Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Troy Loney on Tue Nov 19, 2013 3:54 pm

Rocco wrote:Are we still arguing that the Steelers aren't rebuilding? Do I need to post that summary of what they did in free agency last year?



They're still restructuring contracts and having to push cap hits to future years. That's not a good rebuild.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Idoit40fans on Tue Nov 19, 2013 3:57 pm

They aren't really going to be handicapped after this season though, right? I mean they can keep money on the books and still effectively build. They could move Ben at some point, but ideally after they have his replacement.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Rocco on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:00 pm

Troy Loney wrote:
Rocco wrote:Are we still arguing that the Steelers aren't rebuilding? Do I need to post that summary of what they did in free agency last year?



They're still restructuring contracts and having to push cap hits to future years. That's not a good rebuild.


Why, because they aren't trying to bottom out the roster and go 4-12? They're rebuilding. There's no getting around it.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Troy Loney on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:07 pm

Rocco wrote:
Troy Loney wrote:
Rocco wrote:Are we still arguing that the Steelers aren't rebuilding? Do I need to post that summary of what they did in free agency last year?



They're still restructuring contracts and having to push cap hits to future years. That's not a good rebuild.


Why, because they aren't trying to bottom out the roster and go 4-12? They're rebuilding. There's no getting around it.



There's a difference between "bottoming out the roster" and saying, well, maybe we'll take that draft pick for sanders instead of fitting him under the cap.

What they're doing is not a rebuild, they're working to replace some of the aging guys. Ie, Jones for Harrison. I also understand the approach of not looking to move on from Roethlisberger until a replacement is found. But they can't take that approach with guys like Foote, Polamalu, Clark Taylor, Miller, Woodely etc.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Fast B on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:38 pm

Troy Loney wrote:The question remains, for how long does he need to maintain his 3.1 ypc till he's deemed a marginal talent?


That question is totally loaded and shouldn't even be treated seriously. He's a rookie, he's been running behind a mediocre-to-awful offensive line, and he's still easily the best running back this team has had in the last three years. What would you prefer, exactly?
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby slappybrown on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:41 pm

Troy Loney wrote:The Steelers should fold and cease operations. The end is nigh. Abandon all hope. Drive a Ruckus.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Idoit40fans on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:42 pm

Sadly, Rashard Mendenhall says hi.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Troy Loney on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:44 pm

slappybrown wrote:
Troy Loney wrote:The Steelers should fold and cease operations. The end is nigh. Abandon all hope. Drive a Ruckus.



When they come to the county asking for a new stadium...then that's the recourse.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Rocco on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:48 pm

Troy Loney wrote:
Rocco wrote:
Troy Loney wrote:
Rocco wrote:Are we still arguing that the Steelers aren't rebuilding? Do I need to post that summary of what they did in free agency last year?



They're still restructuring contracts and having to push cap hits to future years. That's not a good rebuild.


Why, because they aren't trying to bottom out the roster and go 4-12? They're rebuilding. There's no getting around it.



There's a difference between "bottoming out the roster" and saying, well, maybe we'll take that draft pick for sanders instead of fitting him under the cap.

What they're doing is not a rebuild, they're working to replace some of the aging guys. Ie, Jones for Harrison. I also understand the approach of not looking to move on from Roethlisberger until a replacement is found. But they can't take that approach with guys like Foote, Polamalu, Clark Taylor, Miller, Woodely etc.


Sanders is young and has shown promise. They decided to keep him around for this year. If they don't resign him they'll get a compensatory draft pick for him. They had the cap room and if it was the motivating force to get them to dump Colon then it was a good move.

So you're saying they should just cut people with no actual replacements lined up and start cardboard cutouts instead? As I've written before, most of those guys are gone after this year due to their contracts. Clark's a UFA. Troy and Ike will have one more year left and likely are getting released. They drafted Shamarko Thomas last year with the obvious plan of having him replace one of the two safeties. There's no TE on the roster close to as good as Miller. Woodley is still under 30 and it wasn't insane to think last year was a down year. At this point it's looking like he'll never be right again but the cap hit the team would take to let him go may buy him another season.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Rocco on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:50 pm

Mendenhall has a worse YPC than Bell this year. He managed 14 yards on 13 carries against the mighty Jags. That's not even including the off-the-field crap. Who exactly wants him back over Bell?
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby IanMoran on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:54 pm

According to a text from my brother.. Graham signed to practice squad.

I can't find it anywhere

edit: Looks like Pitt football tweeted it

Edit 2: Bob Labriola ‏@BobLabriola 14m
Practice squad move for @Steelers: RB George Winn released; RB Ray Graham signed
Last edited by IanMoran on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Troy Loney on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:55 pm

I guess I'm saying something more like this. Instead of restructuring the deals for Brown, Woodley, Timmons last offseason to push cap hits into future years, if there were cap savings for cutting someone like Clark or Polamalu even without a replacement. That would be the better course of action. Don't make Brown and Timmons more expensive in the coming years. Does that not seem to you like a "keeping the gang together" roster stance?
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Troy Loney on Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:56 pm

Rocco wrote:Mendenhall has a worse YPC than Bell this year. He managed 14 yards on 13 carries against the mighty Jags. That's not even including the off-the-field crap. Who exactly wants him back over Bell?



Mendenhall is not the same player since that injury.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby pfim on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:01 pm

IanMoran wrote:According to a text from my brother.. Graham signed to practice squad.

I can't find it anywhere

edit: Looks like Pitt football tweeted it

Edit 2: Bob Labriola ‏@BobLabriola 14m
Practice squad move for @Steelers: RB George Winn released; RB Ray Graham signed


The masses have been appeased.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Idoit40fans on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:06 pm

Troy Loney wrote:
Rocco wrote:Mendenhall has a worse YPC than Bell this year. He managed 14 yards on 13 carries against the mighty Jags. That's not even including the off-the-field crap. Who exactly wants him back over Bell?



Mendenhall is not the same player since that injury.


That really doesn't matter anyway. Mendenhall was brought into this conversation when someone said that Bell is the best RB the steelers have had in the last 3 seasons. Mendenhall had better YPC in 2011 and his time in 2012.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Rocco on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:06 pm

Troy Loney wrote:I guess I'm saying something more like this. Instead of restructuring the deals for Brown, Woodley, Timmons last offseason to push cap hits into future years, if there were cap savings for cutting someone like Clark or Polamalu even without a replacement. That would be the better course of action. Don't make Brown and Timmons more expensive in the coming years. Does that not seem to you like a "keeping the gang together" roster stance?


So you're in favor of starting cardboard cutouts. Got it.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby slappybrown on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:08 pm

lololol, pretty much
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:22 pm

slappybrown wrote:I'm pretty sure that Troy is now outright trolling Steelers threads. He admitted he doesn't even watch the games and still has these "interesting" theories and questions to pose.


+1. any nerd can sit and look at his YPC and see it is yucky but that doesnt tell the whole story. the kid turns nothing in to something rather frequently and is pretty strong catching passes out of the backfield. i am excited about him
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Idoit40fans on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:23 pm

Yeah Bell is definitely great out of the backfield and should be effective if the line is ever good. Hopefully he isn't wasted and something magic happens or the find the new starting QB quickly.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Troy Loney on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:23 pm

Counting Bell's catches, 13 of his touches went for two or fewer yards, while his yards per carry is now down to 3.13. When defenses are ready for Bell — which has been often this season — he simply can't get more than what's blocked


http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/8390/leveon-bell
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:24 pm

why should we listen to roto world when you crushed their analysis of harold douglas last week in the fantasy thread?
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Troy Loney on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:26 pm

But, we can just make a blanket statement about how bad the offensive line is, and that is basically the end all for all discussion as to why the Steelers are bad. I'd be willing to bet if they had more talent on offense that defenses had to respect, the oline would play better.
Last edited by Troy Loney on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby Troy Loney on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:27 pm

Letang Is The Truth wrote:why should we listen to roto world when you crushed their analysis of harold douglas last week in the fantasy thread?


Cause they were repeatedly saying results were an anamoly with regards to douglas.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby slappybrown on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:28 pm

Troy Loney wrote:But, we can just make a blanket statement about how bad the offensive line is, and that basically the end all for all discussion as to why the Steelers are bad. I'd be willing to bet if that had more talent on offense that defenses had to respect, the oline would play better.

Roethlisberger is safely, even by your insane measure, a top 10 QB. Brown has been fantastic this season. Miller is one of the most complete TEs in the league. What are you talking about? If the line was average, they'd be .500 or better.

Honestly, this is approaching Shaky Walton in PR levels.
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Re: Are You Ready for Some Football - Steelers/Lions

Postby count2infinity on Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:30 pm

Troy Loney wrote:But, we can just make a blanket statement about how bad the offensive line is, and that is basically the end all for all discussion as to why the Steelers are bad. I'd be willing to bet if they had more talent on offense that defenses had to respect, the oline would play better.


Out of curiosity, which offensive position is lacking talent? RB? Ask most experts, they'll tell you he's a very talented running back. WR? We have a good bit of talent there, I'd say. QB? He's one of the best in the league (I know...debatable.) TE? You don't get much more consistent than Heath. O-line... eek.

whoops... slappy beat me there.

:fist:
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