Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Forum for posts that are not hockey-related.

Moderators: Three Stars, dagny, pfim, netwolf

Did/Does he?

Yes
17
35%
No
7
14%
Maybe
7
14%
Probably
18
37%
 
Total votes : 49

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby Gaucho on Fri Aug 24, 2012 9:57 am

llipgh2 wrote:Given how many cyclists have been caught doping...who cares?

A juiced Armstrong beat equally juiced competitors. :lol:


Pretty much.
Gaucho
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 41,563
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2006 10:22 am
Location: The Onyx Club

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby columbia on Fri Aug 24, 2012 9:57 am

Considering how slow my postal carrier is, I wish Lance had passed on some juice to those folks.
columbia
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 47,418
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:13 am
Location: If you don't have a seat at the table, you're probably on the menu.

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby KennyTheKangaroo on Fri Aug 24, 2012 9:59 am

shafnutz05 wrote:I would be a lot more inclined to think this was a vendetta if this was a European or world anti-doping organization. But this is the USADA that is so doggedly pursuing this. I don't really think they have a vendetta against American athletes.


its a vendetta against michelob ultra
KennyTheKangaroo
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 12,099
Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 12:15 am
Location: Under the Skycoaster

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby CBear3 on Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:05 am

shafnutz05 wrote:I would be a lot more inclined to think this was a vendetta if this was a European or world anti-doping organization. But this is the USADA that is so doggedly pursuing this. I don't really think they have a vendetta against American athletes.

It's real easy. What's the best way to make a splash and make people pay attention to you? Take down the biggest fish in the ocean. And knowing that he's been picked at from every angle for a decade makes it easy to win.
CBear3
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 1,615
Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:18 am
Location: Kansas City

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby stopper40 on Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:32 am

KennyTheKangaroo wrote:
shafnutz05 wrote:I would be a lot more inclined to think this was a vendetta if this was a European or world anti-doping organization. But this is the USADA that is so doggedly pursuing this. I don't really think they have a vendetta against American athletes.


its a vendetta against michelob ultra



Everyone should have a vendetta against michelob ultra
stopper40
AHL'er
AHL'er
 
Posts: 4,745
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 9:51 am
Location: BANNED for liking Butterfingers

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby shafnutz05 on Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:37 am

stopper40 wrote:
KennyTheKangaroo wrote:
shafnutz05 wrote:I would be a lot more inclined to think this was a vendetta if this was a European or world anti-doping organization. But this is the USADA that is so doggedly pursuing this. I don't really think they have a vendetta against American athletes.


its a vendetta against michelob ultra



Everyone should have a vendetta against michelob ultra


Agreed. Budweiser Select 55 is so much better
shafnutz05
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 57,114
Joined: Tue Jun 02, 2009 5:10 pm
Location: Amish Country

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby JS© on Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:04 pm

While I'm sure Lance doped... I just think it's funny that the new TDF winners we have as a result of this are:

Zulle - admitted EPO user
Ulrich x 3 - suspended for doping
Basso - suspended for doping
Kloden - suspected and fined for doping
Beloki - suspected of doping, but acquitted.

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showpost.p ... stcount=56

a million views in this thread, and it seems like Lance doesn't have too many fans at Cycling News: http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=18272
JS©
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 20,571
Joined: Fri Feb 03, 2006 11:52 am
Location: hooray for me

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby steelhammer on Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:10 pm

This is a good summary of doping in cycling. They have the top 10 finishers for every year since 1998 and what their doping history is. Might have to go outside of the top 10 for many of the races to determine a winner.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doping_at_the_Tour_de_France
steelhammer
AHL'er
AHL'er
 
Posts: 3,279
Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 12:31 am
Location: Hold on, I have a stat for that.

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby Gaucho on Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:11 pm

I don't think there will be "new" winners. There'll simply be no winner at all.

It is really sad what has become of cycling.
Gaucho
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 41,563
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2006 10:22 am
Location: The Onyx Club

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby columbia on Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:13 pm

Doping aside, I'm amazed that any human being could even finish the Tour de France.
columbia
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 47,418
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:13 am
Location: If you don't have a seat at the table, you're probably on the menu.

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby Gaucho on Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:17 pm

columbia wrote:Doping aside, I'm amazed that any human being could even finish the Tour de France.


This is something that often gets overlooked. These guys are still amazing athletes. And it sucks that they are being singled out and made scapegoats for a culture that is probably more or less prevalent in most all endurance and strength sports.
Gaucho
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 41,563
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2006 10:22 am
Location: The Onyx Club

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby steelhammer on Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:24 pm

Gaucho wrote:
columbia wrote:Doping aside, I'm amazed that any human being could even finish the Tour de France.


This is something that often gets overlooked. These guys are still amazing athletes. And it sucks that they are being singled out and made scapegoats for a culture that is probably more or less prevalent in most all endurance and strength sports.


The average speed of the race has increased 8% since 1989 which means the riders have to move 16% more air and thus do 16% more work. There is really only 1 way to keep up that kind of pace for 99.99999% of athletes. That might even be a low estimate. Given the physical demands and danger of the sport, the PEDs are one of the lesser risks they take.
steelhammer
AHL'er
AHL'er
 
Posts: 3,279
Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 12:31 am
Location: Hold on, I have a stat for that.

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby DudeMan2766 on Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:47 pm

I think there's some posters juicing their post counts.
DudeMan2766
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 10,935
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 1:33 pm
Location: Squares don't fit in my circle.

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby knives of ice on Fri Aug 24, 2012 2:43 pm

no doubt Armstrong doped. there is no doubt in my mind that Bolt and the Jamaican track team dope as well, the testing is pretty much pathetic and simple to beat. Its an epidemic in all sports right now because they don't spend the money to do CIR tests and allow a 4/1 ratio. what armstrong did was completely different but its en epidemic in all sports its just a matter of if these sports want to spend the money to do the correct testing.
knives of ice
AHL'er
AHL'er
 
Posts: 3,783
Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:36 pm
Location: good riddance Armstrong

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby Mr. Colby on Fri Aug 24, 2012 2:52 pm

Why don't they just legalize blood doping in cycling then? Seems like cycling would be a good sport in which to allow the athletes to get more oxygen to their lungs
Mr. Colby
AHL Hall of Famer
AHL Hall of Famer
 
Posts: 8,754
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:33 pm
Location: Born and Raised in Kent Manderville

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby Mr. Colby on Fri Aug 24, 2012 2:53 pm

Negative effects are increased viscosity = more easily coagulated
Mr. Colby
AHL Hall of Famer
AHL Hall of Famer
 
Posts: 8,754
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:33 pm
Location: Born and Raised in Kent Manderville

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby steelhammer on Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:09 pm

Mr. Colby wrote:Why don't they just legalize blood doping in cycling then? Seems like cycling would be a good sport in which to allow the athletes to get more oxygen to their lungs


There are some arguments for it: http://blog.practicalethics.ox.ac.uk/2012/07/stop-persecuting-armstrong-time-for-a-doping-amnesty-in-cycling/#more-3905
steelhammer
AHL'er
AHL'er
 
Posts: 3,279
Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 12:31 am
Location: Hold on, I have a stat for that.

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby llipgh2 on Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:18 pm

JS© wrote:
a million views in this thread, and it seems like Lance doesn't have too many fans at Cycling News: http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=18272


Pfft. Even if these people juiced to the max, they couldn't do what Armstrong did.

I agree with some other posters. Juiced or not, it is a big accomplishment. And it's not like he was the only one. And juiced or not, winning 7 times is rather remarkable.
llipgh2
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 10,757
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:29 pm
Location: Gasp! The Clamboni!

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby PghSkins on Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:33 pm

JS© wrote:a million views in this thread, and it seems like Lance doesn't have too many fans at Cycling News: http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=18272


I like to ride but did not realize how superior I was supposed to feel. Fortunately all the posters in that thread have set me straight.
PghSkins
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 15,621
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 8:36 pm
Location: Beaver

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby Shyster on Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:00 pm

The poll needs an option for “I don’t care.” Based on the fact that pretty much anyone and everyone who has ever won a bicycle race for the last 40 years seems to have been busted for doping at some point, even if Armstrong had been doped to the gills he still wouldn’t have had a competitive advantage because everyone else was doing it too. It’s like saying that Mark McGwire had an unfair advantage over Sammy Sosa when in fact they were both on so much juice it was practically squirting out of their pores.
Shyster
AHL All-Star
AHL All-Star
 
Posts: 6,231
Joined: Wed Nov 15, 2006 4:32 pm
Location: Here and there

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby the wicked child on Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:10 pm

WGAF? By the time they are done tearing down the dopers, there won't be anyone left. For a somewhat marginal sport, it's surprising that they seem to be on a never ending witch hunt.
the wicked child
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 16,749
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2006 2:11 pm
Location: :scared:

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:32 pm

Does it really taint his achievements that much if everyone is doping?
MRandall25
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 17,451
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 6:11 pm
Location: BOBROVSKY!!!

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby tifosi77 on Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:58 pm

Lance Armstrong's physiology is simply different.

The Science of Lance Armstrong: Born, and Built, to Win

His heart is physically larger than an average human (by about 30%), his lung capacity is about 3x that of a normal man, his VO2/max - the amount of oxygen in his blood - is double that of a normal man, and high even for an endurance athlete. At the time of the writing of that NatGeo article (2005) he was the only human being ever documented to have improved his muscle efficiency. He has the lowest levels of lactic acid production many scientists have ever seen. All told, over his seven-year TdF win streak he was able to improve his pedaling rate from 85 strokes/min to 105 strokes/min.

While it's difficult to completely discount all the chatter, if it's true he still managed to beat seven fields full of cheaters.
tifosi77
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 11,446
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2006 3:33 pm
Location: White-Juday Warp Field Interferometer

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby Gaucho on Fri Aug 24, 2012 7:06 pm

MRandall25 wrote:Does it really taint his achievements that much if everyone is doping?


Nope. Him being a complete a***hole is what tainted his achievements.
Gaucho
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 41,563
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2006 10:22 am
Location: The Onyx Club

Re: Lance Armstrong, Doper or Not?

Postby Tomas on Wed Oct 10, 2012 12:38 pm

George Hincapie admits he doped (shortly after retirement):

http://www.georgehincapie.com/news/Stat ... -Hincapie/
Tomas
AHL'er
AHL'er
 
Posts: 3,279
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2006 10:21 am

PreviousNext

Return to NHR

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: blackjack68, DudeMan2766, LeopardLetang and 6 guests


e-mail