Flyers offer sheet Weber

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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby mikey287 on Fri Jul 20, 2012 1:36 pm

Nashville cannot trade him now or 364 days from now under any situation.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby pfim on Fri Jul 20, 2012 1:43 pm

Splitting hairs, it's a 7 day period where his rights can't be traded. Nashville has more of a claim to him than Philly does, however, as they can just match the offer and Philly has no recourse. Nashville can't trade his rights for a year if they match the offer.

I don't think RFA has changed much at all. And front loading cash onto a deal to prohibit a team from matching an offer isn't a new thing. The Rangers tried to do it with Joe Sakic.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby mikey287 on Fri Jul 20, 2012 1:45 pm

Right on, the "poison pill", as it were, has been neutralized quite a bit under this CBA. No more Fedorov clauses...
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby Pitts on Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:43 pm

Tico Rick wrote:Thanks, pfim. Didn't think of that angle. I'm not sure how that would work, though, since at this point the Preds don't own the rights to Weber. "We will agree not to match your offer if you give us X, Y and Z?" That's sounds like a trade the NHL would want to take a look at, along with the contract itself.

The Preds will offer the "trade" some or all of the picks back to Philly for players.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby pens#1 on Fri Jul 20, 2012 9:59 pm

I am surprised there are no rumors out there about what is going on, I feel as if its a ton of money for Nashville to come up with- but with that said how much more will they lose if they dont resign him? If Nashville loses him you have to imagine Season tickets sales will drop, advertisers will drop... At the end of the day if the Preds match they are getting a number 1 Dman for his whole career for a very nice cap hit.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby brwi on Sat Jul 21, 2012 6:50 am

pens#1 wrote:I am surprised there are no rumors out there about what is going on, I feel as if its a ton of money for Nashville to come up with- but with that said how much more will they lose if they dont resign him? If Nashville loses him you have to imagine Season tickets sales will drop, advertisers will drop... At the end of the day if the Preds match they are getting a number 1 Dman for his whole career for a very nice cap hit.


I imagine that since Nashville has an ownership group and they have said they make all major decisions as a group, there's a lot of calls and meeting amongst themselves and Poile at the moment. This is a big decision for the franchise and alternatives to signing Weber are out there and will be explored even if they all have decided with 99% certainty that will match.

First, you have the fact that Nashville would be losing their #1 and #2 dmen suddenly. While Ryan Ellis is probably ready for a bigger role and Gill got re-upped, that's a huge hit on the blueline. Next, you have the very real threat of the fans going sour in a hurry seeing Suter and Weber leave at the same time. Then you have the problem of needing to spend a LOT of money to reach the cap floor limit since you're no longer paying Weber or Suter and also had cap space to spare already. Ownership also has to tell Poile "yes, we have or can get the 26mil to match this crap" or "forget it, no way." Then you have to consider if Weber is/isn't committed to Nashville since he obviously signed the offer sheet himself and do we want to keep him or not even if we can make the $ work.

So.....Poile is likely being as subtle as possible in making calls to GM's at home about a lot of what if's. Losing your #1 and #2 dman means obviously they need at least one stellar dman. Does that mean Schenn would be part of any deal with the Pred-Flyers? Schenn obviously isn't enough alone but he's a Flyer and working a deal for him is certainly possible. Then there is the part that Nashville could just take the 4 1st rounders from the Flyers and do nothing with the Flyers at all in terms of dealing. What would it take to get Bouwmeester from Calgary as he's certainly available and fits the bill as a) a top dman and b) his salary gets you closer to the cap floor. What can they get around the league for a couple of FLyers' 1st rounders? Loads of possibilites/alternatives to discuss.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby KG on Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:36 am

Pitts wrote:
Tico Rick wrote:Thanks, pfim. Didn't think of that angle. I'm not sure how that would work, though, since at this point the Preds don't own the rights to Weber. "We will agree not to match your offer if you give us X, Y and Z?" That's sounds like a trade the NHL would want to take a look at, along with the contract itself.

The Preds will offer the "trade" some or all of the picks back to Philly for players.


That doesn't sound like it should be allowed...Has that even happened before?

I remember when the Blues gave the offer sheet to Marty McSorley, LA matched and then traded him to the Pens for McEachern. But I don't think that's allowed anymore either.

I'd be surprised if Nashville could match and take the picks as compensation and then deal those picks back to the Flyers for players. Just sounds weird...
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby pens2005 on Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:09 am

KG wrote:
Pitts wrote:
Tico Rick wrote:Thanks, pfim. Didn't think of that angle. I'm not sure how that would work, though, since at this point the Preds don't own the rights to Weber. "We will agree not to match your offer if you give us X, Y and Z?" That's sounds like a trade the NHL would want to take a look at, along with the contract itself.

The Preds will offer the "trade" some or all of the picks back to Philly for players.


That doesn't sound like it should be allowed...Has that even happened before?


I remember when the Blues gave the offer sheet to Marty McSorley, LA matched and then traded him to the Pens for McEachern. But I don't think that's allowed anymore either.

I'd be surprised if Nashville could match and take the picks as compensation and then deal those picks back to the Flyers for players. Just sounds weird...


It does sound weird for sure.

Why not just trade weber to the flyers for 2 firsts and the players you want?

I guess they tried that already, Philly said f off, we are signing him to an offer sheet.

My guess is that all the pressure is on Nashville as far as trades. Philly doesn't like what they offer, they simply wait it out and give up the 4 picks

They could easily make a separate trade involving picks and players and just claim that it is totally separate from this weber status.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby pens2005 on Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:09 am

KG wrote:
Pitts wrote:
Tico Rick wrote:Thanks, pfim. Didn't think of that angle. I'm not sure how that would work, though, since at this point the Preds don't own the rights to Weber. "We will agree not to match your offer if you give us X, Y and Z?" That's sounds like a trade the NHL would want to take a look at, along with the contract itself.

The Preds will offer the "trade" some or all of the picks back to Philly for players.


That doesn't sound like it should be allowed...Has that even happened before?


I remember when the Blues gave the offer sheet to Marty McSorley, LA matched and then traded him to the Pens for McEachern. But I don't think that's allowed anymore either.

I'd be surprised if Nashville could match and take the picks as compensation and then deal those picks back to the Flyers for players. Just sounds weird...


It does sound weird for sure.

Why not just trade weber to the flyers for 2 firsts and the players you want?

I guess they tried that already, Philly said f off, we are signing him to an offer sheet.

My guess is that all the pressure is on Nashville as far as trades. Philly doesn't like what they offer, they simply wait it out and give up the 4 picks

They could easily make a separate trade involving picks and players and just claim that it is totally separate from this weber status.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby Pitts on Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:07 pm

pens2005 wrote:
KG wrote:
Pitts wrote:
Tico Rick wrote:Thanks, pfim. Didn't think of that angle. I'm not sure how that would work, though, since at this point the Preds don't own the rights to Weber. "We will agree not to match your offer if you give us X, Y and Z?" That's sounds like a trade the NHL would want to take a look at, along with the contract itself.

The Preds will offer the "trade" some or all of the picks back to Philly for players.


That doesn't sound like it should be allowed...Has that even happened before?


I remember when the Blues gave the offer sheet to Marty McSorley, LA matched and then traded him to the Pens for McEachern. But I don't think that's allowed anymore either.

I'd be surprised if Nashville could match and take the picks as compensation and then deal those picks back to the Flyers for players. Just sounds weird...


It does sound weird for sure.

Why not just trade weber to the flyers for 2 firsts and the players you want?

I guess they tried that already, Philly said f off, we are signing him to an offer sheet.

My guess is that all the pressure is on Nashville as far as trades. Philly doesn't like what they offer, they simply wait it out and give up the 4 picks

They could easily make a separate trade involving picks and players and just claim that it is totally separate from this weber status.

It is allowed. Nashville says no to the offer sheet, and "takes the picks" as compensation.

Weber becomes Philly's property, but maybe they want to keep their picks (plus, they need to move some salary anyways), so they make a trade for those picks. It is 2 completely separate transactions.

For this: "Why not just trade weber to the flyers for 2 firsts and the players you want?" -- No can do. Since Weber signed the offer sheet, he can not be traded for one calender year by either Philly or Nashville.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby pens2005 on Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:21 pm

Pitts wrote:
pens2005 wrote:
KG wrote:
Pitts wrote:
Tico Rick wrote:Thanks, pfim. Didn't think of that angle. I'm not sure how that would work, though, since at this point the Preds don't own the rights to Weber. "We will agree not to match your offer if you give us X, Y and Z?" That's sounds like a trade the NHL would want to take a look at, along with the contract itself.

The Preds will offer the "trade" some or all of the picks back to Philly for players.


That doesn't sound like it should be allowed...Has that even happened before?


I remember when the Blues gave the offer sheet to Marty McSorley, LA matched and then traded him to the Pens for McEachern. But I don't think that's allowed anymore either.

I'd be surprised if Nashville could match and take the picks as compensation and then deal those picks back to the Flyers for players. Just sounds weird...


It does sound weird for sure.

Why not just trade weber to the flyers for 2 firsts and the players you want?

I guess they tried that already, Philly said f off, we are signing him to an offer sheet.

My guess is that all the pressure is on Nashville as far as trades. Philly doesn't like what they offer, they simply wait it out and give up the 4 picks

They could easily make a separate trade involving picks and players and just claim that it is totally separate from this weber status.

It is allowed. Nashville says no to the offer sheet, and "takes the picks" as compensation.

Weber becomes Philly's property, but maybe they want to keep their picks (plus, they need to move some salary anyways), so they make a trade for those picks. It is 2 completely separate transactions.

For this: "Why not just trade weber to the flyers for 2 firsts and the players you want?" -- No can do. Since Weber signed the offer sheet, he can not be traded for one calender year by either Philly or Nashville.


I was saying before they got to the point of him signing the offer sheet.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby brwi on Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:47 pm

Pretty sure that the flyers and Preds couldn't come to terms on any potential trade(Weber was being shopped to some extent, at least offers were being entertained by several teams by Poile), and Holmgren made a bold move to basically shutdown any other team from acquiring Weber or giving more time for Nashville to extend Weber theirselves.

You can say whatever you will about Holmgren as a GM, but this was a rather brilliant move that taps into the assets the Flyers have(tons of money) and the offer sheet proposed to Weber(that he signed) isn't totally ridiculous, especially considering how every year the cost of dmen inflates ridiculously in terms of what you get as opposed to what you pay for. It shutout all the competing GM's instantly from making better offers and cleared the playing field with one stroke of the pen. If I were a Flyer fan, I'd be hailing his mad skillz right now because what he did is great for the Flyers and I am not so convinced that offer-sheeting a guy means tough times in the future in dealing with other GM's.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby pens2005 on Sat Jul 21, 2012 3:34 pm

brwi wrote:Pretty sure that the flyers and Preds couldn't come to terms on any potential trade(Weber was being shopped to some extent, at least offers were being entertained by several teams by Poile), and Holmgren made a bold move to basically shutdown any other team from acquiring Weber or giving more time for Nashville to extend Weber theirselves.

You can say whatever you will about Holmgren as a GM, but this was a rather brilliant move that taps into the assets the Flyers have(tons of money) and the offer sheet proposed to Weber(that he signed) isn't totally ridiculous, especially considering how every year the cost of dmen inflates ridiculously in terms of what you get as opposed to what you pay for. It shutout all the competing GM's instantly from making better offers and cleared the playing field with one stroke of the pen. If I were a Flyer fan, I'd be hailing his mad skillz right now because what he did is great for the Flyers and I am not so convinced that offer-sheeting a guy means tough times in the future in dealing with other GM's.



It's less money per year than Suter which to me is interesting. He's worth more than that to be quite honest. The length of the deal is the part that is absurd. But then again, it's really only an 8 or 9 year deal, not a 14.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby penny lane on Sun Jul 22, 2012 1:04 pm

larry brooks on Ed Snider :

But as much as the Flyers’ bonus-laden, front-loaded $110 million offer to Weber was a righteous one, team chairman Ed Snider’s role in all this is as diabolical as they come, given his role as a notable hawk in the current labor negotiations.
For at the same time “Mr. Snider” authorized this offer to Weber, he is wholly supportive of the league effort to discount all but initial $13 million of the deal by nearly 25 percent.
Here is “Mr. Snider” agreeing to pay Weber $52 million in signing bonuses within the next three calendar years while engaged in an effort to prevent players from receiving even a nickel in signing bonuses going forward.
Here is “Mr. Snider” using his financial might to bulk up the Flyers while at the same time pledging to bankroll a lockout in order to stop the competition from ever doing this again.
For you see, Snider’s NBC/Comcast television contract with the NHL calls for the network to pay the league in full for this season — believed between $150 million and $160 million — even if 2012-13 is canceled in full.
Bravo to “Mr. Snider” for providing proof you can — in what polite circles would say — inhale and exhale at the same time.

Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/more_spo ... z21N7B9mdZ
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby Kaizer on Tue Jul 24, 2012 4:36 pm

Matched.
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby Big Easy Pens Fan on Tue Jul 24, 2012 5:14 pm

Great. Much rather see him in a Preds uni than a Cryer uni. :thumb:

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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby thepittman on Tue Jul 24, 2012 6:53 pm

Thank you Preds
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby littlemoonboot on Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:41 pm

LOL
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Re: Flyers offer sheet Weber

Postby Pitt87 on Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:15 pm

littlemoonboot wrote:LOL


Me too. Can't help but think the Preds believe this may get overturned by NHL based on the bonuses added into the first three years. Good news for them if it does. New negotiation.
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