Lockout

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Re: Lockout

Postby no name on Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:09 pm

darkstar57 wrote:
Gaucho wrote:They are now discussing how to deal with a shortened season. How about you worry about that later, you clowns.


Actually a shorten season will play heavily into the discussion esp with this make it whole provision they have been discussing, even in a shorten season there are still revenue, they need to decided if they changes they are putting in place would start day 1 of the new CBA or would be pushed til next year. So its not a small trivial matter, the league took in 3.3 billion last year, even if we chop of say a 1/3 of the season that still over 2 billion dollars.



Yeah but Don said he wants the players paid in full for this season even if they play a shortened season. Owners will only pay a prorated portion of the season. So even if a deal gets done, you got to deal with that.
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Re: Lockout

Postby penny lane on Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:22 pm

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/more_spo ... GAnT5fPrJN

For this from an individual in the room for Friday’s negotiating sessions and confirmed word-for-word by Slap Shots by a source across the aisle:

“Near the end of the meeting, Don [Fehr] said to Gary [Bettman]: ‘Let me get this straight. Even if the players agree to every single component of the league’s economic plan, we still don’t have a deal unless we also agree to every one of your proposed changes to player contract rights?’ ”
To which, both of our sources reported, “Gary said: ‘Yes.’”
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Re: Lockout

Postby FreeCandy44 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 2:34 pm

Sadly I think this season is toast. I really hope I'm wrong.
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Re: Lockout

Postby nocera on Sun Nov 11, 2012 3:34 pm

Just cancel the season so I can cancel my sports package.
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Re: Lockout

Postby offsides on Sun Nov 11, 2012 3:35 pm

penny lane wrote:http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/more_sports/don_bett_on_this_commish_IEaFOaMafgPLGAnT5fPrJN

For this from an individual in the room for Friday’s negotiating sessions and confirmed word-for-word by Slap Shots by a source across the aisle:

“Near the end of the meeting, Don [Fehr] said to Gary [Bettman]: ‘Let me get this straight. Even if the players agree to every single component of the league’s economic plan, we still don’t have a deal unless we also agree to every one of your proposed changes to player contract rights?’ ”
To which, both of our sources reported, “Gary said: ‘Yes.’”


If this really happened, I don't see how there will be hockey this year, next year or even next season.
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Re: Lockout

Postby Gaucho on Sun Nov 11, 2012 3:59 pm

Except in no-hit girls leagues.
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Re: Lockout

Postby skullman80 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:55 pm

Renaud Lavoie ‏@RenLavoieRDS
Don Fehr:"discussion for 60 minutes on players contracting. I don't know when we'll get back together."

Katie Strang ‏@KatieStrangESPN
#CBA Meeting lasted less than an hour. NHL completely unwilling to budge on any player contracting issues, according to Don Fehr


.... Not looking good...
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Re: Lockout

Postby skullman80 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:56 pm

Katie Strang ‏@KatieStrangESPN
#CBA Given NHL's stance on contracting issues, Fehr said he doesn't currently "see a path to an agreement"
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Re: Lockout

Postby skullman80 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:57 pm

Katie Strang ‏@KatieStrangESPN
#CBA According to Fehr, NHL commissioner Gary Bettman said during meeting that "we're past the point of give-and-take."

Katie Strang ‏@KatieStrangESPN
#CBA Fehr said he "suspects it won't be too long" before 2 sides meet again, but no immediate plans. PA will also request talks shift to TO
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Re: Lockout

Postby offsides on Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:03 pm

skullman80 wrote:
.... Not looking good...


I'd say that is a large understatement. :(
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Re: Lockout

Postby ulf on Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:07 pm

yikes
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Re: Lockout

Postby Hawkeynut on Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:14 pm

nocera wrote:Just cancel the season so I can cancel my sports package.


That's just it, they will drag this crap on till the bitter end. The moment they cancel the season, it removes the owners leverage to get a deal done anytime before next summer. As long as there is a season in the balance, the players will continue to try and get something done.

One thing the owners have in their back pocket is that once the season is burnt, only 40% of the players are then under contract. With a majority of players without a contract, it makes it easier for the owners to force the union to take whats on the table as this "make whole" garbage means a lot less to a lot less players.
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Re: Lockout

Postby no name on Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:09 pm

I really don't know if this is true, i figured the NHL was lying about Don hiding info from the players. I would think the PA started these rumors about what Gary said.

They are clearly starting the PR war again.

Oh well i will have to go check out Duquense hockey again.
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Re: Lockout

Postby MRandall25 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:19 pm

It does say "confirmed by a source across the aisle" = an owner.
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Re: Lockout

Postby no name on Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:41 pm

MRandall25 wrote:It does say "confirmed by a source across the aisle" = an owner.


PR wars are fought like this. With sources not actual names.
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Re: Lockout

Postby offsides on Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:52 pm

no name wrote:
MRandall25 wrote:It does say "confirmed by a source across the aisle" = an owner.


PR wars are fought like this. With sources not actual names.


Yep, and PR wars usually mean no serious negotiations are happening.
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Re: Lockout

Postby Bioshock on Sun Nov 11, 2012 7:31 pm

Stepping back and looking at this as a whole, it really is in the best interest of the players to make a deal. They can either lose less or lose all.

They can either lose 231 Million or lose 1.65 Billion. Take your pick guys...
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Re: Lockout

Postby Gaucho on Sun Nov 11, 2012 7:54 pm

That's a very simplified way to look at things.
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Re: Lockout

Postby no name on Sun Nov 11, 2012 8:18 pm

Bioshock wrote:Stepping back and looking at this as a whole, it really is in the best interest of the players to make a deal. They can either lose less or lose all.

They can either lose 231 Million or lose 1.65 Billion. Take your pick guys...


Gaucho wrote:That's a very simplified way to look at things.


I think the players need to be like Billy joe and Bobby Sue.. "??anyone??"
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Re: Lockout

Postby offsides on Sun Nov 11, 2012 8:24 pm

no name wrote:
Bioshock wrote:Stepping back and looking at this as a whole, it really is in the best interest of the players to make a deal. They can either lose less or lose all.

They can either lose 231 Million or lose 1.65 Billion. Take your pick guys...


Gaucho wrote:That's a very simplified way to look at things.


I think the players need to be like Billy joe and Bobby Sue.. "??anyone??"


Take the money and run?
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Re: Lockout

Postby pcm on Sun Nov 11, 2012 8:25 pm

The owners are trying to put in place a sustainable system to support the growth of the game (and protect them from themselves)... the players are trying to maximize their short term gains.

It's really no question who holds the leverage here. Just like 2004.
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Re: Lockout

Postby shmenguin on Sun Nov 11, 2012 8:33 pm

Hawkeynut wrote:
nocera wrote:Just cancel the season so I can cancel my sports package.


That's just it, they will drag this crap on till the bitter end. The moment they cancel the season, it removes the owners leverage to get a deal done anytime before next summer. As long as there is a season in the balance, the players will continue to try and get something done.

One thing the owners have in their back pocket is that once the season is burnt, only 40% of the players are then under contract. With a majority of players without a contract, it makes it easier for the owners to force the union to take whats on the table as this "make whole" garbage means a lot less to a lot less players.


2004 showed that the owners have even more leverage once they cancel a season. It proves they aren't bluffing. The players will be screwed in a couple different ways if they lose this season
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Re: Lockout

Postby Gaucho on Sun Nov 11, 2012 8:38 pm

pcm wrote:The owners are trying to put in place a sustainable system to support the growth of the game (and protect them from themselves)... the players are trying to maximize their short term gains.


That, too, is a very simplified way to look at things.
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Re: Lockout

Postby offsides on Sun Nov 11, 2012 8:41 pm

Gaucho wrote:
pcm wrote:The owners are trying to put in place a sustainable system to support the growth of the game (and protect them from themselves)... the players are trying to maximize their short term gains.


That, too, is a very simplified way to look at things.


Yeah, but it sounds about right to me.
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Re: Lockout

Postby JS© on Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:48 am

the wicked child wrote:Seems like I'm not missing hockey as much as I expected right now though... just disgusted with everyone involved.


Yeah, I'm at the same point with hockey. I would think that I'd miss it more, but the longer the strike goes the more distanced I've become with the game in general. I've tried watching games from the Q, the local NAHL team, the KHL, and even a non-Penguins AHL stream that I found on a Friday night. Sorry, but it's not filler enough for me.

I've now reached the point where I've tuned out all updates. The only things I want to hear are "A season will be played" or "A season will not be played'. I'm tired of "we might be close" and "no progress has been made".
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