Airlines are the worst.

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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby yubb on Fri Jan 24, 2014 2:25 pm

newarenanow wrote:So they were butthurt because we stopped a dictator from invading an ally of ours, not because we were there trying to convert people from Islam and hanging out like yuppbb stated.


President Thomas Jefferson extended Washington's ideas in his March 4, 1801 inaugural address: "peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations, entangling alliances with none." Jefferson's phrase "entangling alliances" is, incidentally, sometimes incorrectly attributed to Washington.


Oh, and "fixt".
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby newarenanow on Fri Jan 24, 2014 3:04 pm

yubb wrote:
newarenanow wrote:So they were butthurt because we stopped a dictator from invading an ally of ours, not because we were there trying to convert people from Islam and hanging out like yuppbb stated.


President Thomas Jefferson extended Washington's ideas in his March 4, 1801 inaugural address: "peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations, entangling alliances with none." Jefferson's phrase "entangling alliances" is, incidentally, sometimes incorrectly attributed to Washington.


Oh, and "fixt".


The world is a much different place since those words were spoken.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby Orlando Penguin on Fri Jan 24, 2014 4:43 pm

newarenanow wrote:
columbia wrote:I find that the incompetence of the airlines far outweighs that of the TSA.


Now I agree with this.

The worst was when I was boarding one time, and they said they double booked my seat and unless the other person wanted to switch, I was stuck. I had my ticket booked for like a month and it didn't matter.



This is one of the things that boggles my mind with no hope of unboggling. Whenever I hear the gate agent ask for volunteers because they were in an oversold situation, I just wonder what the heck they're doing. I would think it wouldn't be all that difficult to figure out that there's only a set amount of tickets they can sell. Of course, in those instances where they downsize the plane at the last minute, that's a whole different story.

I do a ton of traveling for work (every Monday, a different airport it seems) and I've been through a number of TSA lines and I certainly see everyone's consternation with it. I just see it as a necessary evil, though I'd love to find out why the back of my left shoulder always attracts attention. But if you want the definition of incompetence, go to Orlando. I flew in November and the 'airline preferred' line was on the far left of where I normally go and it worked out great. I fly back to PA for Xmas and they moved it to the far right. OK, no big deal, line still easy to deal with. I fly this past Monday for work and they moved it back to the far left...BUT... instead of giving us our own line, they mixed us in with the 'unwashed masses'. Not much of an advantage to be preferred if you have to get in line with everyone else. Yes, that does sound snooty, I know. And yes, TSA pre-check is on my to-do list. The area in Orlando where they have security wasn't made to handle that mess. They've done the best that they can with it but the people that run it don't seem to be the smartest sometimes.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby IamtheWaris on Fri Jan 24, 2014 5:04 pm

Orlando Penguin wrote:
newarenanow wrote:
columbia wrote:I find that the incompetence of the airlines far outweighs that of the TSA.


Now I agree with this.

The worst was when I was boarding one time, and they said they double booked my seat and unless the other person wanted to switch, I was stuck. I had my ticket booked for like a month and it didn't matter.



This is one of the things that boggles my mind with no hope of unboggling. Whenever I hear the gate agent ask for volunteers because they were in an oversold situation, I just wonder what the heck they're doing. I would think it wouldn't be all that difficult to figure out that there's only a set amount of tickets they can sell. Of course, in those instances where they downsize the plane at the last minute, that's a whole different story.

I do a ton of traveling for work (every Monday, a different airport it seems) and I've been through a number of TSA lines and I certainly see everyone's consternation with it. I just see it as a necessary evil, though I'd love to find out why the back of my left shoulder always attracts attention. But if you want the definition of incompetence, go to Orlando. I flew in November and the 'airline preferred' line was on the far left of where I normally go and it worked out great. I fly back to PA for Xmas and they moved it to the far right. OK, no big deal, line still easy to deal with. I fly this past Monday for work and they moved it back to the far left...BUT... instead of giving us our own line, they mixed us in with the 'unwashed masses'. Not much of an advantage to be preferred if you have to get in line with everyone else. Yes, that does sound snooty, I know. And yes, TSA pre-check is on my to-do list. The area in Orlando where they have security wasn't made to handle that mess. They've done the best that they can with it but the people that run it don't seem to be the smartest sometimes.



There are many occasions where they anticipate a certain number of people to not make the flight for whatever reason so they try to maximize the number of tickets sold.

Lots of people will book connections if their final destination is a hub knowing that booking a flight to the connecting city is a lot cheaper than if you bought a ticket straight to the hub. In these cases the airlines can sell extra tickets for the connection in hopes to fill the seats.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby Sarcastic on Fri Jan 24, 2014 6:42 pm

newarenanow wrote:
yubb wrote:If we really wanted less terrorism we'd remove our military from all the countries around the world and stop antagonizing and provoking people. If the roles had been reversed, and Taliban forces were occupying our country trying to force Islam on us, we'd have called the people who flew planes into their buildings patriots.


You do realize they flew the planes into the building before we ever had any troops over there in Afganastan, correct?


You do realize that we've been interfering in the Middle East for years prior to that, in fact, centuries, but let's sick with the current stuff. Bin Laden stated his reasons for 9/11 clearly... our presence and interference in the region, our grip on ties with Saudi Arabia, and our support of Israel's tactics vs Palestinians.

10 years prior to that, due to our sanctions on Iraq, about 750,000 children died from malnutrition and disease in that country. Think Arabs aren't pissed about that? Think again.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby tifosi77 on Fri Jan 24, 2014 7:08 pm

IamtheWaris wrote:There are many occasions where they anticipate a certain number of people to not make the flight for whatever reason so they try to maximize the number of tickets sold.

Similar deal with hotel rooms. I mean, obviously they aren't dealing with connections and whatnot. But they anticipate something like 10% no-shows or last-minute cancellations and so overbook by that amount on most days to ensure as close to 100% occupancy as they can get. Some days that doesn't work out so well.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby ExPatriatePen on Fri Jan 24, 2014 8:07 pm

tifosi77 wrote:
IamtheWaris wrote:There are many occasions where they anticipate a certain number of people to not make the flight for whatever reason so they try to maximize the number of tickets sold.

Similar deal with hotel rooms. I mean, obviously they aren't dealing with connections and whatnot. But they anticipate something like 10% no-shows or last-minute cancellations and so overbook by that amount on most days to ensure as close to 100% occupancy as they can get. Some days that doesn't work out so well.

That's why you pick a hotel chain and work their awards program to the max. I'm
Hilton Diamond. They almost always find me a room.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby tifosi77 on Fri Jan 24, 2014 8:50 pm

Marriott Rewards, ftw. Mrs Tif travels a good bit for work. We're usually able to swing one long weekend per year using only bonus points to pay for the room. That doesn't suck.

Now we go back to the regularly scheduled bickering. ;)
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby ExPatriatePen on Fri Jan 24, 2014 8:54 pm

tifosi77 wrote:
Now we go back to the regularly scheduled bickering. ;)

:)
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby ExPatriatePen on Sat Jan 25, 2014 10:32 am

My flight from Tulsa to Pittsburgh connected through DFW this morning. As our MD80 made its approach we got down to within 15 feet of the ground when the pilot pulled back the throttle and did a "go around" - Later he got on the intercom and told us that it was a "sequencing" problem. I think more likely ground traffic control called him off because of someone crossing a runway they shouldn't have been.
First time in a long time that something like that has happened to me.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby columbia on Sat Jan 25, 2014 10:34 am

I've had some good brisket at DFW.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Sat Jan 25, 2014 10:44 am

ExPatriatePen wrote:
tifosi77 wrote:
IamtheWaris wrote:There are many occasions where they anticipate a certain number of people to not make the flight for whatever reason so they try to maximize the number of tickets sold.

Similar deal with hotel rooms. I mean, obviously they aren't dealing with connections and whatnot. But they anticipate something like 10% no-shows or last-minute cancellations and so overbook by that amount on most days to ensure as close to 100% occupancy as they can get. Some days that doesn't work out so well.

That's why you pick a hotel chain and work their awards program to the max. I'm
Hilton Diamond. They almost always find me a room.


I also think this is part of the reason for the double booking. Johnny 10,000,000 miles calls and needs flight ASAP and they bump little old casual flyer. Not saying its wrong as they should reward their loyal customers.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby tifosi77 on Sat Jan 25, 2014 12:24 pm

ExPatriatePen wrote:My flight from Tulsa to Pittsburgh connected through DFW this morning. As our MD80 made its approach we got down to within 15 feet of the ground when the pilot pulled back the throttle and did a "go around" - Later he got on the intercom and told us that it was a "sequencing" problem. I think more likely ground traffic control called him off because of someone crossing a runway they shouldn't have been.
First time in a long time that something like that has happened to me.

That's right as the aircraft would be settling into ground effect (the cushion of air between the aircraft and a fixed surface, like the earth). At that point in the approach, barring eyeballs-out weather, things like runway obstructions are gauged visually by the cockpit crew. If he got that close to touchdown before calling a missed approach, I don't think it was a sequencing problem or something called to him from ATC or ground control. I think more likely is that he 'floated' the approach and didn't get the aircraft down where he should of, essentially 'going long'.

Was it windy at all? That could have been a factor, too. Last minute crosswind gust.

Spoiler:
Trip to Japan four years ago, spent the final 90 minutes flying into 250+ mph headwinds with severe chop. I don't mind turbulence, but having the intellectual understanding of how un-dangerous bouncing around 7 miles above the Pacific is and having 200 other people around saying the Lord's Prayer and crying kind of unwinds that confidence a little. Anyway, I was listening to ATC the whole way and every aircraft was requesting a different runway at Narita until ATC finally said "Look... this is the runway. We've only got the one, and we can't change the way it points. There are 30-knot crosswinds, with gusts of 50." I was like 50-knot crosswind gusts...!? Anyway, approach was relatively uneventful, we crossed the threshold and flared..... and got hit side-on by one of those 50-knot gusts. I was in the second-to-last row of the airplane, and it blew us so far over that I could see the runway centerline out my window. I'm sure the wingtip on my side came within a foot or so of the ground. But the pilot caught it and stuck us down with no fuss.

The funny thing, is that after all that turbulence and bouncing around, the wind gust wasn't really that physically dramatic. No one on the plane ever really acknowledged it..... yet it was the only truly dangerous moment of the flight, and it made me go completely cold. It's the only time I've ever been for-real scared in an airplane. But it was over in three seconds. I actually shook the pilot's hand as I disembarked and said with a nod "That was a good landing." And he sort of sighed and said "Certainly was exciting." You don't want a commercial airline pilot to describe anything he does as 'exciting'. :lol:
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby ExPatriatePen on Sat Jan 25, 2014 2:26 pm

Great story Tif.

No, the wearer at DFW was fine, and it
Looked like he was 'nailing' the approach.

So I think it's was either debris or ground traffic.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby Shyster on Tue Jan 28, 2014 5:17 pm

Any of you fans of Mayday / Air Crash Investigation / Air Emergency / Air Disasters? Each episode covers a particular plane crash in detail. Many of the episodes are available on YouTube, and full seasons can be found on a certain pirate-themed torrent site.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby PghSkins on Tue Jan 28, 2014 5:30 pm

I am, they also show it on Smithsonian Channel. I think they handle the topics very well- not too creepy or fear of flying-inducing.

There was one incredible one in England where the pilot got sucked out the windshield, but got his foot caught so he didn't fall to earth, he just flapped there in the sky at x-hundred mph for some lengthy amount of time- and lived.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby tifosi77 on Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:19 pm

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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby Shyster on Fri Jan 31, 2014 5:04 pm

Dear America, I Saw You Naked
And yes, we were laughing. Confessions of an ex-TSA agent.
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/ ... uwPQUoo5pg
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby Sarcastic on Fri Jan 31, 2014 6:11 pm

Shyster wrote:Dear America, I Saw You Naked
And yes, we were laughing. Confessions of an ex-TSA agent.
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/ ... uwPQUoo5pg


Now this is pissing me off. Somebody is selling these and somebody approved them for use.

"We knew the full-body scanners didn’t work before they were even installed. Not long after the Underwear Bomber incident, all TSA officers at O’Hare were informed that training for the Rapiscan Systems full-body scanners would soon begin. The machines cost about $150,000 a pop.
Our instructor was a balding middle-aged man who shrugged his shoulders after everything he said, as though in apology. At the conclusion of our crash course, one of the officers in our class asked him to tell us, off the record, what he really thought about the machines.
“They’re s**t,” he said, shrugging. He said we wouldn’t be able to distinguish plastic explosives from body fat and that guns were practically invisible if they were turned sideways in a pocket.
We quickly found out the trainer was not kidding: Officers discovered that the machines were good at detecting just about everything besides cleverly hidden explosives and guns. The only thing more absurd than how poorly the full-body scanners performed was the incredible amount of time the machines wasted for everyone."

-

""As I saw it, $40 million in taxpayer dollars had been wasted on ineffective anti-terrorism security measures at the expense of the public’s health, privacy and dignity.""

Yup. Exactly what I was thinking.

-

"I hinted several times on the blog that a determined terrorist’s best bet for defeating airport security would be to apply for a job with the TSA and simply become part of the security system itself. That assertion stemmed from personal experience. A fellow officer once returned to O’Hare from a trip to TSA headquarters and confessed that he had run into some complications: Someone realized that his background check had never been processed in the four years he had been an employee. He could have been anyone, for all TSA knew—a murderer, terrorist, rapist. The agency had to rush to get his background investigated. Who knows how many similar cases there were, and are, at airports around the nation."
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby Sarcastic on Fri Jan 31, 2014 6:33 pm

Thanks for the article, Shyster.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby ExPatriatePen on Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:51 pm

Booked a flight from DC to Tulsa for tomorrow.

Booked it at 2pm this afternoon, at 4pm I get a call from the airline that the flight had been cancelled. They re-booked me on a different flight, that flight has a four hour layover in Dallas. Ugggghhhh.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby TheHammer24 on Tue Feb 04, 2014 10:51 am

That article is great, Shyster.

It nevertheless amazes me that people can read that and not be outraged. I feel like I can brush a lot of things off. The TSA is not one.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby newarenanow on Tue Feb 04, 2014 10:55 am

TheHammer24 wrote:That article is great, Shyster.

It nevertheless amazes me that people can read that and not be outraged. I feel like I can brush a lot of things off. The TSA is not one.


Probably because it's a view from someone with an opinion on one end of the spectrum and the truth is probably somewhere in the middle of someone who would write a pro TSA and all the good things that come out of it article.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby shmenguin on Tue Feb 04, 2014 11:01 am

at the very least, it proves that implementing the body scanners was just a cash grab for some old friends of the TSA. i try not to think about it because it's so enraging and all, but it's a great example of what's wrong with politics.
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Re: Airlines are the worst.

Postby ExPatriatePen on Tue Feb 04, 2014 11:04 am

Is this an issue that ya'll have to deal with more than a couple of times a year?
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