The Walking Dead

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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby FreeCandy44 on Mon Nov 18, 2013 11:16 pm

PensFanInDC wrote:Maybe he was coming to warn the prison.

He might actually be looking for a place to stay.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby offsides on Mon Nov 18, 2013 11:26 pm

Hockeynut! wrote:I think it could have been accomplished in 15 min rather than an entire ep (or 2 or 3). He's such an annoying character and I don't buy him being redeemed. It's like redeeming Bashar Al-Assad, I'm not buying it. And the whole "failed father finds redemption through a surrogate family" subplot is pretty cliched. When he grabbed the little girl, I kept hoping he'd throw her to the zombies to facilitate his own escape. That would have seemed more believable than what they were feeding us last night. :lol:


I agree, disappointing letdown.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby PensFanInDC on Mon Nov 18, 2013 11:56 pm

FreeCandy44 wrote:
PensFanInDC wrote:Maybe he was coming to warn the prison.

He might actually be looking for a place to stay.


Hey Rick. Sorry I shot RPGs at ya. Mind if I crash here?
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby Hockeynut! on Mon Nov 18, 2013 11:59 pm

PensFanInDC wrote:
FreeCandy44 wrote:
PensFanInDC wrote:Maybe he was coming to warn the prison.

He might actually be looking for a place to stay.


Hey Rick. Sorry I shot RPGs at ya. Mind if I crash here?


And I promise you that I won't kill a bunch of your innocent people like I did my own.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby FreeCandy44 on Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:41 am

Not many people left at the prison to kill boys.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby nocera on Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:10 am

offsides wrote:
Hockeynut! wrote:I think it could have been accomplished in 15 min rather than an entire ep (or 2 or 3). He's such an annoying character and I don't buy him being redeemed. It's like redeeming Bashar Al-Assad, I'm not buying it. And the whole "failed father finds redemption through a surrogate family" subplot is pretty cliched. When he grabbed the little girl, I kept hoping he'd throw her to the zombies to facilitate his own escape. That would have seemed more believable than what they were feeding us last night. :lol:


I agree, disappointing letdown.


No way he's redeemed. That family is going to die and he's going to be an angry governor again.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby largegarlic on Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:18 am

I thought this week's episode was reasonably good in a vacuum, but doesn't seem to bode well for the overall plot on the show. If the governor reverts to the masochistic, power-hungry guy from last season, we basically have last season's plot play out again. If he is "redeemed" and stays that way, maybe he goes back to make a truce with Rick and the prison people and we have that discussion about whether they forgive him or not, but that's more or less the Merle plot line from last season.

So, maybe the writers have something interesting to pull out of this, but I'm not sure I see how this is going to work.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby DropEmJayBird on Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:51 pm

"Oh Hi Gov... Sure, I just kicked out Carol for killing two infected people because she thought it was the right thing to do - but you... why not.. I mean come on in. All is forgiven"


I see no way they can pull a redemption with Rick after Rick just sent Carol packing. It wouldn't be believable at all and based on the storyline - everyone in that prison would shoot the Gov on sight given what he's done.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby DropEmJayBird on Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:51 pm

I keep saying to this people around the office.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby shmenguin on Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:53 pm

the last show runner was dumb enough to have the gang welcome back the governor. the guy in charge now has better sensibilities - despite this current colossal failure
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby JeffDFD on Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:27 pm

People get so angry at this show...haha. I suppose it is a case of people really like the zombie genre and this is all we have or is it something else? Is it the comic book readers who are super critical? I am in the camp that is happy to have the show and just sit back and enjoy it despite the annoyances that crop up. I see some of the things you guys are complaining about, but can largely ignore them and enjoy the good parts. Again, I will say I really liked this episode, but kind of had to watch it as a stand alone show apart from the rest. I would love to see someone else try to compete with tWD, but doubt that would happen. I think it would be sweet to do a World War Z (again, the book, not the movie) type tv show where you see different people's stories kind of like this episode was. Maybe someone with more money/freedom so there isn't restrictions like we have heard AMC has given tWD...HBO or Netflix or something...I can dream I suppose...but I will enjoy tWD in the meantime.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby Hockeynut! on Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:40 pm

I've never read the comics. I thought this season was pretty great, until the last episode. It just ground everything to a halt. I don't even mind the return of the Gov, just wish it would have been 1/3 or 1/2 or the episode, not the whole thing.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby columbia on Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:42 pm

That was the first real character development of the Governor, so I liked that....I guess.
It seems like they had better have a very good reason for bringing him back.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby JeffDFD on Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:48 pm

Hockeynut! wrote:I've never read the comics. I thought this season was pretty great, until the last episode. It just ground everything to a halt. I don't even mind the return of the Gov, just wish it would have been 1/3 or 1/2 or the episode, not the whole thing.


Yeah, I get that...I also thought most everything was resolved a bit too much in the previous episode as well...Glen is fine and they got the meds and it gave the impression that the day was saved there. That bothered me a bit..."Hey, back from the vet - everyone is healthy now". The only main unresolved story line in the prison is the fact that Carol was sent away and they need to talk about it. Other than that...there are several things they are about to get into but haven't yet. We saw the governor outside the prison for 2 seconds and jumped right into a whole episode about him...the transition was a bit sudden and I think that bothered most people. Maybe it would have gone better if they took half of the governor's story and saved blended it in with some prison stuff so we had 2-3 episodes where we got part prison stuff and part governor story until we saw the whole thing.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby shmenguin on Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:55 pm

JeffDFD wrote:People get so angry at this show...haha. I suppose it is a case of people really like the zombie genre and this is all we have or is it something else?


i hate wasting a good premise with terrible execution. it's the same reason that dexter is so irritating.

and i've spent the last few weeks praising this season, so i'm not just sitting here waiting to poke holes. this is a stupid move which, i don't think, is coming from an artistic place. AMC saves a lot of money when they eliminate 90% of the regular cast in a given episode. and they have a history of being very, very dodgy with this show's budget. also, the current show runner is sadly left with the last dill hole's baggage. the governor is the prime example. he's a crap character that they need to resurrect simply out of obligation. also, AMC is likely using this as a way to put feelers out there for their spinoff strategy.

i don't think this is part of a natural story telling arc. this is all business. which i don't appreciate.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby JeffDFD on Tue Nov 19, 2013 2:00 pm

shmenguin wrote:
JeffDFD wrote:People get so angry at this show...haha. I suppose it is a case of people really like the zombie genre and this is all we have or is it something else?


i hate wasting a good premise with terrible execution. it's the same reason that dexter is so irritating.

and i've spent the last few weeks praising this season, so i'm not just sitting here waiting to poke holes. this is a stupid move which, i don't think, is coming from an artistic place. AMC saves a lot of money when they eliminate 90% of the regular cast in a given episode. and they have a history of being very, very dodgy with this show's budget. also, the current show runner is sadly left with the last dill hole's baggage. the governor is the prime example. he's a crap character that they need to resurrect simply out of obligation. also, AMC is likely using this as a way to put feelers out there for their spinoff strategy.

i don't think this is part of a natural story telling arc. this is all business. which i don't appreciate.


I'm not disagreeing with you. Everyone complained about season 2 sitting at the farm for so long and I believe that was a budget thing by AMC so it is a real shame when 1) The person in charge is doing a bad job with they story and/or 2) The person in charge is restricted and can't do what he wants resulting in a bad job.

I hate all this spinoff crap. HIMYM is trying to do a spinoff I think is a bad idea as well because the show itself needed to end a season or so ago. I am OK with Breaking Bad trying to do a spinoff with Better Call Saul, because it is a completely different direction then the show, Breaking Bad is over, Breaking Bad went out on top and could have gone longer itself. That said, it could still be a bad idea and fail, but is perhaps worth the effort. There is a lot to do with tWD and they don't always do it right...I would rather have 1 awesome show then two half-brained (ahhh, see what I did there?...get it...brains!!! Ok, sorry) ones.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby shmenguin on Tue Nov 19, 2013 2:09 pm

last year, i thought the problems with this show ran pretty deep. but really, it was just andrea, lori and the show runner (glen mazzara) that were ruining everything. they fixed the glitches and came back strong this year. i don't really care about the spinoff either way. these types of shows live and die with the creative minds behind them. that's why frank darabont was able to make season 1 as good as it was, despite being given the same shoddy treatment from the network. so as long as it doesn't impose creative limitations on TWD, the spinoff is a non-issue to me.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby nocera on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:17 pm

I'll check out the spinoff just out of curiosity. If it's good, I'll watch it. If it's not, I won't. It's a win-win situation.

Historically, spinoffs don't usually do well. Unless you're talking about Frasier. Or Melrose Place. Or Angel. Or Saved By the Bell. Or Daria. Or the Simpons. ... You guys, this spinoff might be great.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby DelPen on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:21 pm

I doubt many people even knew this was a comic book running for almost a decade before the TV show was even made.

And the comic is at times even dumber than the show.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby Spangler on Tue Nov 19, 2013 6:54 pm

Lori was one of the worst written characters in TV history.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby columbia on Tue Nov 19, 2013 7:19 pm

Spangler wrote:Lori was one of the worst written characters in TV history.


She's also a horrible actress, which has been a general problem with the show.
The dude who plays Rick is pretty much a hack.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby GaryRissling on Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:06 pm

Been meaning to get into this show for a while now...Just started S01E01.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby PensFanInDC on Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:53 pm

GaryRissling wrote:Been meaning to get into this show for a while now...Just started S01E01.


No matter how much you like the show it's (apparently) the "in" thing to bash it relentlessly and talk about how much you hate it....but keep watching.... :D
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby JiriSlegr on Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:46 pm

I've read the comics, but I think the show suffers from an overall lack of strong writing. Some of it is good, some of it is great, but the majority of it is stock shlock there to keep the viewers coming back. Which is sad, because the flashes of greatness are awesome....but only come along once or twice a season.

I enjoy watching the show for what it is: mindless entertainment. It could be more, but I'd say that the Walking Dead is a show cursed with extremely good ratings. Which is insane, right?! Ratings are good and mean money! Except that it's money, and that opens the door for producers poking their fingers in places where they don't belong.

Producer: Hey guy that directed the number one movie on the IMDB top 250 list, I know you created a show that's making us lots of money and has insane viewership, but how about...you make us more money. As in, less zombies (who wants to pay extras?). As in, interior shots and green screens. And outdoor shots on vacant lots that we own (forcing characters into one stagnant place for extended periods of time). Who cares if it makes no sense for the story to stay in one place so long? Stretch it out! And you know what else? We want more screen time with the characters that people want to see (you know, the ones that fans scream about at conventions). You don't agree with that, Darabont? You're fired! And we'll bring in someone that will do what we say.

And season 2 happens...

You have a bunch of writers writing stories that someone else thinks are awesome and will make money and suddenly the characters are unlikable (mom's that keep forgetting they have a son while constantly searching for another woman's lost daughter). They all stay in one place, never talking about what should happen next...just sitting in the southern sun...while the insects drone. And doing stupid relationship things because of sex.

All while committing the worst sin in good writing: becoming repetitive. They talk about the same things again and again. They are selfish and create problems that don't exist. And as a result, viewers lose interest.

Wait--what happened? People aren't loving this? They loved the zombies? But that costs money...and well...what do we do?

You kill the characters that you turned to **** to force a redemption story.

Lori's the worst mother ever and changes her mind every other line? Done-zo.

Dale wants to leave the show--oopsie.

We turned Andrea, the most amazing character from the comics, into a complete idiot? Let's have her say she tried and blow her brains out.

Introduce the governor and create a bad guy. Things get exciting again! The guy's a good actor, and the governor is truly evil.

But not really that evil. I mean, he acts evil. And we say he's evil. And make him look evil. Like stare into the distance evil. And he kills characters that the audience doesn't know, so that makes him evil. You know.

But we can't kill him. I mean, ratings. Keep him alive and we can force even more conflict!

At the end of the day TV is about money. These are people trying to make lots and lots of money and the WD crew are doing it extremely well. And I watch it, and I enjoy it, so I can't complain too much. I just wish it was a show that stuck with the vision that we all saw in that first season. Instead, it's more of a week to week show that might be good and might be really really terrible.
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Re: The Walking Dead

Postby Defence21 on Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:22 am

JiriSlegr wrote:I've read the comics, but I think the show suffers from an overall lack of strong writing. Some of it is good, some of it is great, but the majority of it is stock shlock there to keep the viewers coming back. Which is sad, because the flashes of greatness are awesome....but only come along once or twice a season.

I enjoy watching the show for what it is: mindless entertainment. It could be more, but I'd say that the Walking Dead is a show cursed with extremely good ratings. Which is insane, right?! Ratings are good and mean money! Except that it's money, and that opens the door for producers poking their fingers in places where they don't belong.

Producer: Hey guy that directed the number one movie on the IMDB top 250 list, I know you created a show that's making us lots of money and has insane viewership, but how about...you make us more money. As in, less zombies (who wants to pay extras?). As in, interior shots and green screens. And outdoor shots on vacant lots that we own (forcing characters into one stagnant place for extended periods of time). Who cares if it makes no sense for the story to stay in one place so long? Stretch it out! And you know what else? We want more screen time with the characters that people want to see (you know, the ones that fans scream about at conventions). You don't agree with that, Darabont? You're fired! And we'll bring in someone that will do what we say.

And season 2 happens...

You have a bunch of writers writing stories that someone else thinks are awesome and will make money and suddenly the characters are unlikable (mom's that keep forgetting they have a son while constantly searching for another woman's lost daughter). They all stay in one place, never talking about what should happen next...just sitting in the southern sun...while the insects drone. And doing stupid relationship things because of sex.

All while committing the worst sin in good writing: becoming repetitive. They talk about the same things again and again. They are selfish and create problems that don't exist. And as a result, viewers lose interest.

Wait--what happened? People aren't loving this? They loved the zombies? But that costs money...and well...what do we do?

You kill the characters that you turned to **** to force a redemption story.

Lori's the worst mother ever and changes her mind every other line? Done-zo.

Dale wants to leave the show--oopsie.

We turned Andrea, the most amazing character from the comics, into a complete idiot? Let's have her say she tried and blow her brains out.

Introduce the governor and create a bad guy. Things get exciting again! The guy's a good actor, and the governor is truly evil.

But not really that evil. I mean, he acts evil. And we say he's evil. And make him look evil. Like stare into the distance evil. And he kills characters that the audience doesn't know, so that makes him evil. You know.

But we can't kill him. I mean, ratings. Keep him alive and we can force even more conflict!

At the end of the day TV is about money. These are people trying to make lots and lots of money and the WD crew are doing it extremely well. And I watch it, and I enjoy it, so I can't complain too much. I just wish it was a show that stuck with the vision that we all saw in that first season. Instead, it's more of a week to week show that might be good and might be really really terrible.

See, this is the problem, though, really. The show gets huge ratings because so many people tune in and watch. They're not a victim of their ratings. Their ratings indicate the show's success. It's usually the case that the negative remarks always will be the most vocal -- but you come on here and read nothing but negatives. Stop watching the show if it's that bad. If the writing is terrible, why watch? If the characters are so poorly-developed, why watch? If the acting is so ridiculous, why watch? It's not like we don't have other options in 2013.

The problem is that some people expect absolute perfection, and even then, it likely wouldn't be good enough. It's not "mindless," as you put it. Sure, it has flaws, some of which easily can be pointed out -- but who cares? One of my favorite parts of watching the Walking Dead is the mindful discussion I have with my wife, friends, and co-workers after each episode dissecting why things happened, what they are leading to, etc. Like literature, there's a lot of this show that is open for individual interpretation. That's not common with most TV shows, and that's a big part of what sets the Walking Dead apart from other shows -- and precisely what makes it quite the opposite of "mindless."

Stop looking for perfection. Start looking for entertainment. If it doesn't satisfy, stop watching.
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