More Posturing?? -- Mario in KC

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More Posturing?? -- Mario in KC

Postby pghsccr11 on Wed Jan 03, 2007 10:20 am

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07003/750772-85.stm

more posturing from Mario and Co or just more ammunition for tomorrow's meeting? we shall see..
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Postby bill from turtle creek on Wed Jan 03, 2007 10:28 am

A little bit of both. ML needs to know what else is out there in order to make an educated decision, and the timing is perfect.

KC is about the only real alternative at this point. If their deal really sucks, or is really great, he should want to know that before he meets with the local guys.
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Postby Tinker on Wed Jan 03, 2007 10:39 am

You cannot blame him. Not only does he need to know what others can offer, but Rendell & the Rat need to know as well. KC is the only real alternative for the 07-08 season, and my guess is that Mario doesn't want to waste time dickering. He wants to say to Rendell, this is what I need from plan B, knowing full well what KC can offer.
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Postby Corvidae on Wed Jan 03, 2007 11:22 am

"This is what I can get in KC. What can you do better?"
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Postby Ginger on Wed Jan 03, 2007 11:38 am

bill from turtle creek wrote:A little bit of both. ML needs to know what else is out there in order to make an educated decision, and the timing is perfect.

KC is about the only real alternative at this point. If their deal really sucks, or is really great, he should want to know that before he meets with the local guys.


Well, it shows the city that he's serious & not just posturing doesn't it? He's going to look at the facility & see if this is where the Pens should be going. The arena is fabulous! Any team would be thrilled to play there & fans going to the games would be happy with their surroundings as well. What's Mario gonna do? Say, nah, I'm gonna keep them right here & wait for these fine folks to make up their minds. He's got to move on even if the city doesn't.
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Postby Pitts on Wed Jan 03, 2007 11:49 am

Ginger wrote:
bill from turtle creek wrote:A little bit of both. ML needs to know what else is out there in order to make an educated decision, and the timing is perfect.

KC is about the only real alternative at this point. If their deal really sucks, or is really great, he should want to know that before he meets with the local guys.


Well, it shows the city that he's serious & not just posturing doesn't it? He's going to look at the facility & see if this is where the Pens should be going. The arena is fabulous! Any team would be thrilled to play there & fans going to the games would be happy with their surroundings as well. What's Mario gonna do? Say, nah, I'm gonna keep them right here & wait for these fine folks to make up their minds. He's got to move on even if the city doesn't.

He also could simply scope out new ideas for his Pittsburgh arena! :twisted:
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Postby Ginger on Wed Jan 03, 2007 12:14 pm

Pitts wrote:He also could simply scope out new ideas for his Pittsburgh arena! :twisted:


Yeeees....we can go with that if you like. Image

I think the plans for the new arena in Pittsburgh are pretty much on paper tho' aren't they? Which btw, is a terrific arena too, if ever it gets built!

You can tell I'm remaining skeptical until such a time as I see a large excavation hole in the ground. Image
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Postby Pitts on Wed Jan 03, 2007 1:08 pm

Ginger wrote:
Pitts wrote:He also could simply scope out new ideas for his Pittsburgh arena! :twisted:


Yeeees....we can go with that if you like. Image

I think the plans for the new arena in Pittsburgh are pretty much on paper tho' aren't they? Which btw, is a terrific arena too, if ever it gets built!

You can tell I'm remaining skeptical until such a time as I see a large excavation hole in the ground. Image

Not all the details though...

Mario: " See these brass handles on those doors? I like those. Write that down Ron."

"Hey Ken, I'm liking that wine closet in the executive suite...make a note, huh?"

"How about that Rib Shack? Good food. See if they want a spot in our place."

:D
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Postby pfim on Wed Jan 03, 2007 1:11 pm

Pitts wrote:
Ginger wrote:
Pitts wrote:He also could simply scope out new ideas for his Pittsburgh arena! :twisted:


Yeeees....we can go with that if you like. Image

I think the plans for the new arena in Pittsburgh are pretty much on paper tho' aren't they? Which btw, is a terrific arena too, if ever it gets built!

You can tell I'm remaining skeptical until such a time as I see a large excavation hole in the ground. Image

Not all the details though...

Mario: " See these brass handles on those doors? I like those. Write that down Ron."

"Hey Ken, I'm liking that wine closet in the executive suite...make a note, huh?"

"How about that Rib Shack? Good food. See if they want a spot in our place."

:D


"Ron, this is ice. It's in every hockey arena. Those are boards, they keep the puck on the ice."
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Postby demondg1 on Wed Jan 03, 2007 1:14 pm

Ginger wrote:
Pitts wrote:He also could simply scope out new ideas for his Pittsburgh arena! :twisted:


Yeeees....we can go with that if you like. Image

I think the plans for the new arena in Pittsburgh are pretty much on paper tho' aren't they? Which btw, is a terrific arena too, if ever it gets built!

You can tell I'm remaining skeptical until such a time as I see a large excavation hole in the ground. Image


Hopefully there will be a gourmet Pizza stand. I'm sure Malkin would love it.

That dude loves him some pizza.
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Postby tluke53 on Wed Jan 03, 2007 1:18 pm

Call me pessimistic, but has anyone asked the following....


"Why sit around and Pittsburgh and wait 2 or 3 years for an arena, when I can got to KC and have it now?"
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Postby PensFanBryan on Wed Jan 03, 2007 1:23 pm

tluke53 wrote:Call me pessimistic, but has anyone asked the following....


"Why sit around and Pittsburgh and wait 2 or 3 years for an arena, when I can got to KC and have it now?"


This really isnt a problem. They prefer to stay in Pittsburgh. If they can agree to a deal, they will wait for the arena, and they will have no problem waiting for it. I think as long as they get something within $1M - $1.5M a year of what KC gives them on their lease, they will stay in Pittsburgh.
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Postby dboss on Wed Jan 03, 2007 1:25 pm

Once lived in Pittsburgh wrote:
tluke53 wrote:Call me pessimistic, but has anyone asked the following....


"Why sit around and Pittsburgh and wait 2 or 3 years for an arena, when I can got to KC and have it now?"



"Why sit around in that new empty arena in KC in 2015 when we start losing again, when we could have 93% capacity in a real hockey town?"

You have to consider that, too. Empty seats suck. You don't have em, we might.


Mario: "Oh well that is KC's and the NHL's problem, I have my money. Natalie, pop open another bottle of wine for me baby."
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Postby Ginger on Wed Jan 03, 2007 4:33 pm

tluke53 wrote:Call me pessimistic, but has anyone asked the following....


"Why sit around and Pittsburgh and wait 2 or 3 years for an arena, when I can got to KC and have it now?"

Yeah, that's pretty much what I was alluding to when I said about waiting.
Which should it be? An arena waiting for a team or a team waiting for an arena? Put them together...a team FOR an arena in waiting. I so HATE that! Image
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Postby pfim on Wed Jan 03, 2007 4:35 pm

tluke53 wrote:Call me pessimistic, but has anyone asked the following....


"Why sit around and Pittsburgh and wait 2 or 3 years for an arena, when I can got to KC and have it now?"


Because Lemieux and Burkle aren't going to KC. And as soon as Plan B is settle, they're not going to own the Pens anymore. They won't be affiliated with the franchise in a short time, so why would they care?
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Postby DrBoni on Wed Jan 03, 2007 10:44 pm

Once lived in Pittsburgh wrote:If I had to handicap this thing, I'd put money on it ending up in Houston. I've said that since Day 1.

We'll see if I"m right. Way, way too many things going in that city's favor. PGH is my (distant) second choice.


Just out of curiosity, what exactly is going in their favor?

They have a less favorable ownership situation going than KC does. It would take a maximum amount of interest from Houston to get a deal there to work, and they already have a major tenant.
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Postby Guins on Wed Jan 03, 2007 10:48 pm

DrBoni wrote:
Once lived in Pittsburgh wrote:If I had to handicap this thing, I'd put money on it ending up in Houston. I've said that since Day 1.

We'll see if I"m right. Way, way too many things going in that city's favor. PGH is my (distant) second choice.


Just out of curiosity, what exactly is going in their favor?

They have a less favorable ownership situation going than KC does. It would take a maximum amount of interest from Houston to get a deal there to work, and they already have a major tenant.
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Postby bill from turtle creek on Wed Jan 03, 2007 11:09 pm

But, he doesn't want it. His building is already incredibly busy on just about every day of the year. He's making money hand over fist. If he buys the Pens, he has to displace 41 other events that are already making money for him, plus he has to buy the team for $170 million just to get started. The money he'd make on the team, MINUS the money he gives up on those dates that are already being used, isn't worth his time and effort.

No wonder he isn't interested.
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Postby SportsFan on Wed Jan 03, 2007 11:15 pm

I could say something right now, but I don't want to start a huge fight on here. I do somehow find it bad and some what pathetic Mario would visit KC a day before meeting with city officials.

I know and understand he needs to keep his options open, but the timing of going to KC is just bad. It makes everyone including himself look bad. If he went Friday, I would not have a problem at all. I know alot of people would oanic, but panic should go now cause after the PA cuts today, I don't see anything happening with the city, county, or state.

I will give Mario a big F you for not talking to Peter Arnese of Wheeling Downs. Peter apparently said on his show that he contacted Mario about a group that he would like to put together of local investors, but Mario never called him back.
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Postby Defence21 on Thu Jan 04, 2007 12:00 am

Once lived in Pittsburgh wrote:
bill from turtle creek wrote:But, he doesn't want it. His building is already incredibly busy on just about every day of the year. He's making money hand over fist. If he buys the Pens, he has to displace 41 other events that are already making money for him, plus he has to buy the team for $170 million just to get started. The money he'd make on the team, MINUS the money he gives up on those dates that are already being used, isn't worth his time and effort.

No wonder he isn't interested.


IF he is leasing that bulding out all 180 days of the NHL season, then you might be right. If he's got 50 or so open days, I think he'd want the team.

A lot depends on his civic pride, and if he wants the headaches. I'm just looking at this demographically - and Houston absolutely KILLS pitts and kc

Right now there are a lot of ifs with every situation involving the Pens. There are huge ifs in Pittsburgh, huge ifs in Kansas City and huge ifs in Houston -- not to mention the other cities mentioned. The fact remains that, though the Penguin franchise is a UFA at season's end, the season hasn't ended, which means the hometown has the advantage. That is not to say that this is a lock. It's not even close.

Mario has set this up so there is maximum pressure on the politicians. These guys realize the economic downfall that will occur if the team leaves. These guys also realize that, with this economic downfall, their political careers could be on the line. Lets face it, politicians are liars, but they have to do things for the community/region/state or they won't ever get to the point where their lies are worth anything.

For every city Mario visits and discusses arena lease issues, he will return to Pittsburgh and discuss those issues with the PA and Pittsburgh politicians. The ball is in their court. They know what has to be done to keep the team. And, if you think Lemieux is out to sell to the highest bidder, why is the team not for sale? Why isn't he just saying, "Bid away, highest bidder at the end of January takes the team?" He took the team off the market so HE could get an arena deal in Pittsburgh because he knows that many potential owners won't do so.

By no means is this a slam dunk, but if any city has the advantage right now, it's Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh has the opportunity to match any lease offered anywhere in the country. If Pittsburgh can do so, Mario won't move the team.

I understand you are very interested in the situation and you have your opinions. That's fine. But I can tell you that we Penguin fans have been following this for years -- not months. We've followed this since Boots tried to buy the team in, I believe, 2003. We've followed this since Lemieux bought the team in 1999. We've followed this since Baldwin turned down a new arena deal in the mid 1990s. With all due respect, I think we have a bit more complete information regarding Plan B. And, when I say "we" I mean the collective we -- primarily Draftnik and CP2, who have experience with such dealings.

So, while you claim to come here in peace, you certainly are refuting and ignoring a whole bunch of information thrown your way. Once you reach that point -- and you already have -- you will lose respect and won't regain it. It's quite simple. Unless you come up with hard proof for your opinions and actaully realize that what is being told to you is FACT, not opinion, you will likely be ignored or responded to with sarcasm. If you truely want information, I suggest you figure out a better way to communicate with the people on this board.
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