Flight 93 Memorial... unbelievable.

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Flight 93 Memorial... unbelievable.

Postby FallenHero96 on Thu May 04, 2006 8:16 pm

Has anyone seen this?

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05253/569055.stm

"There's a growing outcry that one element of the newly chosen Flight 93 National Memorial represents Islam and is a slap in the face to the passengers and crew members who died on the hijacked plane four years ago. The winning design, announced Wednesday in Washington, D.C., includes what is called the "Crescent of Embrace." That element of the project calls for two rows of red maple trees to be planted around a bowl-shaped piece of land adjacent to the crash site. The trees, according to the architects, are there to create a physical edge to the landscape and accentuate the topography.

Almost immediately upon seeing the design, online bloggers suggested that it is inappropriate to use a red crescent in the memorial.

To many, that shape represents Islam, and the symbol is used on the flags of several Muslim countries, including Turkey, Pakistan and Uzbekistan."



Image


Does anyone else have a problem with this? I am stunned that they would choose something like this for the memorial. Why would anyone even take the chance of placing a symbol that could represent the religon of Islam on a memorial from 9/11 is beyond me. What are these people thinking?
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Postby Jim on Fri May 05, 2006 7:14 am

My problem is that they have about $55 million set aside for this. $55 million. Here's and idea. Give $500,000, tax free, to the families of each of the passangers. THAT ould go a heck of a lot further for them than some landscaping in central Pennsylvania would.
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Postby NIN on Fri May 05, 2006 9:08 am

First South Park isn't allowed to exploit the Muslem prophet -now this? Well at least they are still allowed to show Jesus and the President deficating on the American flag. :roll:

They should have a memorial for everyone of the passengers. If they are Christian then of course there should be a holy cross there for him/her. If a particular victim happened to be muslem then make a monument for that person with their holy mark, whatever it may be. To dominate the whole sceen by one particular symbol that may loosly resemble Islam or something is not acceptable.

I realize that our President is a huge **** and he is trying to conform to the Islam way of thinking by glorifying their way of life but give me a break. Should the women here start covering up their faces too? There is a limit to how much tolerance we Americans should learn.

Anything even REMOTELY resembling what those religious murderers beleived in should not even be considered. I can't think of a word stronger than disgrace.
Last edited by NIN on Fri May 05, 2006 9:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Flight 93 Memorial... unbelievable.

Postby Daniel on Fri May 05, 2006 11:02 am

FallenHero96 wrote:Does anyone else have a problem with this? I am stunned that they would choose something like this for the memorial. Why would anyone even take the chance of placing a symbol that could represent the religon of Islam on a memorial from 9/11 is beyond me. What are these people thinking?


I don't. These people represent the Islam religion as much as Timothy McVie represented Christians (or whatever religion he was).
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Re: Flight 93 Memorial... unbelievable.

Postby Mad City Mike on Fri May 05, 2006 11:21 am

Daniel wrote:
FallenHero96 wrote:Does anyone else have a problem with this? I am stunned that they would choose something like this for the memorial. Why would anyone even take the chance of placing a symbol that could represent the religon of Islam on a memorial from 9/11 is beyond me. What are these people thinking?


I don't. These people represent the Islam religion as much as Timothy McVie represented Christians (or whatever religion he was).


I don't thuink you can draw that distinction. McVeigh did what he did for his own personal reasons, whether he was a Christian or not. The 9/11 gang did what they did in the name of their religion. That's why I think it would indeed be inappropriate to have any symbol that could be construed as a Muslim emblem on this site.

I realize they don't represent most Muslims, but they did do it for that cause. A more appropriate analogy might be that the IRA does not represent most Catholics. They, too, do what they do in the name of religion.
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Postby Sam's Drunk Dog on Fri May 05, 2006 11:28 am

Although the design resembles an Islamic Crescent, that was not the intent of the artist/ architect.

The maple trees that make up the cresent will only be red in the fall according to the article.

Also, this article is from September of last year. I vaguely recall hearing about the possibility of redesigning the memorial.

If anything they should just use trees that will turn orange or yellow. Or use black maples or another type of tree like cherry.

I'll look for a more up-to-date article when I have time.
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Postby FallenHero96 on Fri May 05, 2006 11:58 am

MCM is right, it's inappropriate. Even if it wasn't the intent, it doesnt matter.

I didn't realize the article was out of date, a friend of mine told me about it yesterday. Sorry about that.
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Postby Hockeynut! on Fri May 05, 2006 12:00 pm

I live in Somerset county and this whole "debate" is insane. The monument in no way glorifies Islam. Anyone who has so much free time on their hands that they need to try to come up with conspiracy theories and find hatred for the design has deep, personal problems.
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Postby Sam's Drunk Dog on Fri May 05, 2006 12:13 pm

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Postby FallenHero96 on Fri May 05, 2006 12:16 pm

Hockeynut! wrote:I live in Somerset county and this whole "debate" is insane. The monument in no way glorifies Islam. Anyone who has so much free time on their hands that they need to try to come up with conspiracy theories and find hatred for the design has deep, personal problems.


Why do you act like we have no basis for argument? What is the conspiracy theory? I didnt see anyone with a conspiracy theory, where did that come from? You either think having a symbol that represents Islam on a memorial is ok, or isnt. Despite the intention, it is there in plain view.
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Postby FallenHero96 on Fri May 05, 2006 12:20 pm

Thanks very much for that updated link. I am happy to see that common sense prevailed and they changed it.
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Postby Jim on Fri May 05, 2006 12:25 pm

I still say it is an extreme waste of money. If you want to honor the people that lost their lives, give the money to their families.
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Re: Flight 93 Memorial... unbelievable.

Postby Daniel on Fri May 05, 2006 12:33 pm

Mad City Mike wrote:A more appropriate analogy might be that the IRA does not represent most Catholics. They, too, do what they do in the name of religion.


Whatever, the point remains the same. A few nuts don't represent a religion as a whole.
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Postby Hockeynut! on Fri May 05, 2006 12:34 pm

FallenHero96 wrote:Why do you act like we have no basis for argument? What is the conspiracy theory? I didnt see anyone with a conspiracy theory, where did that come from? You either think having a symbol that represents Islam on a memorial is ok, or isnt. Despite the intention, it is there in plain view.


FallenHero, I wasn'tt talking about you, I'm talking about every racist nutjob who I've had to hear talking incessantly about this since the design was announced and some crackpot preacher (without a church) said it glorified the terrorists. This debate has been going on for months in Somerset.

The crescent isn't a 100% muslim symbol. It's not a 100% religious symbol. The term crescent was used as an architectural term. The design was changed (ie reworded and a few more trees added) a few months ago.

Overwhelmingly, the familes of the victimes from Flight 93 supported the design. And by overwhelmingly, it's ober 95% of them, maybe even higher. That's good enough for me.

And I agree with Jim, it's a huge waste of money, regardless of the design.
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Postby Jim on Fri May 05, 2006 12:37 pm

Hockeynut! wrote:This debate has been going on for months in Somerset.


You mean all 7 people are talking about it?


Hockeynut! wrote:And I agree with Jim...


Smart people usually do.
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Postby FallenHero96 on Fri May 05, 2006 12:42 pm

I can agree with it being a huge waste of money. It's nice to have a fancy memorial and all, but 55 million dollars is truly excessive. I agree it would be good to give that money to the families, or at least a fund to put their kids through college or something similar to that.
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Postby Jim on Fri May 05, 2006 12:46 pm

I brought the $55m amount into this, but that was just what I heard. I can not say that is wht it costs. It could me $5M it could be $200M.
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I think a nice fitting tribute would be

Postby rasbatch on Fri May 05, 2006 12:50 pm

to get the guy that perpetrated the whole event, instead we'll blow all our dough in Iraq
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Postby FallenHero96 on Fri May 05, 2006 12:53 pm

It was somewhere upwards of 55 million. I actually heard 70 million if you count how much it cost for the land also.
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Postby spoon on Fri May 05, 2006 2:42 pm

only took ya 7 months to find out about it. must be getting caught up on back issues of the PG :lol:
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Postby Ace on Sat May 06, 2006 8:29 am

Being, quite possibly, one of the few if any Muslims on this board, i feel i have to make some comments. The over analysis of the Crescent shape is rather silly, however, I am glad that they came up with a revised plan that would be less contraversial.

One of the quotes that were made in the original article stuck out for me:

"People forget Muslims died [in the attacks], too," Ahmed said. "Islam, as a religion itself, was hijacked on 9/11."

I can assure you that the religion itself does not condone violence against others.....no religion does. The interpretation that some have of staging a Holy War becomes the grey area, which causes suicide bombings, and attacks like the ones on 9/11.

Perhaps I'm a little influenced by being born and raised in North America, and as a Muslim don't see how the attacks are justified as calling it a Holy War. Americans are perceived as the enemy in the Muslim world, there is no doubt about that, and having visited family back "home", i know that for a fact.

However, Iraq was as much a threat to US, as Americans are a threat to the religion of Islam. 2 wrongs don't make a right any way you look at it.

Just my two cents, and hope have not offended anyone, and nor is there any hatred for posters because of their religious beliefs, or what country they are from.
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