Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby meow on Wed Aug 06, 2014 4:51 pm

I cannot argue with this.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Avyran on Wed Aug 06, 2014 4:52 pm

Lotsa ragging on the Columbus defenders. I think Tyutin is adequate. Not the best defender, but not absolutely hopeless. He provides enough positives that I understand the pick.

And chock off another of the "people I was considering" with Jan Hejda. His numbers this year surprised me, because I remembered him as essentially a more mobile Rob Scuderi. Isn't great at anything, but is good at almost everything.

Was happy to pick up Sobotka, as I think he's one of the best shut-down centers in the game. Incredible faceoff ability, physical game; he'll help strengthen my defense & my PK.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Wed Aug 06, 2014 4:54 pm

:shakes fist:
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby MRandall25 on Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:14 pm

Avyran wrote:Lotsa ragging on the Columbus defenders. I think Tyutin is adequate. Not the best defender, but not absolutely hopeless. He provides enough positives that I understand the pick.


He's been a step slower than everyone else the past 2 years or so, from my viewing experience. He also gets stuck in his own zone a lot because he can't move the puck forward under pressure. That's just the two big things that stuck out to me while watching him.

And the thing about Blue Jackets defenders aside from one or two is that they aren't that good individually. The system is just very friendly to them.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Idoit40fans on Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:31 pm

Avyran wrote:Lotsa ragging on the Columbus defenders. I think Tyutin is adequate. Not the best defender, but not absolutely hopeless. He provides enough positives that I understand the pick.

And chock off another of the "people I was considering" with Jan Hejda. His numbers this year surprised me, because I remembered him as essentially a more mobile Rob Scuderi. Isn't great at anything, but is good at almost everything.

Was happy to pick up Sobotka, as I think he's one of the best shut-down centers in the game. Incredible faceoff ability, physical game; he'll help strengthen my defense & my PK.


If he's a more mobile scuderi, then he isn't good at almost everything, he's good at positioning and somewhat better than "horrid" at moving. Still awful at handling the puck, passing, clearing, hitting.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Avyran on Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:39 pm

I know; that's what I thought Hejda was. When I did research on him, I was surprised by his numbers - lots of hits, lots of blocked shots, decent production. I'm saying my idea of him was off.

And if the CBJ defense is as bad as everyone says... well, that's even more damning of the Pens last year, eh?
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby pcm on Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:54 pm

Hejda is the Avs #2 dman. He's been paired with Eric Johnson. He's basically the Avs rock on defense. While I got him for his shutdown/pk acumen, he's much more talented than Scuderi, who shuts down his own team's offense...

I'd rank Hejda in the top 10-15 shutdown dmen.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby MRandall25 on Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:58 pm

That's not really what I'm saying at all, in regards to the Pens. That's a whole different story.

The players aren't very good if you take them out of Columbus's system. At an individual level (which is pretty much what you're going to be arguing for in this game), they're all pretty awful. Jack Johnson doesn't know how to play defense, Tyutin is a Russian Scuderi, Wiz takes dumb penalties and is slow. But they're put in a position to succeed in Columbus's system, how ever little the success is. They get a lot of help from the forwards and the system. Also having _______ in goal for them helps make up for the majority of their time on the ice.

But trying to say Jack Johnson, Wiz, and Toots are good is like trying to put lipstick on a pig. Sure, they have maybe 1 or 2 things that they can do well, but overall, they aren't very good defensemen.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby MRandall25 on Wed Aug 06, 2014 6:02 pm

Not sure if that makes sense, because it's hard to try to explain something that I've seen in person to someone who hasn't spent the last 4 years watching these guys play. I've seen a lot more bad from those 3 than I've seen good, and that's what I've based my opinion of them on. I realize you probably have a completely different view, but it is what it is.







God, I think that makes me sound like an a-hole, but it wasn't my intention. I just can't find another way to explain it.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Avyran on Wed Aug 06, 2014 6:07 pm

Nah, it makes sense. Still think it's kinda a strike against the Pens' play that we struggled so much against an incredibly inferior team, talent-wise. Definitely respect your opinion, even if I do think a little more highly of the players. No worries. Not arguing they're Norris-worthy, haha. Just think Johnson, Wiz, & Tyutin have value in the right circumstances. Having those different opinions'll make judging the teams fun.

In the end, I'd definitely put more stock in your opinion than in mine anyway, since you're actually in Columbus (IIRC).

Didn't sound bad; just sounded like you have a more concrete opinion than me, haha.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby mikey287 on Wed Aug 06, 2014 6:59 pm

Just responding in order that I see something worth responding to:

- I also like Tyutin, and have. He's nothing special, and it's debatable at whether or not he should have been drafted (I'm not so sure he should have, but I haven't given it a ton of thought) but he's been a decent player in his career. Steady Eddy. Better with the Rangers than with the Jackets, in my opinion. Not tracking upward in my opinion either.

- Hejda, in a vacuum, is a #4/5 d-man, but he really worked well last season with the Avs new shebang-a-bang...I don't rate him quite that highly on the shutdown scale, but it also depends on what encompasses a "shutdown dmen" - I can think of at least one player that was in a similar situation as Hejda last year that has not been selected and is better than him, for instance.

- I agree with MR25, the d-men in a vacuum lack a lot of, well, most things...JMFJ is probably the most talented of the lot, but it's hardly without warts...you honestly could have not drafted a single d-man from that team and no one would have batted an eyelash...Wiz makes for a fine PP specialist...but when you're talking about 61st or 78th best d-man in the league, I mean, what are we really hashing out here? Preference. It's all about utilizing them correctly.

- If MR25 had more thoughts about the proper utilization of the Blue Jackets d-men and how their system covers (or doesn't) for individual weaknesses, I think we'd all be more interested to hear this, if he's willing to share. Then again, these are future opponents that he might be sharing info with, so maybe not.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby MRandall25 on Wed Aug 06, 2014 7:01 pm

I considered Drouin, but wasn't sure I wanted to put that much stock into potential.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Avyran on Wed Aug 06, 2014 7:03 pm

Yeah, I'd definitely be interested in learning more about your opinion, MRandall. I'm in this to learn more about players & have fun, not make sure my team wins, haha.
Last edited by Avyran on Wed Aug 06, 2014 7:04 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby mikey287 on Wed Aug 06, 2014 7:03 pm

I think he probably just about moonwalks to the Calder this year like MacKinnon did...Drouin would not have looked out of place in the NHL last season...wouldn't have won the Calder, but he would have been productive to some degree...he's gonna come in guns blazing...
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Kraftster on Wed Aug 06, 2014 8:04 pm

Very disappointed that Sobotka was taken. Gah, what a bummer.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Idoit40fans on Wed Aug 06, 2014 8:08 pm

I think Drouin really cemented himself as fully legit this year in Junior. Eliminated any thoughts that maybe he leached off of MacKinnon. If he slots into a line with Stamkos and Callahan, its going to be a monster year.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Avyran on Wed Aug 06, 2014 8:30 pm

No one is winning faceoffs against me. :twisted: You just might beat me everywhere else, haha.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby count2infinity on Wed Aug 06, 2014 9:13 pm

I think I feel the same way about coaches as Mikey feels about goalies... "meh, they'll all be fine with the right team in front of them."
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby MRandall25 on Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:03 pm

Oh go **** yourself with a rusty pole, LITT :pop:

Ryan Murray was the one guy from the CBJ defense i was talking about who actually looks like a competent defenseman. Only "flaw" I saw in his time (missed some to injury) was inexperience. He's going to be good. Lot of room to grow for him.

As for system, I can't say I know too much about the X's and Os aspect, but what I saw from CBJ was collapsing around Bobrovsky and having the forwards really help out beneath the circles, which made up for the lack of actual defensive skill from the d-men. It doesn't take a bunch of studs to pack the house and stand in shooting lanes. And a great backcheck from the forwards helps prevent easy offensive movement, but forces the d-men to move the puck themselves, which they struggled at. The Jackets would get hemmed in a lot (though it was slightly better last year... There were games the previous years where they'd be out shot 2-1 because they couldn't get it out).

In short, Murray is good. CBJ relied a lot on full team defense, involved forwards, and packing lanes.
Last edited by MRandall25 on Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:04 pm

kraftster was all over that one
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Beveridge on Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:06 pm

count2infinity wrote:I think I feel the same way about coaches as Mikey feels about goalies... "meh, they'll all be fine with the right team in front of them."


I was in the same boat, obviously since I don't have a goalie yet either, but I feel just like the Olympics, when you have a short period of time (1 season in our case), the right coach is key.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Avyran on Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:07 pm

Yep, was guessing that Murray was the guy you'd think highly of. Have seen nothing but good things said about him (outside of the inexperience). He's a part of the quality young players that CBJ has which makes me think they'll continue to get better.

Cogliano, meanwhile, is my "oh yeah, I forgot about him" player.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby mikey287 on Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:42 am

Eh, will probably be a tandem job anyhow. But I'll begrudgingly select Bobrovsky. Him being the only non-playoff Vezina winner in the voting era (1982-) and the first Vezina winner to win the award in a non-playoff effort since Roy Worters some 80 years ago, ranks a major milestone historically...
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby count2infinity on Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:43 am

He was likely to be our back up in a round or two... good pick this late.
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Re: Dispersal Draft Game - Discussion Thread

Postby Idoit40fans on Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:59 am

Ewww.
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