Man the South East is a bad division.....

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Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby MarioLives on Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:18 pm

Just saying. Almost not fair giving a 3rd seed to the winner of that division. The NHL needs to do just straight seeding. That division is almost double digit worse that every other division.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby ffemtreed on Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:37 pm

Canes are looking well. They had a rough start and are actually coming around now.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby darkstar57 on Wed Feb 20, 2013 4:50 pm

ffemtreed wrote:Canes are looking well. They had a rough start and are actually coming around now.


One might say they where "Staaled" out of the gate
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby mikey287 on Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:41 am

If you change the format because a division looks bad for some time...what happens when the ebb and flow of sports takes effect and the divisions even out? It's "unfair" that we have to play in a stacked division...but what happens if in 5 years it's just us and the Islanders and the rest of those teams blow? Will we not get the #3 seed? I'm not saying it for any other reason then: if you tinker on short-term trends, you create long-term issues sometimes...
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby columbia on Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:48 am

It comes down to the fact that Canaduan teams are always going to be more likely to ice champions than anyone from the SE. ;)
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby joopen on Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:02 am

columbia wrote:It comes down to the fact that Canaduan teams are always going to be more likely to ice champions than anyone from the SE. ;)

Right, I mean look at how many cups the Leafs have won compared to TBL and CAR since those teams were founded :lol:
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby MarioLives on Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:02 pm

mikey287 wrote:If you change the format because a division looks bad for some time...what happens when the ebb and flow of sports takes effect and the divisions even out? It's "unfair" that we have to play in a stacked division...but what happens if in 5 years it's just us and the Islanders and the rest of those teams blow? Will we not get the #3 seed? I'm not saying it for any other reason then: if you tinker on short-term trends, you create long-term issues sometimes...



Valid point, but do we really think the SE is ever going to rival the Atlantic?
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby Rylan on Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:04 pm

MarioLives wrote:
mikey287 wrote:If you change the format because a division looks bad for some time...what happens when the ebb and flow of sports takes effect and the divisions even out? It's "unfair" that we have to play in a stacked division...but what happens if in 5 years it's just us and the Islanders and the rest of those teams blow? Will we not get the #3 seed? I'm not saying it for any other reason then: if you tinker on short-term trends, you create long-term issues sometimes...



Valid point, but do we really think the SE is ever going to rival the Atlantic?


Yes.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby Idoit40fans on Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:15 pm

SE has delivered two Champions in the last decade, Atlantic has delivered 1. Just sayin. Interestingly, coaches of all 3 of those winners are now coaching in the Atlantic.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby Puffymuffin on Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:07 pm

The Canes and Lightning would lead the North West if it wasn't for Vancouver.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby Pens Fan Since 1970 on Fri Feb 22, 2013 8:47 am

Capitals: Last in the league standings, 7 points out of final playoff spot 6 points from being 3rd in conference. :face:
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby MarioLives on Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:06 pm

Rylan wrote:
MarioLives wrote:
mikey287 wrote:If you change the format because a division looks bad for some time...what happens when the ebb and flow of sports takes effect and the divisions even out? It's "unfair" that we have to play in a stacked division...but what happens if in 5 years it's just us and the Islanders and the rest of those teams blow? Will we not get the #3 seed? I'm not saying it for any other reason then: if you tinker on short-term trends, you create long-term issues sometimes...



Valid point, but do we really think the SE is ever going to rival the Atlantic?


Yes.


I guesse we can agree to disagree on that one. I think it is more likely the SE loses 1 if not 2 of those teams before they every rival the Atlantic. No one cares about hockey in Florida or Carolina......not to mention Tampa Bay is not that great a town either.

Tampa 21st in attendance
Florida 23rd
Carolina 26th

Based on last year.....

None of them have been above 20 in the last 5 years.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:13 pm

That's if you look strictly at numbers, and your numbers are wrong. Tampa was 7th in average attendance with 19,204. Carolina was 15th.

Percentage-wse, Florida is 9th in the league, with 100.4% attendance. Carolina and Tampa are each at 97+.

Where are you getting your numbers?

EDIT: Those are this year's numbers, from what I just posted

Last year:

Tampa: 13th in average

Carolina: 22nd

Florida: 21st

I see now, you're using last year's %.


And yet, they're still higher than New Jersey (avg attendance/game, and they're only right above in %) and the Islanders.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby Idoit40fans on Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:22 pm

As a hockey town, Tampa is about identical to Pittsburgh. Winning they sell out, losing they don't. In fact, they were 4000 behind Pittsburgh last year in attendance.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby She'sTheFastest on Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:03 pm

darkstar57 wrote:
ffemtreed wrote:Canes are looking well. They had a rough start and are actually coming around now.


One might say they where "Staaled" out of the gate


He or she would be spelling stall wrong. :pop:
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby Desiato on Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:06 pm

What makes Tampa a viable hockey market is that it has a relatively high number of Canadian retirees and seasonal (winter) residents. While they attend games, they aren't necessarily Lightning fans first and foremost.

The indigenous market alone, roughly the same size as Pittsburgh, probably wouldn't support a franchise.

There are other factors as important as attendance, such as cultural penetration of the game and team, city/state buy-in, avg GDP of the population, league strategy, etc.. For example, Miami is an important market for the league in terms of exposure and mind share.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby pens2005 on Mon Feb 25, 2013 12:40 am

darkstar57 wrote:
ffemtreed wrote:Canes are looking well. They had a rough start and are actually coming around now.


One might say they where "Staaled" out of the gate


Horatio Cain style!
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby Tim Thomasen on Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:08 pm

mikey287 wrote:If you change the format because a division looks bad for some time...what happens when the ebb and flow of sports takes effect and the divisions even out? It's "unfair" that we have to play in a stacked division...but what happens if in 5 years it's just us and the Islanders and the rest of those teams blow? Will we not get the #3 seed? I'm not saying it for any other reason then: if you tinker on short-term trends, you create long-term issues sometimes...



The Flyers will never blow. They have been good from the start of the franchise and have had only one real down period in their history (89-90 to 93-94). Sure they have had a few down years in between (like the one year where we won every game againiat them) but have had only one period of time where they were terrible like how we were from 01-02 to 05-06. Plus even when they weren't cup contenders, they were still good enough to make the playoffs.

Granted that's just one team, but i'm just saying I can't ever see a time where the Flyers are God awful for a period of time.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby guiner on Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:48 pm

mikey287 wrote:If you change the format because a division looks bad for some time...what happens when the ebb and flow of sports takes effect and the divisions even out? It's "unfair" that we have to play in a stacked division...but what happens if in 5 years it's just us and the Islanders and the rest of those teams blow? Will we not get the #3 seed? I'm not saying it for any other reason then: if you tinker on short-term trends, you create long-term issues sometimes...


It would just demonstrate that the top team/division seeding first idea is not good.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby MarioLives on Tue Feb 26, 2013 11:04 pm

Every team but one in the NE has more points than the SE leader
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby Rylan on Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:53 pm

MarioLives wrote:Every team but one in the NE has more points than the SE leader


ok...its still a myopic view.
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby MRandall25 on Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:06 pm

MarioLives wrote:Every team but one in the NE has more points than the SE leader


What about the Atlantic?
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby iWonTheCup87 on Thu Feb 28, 2013 10:14 am

really annoying me because i live around DC and cant stand the Caps. They are awful and still have a shot to win the dvision after a horrible start. This division is a joke
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Re: Man the South East is a bad division.....

Postby shmenguin on Thu Feb 28, 2013 10:19 am

i'd be in favor of a permanent adjustment to split up the trash from the SE, but only if there was the right kind of evidence to say it needed to be done. basically, i would need attendance numbers to be low enough, for a long enough period of time that these teams were regularly forced to spend towards the cap floor. but that isn't really happening. they're trying to field competitive teams, and generally are spending enough money to do so - it's just coincidence that they suck at it, not some indication that the SE is permanently screwed.
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