Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbons

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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Jesse on Tue May 27, 2014 12:06 pm

Take the Body Shoot the Puck wrote:
Jesse wrote:
Stevo wrote:
I Agree with both of yinz. The thing with Megna is, is that he has NHL Wheels and that is something you can't really teach. Is he going to be Chris Kunitz? Probably not. But he is the one bright spot in an lack luster pack of forward prospects and is the type of player the big is going to need forward with. You know the "hard worker" Type.


Forwards in our system I like:

Megna (hard work always wins) - Archibald (oozing with talent, but problematic size) - Bleuger (Complete wildcard)


Jesse, I haven't ever seen Archibald play or know anything about him that I haven't read here or seen on HockeysFuture.com (plug for Mikey...). What are your more complete thoughts on him and what is your prediction for how he pans out/what role he could play for the Pens?


He's never really been hampered by size, although it's something you probably have to mention. WB/S has his most up-to-date numbers at 5'10 - 170lbs - which is probably accurate. You learn a lot about the kid knowing that he stepped into a heated seven game AHL playoff battle, scored in his first game, and didn't look out of place at all.

His shot is way above-average for his age. He's very creative offensively. I wouldn't say equal parts playmaker and scorer, he's a scorer first but his vision makes him capable of distributing the puck at a high level. He doesn't quit, he's extremely fast and agile, and he works like he's 6'3 in the boards.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Take the Body Shoot the Puck on Tue May 27, 2014 12:21 pm

Thanks Jesse. Would a more complete, yet smaller TK be a good future for him on the 3rd line?
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby mikey287 on Tue May 27, 2014 1:07 pm

I've seen Sundqvist. He doesn't look like a top-sixer to me, in short.

Archibald has better hockey sense, vision, passing ability, than TK. Better on his edges too, I believe.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby meecrofilm on Tue May 27, 2014 1:34 pm

Speaking of Sundqvist, the Pens have until June 1st to sign him, or else he goes back into the draft.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Tue May 27, 2014 1:40 pm

Jesse wrote:I watched him play as 21 year old in the USHL where he put up inflated point totals because he was older than the majority of the players in the lineup. So I "know" a few things about him. That's a hard lesson I had to learn from watching Casey Pierro-Zabotel assault the WHL as an overage player.

Considering I've spent the last eight years paying pretty close attention to the junior hockey scene in order to come out with a yearly draft ranking I can be proud of, I'm fairly certain I can say that I'm aware of how player development works and how difficult it can be to get into the lineup at a young age. So your broad brush painting of how I view depth is laughable at best.

I know for a fact that Megna's deficiencies defensively are on video and are the reason the Penguins haven't given him an extended look in the lineup. There's a pedigree discussion to be had here that seems to be lost in the declaration of my lack of understanding. Pedigree is something that isn't developed at the NHL level. If it were, high-risk players like Landon Ferraro would be all over the NHL by now. If pedigree and skill set weren't important there would be no need for a yearly draft ranking. You think there's no difference between a guy like Ben Hanowski and a guy like Connor McDavid? That's not to say that guys can't magically turn around and become something great. Examples have already been provided in this thread. That also doesn't mean it happens with regularity.

He's gotten better in some extremely key areas, which has been acknowledged by Bill Guerin.

I'll say it again since you completely missed by point: this team has drafted poorly and has no legitimate forward depth in the system.

I've already said, in this very thread, that Megna is a hard worker and that's his best asset. Could he fill in for the bottom six? Yes. Is he going to suddenly explode offensively and take the world by storm? Probably not. Is he a dime a dozen guy? Yes. Does having him in the system suddenly make the Penguins ignoring an extremely important need okay? No.

I wouldn't complain for one second if our fourth line put up an aggregate of 15 points per season as long as they were able to keep the puck out of the defensive zone, change up momentum in-game, and draw a few penalties.


I honestly don't care how long you've watched him in Junior or how closely you pay attention to the Junior hockey. I'm watching what he's doing NOW. Megna has his shortcomings, yes, but to think he can't get better is silly. He's done more in a short period of time than other players in his role on very deep teams. I don't care if he's a dime a dozen. If you can get 20 to 25 points out of a 4th line player I'm in! You can balance out a line like that with better defensive players.

His defensive shortcomings aren't THAT bad. They can be improved upon. If he's a dime a dozen, then I'd rather spend the lowest amount possible on a player like Megna than the money teams like LA spend on their 4th line players and distribute that little extra elsewhere.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby DelPen on Tue May 27, 2014 2:19 pm

It will always cost more to bring in UFA's for depth than develop and promote from within. I don't think Megna and Gibbons are bad NHL players but the reality is to get someone better we would need to trade defensive depth, which is going to need to happen a some point, or you need to sign some via UFA but that gets more expensive and I have questions on the talent and/or attitude of a 24-25 year old who is a UFA that young. That means they either weren't tendered or didn't have enough NHL games to be an RFA.

Shero always seemed to draft guys who are solid AHL 2nd liners but can't elevate their game in the NHL but also aren't good at being depth grinders because they have no size or grit.

Veilleux, Caputi, Kühnhackl and Uher might be the only guys that fit a bottom 6 mold, the first two busted, the last two who knows.

Not sure how well Agostina and Hanowski will pan out but trading them away decimated our forward prospect depth.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby owtahear on Wed May 28, 2014 7:57 am

meecrofilm wrote:Speaking of Sundqvist, the Pens have until June 1st to sign him, or else he goes back into the draft.



Jake Muzzin anyone?
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Crankshaft on Wed May 28, 2014 9:39 am

owtahear wrote:
meecrofilm wrote:Speaking of Sundqvist, the Pens have until June 1st to sign him, or else he goes back into the draft.



Jake Muzzin anyone?


lol
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby sil on Wed May 28, 2014 9:44 am

I ain't gonna lie...I DO want us to sign Sundqvist.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby columbia on Wed May 28, 2014 9:46 am

sil wrote:I ain't gonna lie...I DO want us to sign Sundqvist.


Too many good forwards in the system to think about signing him.






















:pop:
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby slappybrown on Wed May 28, 2014 9:50 am

mikey287 wrote:I've seen Sundqvist. He doesn't look like a top-sixer to me, in short.

Archibald has better hockey sense, vision, passing ability, than TK. Better on his edges too, I believe.

I've never seen Sundqvist play, but the stuff I've read on him indicates a defensively responsible 2nd/3rd line guy with snarl, who had a good showing at age 19 playing with men in the SHL. His PIMs were also down. Seems like the kind of guy we could use, even if he's probably 2 years away from having a real shot at playing in NHL.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby columbia on Wed May 28, 2014 9:51 am

We could have used a few players with that profile this year....if you can develop them internally, why not.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Mad City Mike on Wed May 28, 2014 10:45 am

Hugo Stiglitz wrote:If you can get 20 to 25 points out of a 4th line player I'm in! You can balance out a line like that with better defensive players.



I am up in the air on Megna. From what I saw this year, he has some offensive talent and a bit of speed. If he's going to play in the NHL as a fourth-liner, he's going to have to become a lot more responsible defensively and probably learn to kill penalties. You cannot have defensively deficient guys on the fourth line. And that leads to my second point.

No way in hell will he put up 20-25 points as a fourth-liner. Almost no fourth-liners score that much. His point total this year was inflated because he played a lot on Geno's line. He's not a guy who can create for himself, so I'd be shocked if he even notched 15 on the fourth line. That's still better than slugs like Adams and Vitale who bring absolutely zero to the table offensively. So if he shows he can be responsible defensively in WBS, then fine bring him up and let him replace one of those guys. But he has yet to do that.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Mad City Mike on Wed May 28, 2014 10:47 am

owtahear wrote:
meecrofilm wrote:Speaking of Sundqvist, the Pens have until June 1st to sign him, or else he goes back into the draft.



Jake Muzzin anyone?


Matt Moulson, anyone?

Chad Johnson, anyone?
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby pens_CT on Wed May 28, 2014 12:31 pm

meecrofilm wrote:Speaking of Sundqvist, the Pens have until June 1st to sign him, or else he goes back into the draft.

Does that apply to europeans who are currently signed to professional contracts in euope?
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby mikey287 on Wed May 28, 2014 12:51 pm

Didn't we trade Chad Johnson because he didn't want to sign with us...?

Re: the most recent question. Effectively, yes.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby meecrofilm on Wed May 28, 2014 1:07 pm

slappybrown wrote:
mikey287 wrote:I've seen Sundqvist. He doesn't look like a top-sixer to me, in short.

Archibald has better hockey sense, vision, passing ability, than TK. Better on his edges too, I believe.

I've never seen Sundqvist play, but the stuff I've read on him indicates a defensively responsible 2nd/3rd line guy with snarl, who had a good showing at age 19 playing with men in the SHL. His PIMs were also down. Seems like the kind of guy we could use, even if he's probably 2 years away from having a real shot at playing in NHL.


Yeah, he had a real solid playoffs especially. If signed (and I see no reason why he wouldn't be), he'll spend another year in the SHL and then make the jump the season after.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby owtahear on Wed May 28, 2014 3:13 pm

sil wrote:I ain't gonna lie...I DO want us to sign Sundqvist.



Considering there was this thing called the "World Junior Championships" and he was our only forward who was deemed talented enough to participate for their country....I would say.....yeah, maybe not a bad idea.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Mad City Mike on Wed May 28, 2014 3:53 pm

mikey287 wrote:Didn't we trade Chad Johnson because he didn't want to sign with us...?

Re: the most recent question. Effectively, yes.


Ah, you're right about Johnson. But he is one they let get away. And they traded him for a pick that became the immortal Andy Bathgate. No, not THAT immortal Andy Bathgate.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Wed May 28, 2014 7:31 pm

Mad City Mike wrote:
Hugo Stiglitz wrote:If you can get 20 to 25 points out of a 4th line player I'm in! You can balance out a line like that with better defensive players.



I am up in the air on Megna. From what I saw this year, he has some offensive talent and a bit of speed. If he's going to play in the NHL as a fourth-liner, he's going to have to become a lot more responsible defensively and probably learn to kill penalties. You cannot have defensively deficient guys on the fourth line. And that leads to my second point.

No way in hell will he put up 20-25 points as a fourth-liner. Almost no fourth-liners score that much. His point total this year was inflated because he played a lot on Geno's line. He's not a guy who can create for himself, so I'd be shocked if he even notched 15 on the fourth line. That's still better than slugs like Adams and Vitale who bring absolutely zero to the table offensively. So if he shows he can be responsible defensively in WBS, then fine bring him up and let him replace one of those guys. But he has yet to do that.


Fair enough. I just feel he's done and shown enough to warrant a solid look and get a chance to improve defensively.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby GeoTank on Thu May 29, 2014 10:56 am

meecrofilm wrote:Speaking of Sundqvist, the Pens have until June 1st to sign him, or else he goes back into the draft.


I asked Molinari about Sundqvist and signing him or losing him and he said there would be a story about it in Friday's post-gazette
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Thu May 29, 2014 11:18 am

what about matia marcantouni
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Mad City Mike on Thu May 29, 2014 11:24 am

Hugo Stiglitz wrote:
Mad City Mike wrote:
Hugo Stiglitz wrote:If you can get 20 to 25 points out of a 4th line player I'm in! You can balance out a line like that with better defensive players.



I am up in the air on Megna. From what I saw this year, he has some offensive talent and a bit of speed. If he's going to play in the NHL as a fourth-liner, he's going to have to become a lot more responsible defensively and probably learn to kill penalties. You cannot have defensively deficient guys on the fourth line. And that leads to my second point.

No way in hell will he put up 20-25 points as a fourth-liner. Almost no fourth-liners score that much. His point total this year was inflated because he played a lot on Geno's line. He's not a guy who can create for himself, so I'd be shocked if he even notched 15 on the fourth line. That's still better than slugs like Adams and Vitale who bring absolutely zero to the table offensively. So if he shows he can be responsible defensively in WBS, then fine bring him up and let him replace one of those guys. But he has yet to do that.


Fair enough. I just feel he's done and shown enough to warrant a solid look and get a chance to improve defensively.


I think he's going to have to show that defensive improvement in the minors before they would give him that role in the bigs.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby Dickie Dunn on Thu May 29, 2014 11:34 am

Letang Is The Truth wrote:what about matia marcantouni


Signed last year.

http://penguins.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=687614

Also signed an ATO after his junior season and played one game with WBS.
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Re: Next Year's Youth Movement Zlobin, Megna, Sheary, Gibbon

Postby GeoTank on Thu May 29, 2014 11:42 am

GeoTank wrote:
meecrofilm wrote:Speaking of Sundqvist, the Pens have until June 1st to sign him, or else he goes back into the draft.


I asked Molinari about Sundqvist and signing him or losing him and he said there would be a story about it in Friday's post-gazette


LOL i originally asked Molinari and Yohe on twitter about Sundqvist and since Molinari responded i guess he played his hand to his rival news outlet so it forced him to post a portion of it now ahead of the full version of tomorrow..... his personal message didn't read happy


http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/peng ... 1405290251
Last edited by GeoTank on Thu May 29, 2014 11:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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