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Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby itissteeltime on Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:38 am

At this point you gotta try to roll sheary-crosby-guentzel right?

Hags-malkin-horny
Rust-brassard-kessel
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby penny lane on Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:58 am

pronovost19 wrote:good to see sheary get a few

Especially with two injuries. The pens need scoring from their village.

Good game- Jarry got a victory in Philly, benchmark reached.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby Puck-Lurker on Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:26 am

Curious to see what staff is going to do. Looks like ZAR, Rust and Simon out for the time being.

That creates two holes. Obviously, we'll have to play Rowney. :slug:

But who's coming up?
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby lemieuxReturns on Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:37 am

Puck-Lurker wrote:Curious to see what staff is going to do. Looks like ZAR, Rust and Simon out for the time being.

That creates two holes. Obviously, we'll have to play Rowney. :slug:

But who's coming up?


Holding off purchasing the Charlotte Checkers tickets for next weeks game. Really want to see Sprong play down here. :)
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby Faubert5 on Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:11 am

itissteeltime wrote:At this point you gotta try to roll sheary-crosby-guentzel right?

Hags-malkin-horny
Rust-brassard-kessel


I would think so. We'll see if the kids are alright.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby Henry Hank on Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:17 am

I wouldn't count on a Sprong call-up. I don't think they're going to call him up to play fourth line.

They mostly had Sheahan playing on the third line with Brassard/Kessel. My guess is Blueger gets called up to center the fourth line. Maybe Jooris as well.

One thing to consider with Sprong is that sending him to the AHL isn't going to be an option next year because he'll have to go through waivers. Part of their decision making process may be to get him as much development time as they can now (while they can), if they're still not satisfied with his overall game.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby sil on Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:40 am

Interestingly, pens 3-0 against flyers this year. Jarry 3-0 against flyers this year.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby jwest21 on Thu Mar 08, 2018 12:27 pm

lemieuxReturns wrote:
Puck-Lurker wrote:Curious to see what staff is going to do. Looks like ZAR, Rust and Simon out for the time being.

That creates two holes. Obviously, we'll have to play Rowney. :slug:

But who's coming up?


Holding off purchasing the Charlotte Checkers tickets for next weeks game. Really want to see Sprong play down here. :)

Isn't Sprong in WBS?
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby FallenHero96 on Thu Mar 08, 2018 12:47 pm

Charlotte Checkers are an AHL team, you may be thinking of Charlottetown Islanders, which was Sprong's team in the QMJHL.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby longtimefan on Thu Mar 08, 2018 1:34 pm

Henry Hank wrote:I wouldn't count on a Sprong call-up. I don't think they're going to call him up to play fourth line.

They mostly had Sheahan playing on the third line with Brassard/Kessel. My guess is Blueger gets called up to center the fourth line. Maybe Jooris as well.

One thing to consider with Sprong is that sending him to the AHL isn't going to be an option next year because he'll have to go through waivers. Part of their decision making process may be to get him as much development time as they can now (while they can), if they're still not satisfied with his overall game.



Sprong also hasn't been tearing it up. He has 21 goals and 44 points in 46 games, and is a team worst -9. JR said they don't think he's ready because he needs to work on the other parts of his game. I agree he won't be up here again this season unless injuries necessitate it. I also agree that Sheahan is likely to move to left wing with Brassard and Kessel. I think Jooris is likely to get in the lineup over Blueger though. At this stage of the season, I'm not sure how much trust the coaches will put in a player making his NHL debut. I don't know a great deal about Jooris, but he has played in 31 NHL games this season. My guess is they'll go with Jooris on RW, with Rowney at C, and Kuhnhackl. It's not sexy, and they won't play much, but I think it will come down to trust, and Jooris does have 204 NHL games under his belt.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby Henry Hank on Thu Mar 08, 2018 1:38 pm

I could see that for sure. I'm just basing it on Bleuger got the call last time they needed another body from the AHL, so they probably think he's ready for a look. That was before Jooris was acquired, of course. I think they'd probably like to see both of them get some NHL action, if I had to guess, because they may be needed for the playoffs, and definitely better for them to debut now than in the middle of a playoff series.

I'm actually curious to see how Rowney would look if he got plugged in now, too. He's the kind of the guy who's going to be at his best when he's playing for a spot in the lineup. A guy like that really never should feel comfortable with his place. I bet we'll see an inspired Rowney when he does get the call again.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby Hot Dog Vendor on Thu Mar 08, 2018 1:47 pm

longtimefan wrote:
Henry Hank wrote:I wouldn't count on a Sprong call-up. I don't think they're going to call him up to play fourth line.

They mostly had Sheahan playing on the third line with Brassard/Kessel. My guess is Blueger gets called up to center the fourth line. Maybe Jooris as well.

One thing to consider with Sprong is that sending him to the AHL isn't going to be an option next year because he'll have to go through waivers. Part of their decision making process may be to get him as much development time as they can now (while they can), if they're still not satisfied with his overall game.



Sprong also hasn't been tearing it up. He has 21 goals and 44 points in 46 games, and is a team worst -9. JR said they don't think he's ready because he needs to work on the other parts of his game. I agree he won't be up here again this season unless injuries necessitate it. I also agree that Sheahan is likely to move to left wing with Brassard and Kessel. I think Jooris is likely to get in the lineup over Blueger though. At this stage of the season, I'm not sure how much trust the coaches will put in a player making his NHL debut. I don't know a great deal about Jooris, but he has played in 31 NHL games this season. My guess is they'll go with Jooris on RW, with Rowney at C, and Kuhnhackl. It's not sexy, and they won't play much, but I think it will come down to trust, and Jooris does have 204 NHL games under his belt.


At this point, they need to just trade Sprong to someone who will let the kid be who he is & learn that way. I'm so sick & tired of this Derrick Pouliot-type, "We're not satisfied with 'other parts of his game'.....actually the coach just doesn't like the guy so he'll never get a fair chance to crack the NHL lineup", young-talent-wasting ****.

I'm also sick to death of the "friction with Sullivan" storyline. Obviously, there are some character flaws there for now multiple players to have had run-in's & bad blood with the guy. Maybe just coach a **** hockey team & use your best assets in the process instead of this petty, childish, "you can't play because I don't like you" ****.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby Henry Hank on Thu Mar 08, 2018 1:58 pm

I don't really see where they've done wrong by Sprong this year.*

First off, is he a better top nine option than Kessel, Hornqvist, Rust, or Sheary? The only one of those guys you can maybe make the argument is Sheary, but he's a guy who put up nearly a point per game at the NHL level last season.

Sprong got eight games this season, played a significant amount of time with Crosby, and scored points in only one of them. He's WBS leading scorer but also has the worst plus/minus on the team (I understand the limitations of the stat).

The kid is 20 years old. He has a lot of talent but he's clearly shown that there are deficiencies, and with the roster they have, I don't see that he necessarily makes the NHL team better right now. There really isn't a problem with a 20-year-old playing and developing in the AHL, especially when he's not really needed at the NHL level. The area where he would most likely contribute is on the PP, but they have a historically great PP this season as it is.

I also don't understand any kind of "Sullivan is wasting young talent" angle. In recent years, they've run with a bunch of young players, including Murray, Guentzel, Rust, Sheary, Kuhnhackl, and Dumoulin. He's played Simon and Jarry a bunch this year as well, and it seemed that Aston-Reese was establishing himself in the lineup. I don't think they are showing any problem playing rookies. If there's a problem, it's with the players (Sprong and Pouliot) and not the coaching right now.


*Where they did Sprong poorly is two years ago when they kept him up >9 games but then didn't end up using him anyway. They wasted his entry level contract and now more time in the AHL isn't going to be an option for him next year, even if it might be needed. Most likely, unless they're willing to give up on him in the near future, he's going to have to sink or swim at the NHL level this fall anyway.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby longtimefan on Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:18 am

The Pens also did Sprong a disservice by raising expectations to a crazy level. He should never have been kept after his 9 game audition. Sprong is sexy, because he oozes offensive skill. For some reason though, he was a mid 2nd round pick. We seem to put him in that top 10 pick category. Which creates the myth that he's can't miss. Far from it. The majority of those drafted in his slot never make it. He's also 20 years old. Outside of the young goalies, the youngest player on the team is 23 year old Guentzel. He got off to a great start at WBS, but has really slowed down. The -9 concerns me, simply because he spoke about how proud he was at the beginning of the season about his progress. Being the worst on the team is alarming. We are fans. We see what we see, and we like sexy. We don't notice the nuances. I have to trust the braintrust. Sprong has 4 goals and an assist in 26 NHL games. He had 2 of the goals and an assist in the same game against the Isles when he played with Sid. Which means he has 2 goals outside that game. He should've been sent back, and his ELC would have just started. It didn't happen. So they'll have to make a decision next season. Which he probably would be best served in WBS, at least to start. His skill is scoring. Something that is always welcome, but the Pens score about a half goal more a game than the next highest scoring team since Jan 1. He just isn't what they need at this point. He needs to figure it out. Like I said, with where he was drafted, the odds against him making it aren't really that good. Perhaps he's a gem. Perhaps we will understand why he was the 46th pick.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby lemieuxReturns on Fri Mar 09, 2018 7:41 am

jwest21 wrote:
lemieuxReturns wrote:
Puck-Lurker wrote:Curious to see what staff is going to do. Looks like ZAR, Rust and Simon out for the time being.

That creates two holes. Obviously, we'll have to play Rowney. :slug:

But who's coming up?


Holding off purchasing the Charlotte Checkers tickets for next weeks game. Really want to see Sprong play down here. :)

Isn't Sprong in WBS?


WBS plays the Checkers next week.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby DelPen on Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:42 am

I would really look to put Sheahan on Malkin’s wing so he can take faceoffs too. Then get Hags where he belongs on HBK 2.0

I would expect Khunhackl-Rowney-Jooris to get barely any ice time but that’s fine for now.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby Jim on Fri Mar 09, 2018 10:33 am

longtimefan wrote:The Pens also did Sprong a disservice by raising expectations to a crazy level.


The Pens didn't do that. Click bait writers and non thinking sheep fans did.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby FLPensFan on Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:21 am

I think Sprong needs to be on the NHL roster next season. While it doesn't fit the traditional approach, I wouldn't mind seeing Sprong on a 4th line:

ZAR-Sheahan-Sprong

If Sprong's defense is lacking, swap Kuhnhackl back in. While the minutes may not be indicative of a 3rd line, I think that line could actually do some good. Send ZAR to the net, let Sprong fire away. ZAR and Sheahan are both good defensive to cover for Sprong.

Guentzel-Crosby-Sheary
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Rust-Brassard-Kessel
ZAR-Sheahan-Sprong/Kuhnhackl
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby Henry Hank on Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:28 am

I suspect the early part of next season is going to feature a lot of griping about Sprong because of exactly that. The roster is going to be full but they're going to be stuck keeping him in the NHL because of waivers. There's a good chance that he's going to have to start with fourth line duty and work his way up the lineup which he may struggle with.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby pens_CT on Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:28 am

FLPensFan wrote:I think Sprong needs to be on the NHL roster next season. While it doesn't fit the traditional approach, I wouldn't mind seeing Sprong on a 4th line:

ZAR-Sheahan-Sprong

If Sprong's defense is lacking, swap Kuhnhackl back in. While the minutes may not be indicative of a 3rd line, I think that line could actually do some good. Send ZAR to the net, let Sprong fire away. ZAR and Sheahan are both good defensive to cover for Sprong.

Guentzel-Crosby-Sheary
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Rust-Brassard-Kessel
ZAR-Sheahan-Sprong/Kuhnhackl


I thought that next season Sprong was no longer waiver exempt, so it’s either a NHL roster with the Pens or pass through waivers to get to WBS?
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby SteelCityFan on Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:35 am

FLPensFan wrote:I think Sprong needs to be on the NHL roster next season. While it doesn't fit the traditional approach, I wouldn't mind seeing Sprong on a 4th line:

ZAR-Sheahan-Sprong

If Sprong's defense is lacking, swap Kuhnhackl back in. While the minutes may not be indicative of a 3rd line, I think that line could actually do some good. Send ZAR to the net, let Sprong fire away. ZAR and Sheahan are both good defensive to cover for Sprong.

Guentzel-Crosby-Sheary
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Rust-Brassard-Kessel
ZAR-Sheahan-Sprong/Kuhnhackl


I really like that line up. I would love to see that 4th line happen this year. Hopefully ZAR gets well soon
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby FLPensFan on Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:38 am

pens_CT wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:I think Sprong needs to be on the NHL roster next season. While it doesn't fit the traditional approach, I wouldn't mind seeing Sprong on a 4th line:

ZAR-Sheahan-Sprong

If Sprong's defense is lacking, swap Kuhnhackl back in. While the minutes may not be indicative of a 3rd line, I think that line could actually do some good. Send ZAR to the net, let Sprong fire away. ZAR and Sheahan are both good defensive to cover for Sprong.

Guentzel-Crosby-Sheary
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Rust-Brassard-Kessel
ZAR-Sheahan-Sprong/Kuhnhackl


I thought that next season Sprong was no longer waiver exempt, so it’s either a NHL roster with the Pens or pass through waivers to get to WBS?

Sprong should no longer be waiver exempt next season. If you sign your ELC at age 18, you get 5 years total waiver exemptions......however, once you play 11 games at the NHL level, that drops to 3 years. Sprong played 18 games in 2015-2016, so that was year 1. He played no games last year, but because of those 18 games the season before, the clock was still ticking. This will be his 3rd and final year of waiver exemption.

I would expect he will have a spot on the roster next year at the NHL level.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby FLPensFan on Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:39 am

Henry Hank wrote:I suspect the early part of next season is going to feature a lot of griping about Sprong because of exactly that. The roster is going to be full but they're going to be stuck keeping him in the NHL because of waivers. There's a good chance that he's going to have to start with fourth line duty and work his way up the lineup which he may struggle with.

If you are playing with Rowney on a 4th line, that's worthless. If you are playing with someone like Sheahan, and your other winger has played well as well (ZAR/Rust), it's more like a 3rd line with reduced minutes.
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Re: Official GDT: Pens @ Flyers 3/7/18

Postby Henry Hank on Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:45 am

FLPensFan wrote:
Henry Hank wrote:I suspect the early part of next season is going to feature a lot of griping about Sprong because of exactly that. The roster is going to be full but they're going to be stuck keeping him in the NHL because of waivers. There's a good chance that he's going to have to start with fourth line duty and work his way up the lineup which he may struggle with.

If you are playing with Rowney on a 4th line, that's worthless. If you are playing with someone like Sheahan, and your other winger has played well as well (ZAR/Rust), it's more like a 3rd line with reduced minutes.


I don't disagree with it. I think there's value in a young player starting out in that sort of role, even a guy who's expected to be a scorer. But there's already a sentiment that the Pens are mishandling him. They have, in that they wasted his entry level deal and are going to put him in a situation where he's going to be forced into the NHL next year whether or not he's ready.

I think that if Sprong is truly an NHL player, the cream will rise to the top and he will prove himself even if he isn't handed a permanent spot in the top six. I fully expect that if he does not pan out, all blame is going to be given to the coaching staff though I agree with the point made above that a prospect of his pedigree more often than not busts and so we should really be tempering our expectations to begin with.
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