Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

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Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby headh on Thu May 15, 2014 1:29 pm

For better or worse the Penguins are loaded with young defense men who need and deserve ice time

The Penguins are far too close to the top of the salary cap

The penguins desperately need real live goal scoring and/or physical wings to play with 87 and 71

Guys like Dupuis, Gibbons, Jussi and Kunitz should all be making our bottom 6 legitimate instead of a liability

There is no question that Letang has talent but the combination of his cap hit, health issues, bone head plays and scatter-shot productivity make him a logical choice to trade. Some other team will look at him and gamble on his elite talent level and be willing to trade legitimate Wing prospects and proven producer in order to obtain a legitimate top 2 Dman talent. It's not painless but it's a singular move that will go a long way to solving issues.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby DelPen on Thu May 15, 2014 1:30 pm

He has the ability and has shown he can play like a $7 million defenseman. The gample will be if a new coahc can get that out of him on a nightly basis. Subban has really settled down under Therrien.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby lemieuxReturns on Thu May 15, 2014 1:33 pm

DelPen wrote:He has the ability and has shown he can play like a $7 million defenseman. The gample will be if a new coahc can get that out of him on a nightly basis. Subban has really settled down under Therrien.


Subban is going to get a very very large contract.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby headh on Thu May 15, 2014 1:37 pm

DelPen wrote:He has the ability and has shown he can play like a $7 million defenseman. The gample will be if a new coahc can get that out of him on a nightly basis. Subban has really settled down under Therrien.


He is without a doubt a "word class" talent. Part of the issue is that the Penguins do need a disciplinarian like Therrien but the players apparently aren't willing to accept that in a coach. I say apparently because of stories alleging that Therrien was tuned out and now Bylsma is being tuned out due to taking too heavy handed of an approach. If there's a solution to that dilemma I think it involves removing players who aren't self disciplined.

Do you feel Letang falls in the category of "self disciplined"? I clearly do not.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby stonyman on Thu May 15, 2014 1:40 pm

headh wrote:For better or worse the Penguins are loaded with young defense men who need and deserve ice time

The Penguins are far too close to the top of the salary cap

The penguins desperately need real live goal scoring and/or physical wings to play with 87 and 71

Guys like Dupuis, Gibbons, Jussi and Kunitz should all be making our bottom 6 legitimate instead of a liability

There is no question that Letang has talent but the combination of his cap hit, health issues, bone head plays and scatter-shot productivity make him nigh un-tradable. Some other team will look at him and gamble on his elite talent level and be willing to trade legitimate Wing prospects and proven producer in order to obtain a legitimate top 2 Dman talent. It's not painless but it's a singular move that will go a long way to solving issues.


FIFY.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby headh on Thu May 15, 2014 1:44 pm

stonyman wrote:
headh wrote:For better or worse the Penguins are loaded with young defense men who need and deserve ice time

The Penguins are far too close to the top of the salary cap

The penguins desperately need real live goal scoring and/or physical wings to play with 87 and 71

Guys like Dupuis, Gibbons, Jussi and Kunitz should all be making our bottom 6 legitimate instead of a liability

There is no question that Letang has talent but the combination of his cap hit, health issues, bone head plays and scatter-shot productivity make him nigh untradable. Some other team will look at him and gamble on his elite talent level and be willing to trade legitimate Wing prospects and proven producer in order to obtain a legitimate top 2 Dman talent. It's not painless but it's a singular move that will go a long way to solving issues.


FIFY.



Nearly can't be traded is significantly different than can't be traded. There are teams out there who will covet #58 imo. I certainly would prove it one way or the other.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby Antonio on Thu May 15, 2014 3:08 pm

trading him is not impossible, but the real window to do so I believe was last year before signing him to that contract.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby thehockeyguru on Thu May 15, 2014 3:10 pm

DelPen wrote:He has the ability and has shown he can play like a $7 million defenseman. The gample will be if a new coahc can get that out of him on a nightly basis. Subban has really settled down under Therrien.


He doesnt have the offensive upside of a Shea Weber or Duncan Keith ie: QB PP. He cant shoot from the point and there is no way he is worth $7M.

If there was a taker, I would give him away.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Thu May 15, 2014 3:13 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:
DelPen wrote:He has the ability and has shown he can play like a $7 million defenseman. The gample will be if a new coahc can get that out of him on a nightly basis. Subban has really settled down under Therrien.


He doesnt have the offensive upside of a Shea Weber or Duncan Keith ie: QB PP. He cant shoot from the point and there is no way he is worth $7M.

If there was a taker, I would give him away.


While I don't agree with the first part of your statement, I'm fully with you in your closing remarks.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby Penspal on Thu May 15, 2014 3:18 pm

FWIW - This season, Letang did not return to the form he showed for the better part of last year. However, upon his playoff return, he did show improvement over how he was playing this year. Waaaaay more restraint and signs of improvement in decision making. Still far from a 7M, more like a 4.5M
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby AlexPKeaton on Thu May 15, 2014 3:18 pm

Yeah Letang is not worth the contract at all. Not without the ability to QB a PP. He isn't an elite offensive talent on D, and he is not an elite defensive talent. He is just extremely athletic. But another part of me thinks that maybe he could develop some more under a different coach. FHCMT did wonders for him and other young defensemen, and so has Trotz in the past. In other words, I wouldn't give him away, just entertain offers.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby stopper40 on Thu May 15, 2014 3:22 pm

AlexPKeaton wrote:Yeah Letang is not worth the contract at all. Not without the ability to QB a PP. He isn't an elite offensive talent on D, and he is not an elite defensive talent. He is just extremely athletic. But another part of me thinks that maybe he could develop some more under a different coach. FHCMT did wonders for him and other young defensemen, and so has Trotz in the past. In other words, I wouldn't give him away, just entertain offers.



But on the odd chance that they brought Trotz in, would you give him a chance to develop under Trotz?
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby pressure=9Pa on Thu May 15, 2014 3:28 pm

He can also eat a lot of minutes and hold up fairly well. If a coach or system were able to reign him in consistently, he would be a solid 2nd pairing guy for someone. The problem is that for at least the first few years of the contract, he's being paid as an elite d-man.

I could see a team wanting him if they were building for 2016-19, and were thinking the cap would go high enough fast enough to put that contract at a reasonable level.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby thehockeyguru on Thu May 15, 2014 3:48 pm

With regards to a Letang deal there is no doubt that the value to the Pens is:

Cap Space > Return
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby columbia on Thu May 15, 2014 3:52 pm

I was in favor of trading him at the draft, but feel that it is best to keep him now.
(And that's setting aside the decreased haul that they would get for him, because of the stroke.)

The Penguins have been such a complete undisciplined mess; let's see if a new regime to coach him up to use his talent.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby DropEmJayBird on Thu May 15, 2014 3:54 pm

He was paid because Bylsma's system puts a huge huge value on defense that can move the puck. It's a necessity - hence we overpay for that, and draft the hell out of it.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby DesertPenguin on Thu May 15, 2014 3:55 pm

I think the theory with Letang was that you could pair him with a stay at home, responsible defender, and it would serve to balance out his risk taking an questionable decision making. Letang and Scuderi though were like oil and water. Maybe thats as much on Scuderi ad Letang, but it didn't work. Letang did look better with Martin, though Martin was clearly the better all around player. Scuderi though, he just doesn't fit a full Bylsma system. It relies too much on smooth skating, puck moving D men.

I don't think you can fix the Pens in one year. I'd like to wait for a new coach to come in, implement a system. The more I think about it, the more I want Trotz coaching this team. He has quite a bit of experience working with and molding elite defensemen, and guess what? We've got a ton of those both on the roster and in the pipeline. It would be like Nashville, if Nashville also had elite scorers and the financial backing to round out the team past the blueline. He could get the right stuff out of Letang, mold Maatta and Pouliot, repair Despres, and have us a truely wicked defense core.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby DayWalker on Thu May 15, 2014 3:57 pm

I worry the Penguins will not get anything approaching Letang's actual or prospective value if they deal him this summer, and he is way too valuable of an asset to essentially "dump" for salary-related reasons. I can think of three forwards in the top six I would attempt to move first.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby DayWalker on Thu May 15, 2014 3:59 pm

Letang is maddening at times, but his skill set is off the charts. There is no player in the system or likely available for trade capable of matching what Letang could bring if he is healthy and focused.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby DayWalker on Thu May 15, 2014 4:01 pm

I worry the Penguins will not get anything approaching Letang's actual or prospective value if they deal him this summer, and he is way too valuable of an asset to essentially "dump" for salary-related reasons. I can think of three forwards in the top six I would attempt to move first.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby thehockeyguru on Thu May 15, 2014 4:02 pm

DayWalker wrote:Letang is maddening at times, but his skill set is off the charts. There is no player in the system or likely available for trade capable of matching what Letang could bring if he is healthy and focused.


I cant recall a top of the line offensive defenseman who misses the net with as much regularity as Letang.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby Firebird on Thu May 15, 2014 4:10 pm

Trade Letang at his lowest stock level? Makes sense....
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby Rocco on Thu May 15, 2014 4:14 pm

Firebird wrote:Trade Letang at his lowest stock level? Makes sense....


No, you see, someone will give up a ton for Letang despite the fact that everyone thinks he sucks. Or something. I think underpants gnomes are involved.
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby Pens4Life on Thu May 15, 2014 4:53 pm

Im for keeping Kris for one more season and let him play with new coach,new system and with Martin the whole time.
Besides that his stocks arent that high right now,so in return we might not get what we would like.
I say pack Scuds and re-sign Niskanen for start on D and lets go from there.. Orpik?!? hm.. really dont know what do to with him.. maybe keep him on low contract.

Martin - Letang
Maata - Niskanen
Bortuzzo - Despres
x - AHLer from this season (Harrington, Dumoulin..)
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Re: Letang's trade solves a lot of problems

Postby AlexPKeaton on Thu May 15, 2014 4:57 pm

stopper40 wrote:
AlexPKeaton wrote:Yeah Letang is not worth the contract at all. Not without the ability to QB a PP. He isn't an elite offensive talent on D, and he is not an elite defensive talent. He is just extremely athletic. But another part of me thinks that maybe he could develop some more under a different coach. FHCMT did wonders for him and other young defensemen, and so has Trotz in the past. In other words, I wouldn't give him away, just entertain offers.



But on the odd chance that they brought Trotz in, would you give him a chance to develop under Trotz?


Well yeah, I think Trotz could turn him and our other young defensemen into very good players. So unless the return was very good on some theoretical trade I'd keep him and see what Trotz could do.
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