True Detective - Spoilers Inside

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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby columbia on Mon Mar 10, 2014 9:19 am

My understanding that the 2nd and subsequent seasons will have nothing to do with this plot line, characters, setting, etc.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby Kraftster on Mon Mar 10, 2014 9:29 am

Loved the series, fairly let down by the finale.

I think I can accept how the investigation resolved, though I have to say that doing nothing with all of the Audrey stuff--dolls on the floor, sex drawings, slut captain, etc--leaves me a little bit disappointed. We can't really be expected to see that as a red herring, can we? But, again, I guess I can live with not "getting them all," and possibly be left wondering just how Audrey/Maggie/Maggie's dad were somehow touched by the cult at some point in their lives.

What doesn't really work for me is the Cohlversion at the end of the show. I guess there are signs that 2012 Rust is far removed from the 1995 version that "knows what he is." The being "drunk for the better part of 10 years" fact should show us that. 1995 Rust knows what he is (nothing) and lives a very stoic life, accepting that he lacks the constitution to kill himself and must just keep plugging along, but realizing that there's no reason to get worked up about because he can't change it. I guess perhaps we should know that Rust's nihilistic stoicism isn't perfect when Marty observes at the revival tent that Rust is awfully worked up about things for someone who doesn't care, but I don't know... it's just hard for me to buy the transformation. Maybe that's a byproduct of having to compress things. I just feel like if that is the big finale--the twist if there is one at all--that we should have taken the journey with Cohle a bit more from 95 Cohle to 12 Cohle. Maybe the pointless encounter with Geracie could have been cut to provide 10 extra minutes towards explaining Rust's philosophical evolution during the 10 years that we don't get to see him.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby Kraftster on Mon Mar 10, 2014 9:30 am

columbia wrote:My understanding that the 2nd and subsequent seasons will have nothing to do with this plot line, characters, setting, etc.


That's my understanding and expectation as well. We have all the resolution on these issues that we're ever going to have.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby eddysnake on Mon Mar 10, 2014 9:45 am

Last edited by eddysnake on Mon Mar 10, 2014 9:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby Kraftster on Mon Mar 10, 2014 9:46 am

Hmm...this is a pretty good take on last night. Brings me around a bit, actually.

http://popwatch.ew.com/2014/03/10/true- ... py-ending/

But no. It was gotcha moment, for Rust, and for us. Childress seized him and cut him to the core, literally and spiritually, like a knife to an empty can of Lone Star. “TAKE OFF YOUR MASK!” The Monster bellowed. It was as if Childress was telling him to cut the phony bologna nihilist crap, the useful fairy tale of baggy and buggy sentient meat denying his truth. Of course, you can say the same of his agent of enlightenment, his doppelganger: True Detective was always all about authenticity — or rather, the lack thereof, and the stories we tell ourselves to get us through the day — be it religion, or nothingness, or our private Carcosas — and in turn imprint (and inflict) upon the world.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby eddysnake on Mon Mar 10, 2014 9:59 am

from the interview above, thought this was interesting:

Early in the episode, we see Errol come into the big house, "North by Northwest" is playing and he starts doing a James Mason voice. Then he slips into a number of other accents. What was behind that?

Nic Pizzolatto: That was part of his creation as a character. There was this idea that when he talks in his real voice, it's very slurred because of the scarring. My background for him was that he learned how to enunciate properly through watching all these old VCR movies. And that brings us back to the idea of storytelling, right? At one minute he can affect this Andy Griffith good ol' boy voice, the next he can sound like James Mason, and when he wants to use his real voice, he sounds like something wounded and damaged. And then when Cohle is in Carcosa, he sounds like something entirely different.


also regarding season 2

Can you tell me anything at all about season 2?

Nic Pizzolatto: Okay. This is really early, but I'll tell you (it's about) hard women, bad men and the secret occult history of the United States transportation system.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby tifosi77 on Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:05 pm

eddysnake wrote:also regarding season 2

Can you tell me anything at all about season 2?

Nic Pizzolatto: Okay. This is really early, but I'll tell you (it's about) hard women, bad men and the secret occult history of the United States transportation system.

I've heard that it will take place in Southern California.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby shafnutz05 on Mon Mar 10, 2014 5:25 pm

This is totally random, but I noticed in the very final scene, when they showed the star scene, I'm fairly certain they were showing the constellation Corvus. Corvus is known as either the crow, or more significantly, the raven. (amateur astronomy knowledge finally coming in handy)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/22/Corvus_IAU.svg/250px-Corvus_IAU.svg.png

Spoiler:
Image


Perhaps most notably, Corvus is known for facing right up towards Virgo, the Virgin. If you look, Virgo is visible at the left upper side of your screen. Again, absolutely no clue if there is symbolism there, but I'm thinking there has to be. The Raven (symbolizing evil) and Virgo, symbolizing innocence?
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby shafnutz05 on Mon Mar 10, 2014 5:33 pm

I can't find anything related to this find on the Internet, but I feel like it almost HAS to be intentional
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby LeopardLetang on Mon Mar 10, 2014 5:59 pm

large image of corvus and virgo

Spoiler:
Image


so that was really the constellation shown at the end? doesn't ring a bell and i stared at it carefully last night because i agree it had to be a symbol like you suggest
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby shafnutz05 on Mon Mar 10, 2014 6:04 pm

I mean, it looked a LOT like Corvus. Virgo I'm a little more iffy on, but Corvus has a very distinct shape.

Again, could be some stock sky footage, but just seemed interesting. Even if it is just Corvus, I still could see some symbolism in the raven.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby LeopardLetang on Mon Mar 10, 2014 6:11 pm

shafnutz05 wrote:I mean, it looked a LOT like Corvus. Virgo I'm a little more iffy on, but Corvus has a very distinct shape.

Again, could be some stock sky footage, but just seemed interesting. Even if it is just Corvus, I still could see some symbolism in the raven.


i would assume you're right. i was just trying to clarify because i had that "wormhole" before rust got attacked on my mind and thought maybe there was a constellation shown then too
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby LeopardLetang on Mon Mar 10, 2014 6:18 pm

you guys know that scene where the big girl was on the monster's lap after talking about flowers and he started... anyway, i can't stop imagining obama sitting on his couch watching that scene
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby Factorial on Mon Mar 10, 2014 7:30 pm

^ I can and I'm sure his response was revulsion like the rest of us. :vomit:
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby eddysnake on Tue Mar 11, 2014 11:30 am

more insight and answers from the writer/creator

http://popwatch.ew.com/2014/03/10/true-detective-post-mortem-creator-nic-pizzoletto-on-happy-endings-season-2-and-the-future-of-cohle-and-hart/

Is it true that you’ve retained the literary rights to Cohle and Hart?
-I do. So maybe you will see Cohle and Hart novels down the road after Hollywood kicks me out. Always a possibility.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby eddysnake on Tue Mar 11, 2014 11:37 am

creepy - the yellow king

Spoiler:
Image
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby shafnutz05 on Tue Mar 11, 2014 11:48 am

Pizzoletto raises a good point. Previously, it used to be a shock on television to see one of the main protagonists die. I feel like now, it's become almost overused. If anything, it was more of a (pleasant) surprise to discover that not only did Cohle and Marty both survive, but their friendship had been reforged through the terror they went through.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby PensFanInDC on Tue Mar 11, 2014 11:50 am

I think the last scene with Marty's family could also be considered to show that they will reconcile and remain close. I know she remarried, as evidenced by the sizable ring on her finger, but I think they keep in touch more now.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby shafnutz05 on Tue Mar 11, 2014 11:51 am

PensFanInDC wrote:I think the last scene with Marty's family could also be considered to show that they will reconcile and remain close. I know she remarried, as evidenced by the sizable ring on her finger, but I think they keep in touch more now.


Yeah, that too. After the horrifically dark tone of the series, I don't think the happy ending was cheap in any way. It would have been easy to just kill off Cohle or whatever.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby PensFanInDC on Tue Mar 11, 2014 11:52 am

I think the happy ending adds to the "strangeness" of the series. Who actually predicted an overall happy ending?
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby Hockeynut! on Tue Mar 11, 2014 11:57 am

Not me, that's for sure. The show was so bleak, I was pretty certain they'd both die. Very glad I was wrong.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby roland on Tue Mar 11, 2014 2:15 pm

I was wondering about Errols different voices/accents and wondered if that was just craziness or something else. At first it was a southern accent, then british/proper, then marble mouth when asking about grandpa.

Spoiler:
What movie was Errol watching at the beginning of the finale? And what was with all the creepy accents?

Errol is watching North by Northwest. True Detective creator Nic Pizzolatto explained his thinking behind this scene in an interview with Alan Sepinwall:

There was this idea that when he talks in his real voice, it’s very slurred because of the scarring. My background for him was that he learned how to enunciate properly through watching all these old VCR movies.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby meecrofilm on Wed Mar 12, 2014 11:59 pm

Kraftster wrote:Hmm...this is a pretty good take on last night. Brings me around a bit, actually.

http://popwatch.ew.com/2014/03/10/true- ... py-ending/

But no. It was gotcha moment, for Rust, and for us. Childress seized him and cut him to the core, literally and spiritually, like a knife to an empty can of Lone Star. “TAKE OFF YOUR MASK!” The Monster bellowed. It was as if Childress was telling him to cut the phony bologna nihilist crap, the useful fairy tale of baggy and buggy sentient meat denying his truth. Of course, you can say the same of his agent of enlightenment, his doppelganger: True Detective was always all about authenticity — or rather, the lack thereof, and the stories we tell ourselves to get us through the day — be it religion, or nothingness, or our private Carcosas — and in turn imprint (and inflict) upon the world.


I liked the finale as well. Surprised that a lot of people didn't, to be honest.

Yeah, thinking about it throughout the show, the death of his daughter clearly had a huge effect on Cohle. After all, this was a man who once married a woman and had a kid. Then, we he has to meet Marty and his kids and family on his daughter's would-be birthday... he's clearly not equipped to, which was a big tell -- the superhero-nihilist was a more appealing character, in a sense, but how Cohle turned out was much more realistic. Like that article says, the way he acted/lived was just his coping mechanism, and if you tell yourself something like that long enough, eventually you'll start to believe it and be able to convince yourself it's true.

Not that he doesn't believe what he's saying when he's telling Hart his life philosophies throughout the series -- he's just not open to believing anything else at the time, because he's not capable of functioning if he does.

Kraftster wrote:Hmm.. I will spoiler this, though. From an interview with Pizzolatto, sort of hints at what the end might be like:

Spoiler:
“I’ve enjoyed reading people theorize about what’s going to happen because it’s a sign that you’re connecting,” Pizzolatto told me. “But I’m also sort of surprised by how far afield they’re getting. Like, why do you think we’re tricking you? It’s because you’ve been abused as an audience for more than 20 years. I cannot think of anything more insulting as an audience than to go through eight weeks, eight hours with these people, and then to be told it was a lie—that what you were seeing wasn’t really what was happening. The show’s not trying to outsmart you.”

It’s not The Sixth Sense.

“It really isn’t. Exactly. I knew the guy was dead as soon as he showed up after being gut shot in the second close. It was the same thing with The Usual Suspects. It was like, “Wait a minute. Don’t tell me this whole thing is just a lie. Because if it just a lie, what parts of the movie were true? Maybe none of it. What did we just sit here watching?”

People like to be fooled, though.

“I question it. I don’t think me outright lying to you is “fooling’ you. Chinatown, for instance, is a kind of smart trickery that is rewarding. You didn’t get lied to in Chinatown. You just couldn’t see all the pieces of the picture. And then when you saw it, you realized not only was this about the corruption of an entire state, but it was mirrored in the corruption of an American family. Simply being told, “Hey, everything you just saw—we lied?” That’s not smart. Nobody outsmarted you. And really if you pay attention… if someone watches the first episode and really listens, it tells you 85 percent of the story of the first six episodes.”


I'm also very glad the show didn't take a turn like this as well, though I didn't expect it to. Some whole big twist out of nowhere wouldn't have served it well at all. The "soft landing" is a misnomer. Definitely one of my favorite seasons of Television Drama.
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:14 am

finally watched the episode. i still enjoyed the series but felt it was very sloppy - many unanswered questions. not sure if related to it only being 8 episodes or not but there are a number of loose ends not tied up
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Re: True Detective - Spoilers Inside

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:23 am

also how many people had errol killed?
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