Goligoski Re-signed

Forum for hockey posts that are not Penguins-related.

Moderators: Three Stars, dagny, pfim, netwolf

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Sarcastic on Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:38 pm

tfrizz wrote:
Henry Hank wrote:And this is why the Pens traded him. They couldn't be paying that kind of money to their #5 D.


:thumb: :thumb: :thumb:


That may not be true at all. I haven't watched him much in Dallas, but I can't imagine him being worse defensively than Martin is right now. And Gogo brings an additional offensive side and a shot. Maybe he could have been our #3, instead of the pile of crap we got. I always imagined Letang on pair 1 and Gogo on pair 2, each with a defensive stalwart.
Sarcastic
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 15,283
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 3:49 pm

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Be1isarius89 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:49 pm

The Snapshot wrote:
Be1isarius89 wrote:Seems a bit much for an undersized puck mover with limited defensive skills who has struggled this year but then again I honestly haven't watched him play since he was traded.


This is the Cliffs Notes version of scouting on a guy who is probably in the top 20 Defensemen for offenisive ability. You admit you haven't watched him though. There are probably 15 teams in the league who would be upgrading their top PP QB spot by signing him. It may be more than that. He is under-rated defensively by people who don't appreciate that a Dman doesn't have to rattle the boards to be effective.

Let's put it this way, when Letang was out I would have much preferred to have him to step up instead of having Paul Martin on the point on the PP. Defensively, they are not that different either, although Martin is slightly better positionally when he isn't at the depths of his suckitude.

This is a good signing for Dallas, because they do not have any D anywhere near his abilities - and yes it is a factor that they traded away two strong assets to get him.

The analysis above is akin to the folks who sum Crosby up by saying he is good, but he is a diver and a whiner.


$4.6 million a year is still alot for what he could potentially be. Guess it makes sense that Gogo is getting paid like Dennis Wideman.....
Be1isarius89
Junior 'A'
Junior 'A'
 
Posts: 465
Joined: Wed Jan 06, 2010 10:26 pm
Location: Inside your head

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby tfrizz on Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:59 pm

Sarcastic wrote:
tfrizz wrote:
Henry Hank wrote:And this is why the Pens traded him. They couldn't be paying that kind of money to their #5 D.


:thumb: :thumb: :thumb:


That may not be true at all. I haven't watched him much in Dallas, but I can't imagine him being worse defensively than Martin is right now. And Gogo brings an additional offensive side and a shot. Maybe he could have been our #3, instead of the pile of crap we got. I always imagined Letang on pair 1 and Gogo on pair 2, each with a defensive stalwart.


In any case you'd be paying way too much for the #5 defenseman, whether it's Goligoski, Michalek, or Martin.
tfrizz
AHL Hall of Famer
AHL Hall of Famer
 
Posts: 8,539
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:49 am
Location: Freddy Beach

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Rylan on Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:01 pm

lol i think for neal's sake he does anything to be signed in pittsburgh. malkin and company allow him to just play hockey without the pressure that other cities seemingly impose on their players.
Rylan
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 16,057
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:07 am
Location: Dead and Without Love

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Sarcastic on Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:43 pm

tfrizz wrote:
Sarcastic wrote:
tfrizz wrote:
Henry Hank wrote:And this is why the Pens traded him. They couldn't be paying that kind of money to their #5 D.


:thumb: :thumb: :thumb:


That may not be true at all. I haven't watched him much in Dallas, but I can't imagine him being worse defensively than Martin is right now. And Gogo brings an additional offensive side and a shot. Maybe he could have been our #3, instead of the pile of crap we got. I always imagined Letang on pair 1 and Gogo on pair 2, each with a defensive stalwart.


In any case you'd be paying way too much for the #5 defenseman, whether it's Goligoski, Michalek, or Martin.


No, you see, Gogo #3. Martin or Michalek not here. Same money.
Sarcastic
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 15,283
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 3:49 pm

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby NeddieVedder on Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:51 pm

Sarcastic wrote:
tfrizz wrote:
Sarcastic wrote:
tfrizz wrote:
Henry Hank wrote:And this is why the Pens traded him. They couldn't be paying that kind of money to their #5 D.


:thumb: :thumb: :thumb:


That may not be true at all. I haven't watched him much in Dallas, but I can't imagine him being worse defensively than Martin is right now. And Gogo brings an additional offensive side and a shot. Maybe he could have been our #3, instead of the pile of crap we got. I always imagined Letang on pair 1 and Gogo on pair 2, each with a defensive stalwart.


In any case you'd be paying way too much for the #5 defenseman, whether it's Goligoski, Michalek, or Martin.


No, you see, Gogo #3. Martin or Michalek not here. Same money.


And no Neal?
NeddieVedder
Junior 'A'
Junior 'A'
 
Posts: 420
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2006 11:35 am

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Sarcastic on Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:57 pm

I'm not speaking about Gogo/Neal trade. I'm happy about it, of course. I'm just arguing the monetary issue. We did not trade Gogo because we couldn't pay it. Just saying I'd rather have him than Martin for the money.
Sarcastic
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 15,283
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 3:49 pm

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby shmenguin on Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:00 pm

Henry Hank wrote:They couldn't be paying that kind of money to their #5 D.


i feel like, on too many nights, they already are
shmenguin
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 23,185
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 11:34 pm

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Zach6668 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:05 pm

Pretty sure he leads that team in average TOI. He's their number 1 D-man.

I don't have the stats in front of me, though. Something I recall reading.
Zach6668
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 1,459
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:29 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON, formerly Thunder Bay, ON

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby The Snapshot on Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:15 pm

Zach6668 wrote:Pretty sure he leads that team in average TOI. He's their number 1 D-man.

I don't have the stats in front of me, though. Something I recall reading.


Forget it. To many here, he was overpaid on his current deal. He went to Dallas with 31 points and a plus 20 in only 60 games, and until this year had never been a - player in the NHL for and season/fraction of a season. He has averaged over .5 points per game and is +28 for his career, yet he is ineffective.

It's a good signing for Dallas, but as much as I liked Goligoski here - we did much better in the deal because of need. Dallas may feel the same way, because they have Jamie Benn and hated Niskanen. Maybe it shows most fans can't judge young defensemen?
The Snapshot
AHL Hall of Famer
AHL Hall of Famer
 
Posts: 8,322
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 11:28 am
Location: Somewhere between here and there

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby MRandall25 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:23 pm

The Snapshot wrote:
Zach6668 wrote:Pretty sure he leads that team in average TOI. He's their number 1 D-man.

I don't have the stats in front of me, though. Something I recall reading.


Forget it. To many here, he was overpaid on his current deal. He went to Dallas with 31 points and a plus 20 in only 60 games, and until this year had never been a - player in the NHL for and season/fraction of a season. He has averaged over .5 points per game and is +28 for his career, yet he is ineffective.

It's a good signing for Dallas, but as much as I liked Goligoski here - we did much better in the deal because of need. Dallas may feel the same way, because they have Jamie Benn and hated Niskanen. Maybe it shows most fans can't judge young defensemen?


Goligoski didn't have SexyHair..

But really, I think the problem with Goligoski was that his name wasn't "Kris Letang".
MRandall25
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 17,942
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 6:11 pm
Location: BOBROVSKY!!!

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby penny lane on Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:28 pm

Hope GM Shero is crunching numbers for James neal. With Goose, you 've got to give something to get.
This year, it's a win for the pens, next year it may be Dallas. ?
penny lane
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 28,827
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2006 6:29 pm
Location: Have fun, kick butt!

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby The Snapshot on Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:28 pm

Be1isarius89 wrote:
The Snapshot wrote:
Be1isarius89 wrote:Seems a bit much for an undersized puck mover with limited defensive skills who has struggled this year but then again I honestly haven't watched him play since he was traded.


This is the Cliffs Notes version of scouting on a guy who is probably in the top 20 Defensemen for offenisive ability. You admit you haven't watched him though. There are probably 15 teams in the league who would be upgrading their top PP QB spot by signing him. It may be more than that. He is under-rated defensively by people who don't appreciate that a Dman doesn't have to rattle the boards to be effective.

Let's put it this way, when Letang was out I would have much preferred to have him to step up instead of having Paul Martin on the point on the PP. Defensively, they are not that different either, although Martin is slightly better positionally when he isn't at the depths of his suckitude.

This is a good signing for Dallas, because they do not have any D anywhere near his abilities - and yes it is a factor that they traded away two strong assets to get him.

The analysis above is akin to the folks who sum Crosby up by saying he is good, but he is a diver and a whiner.


$4.6 million a year is still alot for what he could potentially be. Guess it makes sense that Gogo is getting paid like Dennis Wideman.....


Yeah, well Wideman has comparable stats offensively, but he is -34 in his last three seasons. I honestly don't think he would have even respectable numbers in that category if he didn't play almost 2 full seasons with Chara in Boston. Take away his combined +43 at the teat of Z and he would be -75 for his career.

Goligoski put up a +20 anchoring a rotation of Engelland and Lovejoy. People can deny all they want or say +/- is a flawed stat, but he produced enough offensively at even strength to offset any perceived shortcomings on D. He has very few true lmitations on D other than being overpowered on occassion by a 225lb forward that can also handle the puck (luckily there aren't many of those). His skating is effortless, oustanding agility, not at all afraid, great shot, good passer, can skate the puck out of danger.....

Goligoski is also a few years younger than Wideman and they locked him up until 30 for that number.

That said, I know the Pens need Neal more than him, and we also have Niskanen who is pretty serviceable.
The Snapshot
AHL Hall of Famer
AHL Hall of Famer
 
Posts: 8,322
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 11:28 am
Location: Somewhere between here and there

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby IanMoran on Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:42 pm

W :shock: W
IanMoran
AHL All-Star
AHL All-Star
 
Posts: 5,985
Joined: Tue May 12, 2009 12:10 am
Location: Minneapolis, via Pittsburgh

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby FallenHero96 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:07 pm

Mr. Colby wrote:Good for Goligoski, I've always liked him. I don't think the dollar amount is that far off from what he deserves.


:thumb:
FallenHero96
AHL'er
AHL'er
 
Posts: 2,645
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2006 2:39 am
Location: Minneapolis, MN

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Zach6668 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:28 pm

My guess is that his +/- has a lot to do with being on the top pairing as opposed to getting more sheltered minutes in Pittsburgh. Not saying he's necessarily facing the top line every game now, I have no idea, but I'd venture he's seeing stiffer opposition than being in the bottom pairing in Pittsburgh.

He has 5+10 in 36 games. That's about a 33-34 point season. Not awful, not the pace he was on here, but he's on a worse team, as well.

I bet he rebounds pretty strong in the second half and the rest of his career.
Zach6668
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 1,459
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:29 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON, formerly Thunder Bay, ON

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Mongoose87 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:40 pm

MRandall25 wrote:
But really, I think the problem with Goligoski was that his name wasn't "Kris Letang".

However, even to the unbiased among us, one has to be happy with getting Kris Letang for less than Goligoski.
Mongoose87
AHL All-Star
AHL All-Star
 
Posts: 6,908
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2007 3:04 pm
Location: The breakfast table of TRIUMPH!

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby MRandall25 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:44 pm

Mongoose87 wrote:
MRandall25 wrote:
But really, I think the problem with Goligoski was that his name wasn't "Kris Letang".

However, even to the unbiased among us, one has to be happy with getting Kris Letang for less than Goligoski.


Although who would've predicted Goligoski would've gotten this much on the open market if Shero had a plan set in to keep him?

Because I feel that's what happened with Letang. Shero knew he needed to keep Letang here, so he signed him to the extension before his value skyrocketed.

I wouldn't be surprised if Letang pulled $5 mil plus in his next contract, but we'll see what happens.
MRandall25
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 17,942
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 6:11 pm
Location: BOBROVSKY!!!

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby The Snapshot on Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:55 pm

Mongoose87 wrote:
MRandall25 wrote:
But really, I think the problem with Goligoski was that his name wasn't "Kris Letang".

However, even to the unbiased among us, one has to be happy with getting Kris Letang for less than Goligoski.


Agree this is a steal, and I would pay more for Letang anyway. Shero bought low on Letang though, because right now he should be among the top 5 defensemen in terms of compensation. When he is on, he is absolutely controlling the play out there. When his not, he is still a great defenseman. For Goligoski, only the first part of the previous sentence is true - although that goes for most of the NHL.
The Snapshot
AHL Hall of Famer
AHL Hall of Famer
 
Posts: 8,322
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 11:28 am
Location: Somewhere between here and there

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Henry Hank on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:10 pm

It gets forgotten now but they signed Letang when he was still unproven. I remember people thought his contract was a bit much considering what he had accomplished to that point but it was a risk that paid off because his game has elevated some levels since then and now it's a huge bargain. Which is the point of signing guys to these kinds of deals. At the time, Letang was in the middle of a 3 goal, 27 point season. Career high was 33 points and he wasn't getting quite the ice time he gets now. His defensive game was really rough around the edges. Now he's playing #1 D minutes and is almost at a point per game pace. He's going to get a lot more than $3.5 million on his next deal.
Henry Hank
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 12,480
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:31 pm

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Idoit40fans on Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:51 pm

...First contract i've seen that makes Martin's contract look better. Good for you Gogo.
Idoit40fans
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 53,547
Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 2:42 pm
Location: I'm sorry you feel that way

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby mikey287 on Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:20 pm

Not as bad as some here make it out to be, not great though. The Stars have to pay to keep talent around though. Gotta pay to play if you're a small market team...once they dump someone like Robidas, Goose won't look so bad...
mikey287
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 18,501
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 6:40 pm
Location: Philadelphia, PA - @MichaelFarkasHF

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Mr. Colby on Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:33 pm

If Letang were unrestricted after this season, he would get 7 million on the open market. Or else a 10+ year deal
Mr. Colby
AHL Hall of Famer
AHL Hall of Famer
 
Posts: 8,837
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:33 pm
Location: Born and Raised in Kent Manderville

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby Draftnik on Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:57 pm

Dallas bought 3 UFA seasons from Gogo. If people think the Pens are going to get UFA seasons from Tanger at $3.5M or Nealer at $2.8M keep dreaming.

I think its a good deal. Martin essentially took Gogo's spot. The Pens kept better D and sacrificed O, but they also were able to get Neal. The Pens couldn't have picked up a F the caliber of Neal via UFA. This is another testament to Shero's excellent asset management despite the vitriol hurled towards Martin.
Draftnik
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 16,011
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 1:52 pm
Location: Peters Twp.

Re: Goligoski Re-signed

Postby The Snapshot on Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:20 am

Draftnik wrote:Dallas bought 3 UFA seasons from Gogo. If people think the Pens are going to get UFA seasons from Tanger at $3.5M or Nealer at $2.8M keep dreaming.

I think its a good deal. Martin essentially took Gogo's spot. The Pens kept better D and sacrificed O, but they also were able to get Neal. The Pens couldn't have picked up a F the caliber of Neal via UFA. This is another testament to Shero's excellent asset management despite the vitriol hurled towards Martin.


I don't think people understand the economic reality of Free Agency, restricted or not. They have him until he's 30.

Of course, some people also think he is terrible, so whatever.

I don't have the energy to cross-reference those who hated Goligoski with those that still think Tangradi is a late bloomer, but if anyone is in both camps......
The Snapshot
AHL Hall of Famer
AHL Hall of Famer
 
Posts: 8,322
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 11:28 am
Location: Somewhere between here and there

PreviousNext

Return to NPR

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


e-mail