Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby Geezer on Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:23 am

mikey287 wrote:
Jesse wrote:D'Agostino is way too low for me. I'd have him at 11th at most.


That's always my first critique of Ian's list "D'Agostino should be higher" :thumb:

I.ve wondered whether D"Agostino might decline a Pen's offer to avoid going to a team with a boatload Young D prospects heading to or at WBS
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby mikey287 on Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:25 am

I'm not sure he's in a position to decline an offer really. If a team offers him an NHL contract, he should take it. He's not Justin Schultz. He's a mid-level prospect. If he doesn't take what we offer, I think it's fairly unlikely that five teams are gonna knock down his door.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby Letang Is The Truth on Sun Mar 17, 2013 5:56 pm

What's up with matia marcantouni
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby mikey287 on Sun Mar 17, 2013 6:45 pm

Letang Is The Truth wrote:What's up with matia marcantouni


Not looking good. Well, Kitchener has had a hard time getting their offense off the ground and a lot of players have been disappointing this year. Marcantuoni is among them. Though I was in his corner when we drafted him, I've quickly soured on him. He's a lot of speed, some skill and not all that much else it seems. His lack of hockey sense will likely preclude him from having a major NHL impact. At this point, I'd say we should hope that he becomes as good as Tyler Kennedy. Which to some is overly grim, but only to those that blindly dislike Kennedy.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby pens_CT on Sun Mar 17, 2013 7:50 pm

Mikey, what is your opinion of Bryan Rust? His first two years in college he didn't show much offensive upside at all, this year is completely different and he is showing some offensive ability. Is he a possible future NHL player (bottom six)?
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby mikey287 on Sun Mar 17, 2013 8:22 pm

I've liked this pick, not for the upside, but the player struck me as decent quality. He's not gonna be a first liner, as you kinda allude to there, but he competes, he's skates well, seems to have a pretty good head on his shoulders. He might be the most clutch prospect we have. He seems to just make big plays in big spots. It's the CCHA tournament or whatever right now, and Notre Dame is against Bowling Green in a best of 3. It's game 2, about halfway through the 3rd period of a tie game, ND gets a penalty shot and the coach picks Rust to take it and just makes a neat little backhand play to help give ND the win.

He seems to be around a lot when good things happen. Not an elite skill set, but he's a righty that likes to compete and likes to win. He's not that big, loud diesel engine that drags boulders and moves mountains...he's a quiet engine that makes things go, he's a Prius (not like hipster nonsense stuff), he's quiet, he's effective. When it comes down to skill on skill, size on size, yeah, he's probably overmatched a bit...but he's gonna give it his all anyhow...
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby pens_CT on Sun Mar 17, 2013 8:40 pm

mikey287 wrote:I've liked this pick, not for the upside, but the player struck me as decent quality. He's not gonna be a first liner, as you kinda allude to there, but he competes, he's skates well, seems to have a pretty good head on his shoulders. He might be the most clutch prospect we have. He seems to just make big plays in big spots. It's the CCHA tournament or whatever right now, and Notre Dame is against Bowling Green in a best of 3. It's game 2, about halfway through the 3rd period of a tie game, ND gets a penalty shot and the coach picks Rust to take it and just makes a neat little backhand play to help give ND the win.

He seems to be around a lot when good things happen. Not an elite skill set, but he's a righty that likes to compete and likes to win. He's not that big, loud diesel engine that drags boulders and moves mountains...he's a quiet engine that makes things go, he's a Prius (not like hipster nonsense stuff), he's quiet, he's effective. When it comes down to skill on skill, size on size, yeah, he's probably overmatched a bit...but he's gonna give it his all anyhow...

So would it be fair to say he projects as an improved version of Joe Vitale, although playing wing not center?
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby mikey287 on Sun Mar 17, 2013 8:42 pm

Hmm...let me get back to you on that. When I give a comparable, I really try to get close to someone that's in the league and honestly, I just don't see Rust often enough to make a call like that right now. He's not quite as fast as Vitale I don't believe, but that might not be far off.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby Steve Dave on Sun Mar 17, 2013 11:17 pm

I always thought of Rust as a Kunitz type player.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby DesertPenguin on Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:14 am

Herein lies the problem with Shero's stockpile defensemen strategy: We barely have enough AHL ice time to go around for these guys, let alone space to get them quality minutes in the NHL. Whitney and Goligoski were both established defensemen with enough NHL game tape to sell to other clubs. We like Despres, want to keep him, but right now he's the only defensive prospect with any real value for us. Bortuzzo isn't even really valuable because he hasn't seen enough action to prove himself. Meanwhile, Dumoulin and Morrow are going to be ready for the show next season, and we will have no room to fit them.

On the flipside, Stanley Cup contenders need veteran blueliners, so I don't expect a firesale of our veterans in the coming off season. We seem to be stuck with a glut of good prospects and no room to develop them properly.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby the wicked child on Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:15 am

Eh, I expect things will work themselves out before it becomes a real issue. Trades will undoubtedly occur and some people on the current roster won't be re-signed.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby mikey287 on Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:26 am

Disagree, at least for now. Aren't Dylan Reese and Joey Mormina - a couple of AHL vets - getting regular time this year? So, there's still room to squeeze out another couple of guys. If the organization feels that Morrow absolutely has to be fast-tracked to the point that he's out grown the AHL (he has not, IMO) then we make a trade and get him in there. Otherwise, you let training camp take it's course and you see what happens...I wouldn't at all be panicked/bothered by it right now...nothing bad has happened...and it doesn't look like anything bad will happen next year either...
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby Gaucho on Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:32 am

Not like 3 or 4 of these guys will be more or less NHL ready at the same time. And if they do it sure is a nice problem to have.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby Hawkeynut on Mon Mar 18, 2013 12:27 pm

Gonna have to tap into that bucket of young defenseman in a couple years. Orpik, Nisky, Letang and Engelland are all UFAs after next year. Can't assume they will all be back. I worry about the Pens ability to resign Letang if he hits the Norris trophy jackpot.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby slappybrown on Mon Mar 18, 2013 12:30 pm

DesertPenguin wrote:We like Despres, want to keep him, but right now he's the only defensive prospect with any real value for us.

wat
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby Idoit40fans on Mon Mar 18, 2013 12:31 pm

Kovy27 wrote:Where is Filip Forsberg? *ducks*


Is this a dig at the Pens for HF ranking him ahead of any Penguin in their rankings?
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby DesertPenguin on Mon Mar 18, 2013 1:40 pm

slappybrown wrote:
DesertPenguin wrote:We like Despres, want to keep him, but right now he's the only defensive prospect with any real value for us.

wat


You won't be getting full value from Morrow, Pouliot, Matta, Harrington, Dumoulin until they play at least a season in the NHL. Despres fits that bill now. I only see room for one guy a year on the big club getting that experience, and that implies that someone from the year before has left via free agency or trade. It's impossible to develop all these guys into valueable trade assets and still contend because doing so requires them to play NHL minutes first.

On the flip side, we could also be bringing up young guys for sheltered minutes on the bottom pairings at forward, but now that Bennett is up, the forward cupboard is bare. I would have preferred more balance to our prospect pool in order to get full value from the guys we have. We're going to sell some of these guys short of what they could be worth because of the asterisk next to their name that reads: "Lacks NHL experience"
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby slappybrown on Mon Mar 18, 2013 1:57 pm

I'm not sure what "full value" is, because you can't assume that each of those prospects is going to pan out. They could get called up and, for whatever reason, fail to make it at this level/look bad/get hurt/quit hockey and become bakers. Despres, who is obviously on the right track, isn't a guarantee either.

People understand that prospects "lack NHL experience." It doesn't mean you can't get "real value", whatever that means despite them having played 0 NHL minutes.

We're going to sell some of these guys short of what they could be worth because of the asterisk next to their name that reads: "Lacks NHL experience"


Maybe. And maybe they turn out to be jabronis and we -- in hindsight -- fleeced some team. These prospects hold plenty of value as is.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby lemieuxReturns on Mon Mar 18, 2013 2:22 pm

Is Samulesson not considered top 20 in our prospect list?
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby mikey287 on Mon Mar 18, 2013 2:50 pm

lemieuxReturns wrote:Is Samulesson not considered top 20 in our prospect list?


Did you read the article? :pop:

No, he's not, nor should he be. He's not in the next handful that I would consider either. He's a tier below that.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby Nizzy on Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:11 pm

pouliot's a bust mikey

should've drafted grikorenko
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby Gaucho on Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:13 pm

no, forsberg. forsberg is the new... the new forsberg.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby TKovacs2 on Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:16 pm

Nizzy wrote:pouliot's a bust mikey

should've drafted grikorenko


:roll: And this is based off of what exactly?
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby columbia on Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:17 pm

TKovacs2 wrote:
Nizzy wrote:pouliot's a bust mikey

should've drafted grikorenko


:roll: And this is based off of what exactly?


Senseless axe grinding is the current theory.
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Re: Hockey's Future: Penguins Top 20 Prospects - Spring 2013

Postby TKovacs2 on Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:19 pm

columbia wrote:
TKovacs2 wrote:
Nizzy wrote:pouliot's a bust mikey

should've drafted grikorenko


:roll: And this is based off of what exactly?


Senseless axe grinding is the current theory.


I'm going with Pouliot ran over his dog and stole his girlfriend personally.
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