Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby shoeshine boy on Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:21 am

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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby DelPen on Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:26 am

So the only guy the prosecution can find who saw the fight testifies that Zimmerman was always on the bottom, he say Martin's arms going downward but couldn't see punches and thinks that it was Zimmerman crying out for help.

How many more witnesses does the prosecution have before this is dismissed? Unless they are waiting to drop a bomb shell all the testimony given supports a self defense case.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby shoeshine boy on Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:44 am

agreed. I knew very little about this case before I started watching the trial. I had heard of it but didn't really read any of the news stories when it happened. if I was on that jury I'd be wondering wtf the prosecution is doing right now.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby Kaizer on Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:51 pm

the police first responder pretty much corroborates zimmerman's story about his injuries.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby DropEmJayBird on Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:13 pm

shoeshine boy wrote:an interesting read: http://ideas.time.com/2013/06/28/rachel ... ?hpt=hp_t2


I know you are just sharing it, but what a load of trash.

This court case was brought for one reason - to stoke racial tension. The evidence is non existent, the "star witnesses" contradict themselves minutes after taking the stand. When one main witness bases her idea of who she thought was the "bigger of the two men" on the laughable child photos spread by the media - and actually admits that in court, the trial has become a joke.

This is embarassing, and to know that the only reason it was brought forth is due to the racial overtones is disgusting, especially when people (like the author of the article above) still describe Zimmerman as a white.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby shafnutz05 on Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:15 pm

Sadly, this was all predictable from the very beginning. The media narrative began as soon as they started using the baby-faced, horribly outdated photo of Trayvon and started plastering it everywhere.

I would think no jury on the planet could convict based on this trial, even with how bad the defense is, but the prosecution's case really is that bad.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby shmenguin on Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:23 pm

shafnutz05 wrote:I would think no jury on the planet could convict based on this trial, even with how bad the defense is, but the prosecution's case really is that bad.


you'd think that. you'd also think that the guy who runs our country wouldn't go on TV and make some stupid, phony, inflammatory speech on the matter either. nothing would surprise me about how this ends up.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby shafnutz05 on Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:24 pm

shmenguin wrote:
shafnutz05 wrote:I would think no jury on the planet could convict based on this trial, even with how bad the defense is, but the prosecution's case really is that bad.


you'd think that. you'd also think that the guy who runs our country wouldn't go on TV and make some stupid, phony, inflammatory speech on the matter either. nothing would surprise me about how this ends up.


Touché. I really think the all-female jury is the wild card in this situation.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby ulf on Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:27 pm

I don't get what the all female jury has to do with it.. Are females less rational, or what are you trying to say?

:pop:
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby Hockeynut! on Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:27 pm

shafnutz05 wrote:
Touché. I really think the all-female jury is the wild card in this situation.


Yes, we know those estrogen filled women aren't smart enough to reach a verdict based on the evidence... :pop:


Totally kidding
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby shafnutz05 on Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:29 pm

Lol at yinz both. Please don't reignite gender questions ITT.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby Hockeynut! on Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:32 pm

sexistnutz05 wrote:Lol at yinz both. Please don't reignite gender questions ITT.


Okay...
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby shafnutz05 on Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:41 pm

Hockeynut! wrote:
sexistnutz05 wrote:Lol at yinz both. Please don't reignite gender questions ITT.


Okay...


Please refer to the "Men are from Mars, Woman are from Venus" thread.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby Firebird on Fri Jun 28, 2013 6:38 pm

This never would've made it to trial if the police released the photo's of a beat up Zimmerman, as opposed to waiting 2 months.

Also showing TM 5 years younger and Zimmerman only w/ his mug shot didn't help either
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby Kaizer on Fri Jun 28, 2013 6:48 pm

The main question is still the same. Is GZ criminally responsible for the kids death because he didn't leave him alone. Probably unanswerable.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby Geezer on Fri Jun 28, 2013 7:30 pm

shafnutz05 wrote:Sadly, this was all predictable from the very beginning. The media narrative began as soon as they started using the baby-faced, horribly outdated photo of Trayvon and started plastering it everywhere.

I would think no jury on the planet could convict based on this trial, even with how bad the defense is, but the prosecution's case really is that bad.

Charging 2nd degree murder was a politically based overreach. This should have been a manslaughter case
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby columbia on Fri Jun 28, 2013 7:33 pm

Geezer wrote:This should have been a manslaughter case


From what I know, I tend to agree with this.

Man chases down another, who is seemingly minding his own business.
The latter ends up dead.

Political histrionics aside, I don't see why people would rush to defend GZ.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby shafnutz05 on Fri Jun 28, 2013 7:36 pm

columbia wrote:
Geezer wrote:This should have been a manslaughter case


From what I know, I tend to agree with this.

Man chases down another, who is seemingly minding his own business.
The latter ends up dead.

Political histrionics aside, I don't see why people would rush to defend GZ.


To be honest, I think much of the immediate defense of him came from the fact that he was immediately tried, convicted, and executed in the media, Hollywood, etc. You even had Obama making a stupid speech about how "Trayvon looked like one of his children".

George Zimmerman may be a total frigging jerk. But for me, the initial one or two weeks of the Trayvon Martin saga nauseated me to the point of no return.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby Froggy on Fri Jun 28, 2013 7:36 pm

maybe because he's clearly NOT GUILTY of the crime he is accused of? not saying he's innocent... just not saying what he did was legally "murder"
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby columbia on Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:02 pm

A manslaughter conviction would have seemed to have been the correct outcome.
Either way, Martin would be alive today if GZ had minded his own business.

From a moral standpoint, that should be tough to overlook.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby shafnutz05 on Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:05 pm

columbia wrote:A manslaughter conviction would have seemed to have been the correct outcome.
Either way, Martin would be alive today if GZ had minded his own business.

From a moral standpoint, that should be tough to overlook.


Say I am approached by a neighborhood watch officer, minding my own business walking down the sidewalk. He asks what my business is. I get nervous, and attack him, and end up on top of him (as multiple witness accounts corroborate). He panics as I am wailing on him/smashing his head on the ground, and he ends up shooting me. I die from my wounds.

I get what you are saying, but assuming most of the accounts thus far are correct, Trayvon shoulders his share of blame for what happened.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby columbia on Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:08 pm

You're assuming that Zimmerman wasn't on top on him first.
We don't really know....but I don't have any sympathy for the one that survived and created the incident.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby shafnutz05 on Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:11 pm

columbia wrote:You're assuming that Zimmerman wasn't on top on him first.
We don't really know....but I don't have any sympathy for the one that survived and created the incident.


TBH, I don't think we know enough to pass judgment. If GZ was just some random schmuck, that's one thing. But he WAS a neighborhood patrol officer (we can debate the merits of that job on another day). I don't have an excess of sympathy for the 17 year odl "kid" that posted photos of himself holding illegal handguns.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby Shyster on Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:19 pm

shafnutz05 wrote:TBH, I don't think we know enough to pass judgment. If GZ was just some random schmuck, that's one thing. But he WAS a neighborhood patrol officer (we can debate the merits of that job on another day). I don't have an excess of sympathy for the 17 year odl "kid" that posted photos of himself holding illegal handguns.

It wasn't clear who was holding the pistol, but Martin's cell phone did indeed have close-up pictures of someone holding a handgun. The gun in question was a S&W Sigma, which tells me that whoever it was, they have poor taste.*


*While S&W has a great reputation and over its long existence has made many, many excellent firearms, the Sigma series of pistols is—to put it politely—not generally counted among the company's better works.
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Re: Shooting Reignites Racial Questions

Postby MWB on Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:11 pm

shafnutz05 wrote:
columbia wrote:You're assuming that Zimmerman wasn't on top on him first.
We don't really know....but I don't have any sympathy for the one that survived and created the incident.


TBH, I don't think we know enough to pass judgment. If GZ was just some random schmuck, that's one thing. But he WAS a neighborhood patrol officer (we can debate the merits of that job on another day). I don't have an excess of sympathy for the 17 year odl "kid" that posted photos of himself holding illegal handguns.


"Neighborhood patrol officer" doesn't give him any more rights or training than anyone else. I think I might actually be a part of our neighborhood watch and I don't recall any training. And he also called the police, correct?
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