More Staal Speculation...

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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby no name on Fri May 25, 2012 9:21 pm

pressure=9Pa wrote:
Pens15 wrote:

But above all, it seems that it needs to be stated, yet again, if Staal is traded, the main purpose will be to avoid losing him for nothing. NOT for cap reasons, and NOT for hockey reasons. It could be pretty difficult to swing a Staal trade that makes the team better immediately, before any additional moves are made.


How dare you inject logic into our :scared: :scared: :scared: thread!


True very true, losing and asset like Staal for nothing would do nothng more than open up cap space. I said it befor, and as bad as it sounds. You are better off signing Staal then tryng to trade him. You are promised maximum value for him that way. But that would be kinda cold signing him then moving him. Or at the least give the other team a chance to sign him to a long term deal befor the trade goes through.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby Pavel Bure on Fri May 25, 2012 9:35 pm

no name wrote:
pressure=9Pa wrote:
Pens15 wrote:

But above all, it seems that it needs to be stated, yet again, if Staal is traded, the main purpose will be to avoid losing him for nothing. NOT for cap reasons, and NOT for hockey reasons. It could be pretty difficult to swing a Staal trade that makes the team better immediately, before any additional moves are made.


How dare you inject logic into our :scared: :scared: :scared: thread!


True very true, losing and asset like Staal for nothing would do nothng more than open up cap space. I said it befor, and as bad as it sounds. You are better off signing Staal then tryng to trade him. You are promised maximum value for him that way. But that would be kinda cold signing him then moving him. Or at the least give the other team a chance to sign him to a long term deal befor the trade goes through.

I feel like the sign and trade topic was discussed about a year ago and someone did the research on it. I believe there were only 2 of note in the last 20 years. It's just something that very rarely happens.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby Steve on Sat May 26, 2012 9:38 am

I know it's kind of exciting to think about the return we could get for Staal - but really I hope we can just resign him, and keep the 3 center model going.

Obviously, round one proves that nothing is guaranteed - but the Pens have such a luxury of having these three down the middle. Keep it going for as long as possible...
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby sil on Sat May 26, 2012 9:41 am

Steve wrote:I know it's kind of exciting to think about the return we could get for Staal - but really I hope we can just resign him, and keep the 3 center model going.

Obviously, round one proves that nothing is guaranteed - but the Pens have such a luxury of having these three down the middle. Keep it going for as long as possible...


The players have to want it to. Not saying Staal wants out, but that plays a factor too.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby Pens15 on Sat May 26, 2012 12:17 pm

Steve wrote:I know it's kind of exciting to think about the return we could get for Staal - but really I hope we can just resign him, and keep the 3 center model going.

Obviously, round one proves that nothing is guaranteed - but the Pens have such a luxury of having these three down the middle. Keep it going for as long as possible...


I wouldn't complain, but then again, I'm not so sure. As you say, it didn't really work out too well this year. If Staal gets the raise that some people are predicting, then it gets even tougher to fill in the wings then it already is.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby pens#1 on Sat May 26, 2012 12:52 pm

Pens15 wrote:
Steve wrote:I know it's kind of exciting to think about the return we could get for Staal - but really I hope we can just resign him, and keep the 3 center model going.

Obviously, round one proves that nothing is guaranteed - but the Pens have such a luxury of having these three down the middle. Keep it going for as long as possible...


I wouldn't complain, but then again, I'm not so sure. As you say, it didn't really work out too well this year. If Staal gets the raise that some people are predicting, then it gets even tougher to fill in the wings then it already is.


the holes are alot easier to fill when you can bring in quality players from the draft on entry level deals or bring in players that havent worked out on other teams that carry a small cap hit (the best example i can think of is when the Flyers got Leino for a bag or pucks from Det)
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby Fire0nice228 on Sat May 26, 2012 1:40 pm

Yeah but when you do that your praying that guys that didnt work out on other teams work out on yours, or that your Janne Pessonen experiment works out.. (low odds)
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby pugilist13 on Sun May 27, 2012 12:15 pm

Steve wrote:I know it's kind of exciting to think about the return we could get for Staal - but really I hope we can just resign him, and keep the 3 center model going.

Obviously, round one proves that nothing is guaranteed - but the Pens have such a luxury of having these three down the middle. Keep it going for as long as possible...

Personally, i hope they sign Staal long term. If they do move him it should be at the deadline. Thats when you get the most value. There would be teams lining up to mortage their future to acquire a guy like Staal for the push. I dont see the rush in moving him with a year left on his deal and his ability to still fit with the cap. Look at the past few deadlines. Teams overpaying big time to pick up the missing piece of the puzzle.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby opie22002 on Sun May 27, 2012 12:31 pm

Staal for Bobby Ryan straight up!
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby no name on Sun May 27, 2012 1:44 pm

pugilist13 wrote:
Steve wrote:I know it's kind of exciting to think about the return we could get for Staal - but really I hope we can just resign him, and keep the 3 center model going.

Obviously, round one proves that nothing is guaranteed - but the Pens have such a luxury of having these three down the middle. Keep it going for as long as possible...

Personally, i hope they sign Staal long term. If they do move him it should be at the deadline. Thats when you get the most value. There would be teams lining up to mortage their future to acquire a guy like Staal for the push. I dont see the rush in moving him with a year left on his deal and his ability to still fit with the cap. Look at the past few deadlines. Teams overpaying big time to pick up the missing piece of the puzzle.


I can see your logic but trading for a guy like Staal at the deadline only gives his services for 3 months at best. If a team trades for him now he can help you win all year, and you can try to sign him long term during that year. And what ever we get intretun for Staal at the deadline won't make us better for our playoff run. Unless you are getting a UFA Dmam in return for Staal.

In the end its very simple, what ever you do for Staal has to make us a better team, and like its been said befor We will know alot more come July 1st. if Staals contract demands are out of our reach after we sign Sid. Then the rumor mill will really heat up.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby sil on Tue May 29, 2012 8:43 am

opie22002 wrote:Staal for Bobby Ryan straight up!


It's a unique twist to look at trading Staal for the better player instead of him being the better player in each trade. I crossed out 'straight up' because Anaheim would't do it...but they do need another center behind Getzlaf...and badly. It would take more than Staal though.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby no name on Tue May 29, 2012 10:05 am

sil wrote:
opie22002 wrote:Staal for Bobby Ryan straight up!


It's a unique twist to look at trading Staal for the better player instead of him being the better player in each trade. I crossed out 'straight up' because Anaheim would't do it...but they do need another center behind Getzlaf...and badly. It would take more than Staal though.


Of all the trade suggestions, even my own, i like this the best. Throw in Tangradi if it gets the deal done.
Ryan has 3 years left on his contract, at 5.1 million, right at or above of what Staal will get. We would have to let them negotiate a deal with Staal first to get it done, that could be a major hang up. No one has any idea if Staal wants to stay or how much he is looking for. This is a trade that i can look at and say, this makes us a better team.

Mrs. No Name has a hunch Staal will sign for 5 - 5.5 million to stay in the burgh
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby Pitts on Tue May 29, 2012 10:26 am

no name wrote:
sil wrote:
opie22002 wrote:Staal for Bobby Ryan straight up!


It's a unique twist to look at trading Staal for the better player instead of him being the better player in each trade. I crossed out 'straight up' because Anaheim would't do it...but they do need another center behind Getzlaf...and badly. It would take more than Staal though.


Of all the trade suggestions, even my own, i like this the best. Throw in Tangradi if it gets the deal done.
Ryan has 3 years left on his contract, at 5.1 million, right at or above of what Staal will get. We would have to let them negotiate a deal with Staal first to get it done, that could be a major hang up. No one has any idea if Staal wants to stay or how much he is looking for. This is a trade that i can look at and say, this makes us a better team.

Mrs. No Name has a hunch Staal will sign for 5 - 5.5 million to stay in the burgh

Why would Anaheim want Tangradi back? I'd go Staal and Kennedy for Ryan and a 2nd round pick.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby Jamie on Tue May 29, 2012 10:48 am

What worries me is that Staal will/wants to sign with Carolina as a UFA to play with his brother. They easily have the cap space to sign him, when he hits UFA status.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby owtahear on Tue May 29, 2012 11:14 am

steelhammer wrote:
sil wrote:From that article...

"A package of Bolland, Saad, another prospect and a first-round pick or two might get Staal to Chicago."

Jordan Staal for...

Dave Bolland
Brandon Saad
Philip Danault
2 first round picks


Uhhhhhhh...I'd do it.


I think people on this board really underestimate Jordan Staal's value. He can bring a huge return. That is why I laughed when I saw the post regarding sending Staal and our #1 and something else to Edmonton for the #1 pick (Yakobov). He is not Crosby or Malkin. Why would you send that much to Edmonton for the #1 overall? I wouldn't do it one on on for Staal, I would want more from Edmonton.

Again, Pens fans are looking at Staal as purely a 3rd line Center or "a wing for Geno". Most teams see him as the guy they covet.

If we are waiting for a deal like that to come up to trade Staal, we will be waiting for a very long time. Bolland is priced a little high, but he should be entering his prime now and has already proven to be a good player in the playoffs. Saad erased all of the misconceptions about him that made him a 2nd round pick this past season. He is exactly what our organization needs in terms of a scoring winger. He'll be on a very affordable entry-level deal over the next 3 seasons and then will have value as an RFA. Prime candidate to play with Sid. One more pick would make this a fair deal. Holding onto Staal is too much to spend in a position (center) that we are already strong in.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby penny lane on Tue May 29, 2012 11:26 am

Jamie wrote:What worries me is that Staal will/wants to sign with Carolina as a UFA to play with his brother. They easily have the cap space to sign him, when he hits UFA status.


Why not play with Mark in NYC ?
I've never read anything that indicates Jordan wants to play with any of his brothers.
GM Shero wont' hold onto to Staal until free agency and be left with nothing in return.
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby sil on Tue May 29, 2012 11:40 am

Jordan actually hates Eric and Marc...he REALLY wants to play with Jared...just so happens that's Carolina too!
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Re: More Staal Speculation...

Postby It'sagreatdayforhockey! on Tue May 29, 2012 12:01 pm

no name wrote:
pugilist13 wrote:
Steve wrote:I know it's kind of exciting to think about the return we could get for Staal - but really I hope we can just resign him, and keep the 3 center model going.

Obviously, round one proves that nothing is guaranteed - but the Pens have such a luxury of having these three down the middle. Keep it going for as long as possible...

Personally, i hope they sign Staal long term. If they do move him it should be at the deadline. Thats when you get the most value. There would be teams lining up to mortage their future to acquire a guy like Staal for the push. I dont see the rush in moving him with a year left on his deal and his ability to still fit with the cap. Look at the past few deadlines. Teams overpaying big time to pick up the missing piece of the puzzle.


I can see your logic but trading for a guy like Staal at the deadline only gives his services for 3 months at best. If a team trades for him now he can help you win all year, and you can try to sign him long term during that year. And what ever we get intretun for Staal at the deadline won't make us better for our playoff run. Unless you are getting a UFA Dmam in return for Staal.

In the end its very simple, what ever you do for Staal has to make us a better team, and like its been said befor We will know alot more come July 1st. if Staals contract demands are out of our reach after we sign Sid. Then the rumor mill will really heat up.



Yeah, the problem at the deadline is that any team willing to overpay is a team that is a contender. That hurts the pens in the short term because 1) they aren't likely to want to move pieces that would help us/hurt them going into the playoffs and 2) that team isn't likely to have a high draft pick available so we are looking at acquiring mid-late 1st round+ picks and prospects. This is bad news for a team looking to win now.
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