Student Loan Thread

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Student Loan Thread

Postby mac5155 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:55 am

Last edited by mac5155 on Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby columbia on Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:59 am

Or people could just pay off their loans, like they legally agreed to in the first place.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby shafnutz05 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:03 am

I am pretty firmly against these kind of "loan forgiveness" bills. It rewards financial irresponsibility, IMO.

Edit: My wife and I both pay student loans every month. I came from a lower-income background, and I was able to apply for enough grants and whatnot that I decided my student loans would be manageable after I graduated.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby count2infinity on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:07 am

i hate higher education.... allow a ton of people in, jack up the tuition, profit.

it's hard to feel bad for people that just take on a crap load of debt to get an English literature, art appreciation, etc degree and then complain because they can't find a job in their field that pays enough to pay off their loans.... well no crap!
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby mac5155 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:07 am

No I agree. I signed on the dotted line so I should have to pay.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby Troy Loney on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:09 am

shafnutz05 wrote:
The bill would reward graduates for entering public service professions like teaching and
firefighting.


I have a bit of a problem with this portion of the text. I don't think people should be so handsomely rewarded for pursuing a "public service" (read: government) profession. If the true aim of this bill is to "jump start the economy", that doesn't make any sense. I'm assuming it's a nod to the unions, but meh.

All that being said, I am pretty firmly against these kind of "loan forgiveness" bills. It rewards financial irresponsibility, IMO.



So you want kids to get $60K educations to go work public service jobs that are going to pay $40K a year maybe? It seems like some sort of compromise is needed here, either the government hires a bunch of unqualified people to work public sector jobs, or you give people some sort of incentive to accept lower compensation (as it is obvious that cutting the cost of government means paying these workers in the $40K range and cutting their pension and insurance benefits).
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby count2infinity on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:09 am

shafnutz05 wrote:Edit: My wife and I both pay student loans every month. I came from a lower-income background, and I was able to apply for enough grants and whatnot that I decided my student loans would be manageable after I graduated.


bingo. when i decided i wanted to become a teacher I transferred schools so that I could afford it after I got out. not that it really matters now, but you have to think about those kinds of things while you're in school. oh, and here's a novel idea, graduate in 4 years. that'll keep the debt down as well. i know a ton of people that are in school 5.5+ years and still don't have a bachelor's degree because they dropped so many courses along the way.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby shafnutz05 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:09 am

Yeah, I think that's another issue...racking up a $100k loan on a diploma that pretty much anyone could tell you it's near impossible to find any success in the field. I obtained a degree in political science, and quickly realized that it was going to be very difficult for me to get into any kind of political career that could support me. So I sucked it up and got a job in a completely unrelated field, and I'm doing great five years later.

I just use the degree for arguing :lol:
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby shafnutz05 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:11 am

Troy Loney wrote:So you want kids to get $60K educations to go work public service jobs that are going to pay $40K a year maybe? It seems like some sort of compromise is needed here, either the government hires a bunch of unqualified people to work public sector jobs, or you give people some sort of incentive to accept lower compensation (as it is obvious that cutting the cost of government means paying these workers in the $40K range and cutting their pension and insurance benefits).


When I graduated college, I was getting paid in the neighborhood of $37k/year. I don't want this to turn into an argument about teacher pay/benefits, but I don't like how that group is always singled out as the only group that faces initial economic hardship.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby count2infinity on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:13 am

Troy Loney wrote:

So you want kids to get $60K educations to go work public service jobs that are going to pay $40K a year maybe? It seems like some sort of compromise is needed here, either the government hires a bunch of unqualified people to work public sector jobs, or you give people some sort of incentive to accept lower compensation (as it is obvious that cutting the cost of government means paying these workers in the $40K range and cutting their pension and insurance benefits).


go to a school that is cost efficient so you don't have a 60k debt. simple as that. go to a community college for 2 years then a state school for 2 and you can get out with sub 50k debt. i went to a private school for 2 years and racked up 20K in 2 years (with all the grants and scholarships that i got) then went to a state school which tacked on another 10K for the 2 years I was there.

If at the end of the day you don't think you'll be able to afford those loans after you graduate you should either rethink your career or find ways to cut the costs of education, simple as that.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby count2infinity on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:14 am

shafnutz05 wrote:
Troy Loney wrote:So you want kids to get $60K educations to go work public service jobs that are going to pay $40K a year maybe? It seems like some sort of compromise is needed here, either the government hires a bunch of unqualified people to work public sector jobs, or you give people some sort of incentive to accept lower compensation (as it is obvious that cutting the cost of government means paying these workers in the $40K range and cutting their pension and insurance benefits).


When I graduated college, I was getting paid in the neighborhood of $37k/year. I don't want this to turn into an argument about teacher pay/benefits, but I don't like how that group is always singled out as the only group that faces initial economic hardship.


wow...7k a year more than i made when i graduated and went into the teaching field ;)
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby shafnutz05 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:15 am

count2infinity wrote:
shafnutz05 wrote:
Troy Loney wrote:So you want kids to get $60K educations to go work public service jobs that are going to pay $40K a year maybe? It seems like some sort of compromise is needed here, either the government hires a bunch of unqualified people to work public sector jobs, or you give people some sort of incentive to accept lower compensation (as it is obvious that cutting the cost of government means paying these workers in the $40K range and cutting their pension and insurance benefits).


When I graduated college, I was getting paid in the neighborhood of $37k/year. I don't want this to turn into an argument about teacher pay/benefits, but I don't like how that group is always singled out as the only group that faces initial economic hardship.


wow...7k a year more than i made when i graduated and went into the teaching field ;)


haha, but my job was also in the near-suburbs of Washington, DC. What I would give to have my income now with the cost of living in central PA :lol:
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby Troy Loney on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:15 am

shafnutz05 wrote:
Troy Loney wrote:So you want kids to get $60K educations to go work public service jobs that are going to pay $40K a year maybe? It seems like some sort of compromise is needed here, either the government hires a bunch of unqualified people to work public sector jobs, or you give people some sort of incentive to accept lower compensation (as it is obvious that cutting the cost of government means paying these workers in the $40K range and cutting their pension and insurance benefits).


When I graduated college, I was getting paid in the neighborhood of $37k/year. I don't want this to turn into an argument about teacher pay/benefits, but I don't like how that group is always singled out as the only group that faces initial economic hardship.



I'm not talking about teachers, i'm talking about social workers and other government related jobs. Teachers do fine in my opinion, they're problem is that their income distribution is so ridiculously tilted towards the old guard that "put in their time" or whatever. They young teachers entering the field seem to be getting screwed, but that should be fixed by a more equitable distrbution within the ranks and they need to find a resolution in house. The problem I think, is that the argument that people make about teachers getting paid too much is getting push back from those teachers that aren't really making anything and are taking offense to the criticism they're receiving.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby count2infinity on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:16 am

don't you know how tough it is on the streets of altoona?
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:18 am

Teachers And nurses should make more money
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby prez41 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:18 am

columbia wrote:Or people could just pay off their loans, like they legally agreed to in the first place.


That's just crazy talk....
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby Troy Loney on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:18 am

count2infinity wrote:
shafnutz05 wrote:
Troy Loney wrote:So you want kids to get $60K educations to go work public service jobs that are going to pay $40K a year maybe? It seems like some sort of compromise is needed here, either the government hires a bunch of unqualified people to work public sector jobs, or you give people some sort of incentive to accept lower compensation (as it is obvious that cutting the cost of government means paying these workers in the $40K range and cutting their pension and insurance benefits).


When I graduated college, I was getting paid in the neighborhood of $37k/year. I don't want this to turn into an argument about teacher pay/benefits, but I don't like how that group is always singled out as the only group that faces initial economic hardship.


wow...7k a year more than i made when i graduated and went into the teaching field ;)


I'm not 100% informed on this to be honest, but how much doest it cost to go to like a CalU or IUP nowadays? I know CCAC is cheap, but I can't imagine a CCAC degree being worth much in any field nowadays.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby shafnutz05 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:18 am

Troy Loney wrote:
shafnutz05 wrote:
Troy Loney wrote:So you want kids to get $60K educations to go work public service jobs that are going to pay $40K a year maybe? It seems like some sort of compromise is needed here, either the government hires a bunch of unqualified people to work public sector jobs, or you give people some sort of incentive to accept lower compensation (as it is obvious that cutting the cost of government means paying these workers in the $40K range and cutting their pension and insurance benefits).


When I graduated college, I was getting paid in the neighborhood of $37k/year. I don't want this to turn into an argument about teacher pay/benefits, but I don't like how that group is always singled out as the only group that faces initial economic hardship.



Spoiler:
I'm not talking about teachers, i'm talking about social workers and other government related jobs. Teachers do fine in my opinion, they're problem is that their income distribution is so ridiculously tilted towards the old guard that "put in their time" or whatever. They young teachers entering the field seem to be getting screwed, but that should be fixed by a more equitable distrbution within the ranks and they need to find a resolution in house. The problem I think, is that the argument that people make about teachers getting paid too much is getting push back from those teachers that aren't really making anything and are taking offense to the criticism they're receiving.


Yeah, social work is definitely a thankless field, to be sure. I didn't really get the nod to "firefighters" as indicated in the bill....do firefighters even need a college degree? (I'm honestly asking, I was a volunteer firefighter back home). You actually raise a great point about the income distribution within the teaching field. The old guard does tremendously well for themselves.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby shafnutz05 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:19 am

Letang Is The Truth wrote:Teachers And nurses should make more money


Nurses?! I have been in the medical staffing field for five years. Nurses are hardly starving.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby mac5155 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:19 am

Troy Loney wrote:
count2infinity wrote:
shafnutz05 wrote:
Troy Loney wrote:So you want kids to get $60K educations to go work public service jobs that are going to pay $40K a year maybe? It seems like some sort of compromise is needed here, either the government hires a bunch of unqualified people to work public sector jobs, or you give people some sort of incentive to accept lower compensation (as it is obvious that cutting the cost of government means paying these workers in the $40K range and cutting their pension and insurance benefits).


When I graduated college, I was getting paid in the neighborhood of $37k/year. I don't want this to turn into an argument about teacher pay/benefits, but I don't like how that group is always singled out as the only group that faces initial economic hardship.


wow...7k a year more than i made when i graduated and went into the teaching field ;)


I'm not 100% informed on this to be honest, but how much doest it cost to go to like a CalU or IUP nowadays? I know CCAC is cheap, but I can't imagine a CCAC degree being worth much in any field nowadays.


Tuition at cal is roughly $6,000 a semester. which is more than I paid at Penn State in 2006-07 and 2007-08. Which is lol-tastic.

EDIT: I should add..this is tuition + fees + ~$1500 a semester for housing.
Last edited by mac5155 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby Troy Loney on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:20 am

I don't believe they do. And what's about me "actually raising a great point". I always raise great points.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby Troy Loney on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:22 am

So Cal is $12K a year. So one of the least expensive schools costs $48K. Again, asking someone to pay $48K to go to school to go into a field that only pays 30-40K doesnt make sense.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby JeffDFD on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:22 am

Wait...the first part mentions nothing about entering public service to get the loans forgiven. Maybe I missed something, but it looks like if you entere public service it goes from 10 to 5 years? So they are looking at forgiving all federal loans, regardless of the job?

I think I am missing something important here. What would stop someone who can afford school from just not paying for any of it out of pocket and just getting loans for as much as they can, thus getting more forgiven in the long run?
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby mac5155 on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:23 am

Troy Loney wrote:So Cal is $12K a year. So one of the least expensive schools costs $48K. Again, asking someone to pay $48K to go to school to go into a field that only pays 30-40K doesnt make sense.


and I consider CalU marginally better than a community college as far as education goes. I only go there because it's convenient/within my work's reimbursement guidelines.
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Re: Student Loan Forgiveness Act of 2012

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:24 am

shafnutz05 wrote:
Letang Is The Truth wrote:Teachers And nurses should make more money


Nurses?! I have been in the medical staffing field for five years. Nurses are hardly starving.


In terms of absolute magnitude, maybe maybe not, not the average ICU nurse in Pittsburgh makes around 26.50 and hour or so. Thinking about the acuity and responsibility that most of these nurses take, they essentially function as mid level practitioners. The scope of nursing is continually increased to curb salary costs of hospitalists, intensivists, and mid levels, but RN compensation is not reflective of the responsibility they currently have
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