BALSILLIE DROPS OUT....UN-F'ING BELIEVABLE....

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Postby bill from turtle creek on Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:54 am

Pghsports wrote:The Globe and Mail has a pretty decent article. It mostly says the same things as everyone else, but some of the quotes from "sources" near the bottom are interesting


Here's those quotes, and they are interesting:

QUOTE:

According to sources, some of the NHL's last-minute conditions would have permitted the league to buy back the club or take over arena negotiations with local officials if it did not like the way Balsillie was handing discussions.

The source added that Balsillie had no plans to move the team and was prepared to work with officials if the Isle of Capri bid fell through. However, the source said Balsillie felt he was in an impossible position given the NHL's conditions.

UNQUOTE
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Postby Guins on Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:56 am

newarenanow wrote:
Guins wrote:
bill from turtle creek wrote:I don't think he is a fraud. Not a bit.
Well using a blog who said the Pens chances of staying were 25%.when someone called him on it he said it was an accurate report because they quoted "EXPERTS" that he knows.The "EXPERTS were Tonya Payne & Bill(don't start the PC without me)Peduto.Experts? they're councilpersons in Pittsburgh not exactly experts


That may have been wrong, but he has been right too many times. And as in another thread, even Admin has said he is legit. He even admitted he doesn't know everything, but has some idea what is going on. Until he screws up majorly, or RJ says he's a fraud, I'd rather take it views into consideration than many others on here.
I understand, but when you say that "EXPERTS" are politician that raises a HUGE RED FLAG with me. I trust politicians as far as I can throw their dead carcass
Last edited by Guins on Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby newarenanow on Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:56 am

bill from turtle creek wrote:But, there is still NO DECENT PLACE TO MOVE THIS TEAM. We've been over this a million times. It doesn't matter who the owner is, unless it's Les Alexander. There simply isn't a place to go. Period. That makes sense.


It doesn't have to make sense to us, just the NHL. They moved a team to Phoenix and Carolina. Carolina didn't even have an NHL ready areana.

But I think people are jumping to conclusions and making themselves crazy over this. That is why I'm just going to let it play out and we'll hear more on Wednesday. Until then, I'm taking everything with a grain of salt.
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Postby newarenanow on Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:58 am

Spoink wrote:I think there's some__other__prime factor behind the scenes .. hidden from view, that is the reason for "Balsillie backing-out".

Balsillie seemed sincere about wanting to negotiate in good faith to consumate a process that would get a new arena deal done in Pittsburgh
for The Penguins. I don't think Balsillie is "a bad guy". Balsillie's intentions aren't the problem .. I just really don't think so.

There's something--else--going-on, here .. that we the public are not (of course) being let-in-on. And I just really hope that neither Fingold nor Murstein are being set-up to buy the team. If anyone buys the team, I hope it is Mark Cuban. I suspect, however .. and this is_very_disturbing ..
that Bettman (and his puppeteers) have pulled some sort of--ulterior--manipulation to block Balsillie, in order to bring Fingold and/or Murstein back into the bidding. Bettman is using the "protect Pittsburgh" thing as a cover, I think. Again; I think this is looking like a dirty scheme to block Balsillie at the last minute, so that either Fingold or Murstein can swoop-in and snatch the team, and either of these owners would be__bad news__for this team and for the fans of this team. We need Mark Cuban to step-up and put his money where his mouth has been, and be the hero.


What you're saying doesn't make sense to me. Three sales have fallen through for this team, one of them being Fingold already. Why would the NHL stop a sale just to do it. And as long as they keep the team here, I don't care who the owner is. With the new CBA, it won't be like the Pirates. The Rooney's are cheap adn the Steelers are good almost every year. Salary Cap baby!
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Postby Guins on Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:58 am

Plans change all the time
Last edited by Guins on Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby mjg on Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:59 am

Spoink wrote:I suspect, however .. and this is_very_disturbing ..
that Bettman (and his puppeteers) have pulled some sort of--ulterior--manipulation to block Balsillie, in order to bring Fingold and/or Murstein back into the bidding.


Unless you can give me a reason why Bettman would want one of these two back in the mix over a billionaire with an enormous passion for hockey.....

I don't have a clue where you are going with this line of thinking.
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Postby louie on Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:09 pm

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Postby mjg on Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:23 pm

Guins wrote:If anyone wants to email Mark Cuban his email is markcuban@dallasmavs.com


I hope this is really his e-mail because I just sent him this:

Mr. Cuban,

Please buy the Penguins, or loan me $175 million so I can buy them. Thanks.

MJG


Think he'll loan me the money? I'm willing to put up the equity in my townhouse as collateral.
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Postby Guins on Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:31 pm

mjg wrote:
Guins wrote:If anyone wants to email Mark Cuban his email is markcuban@dallasmavs.com


I hope this is really his e-mail because I just sent him this:

Mr. Cuban,

Please buy the Penguins, or loan me $175 million so I can buy them. Thanks.

MJG


Think he'll loan me the money? I'm willing to put up the equity in my townhouse as collateral.
It is because I looked for it last night & emailed him too
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Postby Guins on Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:33 pm

You want a laugh go to eklund's site & read Kevin Gibson's Blog, he states that Copps Coliseum has been ready for 20 years & also better then Mellon arena because it's younger :lol: :lol: :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Postby bill from turtle creek on Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:41 pm

newarenanow wrote:
It doesn't have to make sense to us, just the NHL. They moved a team to Phoenix and Carolina. Carolina didn't even have an NHL ready areana.



Carolina made no sense, but Phoenix certainly did. And Draftnik's points about charging zillions for an expansion team to move into Southern Ontario is a very very good one, rather than let a guy like JB move in for free. Attendance is down all across the league, except for here, and we are now just moving into the part of the calendar when the Pens draw their best. It's insanity to flush that down the drain.

All signs continue to point to this team remaining here. The fine points of who owns them, and who builds the new building, have yet to be determined.
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Postby magnum on Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:42 pm

I'm out shopping all day yesterday, I have my Pens jersey on and every idiot who is a Pens fan walks past me and tells me the score without me asking and definitely not wanting to know since it makes watching the game on DVR much more fun, YET I hear nothing about the Balsillie bid falling through and I didn't finish watching the game untill 4am last night..

ok... that said... a few questions and/or thoughts...

question...

Is it possible that the teams in the NHL didn't approve this sale? I have no idea how this all works out and the BOG, if the owners of the teams are part of the BOG, disregard this, but I thought that the teams needed to approve this first.

Thoughts...

What if Balsillie knew something about IOC that we didn't know about from his few appearances recently in front of the board? Is it possible that with the kind of coin he put up for the team that he was only really interested in buying it if IOC won? He might know that IOC isn't going to win which sucks to us 'cause that deal is definitely a certainty... He talks to Bettman about what he would do if IOC falls through, Bettman says that is what you have to do and for the amount of money Balsillie put in, this wasn't good enough and he fled....

I can't seem to find a way to get real happy about this for some reason. I'm watching the game last night feeling kinda strange like this isn't really a good thing and another big dip on the rollercoaster is coming... not to sound gloom or doom or anything. I can't put my finger on it, but I don't feel like I'm very uplifted by the news of this

I think that's all... Can't wait for this casino crap to be over with...
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Postby bill from turtle creek on Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:58 pm

One of the real beautiful things about all of this hoopla is that come Wednesday, a lot of people all over Canada and the US are going to be paying very close attention to the Gaming Board decision. I would bet that Rendell never expected that this decision would get so much publicity and scrutiny. If FC gets that license, all of the stuff about the FIX will get stirred up all over again, and there will be a lot of news coverage.

This is a beautiful thing. If you believed in the fix, as I do, this turn of events could definitely make them at least think a lot more closely about what they are going to do. This will not be a decision made in the dark of night, and then essentially ignored. A LOT of questions will be asked if FC wins. They'd better be ready with the answers.
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Postby Draftnik on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:00 pm

While it seems probable the slots license will be awarded next week there is no guarantee. It also hasn't been clarified that the losing parties can't sue to contest the decision, although I would hope that was a condition of their application. This saga won't necessarily get clarified next week.

There are several US markets that are struggling right now with attendance. I brought up St. Louis earlier in this thread because of the similarities (strong TV ratings & attendance) between their market and ours and how Pittsburgh never sank to the depths St. Louis has and they are only into the 2nd year of their down cycle. Pittsburgh was down for 3 seasons; I wouldn't count last year due to the Crosby effect even though it was a down year in the standings.


The time to measure a market is when things are at their worst and this market came through a down period in relatively good shape.

The NHL has to be very introspective right now when so many of their markets like Washington, Atlanta, Nashville, Anaheim, Carolina are not performing as they should based on winning and/or stars. It makes no sense for the NHL to move into a new US market like KC, Houston, etc when they haven't stabilized many of their newer US markets yet and Pittsburgh already shown it is much more stable than many other markets.
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Postby Guins on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:05 pm

Draftnik wrote:While it seems probable the slots license will be awarded next week there is no guarantee. It also hasn't been clarified that the losing parties can't sue to contest the decision, although I would hope that was a condition of their application. This saga won't necessarily get clarified next week.

There are several US markets that are struggling right now with attendance. I brought up St. Louis earlier in this thread because of the similarities (strong TV ratings & attendance) between their market and ours and how Pittsburgh never sank to the depths St. Louis has and they are only into the 2nd year of their down cycle. Pittsburgh was down for 3 seasons; I wouldn't count last year due to the Crosby effect even though it was a down year in the standings.


The time to measure a market is when things are at their worst and this market came through a down period in relatively good shape.

The NHL has to be very introspective right now when so many of their markets like Washington, Atlanta, Nashville, Anaheim, Carolina are not performing as they should based on winning and/or stars. It makes no sense for the NHL to move into a new US market like KC, Houston, etc when they haven't stabilized many of their newer US markets yet and Pittsburgh already shown it is much more stable than many other markets.
Damn You're good :lol: :lol:
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Postby magnum on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:08 pm

I agree Bill, next Wednesday is going to be a very big day and very interesting as well. If IOC doesn't win it will raise a lot of questions...

1. If Harrah's wins, then why? The Gaming force here never recieved updated traffic reports, Traffic has been a huge issue there and there's a lot of issues with Harrah's because of their sale... Then there is the Fix..

2. If PITG wins, why was it favored over IOC when it was generally percieved as the 3rd best deal? Was it because of the outcry for the Hill Residents against IOC? You then revert to the fact that it's widely known that Barden is putting the Hill Residents up to the anti-IOC schtick, probably throwing in a few bucks to keep them from shutting up...

There's a lot of issues..

Ok, back to the topic at hand...

I was thinking some more but positively... Reading through a bunch of websites about this and about Bettman strong arming to keep the Pens here, it is a smart move for hockey in general. The Pens ae already a strong market. The Pens recieve strong T.V. ratings, have great talent and are around 93% capacity for attendance I believe which is great and better than what a lot of the teams do... Sure, maybe a team in Southern Ontario would do good with attendance, but Betman is trying and has been trying to win approval of this sport in the United States. He is still looking for that nice National T.V. agreement and wants to grow this sport. Truth is, he probably won't achieve tha by making a parallel move (moving from a good market to another good market).

Why it won't be a good parallel move is because the Pens are worth more to the NHL in a strong U.S, market than they are in a strong Canadian market, which is why it would be doubtful to see any team relocate to Canda if they are struggling at the gate and ratings like some of the Southern teams or a New York/Jersey team.
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Postby magnum on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:17 pm

I was listening to Dregger and MacKenzie and at the end of their little segment they said that Jerry Bruckheinmer was interested in buying the ens and moving them to Las Vegas before Balsillie stepped in... that's the first time I had heard of that one.
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Postby Noise on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:19 pm

Spoink wrote:I think there's some__other__prime factor behind the scenes .. hidden from view, that is the reason for "Balsillie backing-out".

Balsillie seemed sincere about wanting to negotiate in good faith to consumate a process that would get a new arena deal done in Pittsburgh
for The Penguins. I don't think Balsillie is "a bad guy". Balsillie's intentions aren't the problem .. I just really don't think so.

There's something--else--going-on, here .. that we the public are not (of course) being let-in-on. And I just really hope that neither Fingold nor Murstein are being set-up to buy the team. If anyone buys the team, I hope it is Mark Cuban. I suspect, however .. and this is_very_disturbing ..
that Bettman (and his puppeteers) have pulled some sort of--ulterior--manipulation to block Balsillie, in order to bring Fingold and/or Murstein back into the bidding. Bettman is using the "protect Pittsburgh" thing as a cover, I think. Again; I think this is looking like a dirty scheme to block Balsillie at the last minute, so that either Fingold or Murstein can swoop-in and snatch the team, and either of these owners would be__bad news__for this team and for the fans of this team. We need Mark Cuban to step-up and put his money where his mouth has been, and be the hero.


Someone has been smoking a little too much weed.
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Postby Guins on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:21 pm

magnum wrote:I was listening to Dregger and MacKenzie and at the end of their little segment they said that Jerry Bruckheinmer was interested in buying the ens and moving them to Las Vegas before Balsillie stepped in... that's the first time I had heard of that one.
there will never repeat never be a team in Lost wages er Las Vegas
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Postby magnum on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:27 pm

Guins wrote:
magnum wrote:I was listening to Dregger and MacKenzie and at the end of their little segment they said that Jerry Bruckheinmer was interested in buying the ens and moving them to Las Vegas before Balsillie stepped in... that's the first time I had heard of that one.
there will never repeat never be a team in Lost wages er Las Vegas


that's not what i was saying or asking, i wanted to know if anyone else had heard of jerry bruckheimer being interested
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Postby Guins on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:28 pm

magnum wrote:
Guins wrote:
magnum wrote:I was listening to Dregger and MacKenzie and at the end of their little segment they said that Jerry Bruckheinmer was interested in buying the ens and moving them to Las Vegas before Balsillie stepped in... that's the first time I had heard of that one.
there will never repeat never be a team in Lost wages er Las Vegas


that's not what i was saying or asking, i wanted to know if anyone else had heard of jerry bruckheimer being interested
I know what you meant I was just stating my opinion, no problem
Last edited by Guins on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby edog on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:40 pm

FLPensFan wrote:OK, my first comment is on page 8 of the thread, so I don't doubt that this has been said somewhere in this thread.

Right now, until more details come out, I really can't fault Balsillie for pulling out of the deal. If the statement is true that the NHL said the team cannot be moved under no circumstances, I don't think any potential owner would agree to that.

Murstein & Rennacci would.....

Granted, with a new arena, the Pens are going to have their best revenue potential ever (which would be a team's main reason for leaving, low revenues), but, I'll use an extreme example that would never happen.

Pens win IOC, a new arena gets built, but thousands of fans boycott games in protest of an arena built close to the Hill District. Capacity is only 50%, and the Pens are losing more money than they did in Mellon Arena.

If you said this would never happen, why post it then.... :roll: Pens fans want IOC to happen. The Hill is a cesspool....

With what the NHL was supposedly proposing, the new owner has to sit back and lose money, and has no chance to move the team. Further, they have the potential to have the NHL step in and take over the team, killing the chance for a profitable future sale.

I hate to break this to you scooter, but Pittsburgh is one of the NHL's strongest markets. They don't want to lose it...apparently now under any circumstances.....
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Postby Va Beach Pens Fan on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:46 pm

Take it for what it's worth, considering the source.... Let's hope he's dead on with this one....


http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=4287

BREAKING NEWS: Isles of Capris Likely to Get License

Today @ 12:43 PM ET | Comments (0)

according to a source...interesting twist.again this is just what I am hearing from a trusted source..no guarantees...if true, Happy Holidays Pittsburgh.
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Postby prez41 on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:47 pm

Va Beach Pens Fan wrote:Take it for what it's worth, considering the source.... Let's hope he's dead on with this one....


http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=4287

BREAKING NEWS: Isles of Capris Likely to Get License

Today @ 12:43 PM ET | Comments (0)

according to a source...interesting twist.again this is just what I am hearing from a trusted source..no guarantees...if true, Happy Holidays Pittsburgh.


If true, this will be the best Christmas ever.
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Postby Corban87 on Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:53 pm

I agree, this would be the best christmas if this comes true.

I just can't take it anymore....
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