Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

Postby Dickie Dunn on Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:26 am

slappybrown wrote:
Dickie Dunn wrote:
slappybrown wrote:I think you're crazy if you believe that Tomlin's resume is superior to Cowher's at this point.


Better winning percentage (his winning percentage right now is the same as Cowher's through six seasons), same Super Bowl record, hasn't made a mess of AFC Championship games against lesser opponents, three division titles in five completed seasons. Tomlin has accomplished in five years what took Cowher 15 years to do.

Come talk to me when Tomlin posts 12 playoff seasons in 15 years, and makes 6 AFC champ games. This argument suggests that anything other than a Super Bowl appearance/win and the results are of little value. Only in PGH.

Rocco's point is pretty powerful as well.


Cowher made the playoffs 10 of his 15 seasons, not 12.

LeopardLetang wrote:
Pavel Bure wrote:
Tim Thomasen wrote:I hear the argument on the radio (and everytime that argument gets dismissed for good reason) that Tomlin only won because of Cowher's players. If that's the case, why didn't Cowher win more with Cowher's players?

People forget that despite all the good teams Cowher had, it took him 13 seasons to win the SB (you could make the case that we won because we got alot of favorable calls from the refs) and you and in the process lost a lot of big AFC title games at home, including one in 1994 where they lost to a very beatable Chargers team. Not to mention his last season he mailed it in

Tomlin comes in and within a span of five years has kept the team competitive and made two SB appearances and winning one.

To me, both are good but flawed coaches that I'm happy to say they coached our team.

Eh even if the Steelers beat that "very beatable" Chargers team the juggernaut of the Young/Rice 49ers loomed. It didn't matter who came out of the AFC that year. The 49ers were going to crush.


wholeheartedly disagree about crush. would have been a 10-13 point game instead of a 45 or whatever it was.

on the conversation as a whole, tomlin has roethlisberger. tomlin has roethlisberger. tomlin has roethlisberger.

he's a good coach, but, see above


Yea, Tomlin has Roethlisberger. Chuck Noll had Bradshaw. Walsh had Montana. Belicheck has Brady. Lombardi had Starr. Johnson had Aikman. McCarthy has Rodgers. Coughlin has Manning. Shanahan had Elway. Shula had Greise. Landry had Staubach. Oh hell look, Cowher had Roethlisberger as well and didn't win the Super Bowl until he had him. Its pretty damn easy to make a correlation between good coaches having good quarterbacks. Acting like Roethlisberger's existence makes Tomlin less of a coach is asinine.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

Postby LeopardLetang on Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:33 am

that's sort of what i'm saying though. cowher almost made it work without roethlisberger over a long period of time. i give him good credit for that. i still say tomlin's a good coach, but i'm not convinced he'd do better than cowher without roethlisberger. he needs to win another super bowl with big ben to be at least equal to cowher in my opinion. i'd still give tomlin the slight nod in that case, but he also had a huge advantage if so.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

Postby Pavel Bure on Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:59 am

LeopardLetang wrote:
Pavel Bure wrote:
Tim Thomasen wrote:I hear the argument on the radio (and everytime that argument gets dismissed for good reason) that Tomlin only won because of Cowher's players. If that's the case, why didn't Cowher win more with Cowher's players?

People forget that despite all the good teams Cowher had, it took him 13 seasons to win the SB (you could make the case that we won because we got alot of favorable calls from the refs) and you and in the process lost a lot of big AFC title games at home, including one in 1994 where they lost to a very beatable Chargers team. Not to mention his last season he mailed it in

Tomlin comes in and within a span of five years has kept the team competitive and made two SB appearances and winning one.

To me, both are good but flawed coaches that I'm happy to say they coached our team.

Eh even if the Steelers beat that "very beatable" Chargers team the juggernaut of the Young/Rice 49ers loomed. It didn't matter who came out of the AFC that year. The 49ers were going to crush.


wholeheartedly disagree about crush. would have been a 10-13 point game instead of a 45 or whatever it was.

on the conversation as a whole, tomlin has roethlisberger. tomlin has roethlisberger. tomlin has roethlisberger.

he's a good coach, but, see above

You can disagree but look at that team, specifically the awards/honors section. That 49er team was the highest scoring team in the NFL, had the best WR in the NFL, had the defensive player of the year, had the NFC ROY, had the top QB in the NFL, etc. That 49ers team went right through the 2 time defending champ Cowboys who were if you remember in the 90's just a monster of a team.

On the other side the Steelers were 16th in offense for the league that year. Chargers were 5th. The Steelers and Chargers both had point differences (points scored vs. points allowed) of 82 and 75 respectively. The 49ers had a point differential of 209 along with the 6th ranked D in the league. Neither the Chargers nor the Steelers stood a logical chance in that game.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1994_San_F ... ers_season
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/1994/
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/t ... roster.htm
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

Postby shafnutz05 on Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:31 am

Image
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

Postby mac5155 on Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:37 am

Kiesel is one awesome human
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

Postby FreeCandy44 on Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:50 am

mac5155 wrote:Kiesel is one awesome human

Yes yes yes
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

Postby shmenguin on Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:53 am

good guy off the field, part of the problem on the field
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

Postby shafnutz05 on Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:54 am

shmenguin wrote:good guy off the field, part of the problem on the field


yea
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

Postby LeopardLetang on Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:05 pm

Pavel Bure wrote:
Spoiler:
LeopardLetang wrote:
Pavel Bure wrote:
Tim Thomasen wrote:I hear the argument on the radio (and everytime that argument gets dismissed for good reason) that Tomlin only won because of Cowher's players. If that's the case, why didn't Cowher win more with Cowher's players?

People forget that despite all the good teams Cowher had, it took him 13 seasons to win the SB (you could make the case that we won because we got alot of favorable calls from the refs) and you and in the process lost a lot of big AFC title games at home, including one in 1994 where they lost to a very beatable Chargers team. Not to mention his last season he mailed it in

Tomlin comes in and within a span of five years has kept the team competitive and made two SB appearances and winning one.

To me, both are good but flawed coaches that I'm happy to say they coached our team.

Eh even if the Steelers beat that "very beatable" Chargers team the juggernaut of the Young/Rice 49ers loomed. It didn't matter who came out of the AFC that year. The 49ers were going to crush.


wholeheartedly disagree about crush. would have been a 10-13 point game instead of a 45 or whatever it was.

on the conversation as a whole, tomlin has roethlisberger. tomlin has roethlisberger. tomlin has roethlisberger.

he's a good coach, but, see above

You can disagree but look at that team, specifically the awards/honors section. That 49er team was the highest scoring team in the NFL, had the best WR in the NFL, had the defensive player of the year, had the NFC ROY, had the top QB in the NFL, etc. That 49ers team went right through the 2 time defending champ Cowboys who were if you remember in the 90's just a monster of a team.

On the other side the Steelers were 16th in offense for the league that year. Chargers were 5th. The Steelers and Chargers both had point differences (points scored vs. points allowed) of 82 and 75 respectively. The 49ers had a point differential of 209 along with the 6th ranked D in the league. Neither the Chargers nor the Steelers stood a logical chance in that game.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1994_San_F ... ers_season
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/1994/
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/t ... roster.htm


appreciate the research. i agree they didn't stand a logical chance. maybe 'crush' isn't the right word, but i believe it wouldn't have been such an embarrassment. do you know what the steelers were favored by against the chargers? wasn't it double digits? i considered the steelers as much better than the chargers than the niners were than the steelers. but then the chargers beat the steelers so hah you're probably right

doing my own research:

Steelers were favored by 101⁄2 points


first google pages that came up used words like "stun" and "perhaps one of the greatest upsets in NFL history"

Pittsburgh held advantages in total plays (80–47), total offensive yards (415–226), and time of possession (37:13–22:47)
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Chargers

Postby Pavel Bure on Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:07 pm

LeopardLetang wrote:
Pavel Bure wrote:
Spoiler:
LeopardLetang wrote:
Pavel Bure wrote:
Tim Thomasen wrote:I hear the argument on the radio (and everytime that argument gets dismissed for good reason) that Tomlin only won because of Cowher's players. If that's the case, why didn't Cowher win more with Cowher's players?

People forget that despite all the good teams Cowher had, it took him 13 seasons to win the SB (you could make the case that we won because we got alot of favorable calls from the refs) and you and in the process lost a lot of big AFC title games at home, including one in 1994 where they lost to a very beatable Chargers team. Not to mention his last season he mailed it in

Tomlin comes in and within a span of five years has kept the team competitive and made two SB appearances and winning one.

To me, both are good but flawed coaches that I'm happy to say they coached our team.

Eh even if the Steelers beat that "very beatable" Chargers team the juggernaut of the Young/Rice 49ers loomed. It didn't matter who came out of the AFC that year. The 49ers were going to crush.


wholeheartedly disagree about crush. would have been a 10-13 point game instead of a 45 or whatever it was.

on the conversation as a whole, tomlin has roethlisberger. tomlin has roethlisberger. tomlin has roethlisberger.

he's a good coach, but, see above

You can disagree but look at that team, specifically the awards/honors section. That 49er team was the highest scoring team in the NFL, had the best WR in the NFL, had the defensive player of the year, had the NFC ROY, had the top QB in the NFL, etc. That 49ers team went right through the 2 time defending champ Cowboys who were if you remember in the 90's just a monster of a team.

On the other side the Steelers were 16th in offense for the league that year. Chargers were 5th. The Steelers and Chargers both had point differences (points scored vs. points allowed) of 82 and 75 respectively. The 49ers had a point differential of 209 along with the 6th ranked D in the league. Neither the Chargers nor the Steelers stood a logical chance in that game.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1994_San_F ... ers_season
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/1994/
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/t ... roster.htm


appreciate the research. i agree they didn't stand a logical chance. maybe 'crush' isn't the right word, but i believe it wouldn't have been such an embarrassment. do you know what the steelers were favored by against the chargers? wasn't it double digits? i considered the steelers as much better than the chargers than the niners were than the steelers. but then the chargers beat the steelers so hah you're probably right

doing my own research:

Steelers were favored by 101⁄2 points


first google pages that came up used words like "stun" and "perhaps one of the greatest upsets in NFL history"

Pittsburgh held advantages in total plays (80–47), total offensive yards (415–226), and time of possession (37:13–22:47)

I gotcha, I was looking more purely at the SF side of things but knowing how big of an upset the AFC Champ game was puts it into better perspective.
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