An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

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An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby FLPensFan on Sat Aug 08, 2020 5:27 pm

Now that the 19-20 season officially ended yesterday, and almost 24 hours have passed since the Penguins blew chunks all over the Canadians, I thought I'd take a calmer, more realistic look ahead to next season.

The guarantees:
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1. The Penguins will keep their 2020 draft pick and send the 2021 1st rounder to Minnesota. The Penguins are guaranteed #1 overall or #15 overall. Those are the only 2 picks they can get. Even if it is #15 overall, that is still the lowest 1st round pick they have had since taking Pouliot 8th overall in 2012. You just can't pass that up. The only way you give the pick to the Wild is if you think you have a strong chance at being worse in 20-21 season. Yikes if that is the line of thinking.

2. Justin Schultz, Conor Sheary, and Patrick Marleau should all be somewhere other than Pittsburgh next season. Schultz may be too expensive, but, I'd also argue that his play this year, both regular season and playoffs saw him closer to the Edmonton version of Schultz than the Schultz that filled in for Letang during the playoffs a few seasons ago. Schultz has not looked good, whether with Johnson or Pettersson. Conor Sheary is who Conor Sheary was when Rutherford traded him to Buffalo....a very streaky player who falls down to much and misses too many golden chances to continue playing with Crosby. Patrick Marleau seemed like a good get at the deadline. A feel good story that, come playoff time, didn't feel very good. Marleau looks like toast.

3. Monday could be a big deciding factor in the direction of this team. This team needs to get younger ASAP. If this team manages to get Lafreniere, and can add Poulin to the roster next season, that would be a good jumpstart to the process. If they get #15 overall pick, they may need to look at moving a Letang or a Malkin to help speed up the youth injection to the NHL roster. Also, if they get Lafreniere, they are going to have an overload on the LW side with Guentzel, Lafreniere, and Zucker. Maybe you move Guentzel to the right side, maybe Zucker....or maybe Zucker gives you a strong LW option with Poulin & Rust on the RW.

4. There should be changes at the coaching level. It is very, very doubtful Rutherford is going to fire Sullivan. That decision would likely need to come from above Rutherford, similar to what happened with Shero and Bylsma. I think Sullivan is going to stay, but, there needs to be a shakeup of the coaching staff. Most notably, Recchi should be out, and the Penguins should be scouring the NHL level for the best PP coach available, and be open to new ideas and configurations. Even if it means having two separate units with Crosby and Malkin split up. Everything needs to be on the table. Their PP is too stagnant, and not good enough for the talent they have.

5. I'll put this one last, as it falls between guarantees and strong consideration category, but....Matt Murray will be traded. I can only see about a 10% chance of him staying here. He didn't crap the bed in the playoffs, but, he wasn't a positive difference maker in the series, either. He had some good moments, but, he also had some plays where, kind of the story for the last 2 years, you really needed him to come up with a big save and he did not. Yes, he made some big plays and good saves, but, there were more to be made. I read a comment on Twitter from someone that evaluates and writes about hockey goaltending as a profession that the Petry goal was a bad goal to give up. Yes, it was a great shot by Petry, but, according to this person, with the angle that Petry was, Murray should have been taller in net in the reverse VH position. There was little to no chance of Petry making a cross ice pass from that position, so Murray should not have been cheating to the lower position (which would be to break up a cross-ice pass or to push off and move to the other side of the net for a shot). Those are the little things that have come back to bite Murray the past few years. Can you get a Jokiharju or Montour for Murray.....Murray for Montour and Buffalo's 2021 1st rounder? That's swapping 2 arbitration eligible players plus getting a future 1st. If you get Montour or Jokiharju, that


Strong Consideration:
------------------------
1. Examine trading Kris Letang. See what the market is, especially in places like Toronto or Montreal. I am not a Letang hater. I am often frustrated by his bonehead plays and giveaways, but, I've also seen the numbers on his impact of driving offense on this team. It is significant. I don't think Letang played well offensively in this series. I was away on vacation watching most games on a Firestick with poor internet, so, I can't say for certain about his defense. I thought for the most part, he was better than the regular season or last 2 post seasons. I did't notice a ton of bad giveaways from him, but, I honestly wasn't watching him as closely as usual. I consider moving Letang now because, there are some other options available. Pietrangelo should be available. Tyson Barrie should be available. If you were to trade Murray for a Montour, you can move Marino up to #1 and still have Montour as backup....making shopping for a 3rd pairing RD a little easier. It gives you options. I doubt the Penguins are going to do it, but this might be the right time based on players that might be available through trade or free agency. They probably won't be as good as Letang in his prime, but, they might get you a few years younger and a few $$$ cheaper. At least take a look. Maybe we are underselling Letang due to our frustrations, and someone gives up more than we think.

2. Once again, 3C becomes a position of need. It's not Bjugstad, and the team should be looking to move him or buy him out. He's too expensive of a gamble at this point. McCann really shot his chances here with the post-season that he had. In fact, with the possibility of Lafreniere as well as a Poulin possibility....McCann could have played himself off this roster. I have a hard time right now giving McCann anything in the 3M range on a new deal. He didn't show up for the playoffs, and was bad enough to get scratched. There isn't a lot of younger 3C caliber players available on the UFA market. Penguins have liked Haula, who is already 29 years old. Could they get a 3C as part of a Murray or Letang package?

3. Getting Poulin and POJ onto the NHL roster. No gifting of spots, but, it would help the team tremendously if both of these guys forced their way onto the roster next season. The low cap hit would be a plus. So would some young guys who have a strong desire to win that first Cup, versus some of the stagnant players this team appears to have.

4. Don't fall in love with marginal players. McCann, Simon, and Rodrigues all fall into this category for me. McCann drove himself off a cliff towards the end of the season and the playoffs. His stock is low. No way do we give him 3M plus. Low 1 or 2 year deal around 2.75M at best, and even then, there's a possibility he doesn't have a spot on this team with the possibility of Lafreniere and/or Poulin joining. Rodrigues showed speed, but not a lot else. Buffalo has given up on him a few times. Maybe ok as an extra, but, I'd be playing Lafferty over him at this time.

5. Examine trading Malkin. This is only a consideration if the team misses out on Lafreniere. It's also only a consideration if, between moving Letang or Murray, you can get a capable 2C in return....which is going to be next to impossible to do. Regular season Geno is great. The past 2 post-season Geno's have not been. He's one of the big lip service offenders....we need to play better....and then goes out and lays an egg. He was a big part of last year's post season loss to the Isles, and had something to prove. He stopped short of proving anything in the playoffs. I'm a huge Malkin fan, but, he seems to be one of the biggest offenders of saying a lot but not backing it up on the ice. The giveaways, the charging through 5 defenders like he's 24 and not 34, and generally, making a ton of bucks to not be stepping up in the post season 2 years in a row.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby Ohio_Pens_fan on Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:10 pm

I really don't think Letang or Malkin are going anywhere given that both have no-movement clauses and both want to stay/retire from here. I think everyone is going to have to come to that realization, whether you are pro or con regarding trading one of them.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby Pruezy11881 on Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:14 pm

Ohio_Pens_fan wrote:I really don't think Letang or Malkin are going anywhere given that both have no-movement clauses and both want to stay/retire from here. I think everyone is going to have to come to that realization, whether you are pro or con regarding trading one of them.

But on the other hand, everyone should be looking at the recent examples of hanging on to players too long... Detroit, Chicago, LA, and even Anaheim. They held onto core players too long out of loyalty and their teams went down the crapper for awhile. I personally would rather slowly say goodbye to these guys and stay competitive rather than the league doormat.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby Ohio_Pens_fan on Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:20 pm

Pruezy11881 wrote:
Ohio_Pens_fan wrote:I really don't think Letang or Malkin are going anywhere given that both have no-movement clauses and both want to stay/retire from here. I think everyone is going to have to come to that realization, whether you are pro or con regarding trading one of them.

But on the other hand, everyone should be looking at the recent examples of hanging on to players too long... Detroit, Chicago, LA, and even Anaheim. They held onto core players too long out of loyalty and their teams went down the crapper for awhile. I personally would rather slowly say goodbye to these guys and stay competitive rather than the league doormat.

No disagreement here, but the NMC players are holding all the cards. Someone's gonna have to be pretty creative to convince them to want to leave.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby FLPensFan on Sat Aug 08, 2020 7:23 pm

Ohio_Pens_fan wrote:
Pruezy11881 wrote:
Ohio_Pens_fan wrote:I really don't think Letang or Malkin are going anywhere given that both have no-movement clauses and both want to stay/retire from here. I think everyone is going to have to come to that realization, whether you are pro or con regarding trading one of them.

But on the other hand, everyone should be looking at the recent examples of hanging on to players too long... Detroit, Chicago, LA, and even Anaheim. They held onto core players too long out of loyalty and their teams went down the crapper for awhile. I personally would rather slowly say goodbye to these guys and stay competitive rather than the league doormat.

No disagreement here, but the NMC players are holding all the cards. Someone's gonna have to be pretty creative to convince them to want to leave.

I don't disagree that it wouldn't be easy. Malkin, Letang, and Hornqvist all hold NMC/NTC and will be difficult to move. But, the team should at least see what offers are out there.

If you could get Letang to Montreal, I'm thinking he would consider waiving. Problem is, Montreal can't take Letang with Weber there for another 6 years and 100K more expensive than Letang. They also have Petry there for another year, so they are pretty set at RD. If you could do some type of 3 way deal, where either Weber or Petry moved on, then something might work. It's not a spectacular return, but, the Penguins have liked Philip Danault for a long time. He's playing top 2C for Montreal, which is out of his realm. He'd be a great 3C here in Pittsburgh. If you could work something where Letang goes to Montreal, Danault comes to Pittsburgh, and Petry/Weber go somewhere else, that wouldn't be bad.

Let's just pretend we got that worked out, where PIT got Danault plus a B-level forward prospect for Letang.

I'd then look at Buffalo for Murray. I was reading their organizational depth overview today on the Athletic. Sounds like they are going to want to move on from Montour, and they have gained some faith in Ristolainen. Montour is in same boat as Murray....RFA with Arbitration rights. Swap the 2 of them plus a high pick coming to Pittsburgh:

Lafreniere-Crosby-Rust
Guentzel-Malkin-Poulin
Zucker-Danault-Hornqvist
Tanev-Blueger-Lafferty
xZAR, Johnson, Angello

Dumo-Marino
Pettersson-Montour
POJ-Ruhwedel
xJohnson, Riikola

Jarry
DeSmith

That lineup above is still missing Simon, Bjugstad, and McCann, who could possibly be moved, bought out, retained depending on the situation. You could look to add someone like Trevor Van Riemsdyk on the 3rd pairing if you think he's an upgrade over Ruhwedel. I'm still not sure if that lineup above has added enough young pieces that have the drive and motivation to win another cup.

Malkin would likely accept a deal with Florida if Penguins were to try and move him. Problem is, Florida is pretty barren. The ideal trade would have seen Trocheck come back, but, he's moved on to Carolina. He's also 27 I think. Haula is a UFA with Florida, another piece that the Penguins have been interested in....but he's now 29. That's an issue I see. A lot of these players the Penguins have been interested in previously have aged and aren't really the younger assets you would want to see return.

There is no easy answer, but, if you don't consider doing it this offseason, you are basically going to be stuck with Letang and Malkin for 2 more years until their contracts expire. And I'd expect the Penguins to continue to be 1 round, maybe 2 and done those 2 years. They will not be strong Cup contenders. They will be wild card, sneak into the playoffs and have to get really lucky type of teams.

Sullivan, with the past 3 years of playoff failure, is just about on par with where Bylsma was. Too many unprepared or outcoached performances with quick playoff exits. Detroit, LA, and Chicago are all perfect examples that the Penguins should be looking at and saying we at least need to explore making some uncomfortable moves.....to see if there is anything that would work IF they wanted to pull the trigger. I understand Sullivan and Rutherford aren't going to come out and say the window is closed, but, if behind closed doors, they are still touting what they are publicly saying, then they are a bit out to lunch. It's good to have faith in your guys, but, too much faith for too long is what makes you the next Chicago, Detroit, or LA.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby dark_forces on Sat Aug 08, 2020 7:57 pm

I'm thinking our left side of forwards can still be a real strength with Guentzel, Zucker and McCann. I don't think Geno is going anywhere unless he asks for a move.
3rd line center and defense is where we need the most work.
I let Marleau, Sheary and Schultz walk. I look to deal Aston-Reese for a draft pick. I resign Simon short term and consider re-upping Rodrigues for skilled depth.
I explore the Letang trade market. Tough to do, but maybe you get a couple pieces back, but may have to take on another contract.
I deal Murray and package him with either Bjugstad or Johnson. I think Bjugstad would have more value stand alone than Johnson. One could make the argument he's at least worth the remaining year on his contract as a top 9 forward who could regain his old form.

Guentzel-Crosby-xxxxx (I don't know if Simon is enough here, but would consider keeping him)
Zucker-Malkin-Rust
McCann-xxxxx-Hornqvist
Lafferty-Blueger-Tanev
xRodrigues, xSimon

Dumoulin-Letang
Pettersson-Marino
POJ-Free Agent/Acquisition

Jarry
DeSmith
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby largegarlic on Sat Aug 08, 2020 8:28 pm

My usual summer argument against trading Letang is that the Pens have no one close to replacing him internally, couldn't expect to get a top pairing RD back in a trade, and didn't have any plausible targets on the UFA market who could be top pairing RDs. Now things are a bit different, though. We're still very thin at RD internally (especially with Addison gone), but Marino might be a viable top pairing guy. And there are two UFAs in Pietrangelo and Barrie who are legit top pairing guys.

That said, I feel like Letang was better in the playoffs this year than the past couple years, even if he wasn't a real difference maker, so I feel less of an urge to trade him unless a pretty good return can be had.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby dark_forces on Sat Aug 08, 2020 11:01 pm

largegarlic wrote:My usual summer argument against trading Letang is that the Pens have no one close to replacing him internally, couldn't expect to get a top pairing RD back in a trade, and didn't have any plausible targets on the UFA market who could be top pairing RDs. Now things are a bit different, though. We're still very thin at RD internally (especially with Addison gone), but Marino might be a viable top pairing guy. And there are two UFAs in Pietrangelo and Barrie who are legit top pairing guys.

That said, I feel like Letang was better in the playoffs this year than the past couple years, even if he wasn't a real difference maker, so I feel less of an urge to trade him unless a pretty good return can be had.


I agree. Any Letang deal would be tricky. Many fans don't realize how much of the load he actually carries. Few defenseman could step in and do that.
I wonder how much Barrie could be had for given he had a down year and looks miserable in Toronto? I imagine he would be less expensive than Pietrangelo.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby FLPensFan on Sat Aug 08, 2020 11:07 pm

dark_forces wrote:
largegarlic wrote:My usual summer argument against trading Letang is that the Pens have no one close to replacing him internally, couldn't expect to get a top pairing RD back in a trade, and didn't have any plausible targets on the UFA market who could be top pairing RDs. Now things are a bit different, though. We're still very thin at RD internally (especially with Addison gone), but Marino might be a viable top pairing guy. And there are two UFAs in Pietrangelo and Barrie who are legit top pairing guys.

That said, I feel like Letang was better in the playoffs this year than the past couple years, even if he wasn't a real difference maker, so I feel less of an urge to trade him unless a pretty good return can be had.


I agree. Any Letang deal would be tricky. Many fans don't realize how much of the load he actually carries. Few defenseman could step in and do that.
I wonder how much Barrie could be had for given he had a down year and looks miserable in Toronto? I imagine he would be less expensive than Pietrangelo.

You likely aren't going to get someone equal to Letang's talent in return, however, there are above average options in guys like Pietrangelo and Barrie out there. I'm not sure Marino would be a true #1 next year, but, as long as Dumoulin returns to his normal self next year, a top pairing of Dumo-Marino, with Pettersson-Barrie may be ok. Or you go after Brandan Montour, who it appears Buffalo would like to move based on what I am reading. There are several good options out there this summer, UFA or trade wise. The options are better this year than next year, and, I think your return drops big time if you are dealing Letang as an expiring UFA.

I also feel like Letang was better in the playoffs this year, but, I also still ask around and see what type of offer I can get.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby KG on Sun Aug 09, 2020 12:10 am

I would love to see a Letang trade that maxes sense. Yes he was better in the playoff but he was 4 games 0-0-0 -2 . He was playing not to give up anything .

I like Pietrangelo! But he’s also 30 and will get a boatload !
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby ville5 on Sun Aug 09, 2020 3:27 am

KG wrote:I would love to see a Letang trade that maxes sense. Yes he was better in the playoff but he was 4 games 0-0-0 -2 . He was playing not to give up anything .

I like Pietrangelo! But he’s also 30 and will get a boatload !

Murray for Ristolainen! Then you have more options in dealing Letang.
If Hornqvist is only going to get 14-15 minutes per night (vs. Mtl.- 14, 15, 14, 15), he's overpaid. Especially if the coaching staff or the top dogs don't feel like he's a fit on lines 1 or 2. Move him for a 3C and a pick.
Bye bye Bjugstad, Sheary, Marleau, Rodriguez and Schultz. Maybe you can get a pick for Schultz? ZAR has proved to be rather meh.
If McCann gets more than $2-$2.5, see ya.
Simon should be safe with his versatility.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby RisslingsMissingTeeth on Sun Aug 09, 2020 5:21 am

We were the 3rd oldest team in this postseason. Malkin's golden days are well behind him and each year brings more decline in aging players. Expecting a bounce back is silliness. There is no shortcut here. If we truly think Letang and Geno are staying next year, your only option is to bury their minutes and hope you make the playoffs with cheaper and younger players.

Under no circumstances does it make any sense at all for the Pens to bring in any players over 28 this offseason. Zero. As people look at different scenarios, you can start by eliminating that "quick fix" older player.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby ville5 on Sun Aug 09, 2020 10:11 am

I'd like to sign Haula for 3C. If you can sign him, trade Horny+ for LD and push MP down.
Sign or trade for a couple 3rd pair D.
Zucker- Crosby- ×××
Jake- Malkin- Rust
McCann(?)- Haula- xxx
×××- Blueger- Simon
Dumo-Risto
××××- Marino
Pettersson- ×××××
Jarry
DeSmith (for now)
Not sure where Letang can be moved to. Return can help fill out rest of roster and add some picks.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby pens_CT on Sun Aug 09, 2020 10:21 am

ville5 wrote:I'd like to sign Haula for 3C. If you can sign him, trade Horny+ for LD and push MP down.
Sign or trade for a couple 3rd pair D.
Zucker- Crosby- ×××
Jake- Malkin- Rust
McCann(?)- Haula- xxx
×××- Blueger- Simon
Dumo-Risto
××××- Marino
Pettersson- ×××××
Jarry
DeSmith (for now)


For all of the assets we have given up, and traded for to replace Bonino, we probably should have just re-signed Nick when we had the chance.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby KG on Sun Aug 09, 2020 10:22 am

ville5 wrote:I'd like to sign Haula for 3C. If you can sign him, trade Horny+ for LD and push MP down.
Sign or trade for a couple 3rd pair D.
Zucker- Crosby- ×××
Jake- Malkin- Rust
McCann(?)- Haula- xxx
×××- Blueger- Simon
Dumo-Risto
××××- Marino
Pettersson- ×××××
Jarry
DeSmith (for now)


Haula would be a good get for sure. I would love to knock down MP to the 3rd pair. I would like to see MP/POJ as the 5/6 next year.

Murray for Montaur seems to make a lot of sense for both.

However, I still don’t like how this team has played in the playoffs the last few years, and I feel that no matter what changes are made they need a new voice and plan behind the bench.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby Ericf on Sun Aug 09, 2020 10:28 am

RisslingsMissingTeeth wrote:We were the 3rd oldest team in this postseason. Malkin's golden days are well behind him and each year brings more decline in aging players. Expecting a bounce back is silliness. There is no shortcut here. If we truly think Letang and Geno are staying next year, your only option is to bury their minutes and hope you make the playoffs with cheaper and younger players.

Under no circumstances does it make any sense at all for the Pens to bring in any players over 28 this offseason. Zero. As people look at different scenarios, you can start by eliminating that "quick fix" older player.


I couldn’t agree more. I didn’t like trading for Zucker at his age and contract. JR has to stop bringing in forwards at the end or near the end of their prime. Jake should be the oldest wing Sid or Geno has. Young legs, energy. That’s the only way we’re going to have the players who can put in the work during the playoffs.

Geno is still a really effective player in the regular season. He put up 1.35 points/60 this past year, top 5 in the NHL with like MacKinnon. The problem is that when things get tight in the playoffs neither he nor Sid can effectively get past the tight checking and forechecking with all their miles. They need to have young players, like Rust and Sheary used to do, on their wings to get to work. That’s how you salvage the next two years. Getting rid of Geno is ridiculous because we don’t have a younger 2C on our roster to replace him and we would get no one anywhere near as effective in a trade back. Makes zero sense. We need to get a lot younger in the top 6. Rust and Zucker should be wings on the third line. Horny needs to go. Hopefully Poulin can be an effective top 6 player and I pray we can land Lafreniere. Would be a godsend
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby lemieuxReturns on Sun Aug 09, 2020 10:31 am

Here is my list of players and how I feel about keeping them or not. Obviously for guys like Letang and Murray, etc it would be for the right price.

Untouchable : Geno, Sid, Jake, Jarry, Marino, Dumo

Maybe: Zucker, Horny, Tanev, Rust, McCann, Lafferty, Blueger, Simon, Ruhwedel

Gone: Sheary, Rodrigues, ZAR, Letang, Schultz, Johnson, Pettersson, Rikola, Murray, Marelau
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Sun Aug 09, 2020 10:32 am

Is GMJR expected to speak to media at all regarding this playoff exit? Usually teams have a cleaning out locker room media day but doubt that will happen due to covid. Thoughts?
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Sun Aug 09, 2020 10:39 am

I think Rust is untouchable. He brings a lot of passion and energy to his game and is still relatively young. Also think Zucker is safe.

Here’s what I think we need:
Line 1: Zucker - Crosby - FA
Line 2: Jake - Geno - Rust/Horny
Line 3: Lafferty - X - Rust/Horny
Line 4: ZAR - Teddy - Tanev

With regards to forwards I think you flip Jason/Jake and possibly Rust/Horny. Putting Rust to third line gives me flexibility on finding a center for that 3rd line. I think unless you move Hornqvist you need him in top 6. Think him with Geno/Jake could do some damage.

DP:
Dp1: Dumo - Letang
Dp2: Peterson - Marino
DP 3: x - Ruhwedel
Extra POJ

Jarry / DeSmith

I think you let all RFAs and UFAs walk except lafferty/Jarry/ahl depth. I wanted MCann but he doesn’t fit now. Simon I think you upgrade line 1. I could see flipping Hornqvist to team for 3C maybe?
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby lemieuxReturns on Sun Aug 09, 2020 10:39 am

I don't know if i have said this 100 or 200 million times over the years but "I really hate our defense".
If we are going to accept mediocracy in our defense then I am fine with that... but we should not be paying an outrageous sum for it as well.
What is sad is I am not sure if we let half our defense go this summer that they would even have a job in the NHL. Who would want Johnson? Pettersson? Or even Schultz? Certainly not at their current cap hits. If we want the quality of defense we have been getting over the years we should just pick guys up off the scrap heap and go from there. Its funny how good a kid like Marino looks on a team full of overpaid scrubs.

I am still laughing at the fact we locked in Petterrsson over 4 million for the next 5 seasons. WTH?
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Sun Aug 09, 2020 10:43 am

lemieuxReturns wrote:I don't know if i have said this 100 or 200 million times over the years but "I really hate our defense".
If we are going to accept mediocracy in our defense then I am fine with that... but we should not be paying an outrageous sum for it as well.
What is sad is I am not sure if we let half our defense go this summer that they would even have a job in the NHL. Who would want Johnson? Pettersson? Or even Schultz? Certainly not at their current cap hits. If we want the quality of defense we have been getting over the years we should just pick guys up off the scrap heap and go from there. Its funny how good a kid like Marino looks on a team full of overpaid scrubs.

I am still laughing at the fact we locked in Petterrsson over 4 million for the next 5 seasons. WTH?


I think Johnson and Schultz are gone. I think MP works with Marino. You could also find another top D in FA or trading some package to pair with Marino a la Barrie and use Peterson and Ruhwedel. Ruhwedel should be in the lineup. He is cheap and is a good d man who should just play more. Moving JJ fixes that.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Sun Aug 09, 2020 10:46 am

Pensfan4life8771 wrote:I think Rust is untouchable. He brings a lot of passion and energy to his game and is still relatively young. Also think Zucker is safe.

Here’s what I think we need:
Line 1: Zucker - Crosby - FA
Line 2: Jake - Geno - Rust/Horny
Line 3: Lafferty - X - Rust/Horny
Line 4: ZAR - Teddy - Tanev

With regards to forwards I think you flip Jason/Jake and possibly Rust/Horny. Putting Rust to third line gives me flexibility on finding a center for that 3rd line. I think unless you move Hornqvist you need him in top 6. Think him with Geno/Jake could do some damage.

DP:
Dp1: Dumo - Letang
Dp2: Peterson - Marino
DP 3: x - Ruhwedel
Extra POJ

Jarry / DeSmith

I think you let all RFAs and UFAs walk except lafferty/Jarry/ahl depth. I wanted MCann but he doesn’t fit now. Simon I think you upgrade line 1. I could see flipping Hornqvist to team for 3C maybe?


Also. I think if Pens can move JJ and Bjustad it creates more room for creativity on the roster. I also like the idea of getting youth mixed with veterans. Like a young speedy winger on RW on line 1 and moving Horny to move Rust back up or young winger on Geno line. Could even try Poulin if you move Hornqvist.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby dark_forces on Sun Aug 09, 2020 11:42 am

I’m wondering about bjugstad and his penguin future. Should there be any consideration to keeping him as the 3rd line center?
I’ve been interested in players on expiring contracts and he’s supposedly finally going to be healthy. Does it make sense to at least keep him to begin the season and see how he performs?
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Sun Aug 09, 2020 11:47 am

dark_forces wrote:I’m wondering about bjugstad and his penguin future. Should there be any consideration to keeping him as the 3rd line center?
I’ve been interested in players on expiring contracts and he’s supposedly finally going to be healthy. Does it make sense to at least keep him to begin the season and see how he performs?


Think it depends where and if he fits. I also think it’ll be difficult to keep him and Hornqvist. I think if Nick is healthy you move him.
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Re: An updated look ahead to the Penguins 20-21 season

Postby FLPensFan on Mon Aug 10, 2020 12:33 pm

Dejan did a piece yesterday, talking about what changes need to be made. He discussed a bunch of different items, including:

--In their past 13 playoff games, the Penguins have not scored more than 3 goals in any of them. 25 total goals in 13 games is just under 2 goals per game average. That's not what this team is built for. Lack of scoring is hurting them big time.

--Says the trading of #1 draft picks HAS TO STOP. It is no longer worth trading these away for short term rentals, and even more longer-term pieces like Zucker.

--Says there is no way to win a trade of any of the core. It probably won't be Beech, Sivek, and Lupashuk, but, it isn't going to be a spectacular return either.

--Finally, and this was a big one...the team needs to stop being afraid to play youth. Mentioned how Lafferty and Rodrigues were 2 of the best looking players all camp, and they surely couldn't have been worse than Marleau.

He then went on to give 10 immediate changes that should occur (a lot of these we have discussed or mentioned as well):

1. Rehire Botterill. Say another set of eyes is needed to help guide this team through the next phase.
2. Team needs to publicly pronounce a desire to go younger. Say it to the coaches, the players, and the prospects in the system.
3. Team needs to scour the Earth for a great hockey PP mind. Because the Penguins surely don't currently employ one.
4. Let Schultz, Marleau, and Sheary all walk.
5. Buyout BOTH Bjugstad and Johnson. Doesn't matter if cap savings is "worth it" or not.
6. Trade McCann. Called him an enigma that another team may be willing to overpay for because of his age. Take what you can get.
7. Have internal discussions with Malkin and Letang that, no contract extensions with them are going to occur until a dramatic turnaround in the post season occurs. If they want to be here longer, they need to up their games when it matters most.
8. At least put feelers out for moving Hornqvist. 6M 3rd line winger is too much. Says at his age, salary, and NMC, there likely won't be any takers, but, the team needs to at least poke around and see if there is.
9. Sign Jarry to a multi-year deal with expectation he is the #1
10. Trade Murray. He seems to think there will be a good return, such as a young defenseman.

One thing DK that really got to me was the 1st rounders, and then the Boston Bruins. Boston is the one team that has not hit the wall like Chicago, Detroit, and LA. They still have that same core of Bergeron, Krejci, Marchand, Chara, and Rask. And they have done that because they have added guys like Pastranak, McAvoy, Krug, etc along the way.

I took a deeper look at this. From 2013 - 2019, the Penguins have only drafted in the 1st round twice, Kapanen and Poulin. 7 years, only 2 picks in 1st round. All the others traded away. During that same time period, Boston has lacked a 1st rounder only twice. Even further, Boston still managed to stockpile first rounders. In 2016 Boston has 2 1st rounders. In 2015 they had 3 1st rounders. In that 7 year period, Boston has made 8 1st round selections. They didn't hit on all of them. They did hit on Pastranak, McAvoy, and DeBrusk, and, I'd say the last 2 are too early to tell.

Very interesting items here.
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