Sid v. Geno

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If you were starting a team, which would you prefer to have?

Crosby
32
44%
Malkin
40
56%
 
Total votes : 72

Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby blurryhaze312 on Fri May 16, 2014 5:04 pm

bdevido wrote:i've always liked malkin, but he really won me over this year big time. he should have the C, demote crosby to A and make him earn it back.


This crap really needs to stop. It's a sure-fire way to really screw stuff up even more than it is now. If you are stripping your captain of his title, you better dang well be shipping him out of town.

Yikes.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby shmenguin on Fri May 16, 2014 5:06 pm

pfim wrote:Their playoff careers have been fairly similar and there are certainly years where Malkin didn't step up and Crosby did (2007, 2010). Anyone who can discern a difference between the two at the moment is being fairly myopic.


Says the guy looking at limited high level data and not actual context.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby skullman80 on Fri May 16, 2014 5:09 pm

Stripping Crosby of the "C" is silly.

I don't know why you have to be one camp or the other. Like if you like Sid you have to hate Malkin or vice versa. It really seems that way with alot of people. I'd love to keep both, and I hope this team doesn't ever have to make the decision to dump one or the other.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby shmenguin on Fri May 16, 2014 5:45 pm

Yeah I don't even like my involvement in this thread. They're both great. I can leave it at that.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Willie Kool on Fri May 16, 2014 6:04 pm

MRandall25 wrote:No, but saying it:s because of Sid's playoffs this year doesn't do anyone any favors.

And Sid's entitled, whiny little ***** attitude doesn't do him any favors.

I voted for Malkin. IMO, he is by far the greatest natural talent in the league. Defensively, it's not even close. He has the ability to absolutely take over a game like no one I've seen since Lemieux.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby MRandall25 on Fri May 16, 2014 6:07 pm

Willie Kool wrote:
MRandall25 wrote:No, but saying it:s because of Sid's playoffs this year doesn't do anyone any favors.

And Sid's entitled, whiny little ***** attitude doesn't do him any favors.


And largely (before the past 13 games suddenly reversed opinions), the knock on Malkin was that he only showed up when he wanted to.

Point is, we've never really gotten the best of Malkin and Crosby at the same time.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Willie Kool on Fri May 16, 2014 6:08 pm

Geno has always been at his best when Sid is out. Coincidence?
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby MRandall25 on Fri May 16, 2014 6:12 pm

Probably.

Why can't Geno play well when Sid is in? It's not like they play on the same line. It's not like one of them is holding the other back.

And to further my other point, it wasn't just that Malkin only showed up when he wanted to, but looked completely disinterested when things weren't going his way (some would call this "floating").

As it's been touched on, why does it have to be one or the other?
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby TrueNorth on Fri May 16, 2014 6:15 pm

shmenguin wrote:Yeah I don't even like my involvement in this thread. They're both great. I can leave it at that.


:thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Willie Kool on Fri May 16, 2014 6:31 pm

MRandall25 wrote:Why can't Geno play well when Sid is in? It's not like one of them is holding the other back.


Maybe not physically, but can you really say that his deference to Sid doesn't hold Malkin back? When Geno finally came over wasn't it made perfectly clear to him that this was 'Sid's Team'? Sid even lived with Mario, for God's sake. I can't help but wonder if it would be different now if Geno had been here right after he was drafted.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby MRandall25 on Fri May 16, 2014 6:33 pm

Why does Geno have to "defer" to Sid though? They play on separate lines. That shouldn't be an issue now, since they've played so long with each other.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Willie Kool on Fri May 16, 2014 6:37 pm

MRandall25 wrote:As it's been touched on, why does it have to be one or the other?

Only because that was the OP's question. It's just a message board discussion, and I am in no way advocating we actually trade Sid.

Oh, and also:

MalkinIsMyHomeboy wrote:and keep in mind that we will be trading the loser of this poll for all four Staals
Last edited by Willie Kool on Fri May 16, 2014 6:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Willie Kool on Fri May 16, 2014 6:56 pm

MRandall25 wrote:Why does Geno have to "defer" to Sid though? They play on separate lines. That shouldn't be an issue now, since they've played so long with each other.

I'm not saying it's a conscious decision...
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Desiato on Fri May 16, 2014 8:18 pm

What make Sid and Geno such an awesome 1-2 punch is that they're so unlike as hockey players. An opponent can be suited to stop one while being ill-equipped to deal with the other. It makes them very hard to compare.

During the cup run, each came through when needed at different times. Sid destroyed the Caps. Geno broke through better against the Wings.

I think Geno still has another step to take defensively. He should watch some tapes of the Pens 90s cup runs to see how Mario used his large frame and similar traits to dominate defensively. If he would play defense like that and win faceoffs, he'd be the best player in the league.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby bh on Sat May 17, 2014 12:29 am

I'd take Geno hands down and I'd have said this since day 1 that both were on the team. Malkin is my favorite player on the team. IDK, I've always liked his attitude, his sense of humor, and his breathtaking play at times. I understand why people always call Sid the best player in the league, but I've never really bought into that type of nonsense. There are a lot of really really talented players in the league and Sid is in the cream of the crop... but so is Malkin. I love having both on the team, but if I HAD to choose it would be easy for me.

Also, IF Geno is traded... I will have a second favorite team to follow.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Kovy27 on Sat May 17, 2014 9:10 am

Matthew Monstar wrote:Who won the Conn Smythe in the 2009 cup run?
GENO is my boy.


To be honest, Crosby/Malkin/Staal could have won that Conn Smythe.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Kovy27 on Sat May 17, 2014 9:12 am

pfim wrote:
Kovy27 wrote:
Three Stars wrote:
Kovy27 wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if this team trades Malkin in the off-season. Just throwing that out there.


There's something to be said for rebuilding the team entirely in Crosby's image. Well, the image prior to the playoffs.


What if you used Malkin to get a stud defenseman (like Shea Weber). Then you have a Superstar Forward, Superstar D, and I think Fleury would be fine with a better D around him.


Not sure where goals come from then. And you still have a lot of variability on how Letang plays in relation to that contract.


I'd move Letang, as well. You have to get "heavy". Look at the Kings, look at the Blues...that's how I'd want to be built up front. Players like James "Don't use my Body" Neal and Craig Adams don't fit that bill. I'm all for trading a few of these players out of town to get bigger, grittier, and stronger.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby owtahear on Sat May 17, 2014 10:34 am

I don't want to make this choice. But I thought Joe Starkey made a great point yesterday. Crosby in many circles in the hockey world is getting bashed for his performance. But mostly in Pittsburgh, the criticism relatively tame. And the Crosby sycophants in the media led by Mark Madden are blaming Bylsma and not protecting Sid.

But....if Sid was the second leading scorer in the playoffs, and Geno was the guy with 1 goal, 9 points and a minus rating, MM and many others would be on Malkin mercilessly. I can imagine the calls to MM:

Caller: MM, you are hard on Malkin but it is obvious he is injured, or he is not getting help from his linemates, especially Neal.
MM: I don't care. You pay Geno to score and importantly score goals. Nothing else matters. He is not.
Caller: But Malkin is getting cross checked in the head and held and grabbed.
MM: I have a 166 IQ, I know hockey! Malkin has to work through that. He is paid to score. Period.
Caller: CORSI statistics suggest that Malkin is not playing as bad as you say, the Pens have good puck possession when Malkin's on the ice.
MM: You moron. Malkin is paid to score. Who cares about puck possession. They don't score the games by puck possession. Score. Period.
Caller: MM Malkin has 1 shot on goal on the PP. He needs to be put in better position to shoot the puck.
MM: Look idiot, I have a 166 IQ, and I know hockey. It is not Dan Bylsma's job to tell the players to shoot. You get paid the money, you better know when to shoot the puck!


I can imagine the dialogue being a lot long those lines.......but you can substitute Sid for Geno up there, and Malkin deflects all blame from Sid. That kind of hypocrisy is what neutralizes a 166 point IQ and reeks of siding who is more friendly to the media.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Antonio on Sat May 17, 2014 11:32 am

166 iq?
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Willie Kool on Sat May 17, 2014 11:46 am

Antonio wrote:166 iq?

Mark Madden ​- Super Genius

:roll:
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Big Easy Pens Fan on Sat May 17, 2014 11:53 am

I voted for Crosby because I feel that Geno would definiely be uncomfortable with the "C". To me he is just as fine with the "A" because I believe he likes flying under the radar, if that is even possible. He can lead with his actions to the rest of the team but he for the most part wants out of the limelight.

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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Chirpin' Grinder on Sat May 17, 2014 12:17 pm

owtahear wrote:I don't want to make this choice. But I thought Joe Starkey made a great point yesterday. Crosby in many circles in the hockey world is getting bashed for his performance. But mostly in Pittsburgh, the criticism relatively tame. And the Crosby sycophants in the media led by Mark Madden are blaming Bylsma and not protecting Sid.

But....if Sid was the second leading scorer in the playoffs, and Geno was the guy with 1 goal, 9 points and a minus rating, MM and many others would be on Malkin mercilessly. I can imagine the calls to MM:

Caller: MM, you are hard on Malkin but it is obvious he is injured, or he is not getting help from his linemates, especially Neal.
MM: I don't care. You pay Geno to score and importantly score goals. Nothing else matters. He is not.
Caller: But Malkin is getting cross checked in the head and held and grabbed.
MM: I have a 166 IQ, I know hockey! Malkin has to work through that. He is paid to score. Period.
Caller: CORSI statistics suggest that Malkin is not playing as bad as you say, the Pens have good puck possession when Malkin's on the ice.
MM: You moron. Malkin is paid to score. Who cares about puck possession. They don't score the games by puck possession. Score. Period.
Caller: MM Malkin has 1 shot on goal on the PP. He needs to be put in better position to shoot the puck.
MM: Look idiot, I have a 166 IQ, and I know hockey. It is not Dan Bylsma's job to tell the players to shoot. You get paid the money, you better know when to shoot the puck!


I can imagine the dialogue being a lot long those lines.......but you can substitute Sid for Geno up there, and Malkin deflects all blame from Sid. That kind of hypocrisy is what neutralizes a 166 point IQ and reeks of siding who is more friendly to the media.


:thumb:

The double standard is outrageous.

If the behavior and performance in this year's playoffs were reversed, #71 may not have made it out of Pittsburgh alive. The media would unanimously be calling for him to be traded. Many were after the Boston sweep.

Sid quit on the team in the Rangers series. He didn't want the puck. He didn't want to win. He wanted it to end. Re-watch game 7 if you don't believe me.

Malkin was fighting and battling and giving it his all until the final whistle.

If Sid is doing his leading by example, he either needs to look in the mirror and make a drastic change or the Pens need to deal him.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby TrueNorth on Sat May 17, 2014 12:50 pm

Big Easy Pens Fan wrote:I voted for Crosby because I feel that Geno would definiely be uncomfortable with the "C". To me he is just as fine with the "A" because I believe he likes flying under the radar, if that is even possible. He can lead with his actions to the rest of the team but he for the most part wants out of the limelight.

BEPF


I think many would argue that Geno provides the passion for this team, and I don’t disagree. He plays from the heart and that is what makes him such an extraordinary player--along with his exceptional talent, of course--and such an inspiration to his teammates. But you are absolutely right when you say he is happy wearing the “A” and has no desire to be team captain. He has, in fact, made that very clear on more than one occasion. The fact that he wears an “A” instead of the “C” doesn’t make him any less of a leader.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby MalkinIsMyHomeboy on Sat May 17, 2014 1:34 pm

Desiato wrote:I think Geno still has another step to take defensively. He should watch some tapes of the Pens 90s cup runs to see how Mario used his large frame and similar traits to dominate defensively. If he would play defense like that and win faceoffs, he'd be the best player in the league.


When Geno is "in the zone" (like the second half of the CBJ series and the entire Rags series) his defense is superb. He can strip the puck of anyone.

He's really gotta work on faceoffs though.
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Re: Sid v. Geno

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Sat May 17, 2014 1:50 pm

Sid is Mr. Regular Season
Malkin may disappear in the regular season at times, he's shown up more times in the playoffs when it counts than Sid.

Malkin has a much greater ability to take over a game than Sid.
Malkin is more versicle and has a better ability to play with different players.
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