Thoughts on Weber...

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Thoughts on Weber...

Postby interstorm on Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:09 am

Thinking things through for a few minutes - I am of the opinion that we will see some big activity regarding Shea Weber this summer (with Suter out of the mix, I would imagine this activity may be from Nashville or more likely teams interested via a trade). Here is the crux of my argument:

With the CBA possibly changing to (somehow) limit long-term big money contracts, players who can sign for such money are doing so now (this is apparently obvious). Those not available to resign like this, such as Malkin, may "miss out" on such guaranteed mega-deals.

I think Shea Weber would want to get something like this done for himself, thus protecting his interests in a large guaranteed payday (of course he'll get money done the road if he signed something big next year -- but I have heard that owners may push to have contracts not guaranteeing the money. If you're offered $100 million, it is vastly different if this is guaranteed money or not). Based on this, I could see him either re-upping in Nashville or, should he feel the team may not be a match for his likes, pushing hard for a trade before the season starts. Given Suter was ok with walking away from the team, especially to go to a franchise in an area that loves hockey and really supports the team, I would be inclined to say Weber would do the same.

That being said, I arrive at the thought that Weber MUST be in play big time -- it almost makes no sense for him not to be. As an RFA his options are limited -- but he would be a UFA next year. Nashville won't want to sign him for 1 year - have him play as a lame duck - and watch him leave for (possibly) nothing next summer. Weber, for his part, won't want to sign a 1 year contract and risk some big injury that takes all of that guaranteed money off the table. For the reasons stated above he may not want to sign a long term deal with Nashville. What does that leave?

Given that he would be the perfect compliment to the types of players we have currently on our roster (and in our system), what do we offer? I don't think we can provide much in the form of roster players (please leave Kennedy or Jeffrey out -- they would be no more than a throw in as they are dime-a-dozen players). I guess the question is whether the Preds are considered now in a rebuilding mode or not.

(I could also see the Flyers, who have more in terms of younger roster assets to offer) making a big push.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby NJ5934 on Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:14 am

Nashville is going to do everything they can to keep him. I would not be surprised if Shea Weber becomes to highest paid player in the league at some point.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Kraftster on Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:19 am

interstorm wrote:Thinking things through for a few minutes - I am of the opinion that we will see some big activity regarding Shea Weber this summer (with Suter out of the mix, I would imagine this activity may be from Nashville or more likely teams interested via a trade). Here is the crux of my argument:

With the CBA possibly changing to (somehow) limit long-term big money contracts, players who can sign for such money are doing so now (this is apparently obvious). Those not available to resign like this, such as Malkin, may "miss out" on such guaranteed mega-deals.

I think Shea Weber would want to get something like this done for himself, thus protecting his interests in a large guaranteed payday (of course he'll get money done the road if he signed something big next year -- but I have heard that owners may push to have contracts not guaranteeing the money. If you're offered $100 million, it is vastly different if this is guaranteed money or not). Based on this, I could see him either re-upping in Nashville or, should he feel the team may not be a match for his likes, pushing hard for a trade before the season starts. Given Suter was ok with walking away from the team, especially to go to a franchise in an area that loves hockey and really supports the team, I would be inclined to say Weber would do the same.

That being said, I arrive at the thought that Weber MUST be in play big time -- it almost makes no sense for him not to be. As an RFA his options are limited -- but he would be a UFA next year. Nashville won't want to sign him for 1 year - have him play as a lame duck - and watch him leave for (possibly) nothing next summer. Weber, for his part, won't want to sign a 1 year contract and risk some big injury that takes all of that guaranteed money off the table. For the reasons stated above he may not want to sign a long term deal with Nashville. What does that leave?

Given that he would be the perfect compliment to the types of players we have currently on our roster (and in our system), what do we offer? I don't think we can provide much in the form of roster players (please leave Kennedy or Jeffrey out -- they would be no more than a throw in as they are dime-a-dozen players). I guess the question is whether the Preds are considered now in a rebuilding mode or not.

(I could also see the Flyers, who have more in terms of younger roster assets to offer) making a big push.


What about his game makes him the perfect compliment to the types of players the Pens have on their roster and in the system?
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby shmenguin on Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:26 am

For starters, we don't need a #1 dman. We have one already.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby scpensfan on Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:38 am

shmenguin wrote:For starters, we don't need a #1 dman. We have one already.


I'm more of the belief that if you give up 150 goals in a playoff series, you need to find some people that can play defense better, not just insist that it was "system" problems.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Kraftster on Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:45 am

scpensfan wrote:
shmenguin wrote:For starters, we don't need a #1 dman. We have one already.


I'm more of the belief that if you give up 150 goals in a playoff series, you need to find some people that can play defense better, not just insist that it was "system" problems.


The money Weber will get paid is not going to be for his defense.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Nizzy on Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:48 am

scpensfan wrote:
shmenguin wrote:For starters, we don't need a #1 dman. We have one already.


I'm more of the belief that if you give up 150 goals in a playoff series, you need to find some people that can play defense better, not just insist that it was "system" problems.


But it was. How come the defense was so much better 1 year earlier with the same exact 6 defensive core?

-Injuries
-Philly had tape on the only system we play from OTT smacking us, islanders smacking us 2 games in a row, and us beating philly the last 2 times in the playoffs. THEY FIGURED IT OUT. BYLSMA PLAYED THE SAME THING EVERY TIME.
-Staal gave up on his defense duties to showcase his offense for his trade/he just got sick of his role
-Crosby's condition was slightly behind, he seemed 1 step behind on the backcheck

Obviously system problems, Bylsma got outcoached so hard and its obvious now he's in over his head that he's been "figured out"

It's team defense, and there was none of it.

EDIT: On topic, Weber is more of a pipedream that Suter was and we never had a chance to get him either. We should stop focusing on getting a number 1, or number 2, or another top 4 guy. This team needs a 6'5" number 5 or 6 to beat the crap out of the Holmstrom's around Fleury in the playoffs. We have not had that guy since 2009.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby CERV96 on Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:57 am

To my understanding Nashville has already said they would match whatever offer sheet he would sign. So if this is true there is no point in even thinking about it.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby guiner on Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:07 am

They make good charcoal grills.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby pens_CT on Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:17 am

CERV96 wrote:To my understanding Nashville has already said they would match whatever offer sheet he would sign. So if this is true there is no point in even thinking about it.

I think somebody (Flyers) looks to make a trade for Weber. Nashville, if they can't sign him long term this summer can't lose another guy for nothing.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Idoit40fans on Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:52 am

scpensfan wrote:
shmenguin wrote:For starters, we don't need a #1 dman. We have one already.


I'm more of the belief that if you give up 150 goals in a playoff series, you need to find some people that can play defense better, not just insist that it was "system" problems.


So Weber is out then...
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Idoit40fans on Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:53 am

CERV96 wrote:To my understanding Nashville has already said they would match whatever offer sheet he would sign. So if this is true there is no point in even thinking about it.


Actually if you knew for sure that was true, there is definitely a great reason to sign one.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby DelPen on Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:00 am

He's really good but how much of that was playing with Suter, which is the same knock against Suter, how much of it was Weber?
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Idoit40fans on Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:10 am

DelPen wrote:He's really good but how much of that was playing with Suter, which is the same knock against Suter, how much of it was Weber?


Well balanced, Weber definitely carried the offense, Suter definitely covered up to the point to allow him to do so. They'll both take a step back apart. Not a set back.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby mikey287 on Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:13 am

I know how you get Weber....and I don't want him really, he's another offensive d-man and the cost wouldn't be worth it...

Offer sheet: 1 year, $13 million. Nashville won't match, it'll cost us four 1st round picks. We'll get exclusive negotiating rights for the year until he hits UFA. Anything other than that is a dream...so, if you want him, it's make him the highest paid player in the league for one year and surrender four 1sts...
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby RxBandit66 on Thu Jul 05, 2012 12:41 pm

mikey287 wrote:I know how you get Weber....and I don't want him really, he's another offensive d-man and the cost wouldn't be worth it...

Offer sheet: 1 year, $13 million. Nashville won't match, it'll cost us four 1st round picks. We'll get exclusive negotiating rights for the year until he hits UFA. Anything other than that is a dream...so, if you want him, it's make him the highest paid player in the league for one year and surrender four 1sts...


Weber would make the Pens power play absolutely frightening, but you are right, it's just a pipe dream. They need defense and grit on the blue line, not more offense. And they cannot continue to use Letang for 35 minutes every game. The good news is that any number of defense prospects will be ready to setp in very soon. With that in mind, I have no problem with them going after an older player with some grit (a Hal Gill type of player) that can bridge the gap until those guys are ready. Orpik played poorly last season, and Martin is another guy who needs to have a bounce-back season. Niskanen is solid, Engelland is ok as a 6th or 7th guy. Trading Z created a hole they will need to fill immediately, though, because right now they are not a top contender with their current defense.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Kovy27 on Thu Jul 05, 2012 12:53 pm

mikey287 wrote:I know how you get Weber....and I don't want him really, he's another offensive d-man and the cost wouldn't be worth it...

Offer sheet: 1 year, $13 million. Nashville won't match, it'll cost us four 1st round picks. We'll get exclusive negotiating rights for the year until he hits UFA. Anything other than that is a dream...so, if you want him, it's make him the highest paid player in the league for one year and surrender four 1sts...


Nashville already said they would match any 1 year offer.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby mikey287 on Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:01 pm

Kovy27 wrote:
mikey287 wrote:I know how you get Weber....and I don't want him really, he's another offensive d-man and the cost wouldn't be worth it...

Offer sheet: 1 year, $13 million. Nashville won't match, it'll cost us four 1st round picks. We'll get exclusive negotiating rights for the year until he hits UFA. Anything other than that is a dream...so, if you want him, it's make him the highest paid player in the league for one year and surrender four 1sts...


Nashville already said they would match any 1 year offer.


Yeah, they say that, but I'd like to see it on the biggest single year, full season contract in my memory...but that's the best chance, I feel...so, if they will in fact match that, then Weber is out...another thread that could be locked and done away with...
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby darkstar57 on Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:33 pm

This should be NPR, we didn't have a chance with Suter, we stand NEGATIVE 15% chance with Weber, yes we have no shot out Weber that is actually a negative number

After failing to get Parise or Suter, DET is going to go hard after weber, they covet him more then they coveted Suter and they pushed for Suter.

If he doesn't resign in Nashville which i still they he does because they are going to throw a huge contract at him, would not be surprised if its north of 9 mil a year cap hit.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Pucks_and_Pols on Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:59 pm

Nashville GM: “Shea certainly hoped that Ryan would re-sign. I know if Ryan re-signed that would have made it a lot easier to have Shea make a commitment.”


If there was ever a player that it would be nice to see Shero break the bank to go out and snatch, wouldn’t it be Shea Weber at this point in his career? Is it crazy and reckless? Yes. But man, the immediate payoff would be incredible.

If we sent them Orpik, Martin, TK, and a #1 pick in 2013 for Shea Weber and a prospect, I’d go for it.

dealing off Orpik and Martin would certainly free up space for some of our young guns to step up on D. That is for certain. Orpik would also give Nashville the veteran presence they will be desperately seeking on the blueline to replace Suter and Weber.

It would help Nashville get to their salary floor as they need to fill in about $14m before the start of the season, those 3 would cover 10.75 of that hole. You’d also have to get Orpik and Martin to waive their no-trades as well to go to Nashville. Pens seem more on board with Martin then the fanbase is, considering they were trying to get him to recruit Parise.

But if Shero can swing it, this would be the D-depth as I see it:

Pittsburgh
Letang-Weber
Niskanen-Engelland
Despres-Lovejoy
Strait

Wilkes-Barre
Bortuzzo-Grant
Dumoulin-Reese
Sneep-Samuelsson
Morrow-Harrington

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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Jasmine on Thu Jul 05, 2012 3:02 pm

Trade for Weber now or go through the same Parise/Suter torture/disappointment next summer - and next summer, we might lose to the Flyers!
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby DelPen on Thu Jul 05, 2012 4:16 pm

In a menaingless stat Weber was -3 vs the Atlantic and in 5 games was never on the plus side. Factor in not playing with Suter then I'm not sure how much he wold help espcially in 2025.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Gaucho on Thu Jul 05, 2012 6:52 pm

Niskanen-Engelland as the 2nd pairing sounds like fun.
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby Mongoose87 on Thu Jul 05, 2012 7:06 pm

Gaucho wrote:Niskanen-Engelland as the 2nd pairing sounds like fun.

They fight, and shoot and turn over!
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Re: Thoughts on Weber...

Postby KG on Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:12 pm

shmenguin wrote:For starters, we don't need a #1 dman. We have one already.


I think Letang is a great #2 and I would love Weber here...

that said, it's not happening....
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