Michael Brown

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Re: Michael Brown

Postby pittsoccer33 on Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:10 pm

Can you imagine getting police unions on board with that though? I can't.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby tifosi77 on Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:16 pm

Ferguson PD apparently already has in its possession physical dash cam units. They have just not been installed in the cars as yet.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby BigMcK on Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:30 pm

http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Police-See-Benefit-Equipping-Officers-with-Body-Cams-271950571.html

Police See Benefit Equipping Officers With Body Cams


Experience in other cities has shown benefits. In San Bernardino County, after Rialto police equipped its officers with body cams, a study published last year found significant reductions in not only complaints against officers, but also the number of police use-of-force incidents.


However, not all police officers want all movements to be recorded. Callers into a local talk radio show that claim they are officers are split with some suggesting that the camera is nothing more than big brother sitting on your shoulder and others mentioning lowered moral amongst the rank and file due to having a device record all of your activities and the pressure that comes from scrutiny of those activities. One said he was so focused on the camera it impacted his decision making ability.

It would be interesting to see if a police union or civil rights group weigh in on this topic from the officer's standpoint.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby tifosi77 on Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:42 pm

BigMcK wrote:One said he was so focused on the camera it impacted his decision making ability.

Isn't that kind of the point, tho?
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby thehockeyguru on Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:46 pm

tifosi77 wrote:
BigMcK wrote:One said he was so focused on the camera it impacted his decision making ability.

Isn't that kind of the point, tho?


Yep. I am all for this.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby BigMcK on Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:53 pm

I took his comment as that he would not react to a situation as trained, but rather react to a situation from concern of being scrutinized.

If the officer needed to draw his weapon to shoot as had been trained, he may now hesitate and lose seconds worrying about drawing his weapon.

That was my takeaway.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby DelPen on Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:53 pm

pittsoccer33 wrote:Can you imagine getting police unions on board with that though? I can't.

An appropriate lawsuit from the DOJ will fix that.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby Sam's Drunk Dog on Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:55 pm

Idoit40fans wrote:If they have a budget for cameras, its a no brainer.

If they can afford mini-tanks, they can afford cameras.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby tifosi77 on Fri Aug 22, 2014 4:10 pm

BigMcK wrote:I took his comment as that he would not react to a situation as trained, but rather react to a situation from concern of being scrutinized.

If the officer needed to draw his weapon to shoot as had been trained, he may now hesitate and lose seconds worrying about drawing his weapon.

That was my takeaway.

Either way, I still think the point is to change behavior. Perhaps that should also include changes in training.

Sam's Drunk Dog wrote:
Idoit40fans wrote:If they have a budget for cameras, its a no brainer.

If they can afford mini-tanks, they can afford cameras.

Believe it or not, they actually get that equipment for free from the DoD. It's called the 1033 Program, and it is administered out of Ft. Belvoir, VA. Over $5 billion worth of kit and vehicles has been transferred from the military to the police since the late 90s.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby columbia on Fri Aug 22, 2014 7:39 pm

The screwed up thing is that this topic pales to what's really important in the world right now. Yes, I am extremely troubled by the police shooting an unarmed person and we shall see what the real details were/are. But this ISIS deal is just about the scariest thing I've seen in my time on this earth and I'm including those lunatics on 9/11. These dudes are *seriously* **** bad news.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby Eismann on Fri Aug 22, 2014 7:44 pm

columbia wrote:The screwed up thing is that this topic pales to what's really important in the world right now. Yes, I am extremely troubled by the police shooting an unarmed person and we shall see what the real details were/are. But this ISIS deal is just about the scariest thing I've seen in my time on this earth and I'm including those lunatics on 9/11. These dudes are *seriously* **** bad news.


On this, I fully concur.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby eddysnake on Fri Aug 22, 2014 7:47 pm

How big is ISIS? I was reading today that because of our airstrikes and Iraq army pushing forward they took a lot back. They are certainly batsh*t crazy, but if we (pretty sure the rest of the world should join in on this) went all out, could we take care of them pretty fast?
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby Shyster on Fri Aug 22, 2014 7:55 pm

Disagree on the "really important." Police acting like terrorists in my back yard is more important to me than people who are actually terrorists but are located on the other side of the world.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby columbia on Fri Aug 22, 2014 8:00 pm

Considering that you're white, you should probably be more worried about the other threat. :pop: :slug:
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby Sam's Drunk Dog on Fri Aug 22, 2014 8:03 pm

Precision air strikes could probably wipe them out but the potential collateral damage makes it a difficult decision.

I think it's the best choice out of all the scenarios.

There is do nothing, and thousands of innocent people die.

Send in troops, which results in 100s if not more of military deaths, and 100s if not more civilians still die. If we could get a large coalition of countries involved, that would be great, but I don't see that happening with the lack of support there was previously. I don't think Obama would do much better than Bush at recruiting allies.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby PensFanInDC on Fri Aug 22, 2014 8:27 pm

Shyster wrote:Disagree on the "really important." Police acting like terrorists in my back yard is more important to me than people who are actually terrorists but are located on the other side of the world.


Al queda and ISIS parted ways because ISIS wanted to focus on hitting America at home and al queda wanted them to focus on Syria. ISIS apparently has members with US and European passports. That ish is scary.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby tifosi77 on Fri Aug 22, 2014 8:41 pm

eddysnake wrote:How big is ISIS? I was reading today that because of our airstrikes and Iraq army pushing forward they took a lot back. They are certainly batsh*t crazy, but if we (pretty sure the rest of the world should join in on this) went all out, could we take care of them pretty fast?

They are estimated to have several thousand fighters in Iraq alone. The territory under their control is roughly the size of California spread across Iraq, Syria and Jordan.

But operationally they already pose a far greater threat than al Qaeda ever did, even AQI. They have more money, better equipment and training (thanks to Uncle Sugar), a clear objective, and they are motivated. Al Qaeda never really had territorial/caliphic aspirations.

ISIS/ISIL are an altogether different type of hellbeast. They are the balrog to the Moria goblins. If these guys were in Iraq in 2002/3, I might well have had a very different opinion about invasion. Then again, if Hussein had still been in power all these years..........

Different thread. That said, I'm in total agreement with Shyster.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby columbia on Fri Aug 22, 2014 8:43 pm

They're an army and a quasi-state.
You should be very concerned, IMO.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby PensFanInDC on Fri Aug 22, 2014 8:47 pm

When a cop straps a bomb to his chest and blows up a mall then you can say they are acting like terrorists or compare them to ISIS.

Believe me, I don't like cops in general. I don't like dealing with them and I don't like how some of them abuse their power, in some cases leading to the deaths of innocent people. But to say that is a bigger threat to me right now is not accurate. I'm a middle class white dude in farm country. As far as I am concerned cops pose very little threat to me. Now, if I were a black man in Biloxi, MS.....
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby Shyster on Fri Aug 22, 2014 9:13 pm

Yeah, as a cracker I ain't got nothing to worry about. I mean, when cops with machine guns were hunting for the Boston bomber, they strictly limited their unconstitutional house-to-house raids to black neighborhoods:

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Re: Michael Brown

Postby columbia on Fri Aug 22, 2014 9:20 pm

With that logic, you wonder why Ron Paul didn't get elected?
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby Troy Loney on Fri Aug 22, 2014 9:21 pm

Isis seems to be just plucking from the lunatic suicidal fringe right now, attracting the most radical and idealistic amd hateful people from across the globe. They are baiting the west to fight them in Iraq. Nothing good will come from dedicated military operations. Let the local authorities in the areas they are operating turn on them, i don't think there's any way to defeat guerrillas in another territory.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby MalkinIsMyHomeboy on Fri Aug 22, 2014 10:56 pm

If ISIS were to get their hands on real weapons there could be trouble, but I can't imagine anyone helping them.
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby columbia on Fri Aug 22, 2014 11:03 pm

MalkinIsMyHomeboy wrote:but I can't imagine anyone helping them.


ISIS Is Likely Receiving Funding From People Living In Countries Allied With The US

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/isis-fun ... z3BBGJ4pG4
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Re: Michael Brown

Postby tifosi77 on Sat Aug 23, 2014 12:00 pm

PensFanInDC wrote:When a cop straps a bomb to his chest and blows up a mall then you can say they are acting like terrorists or compare them to ISIS.

Believe me, I don't like cops in general. I don't like dealing with them and I don't like how some of them abuse their power, in some cases leading to the deaths of innocent people. But to say that is a bigger threat to me right now is not accurate. I'm a middle class white dude in farm country. As far as I am concerned cops pose very little threat to me. Now, if I were a black man in Biloxi, MS.....

One very important fact to remember: You’re Eight Times More Likely to be Killed by a Police Officer than a Terrorist
That's from two years ago, and there are a lot of useful links in that blog post that talk about police militarization and whatnot. That's not to marginalize the ISIS/ISIL threat. That's merely to put it in perspective.

Since 9/11, police have killed more Americans than have terrorists.
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