone average either better or worse.

No creativity. No talent. Just make the play even if it's not the best one.


I was thinking along these lines as well. Initially I guess I bought into this Crosby is whiny stuff, but maybe he just is sick of playing in a broken system and mad that there is no flexibility or adjustments. I.e. maybe he is making the same points that this board has been making for the past 3 years.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby SolidSnake on Thu May 15, 2014 8:45 pm

Bylsma probably isn't getting fired.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby Desiato on Thu May 15, 2014 8:51 pm

Can you imagine what it was like to play on the hyper-disciplined, structured, well-oiled machine that was Team Canada and then return to Pensville? It must have been something of a rude awakening.

During Sid's first Olympics, the Pens were fresh from a validating cup win, so it may not have been as apparent to him then; especially as a younger player.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby penny lane on Thu May 15, 2014 9:20 pm

Desiato wrote:Can you imagine what it was like to play on the hyper-disciplined, structured, well-oiled machine that was Team Canada and then return to Pensville? It must have been something of a rude awakening.

During Sid's first Olympics, the Pens were fresh from a validating cup win, so it may not have been as apparent to him then; especially as a younger player.


I'm sure you are not saying that coaching would somehow stop the best player in the nhl from taking shots and making passes; 2 basic hockey skills.

Again, regular season coaching seems to agree with Sidney.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby shmenguin on Thu May 15, 2014 9:28 pm

I don't think Sid was intentionally doing anything to compromise his play. I think he either has something going on outside the rink, or he was frustrated by something with the team, and while he still tried, he wasn't fully engaged.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby Desiato on Thu May 15, 2014 10:34 pm

penny lane wrote:Again, regular season coaching seems to agree with Sidney.

That is indisputable. So too is the fact that Playoff and Olympic hockey also seem to agree with Sid. Hockey, in general, probably agrees with Sid a lot.

I think the biggest area of contention between Sid and hockey involves growing beards.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby TrueNorth on Fri May 16, 2014 12:19 am

penny lane wrote:
Desiato wrote:Can you imagine what it was like to play on the hyper-disciplined, structured, well-oiled machine that was Team Canada and then return to Pensville? It must have been something of a rude awakening.

During Sid's first Olympics, the Pens were fresh from a validating cup win, so it may not have been as apparent to him then; especially as a younger player.


I'm sure you are not saying that coaching would somehow stop the best player in the nhl from taking shots and making passes; 2 basic hockey skills.

Again, regular season coaching seems to agree with Sidney.


It seems that Sid really has fallen out of favour with you, penny--or maybe he never was in your good books and I just didn’t pick up on it. I don’t mean this in a challenging or snarky way, not at all, but do you believe that he really just quit on everybody and didn’t care that he was letting his team down? I get the sense that that is truly what you believe. I ask because I can think of other reasons why he might not have been making passes and taking shots and why his game, in general, was not up to par. What has you so convinced that he just quit on everyone and wasn't even trying, if in fact that is your belief?
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby seabiscuit on Fri May 16, 2014 5:27 am

I recall Therrien stating Sidney called him when he won the cup to thank him.
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Re: Oh. My. God. Bylsma was too hard on them?

Postby CERV96 on Fri May 16, 2014 7:47 am

Let me take a stab at something here. Compare the system to a burning pot on a stove. You touch it, you get burned but your Mom and Dad tell you to continue to touch it. What do you do?

What I am trying to get at is maybe Dan would not tweak the system to stop Sid from getting smothered by Dubinsky or Staal.

I could be totally off base but just a thought.
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