Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby pekkasteele on Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:56 am

How has Jake been as a 3c? For us that have not seen the games he has played there, ok? He have not shown up in the scoring ... but that is not all.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby FallenHero96 on Sat Jan 06, 2018 12:29 pm

Penguins just put Corrado on waivers.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby lemieuxReturns on Sat Jan 06, 2018 12:41 pm

FallenHero96 wrote:Penguins just put Corrado on waivers.


I guess Dumo is feeling better?
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby FLPensFan on Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:00 pm

lemieuxReturns wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:Another Yohe tidbit about the infamous Sid captaincy revolt. Someone had asked about Yohe's favorite Malkin moment:

It was 2011. Crosby was still out with the concussion and had been out for the better part of a year. There was a now infamous meeting in the Penguins' locker room. On one side stood Brooks Orpik, Jordan Staal, Craig Adams and Matt Cooke. Those four were exploring the possibility of naming someone else team captain until Crosby came back. On the other side of the debate were Marc-Andre Fleury, Malkin, Pascal Dupuis and Arron Asham. A rather heated discussion broke out. At the end, Malkin made his point clear: “Guys. Sid is the f****** captain.” Then he left the room. And the conversation was over.

I had heard of Cooke, Orpik, and Adams on the side of electing a new captain, but this is the first time I ever heard Staal in that group. Makes you wonder if there was any animosity between Sid and Jordan, because Staal was traded that summer.


Sid was one of the few at the wedding, so I am not sure if there was any. Either way, kind of d-bagy of Jordan.

I heard Sid said "Congratulations on your wedding. Answer you phone, *****!." :twisted: j/k
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby FLPensFan on Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:05 pm

NashvilleCat wrote:
lemieuxReturns wrote:Interest in Kane just doesn't make sense. We need a center.

A third center and maybe some more depth on defense and I'd like this team's chances to get to the playoffs and make some noise. That would hinge on our core stars playing like stars and solid net minding.

Defense is decent when healthy but how long does that ever last? A better 7 and 8 would be helpful and more consistently smart play would be nice. I thought Letang looked as good last night defensively as he has in a while and made fewer mistakes with the puck.

I wouldn't mortgage the future (i.e. give up the first or one of our top prospects) but some pieces to at least give these guys a shot at the playoffs would be okay. Let's see if I still think this after the Boston game Sunday.

The Penguins need an upgrade a LW as well. 3C is definitely the priority, but if Rutherford somehow has magic beans to trade for players, a better LW would be a high 2nd on the list, so I disagree that Kane isn't needed. He's got some speed and grit to his game. But, I think he is going to cost too much for a rental, unless Rutherford could resign him or had something else up his sleeve.

Hagelin needs to be pushed down to the 4th line or traded. And as much as I have been pushing for the Penguins to move him, someone pointed out something to me that makes sense: The Bruins couldn't find a taker for Matt Belesky and his 3.8M contract, waived him, and he cleared. Hagelin could very well be in that same category......someone nobody will trade for without including a major asset with him.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby NashvilleCat on Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:46 pm

FLPensFan wrote:
NashvilleCat wrote:
lemieuxReturns wrote:Interest in Kane just doesn't make sense. We need a center.

A third center and maybe some more depth on defense and I'd like this team's chances to get to the playoffs and make some noise. That would hinge on our core stars playing like stars and solid net minding.

Defense is decent when healthy but how long does that ever last? A better 7 and 8 would be helpful and more consistently smart play would be nice. I thought Letang looked as good last night defensively as he has in a while and made fewer mistakes with the puck.

I wouldn't mortgage the future (i.e. give up the first or one of our top prospects) but some pieces to at least give these guys a shot at the playoffs would be okay. Let's see if I still think this after the Boston game Sunday.

The Penguins need an upgrade a LW as well. 3C is definitely the priority, but if Rutherford somehow has magic beans to trade for players, a better LW would be a high 2nd on the list, so I disagree that Kane isn't needed. He's got some speed and grit to his game. But, I think he is going to cost too much for a rental, unless Rutherford could resign him or had something else up his sleeve.

Hagelin needs to be pushed down to the 4th line or traded. And as much as I have been pushing for the Penguins to move him, someone pointed out something to me that makes sense: The Bruins couldn't find a taker for Matt Belesky and his 3.8M contract, waived him, and he cleared. Hagelin could very well be in that same category......someone nobody will trade for without including a major asset with him.

I wouldn't disagree I just think that at some point you have to give up too much of the future to fix all of the holes and would caution against pushing all the chips in for a third Cup. Maybe if they were more consistent or higher up in the standings but not from what I've seen.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby thehockeyguru on Sat Jan 06, 2018 2:35 pm

The need to get a 3C is paramount

Simon - Crosby - Sprong
Guentzel - Malkin - Hornqvist
Sheary - 3C - Kessel
Hagelin - Sheahan - Rust / Reaves

Kuhnhackl

The Pens NEED to find a way to move Hagelin, I dont care what for. The fact that they haven't is crazy.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby Maestro on Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:39 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:The need to get a 3C is paramount

Simon - Crosby - Sprong
Guentzel - Malkin - Hornqvist
Sheary - 3C - Kessel
Hagelin - Sheahan - Rust / Reaves

Kuhnhackl

The Pens NEED to find a way to move Hagelin, I dont care what for. The fact that they haven't is crazy.



They may need him if Sheary is the current roster player (among other pieces) moved for a #3 center, at least until Rust gets healthy, which seems a ways off. Then like FLP said, it may be waiver time.
I like Guentzel playing with Kessel personally - regardless of if it is Malkin at center or the TBD superstar 2[B ]center coming our way :D

Brassard has lit it up recently, which is bad news I guess for the Pens. I am not that thrilled about Pageau... this search is becoming quite the snipe hunt.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby ville5 on Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:42 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:The need to get a 3C is paramount

Simon - Crosby - Sprong
Guentzel - Malkin - Hornqvist
Sheary - 3C - Kessel
Hagelin - Sheahan - Rust / Reaves

Kuhnhackl

The Pens NEED to find a way to move Hagelin, I dont care what for. The fact that they haven't is crazy.

Jake to 3C, Kane to 2LW. Rust can move up and down lineup as needed. Buffalo needs to take Hagelin though. :)
Last edited by ville5 on Sat Jan 06, 2018 4:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby Maestro on Sat Jan 06, 2018 4:01 pm

Jake isn't the answer at center. They need to add 1.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby Skatingpen on Sat Jan 06, 2018 4:17 pm

IMO, get younger, faster and retool with the core intact. No reason to make any drastic moves to try and sneak into the playoffs. This team gave us an amazing back to back championship, it is not happening this year so let’s retool and come back and get 3 in 4 years. It amazes me how quickly other teams copied the Pens and now have a younger faster version.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby FLPensFan on Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:00 pm

Maestro wrote:Jake isn't the answer at center. They need to add 1.

This. I think it was Jesse or netwolf I saw talking on Twitter about how many centers in juniors end up moving to wing because they aren't good enough to handle the center responsibilities at the higher levels. I think Guentzel falls into this category. It's not a bad thing. It's similar to William Nylander in Toronto. Some players just don't have the right attributes or mindset to play center at the NHL level
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby FLPensFan on Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:04 pm

Skatingpen wrote:IMO, get younger, faster and retool with the core intact. No reason to make any drastic moves to try and sneak into the playoffs. This team gave us an amazing back to back championship, it is not happening this year so let’s retool and come back and get 3 in 4 years. It amazes me how quickly other teams copied the Pens and now have a younger faster version.

Not winning the Cup is ok in my book. Not even making the playoffs with a largely identical team that just won the Cup......not really ok, for me, and I highly doubt ownership. Again, when you are a cap team that spends up to the cap each and every year, and you have the quality of players and the payroll the Penguins do, I don't think Lemieux/Burkle are going to just accept "f#$@ it, let's just miss the playoffs and retool." That's real shrinking profits or even dollars lost for the club.

Easy for us to say we are ok with it, but I don't think the business side of the Penguins would agree.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby Skatingpen on Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:13 pm

FLPensFan wrote:
Skatingpen wrote:IMO, get younger, faster and retool with the core intact. No reason to make any drastic moves to try and sneak into the playoffs. This team gave us an amazing back to back championship, it is not happening this year so let’s retool and come back and get 3 in 4 years. It amazes me how quickly other teams copied the Pens and now have a younger faster version.

Not winning the Cup is ok in my book. Not even making the playoffs with a largely identical team that just won the Cup......not really ok, for me, and I highly doubt ownership. Again, when you are a cap team that spends up to the cap each and every year, and you have the quality of players and the payroll the Penguins do, I don't think Lemieux/Burkle are going to just accept "f#$@ it, let's just miss the playoffs and retool." That's real shrinking profits or even dollars lost for the club.

Easy for us to say we are ok with it, but I don't think the business side of the Penguins would agree.


Yea you are probably right, I just don’t want them to mortgage the farm to get into the playoffs and probably lose. Just my opinion they are a far way off from competing this year and I hope squeaking in and then losing and being worse next year does not happen
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby FLPensFan on Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:17 pm

Skatingpen wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:
Skatingpen wrote:IMO, get younger, faster and retool with the core intact. No reason to make any drastic moves to try and sneak into the playoffs. This team gave us an amazing back to back championship, it is not happening this year so let’s retool and come back and get 3 in 4 years. It amazes me how quickly other teams copied the Pens and now have a younger faster version.

Not winning the Cup is ok in my book. Not even making the playoffs with a largely identical team that just won the Cup......not really ok, for me, and I highly doubt ownership. Again, when you are a cap team that spends up to the cap each and every year, and you have the quality of players and the payroll the Penguins do, I don't think Lemieux/Burkle are going to just accept "f#$@ it, let's just miss the playoffs and retool." That's real shrinking profits or even dollars lost for the club.

Easy for us to say we are ok with it, but I don't think the business side of the Penguins would agree.


Yea you are probably right, I just don’t want them to mortgage the farm to get into the playoffs and probably lose. Just my opinion they are a far way off from competing this year and I hope squealing in and then being worse next year does not happen

I don't disagree. I think most of us don't want to see our 1st or a player like Sprong or Jarry given up for a pure rental. If there is a creative way for Rutherford to get Kane, and if he knew he could resign him, I would be ok with that. That's why I think finding 1 team that has both a 3C and LW is the better play. Make one big deal for your needs.

What we need to see is a few winning streaks, and winning like 3 out of 4 games for the rest of the month. They can no longer do the 1 win, then look like a high school team the next game stuff. Friday was a building block we have seen before. Now we need to see if they learn from that, play a strong game against Boston, and get 2 wins in a row.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby Jim on Sat Jan 06, 2018 8:38 pm

Maybe a main reason that Rutherford hasn't made a bigger deal yet is because Hagelin would basically need to be included in any deal for cap purposes... and no one wants him...
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby Maestro on Sat Jan 06, 2018 9:32 pm

Sheary out is 3 mil
Cole for a pick is 2.1
Hags waived would save 1.25 mil it looks like (650k min +375k).
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby FLPensFan on Sat Jan 06, 2018 9:42 pm

Maestro wrote:Sheary out is 3 mil
Cole for a pick is 2.1
Hags waived would save 1.25 mil it looks like (650k min +375k).

1.025M if he was sent to the minors, according to CapFriendly ArmChair GM feature.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby Jim on Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:25 pm

Maestro wrote:Sheary out is 3 mil
Cole for a pick is 2.1
Hags waived would save 1.25 mil it looks like (650k min +375k).


You opened $6.125M, and 3 roster spots to fill.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby Maestro on Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:55 pm

If we assume this saga drags on into Feb, Rust replaces Sheary, Hunwick replaces Cole, and of course the new player tbd. Simon and Sprong stay.

That's 1 possible scenario.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby DelPen on Sun Jan 07, 2018 8:33 am

Jim wrote:
Maestro wrote:Sheary out is 3 mil
Cole for a pick is 2.1
Hags waived would save 1.25 mil it looks like (650k min +375k).


You opened $6.125M, and 3 roster spots to fill.


Oleksiak, Simon and Sprong can replace those three for just $2.35 million. Plenty of room to still bring in a 3C for a higher cost especially if they are pending UFA.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby suzinpgh on Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:08 am

Jags is on the way out in Calgary, per Sportsnet:

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/satu ... ting-ways/
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby Steve Dave on Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:19 am

Jim wrote:
Maestro wrote:Sheary out is 3 mil
Cole for a pick is 2.1
Hags waived would save 1.25 mil it looks like (650k min +375k).


You opened $6.125M, and 3 roster spots to fill.


Simon Crosby Sprong
Guentzel Malkin Kessel
Rust *Newbie Hornqvist
Kuhnhackl Sheahan Reaves
Rowney

Dumoulin Letang
Maatta Schultz
Hunwick Oleksiak
Ruhwedel

Murray
Jarry
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby lemieuxReturns on Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:01 am

Hagelin is not useless, its just that his salary hit sucks bad. If you were able to push him to the minors and he isn't claimed, maybe we could do like we did with Satan and bring him back IF we do make the playoffs.
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Re: Off-Season Discussion Thread 2017-2018

Postby ville5 on Sun Jan 07, 2018 12:43 pm

Junior Corrado clears.
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