Ukraine Crisis

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Ukraine Crisis

Postby shafnutz05 on Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:18 pm

Not sure if anyone is following this with everything else that is going on, but pretty horrific things going on in the Ukraine. The Russians are heavily pressuring the standing government to assert their will, and that's obvious in this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DxkDiAcSF8&feature=youtu.be

Not for the squeamish, warning...
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby llipgh2 on Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:20 pm

I am following this. Horrific.

I'm also following what is happening in Venezuela. Looks like it is heading down the same tragic path.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby mac5155 on Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:21 pm

As someone else out it, "once a government opens fire on their citizens, it's no longer a protest".not to turn it overly political, but situations like this are why I exercise my second amendment right. You just never know...
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Rylan on Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:22 pm

Why did the cease-fire/peace end?
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby mac5155 on Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:25 pm

From what I've read the pressure was on the berkut to end the protests and the "good police" are basically fed up with trying to restore order.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Tomas on Fri Feb 21, 2014 12:56 am

Some interesting maps:

Percentages of people identifying their nationality as Ukrainian:

Image

Percentage of people for whom Russian is the No. 1 language:

Image

Monthly salary:

Image
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby legame on Fri Feb 21, 2014 1:35 am

The entire concept of Ukranian nationalism is intriguing. My master's thesis advisor is an expert on it and it's crazy that the Soviet Union basically helped to pull a national culture and language movement out of thin air.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby jimjom on Fri Feb 21, 2014 2:26 am

Western Ukraine has always been very nationalistic. When these two sides collide if there is a coup Russia will get involved and this will be a brutal civil war conflict.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby columbia on Fri Feb 21, 2014 7:13 am

If this really gets out of control - and that is possible - I'm afraid that we'll see increased fist pounding on this side of the Atlantic (from the usual set of suspects).
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Gaucho on Fri Feb 21, 2014 7:21 am

Yanukovych agrees early election, constitutional changes reducing the power of the president.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26289318

Situation still critical.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Factorial on Fri Feb 21, 2014 7:49 am

legame wrote:The entire concept of Ukranian nationalism is intriguing. My master's thesis advisor is an expert on it and it's crazy that the Soviet Union basically helped to pull a national culture and language movement out of thin air.


Isn't this more of political conflict? Those who want a more democratic society with closer ties to the west vs those who prosper with the current ties to Russia?
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Gaucho on Fri Feb 21, 2014 7:53 am

The protest movement has sadly been undercut by ultra right wing nationalists, I'm not sure what the extent of their influence is.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Factorial on Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:08 am

columbia wrote:If this really gets out of control - and that is possible - I'm afraid that we'll see increased fist pounding on this side of the Atlantic (from the usual set of suspects).


Image
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Tico Rick on Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:25 am

Factorial wrote:
legame wrote:The entire concept of Ukranian nationalism is intriguing. My master's thesis advisor is an expert on it and it's crazy that the Soviet Union basically helped to pull a national culture and language movement out of thin air.


Isn't this more of political conflict? Those who want a more democratic society with closer ties to the west vs those who prosper with the current ties to Russia?


A lot of the Ukrainians on the eastern side speak Russian and feel a close affinity to the Russians, so the different senses of nationalism between the eastern and western parts of the country play a role.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby meow on Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:33 am

Image
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby newarenanow on Fri Feb 21, 2014 10:23 am

I've been following this over there. Pretty horrific and sad.

Especially my one grandpap was from the Ukraine, so there is some family history there.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Tico Rick on Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:10 am

Where's Viktor? President Viktor Yanukovych has left Kiev:
http://edition.cnn.com/2014/02/22/world/europe/ukraine-protests/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby DelPen on Mon Feb 24, 2014 2:48 pm

Factorial wrote:
columbia wrote:If this really gets out of control - and that is possible - I'm afraid that we'll see increased fist pounding on this side of the Atlantic (from the usual set of suspects).


Image

Have they moved on from mucking up Syria?
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Factorial on Mon Feb 24, 2014 3:02 pm

DelPen wrote:
Factorial wrote:
columbia wrote:If this really gets out of control - and that is possible - I'm afraid that we'll see increased fist pounding on this side of the Atlantic (from the usual set of suspects).


Image

Have they moved on from mucking up Syria?



No, they're working on multiple fronts.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby columbia on Mon Feb 24, 2014 3:04 pm

So what happens next, now that Ukraine can have Putin's undivided attention?
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby redwill on Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:02 pm

In college, I had a history professor from Ukraine for Western Civ 2.

You'd be amazed at the influence of Ukraine on Western civilization.

Scientific Revolution? Ukraine was the center of new and exciting discoveries.
Enlightenment? Ukraine was the leader.
French Revolution? Ukraine was involved.
Industrial Revolution? Ukraine led the way.
American Civil War? Astonishing Ukrainian contribution.
First World War? It all hinged on Ukraine.

God, I have Zaporizhian Cossacks burned into my brain.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Troy Loney on Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:08 pm

redwill wrote:In college, I had a Ukrainian history professor for Western Civ 2.

You'd be amazed at the influence of Ukraine on Western civilization.

Scientific Revolution? Ukraine was the center of new and exciting discoveries.
Enlightenment? Ukraine was the leader.
French Revolution? Ukraine was involved.
Industrial Revolution? Ukraine led the way.
American Civil War? Astonishing Ukrainian contribution.
First World War? It all hinged on Ukraine.

God, I have Zaporizhian Cossacks burned into my brain.


I was talking with a app designer last week and I was asking him about how they do the software coding. He said it's outsourced to groups in India and Ukraine, and that the stuff from India is mostly garbage and the work from Ukraine is significantly better. I think there's still a perception with regards to outsourcing to India, but with regards to Ukraine...maybe they need some global add campaign or something.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Shyster on Mon Feb 24, 2014 9:59 pm

Tomas wrote:Some interesting maps:
Spoiler:
Percentages of people identifying their nationality as Ukrainian:

Image

Percentage of people for whom Russian is the No. 1 language:

Image

Monthly salary:

Image

I saw a map showing the respective election votes for president Viktor Yanukovych versus the pro-western candiate Yulia Tymoshenko in the last election, and they looked exactly the same as all of the above maps. Pro-Russian Ukrainians voted for him, and anti-Russians did not. It certainly didn't help Yanukovych in these protests that the capital city of Kiev is located smack in the middle of "enemy territory."

As an aside, I think Yulia Tymoshenko is smokin' hot for being 53. I love those hair braids.
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Guinness on Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:58 pm

Image
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Re: Ukraine Crisis

Postby Gaucho on Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:07 pm

redwill wrote:In college, I had a history professor from Ukraine for Western Civ 2.

You'd be amazed at the influence of Ukraine on Western civilization.

Scientific Revolution? Ukraine was the center of new and exciting discoveries.
Enlightenment? Ukraine was the leader.
French Revolution? Ukraine was involved.
Industrial Revolution? Ukraine led the way.
American Civil War? Astonishing Ukrainian contribution.
First World War? It all hinged on Ukraine.

God, I have Zaporizhian Cossacks burned into my brain.


Pens 2009 Cup victory? Not happening without Ukraine.
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